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kcc 04-27-2004 09:48 AM

Royals & Nobles and Wealth, Costs and Finances
 
i started an earlier thread about the wealthiest german royals and thought it would be fun to talk about rich nobles in other parts of europe. can someone tell me about the duchess of alba or the duchess of medinaceli. i have read that they have huge landholdings.any details.what about any titled families recieving land that was confiscated by the communists.what happened to the estates of princess michael of kent or prince bernhard of the netherlands.

kcc 04-27-2004 09:50 AM

i meant the family estates of the theprince of the netherlands and princess michael.

CathyEarnshaw 04-27-2004 10:55 AM

Princes Michael has never owned any estates in Europe. She was born in Carlsbad, Germany (Now Carlovy Vary in the Czech Republic.) Her father was a Baron von Reibnitz and came from Silesia. Such things pass through the male line, not the female line. Silesia is now a part of Poland.


I don't think Bernhard ever owned any land in what would become East Germany.

Duke of Brunswick-Lüneburg 04-27-2004 11:08 AM

ow yes, Prince Bernhard ownes the castle of Reckenwalde, were he was born in 1911 (wich was in East-Germany, now in Poland), but it was nationalised by the state by Hitler and later by the communists in Poland. I don't know if he got his castle back after the fall of Communism. He also has (together with his late wife Queen Juliana) several houses, castles and estates in the Netherlands, like Soestdijk Palace (private property) and the Royal Domain of Eikenhorst (in wich crownprince Willem-Alexander and princess Maxima now live).

Prince Bernhard sayd in november 2003 that the Royal Family of the Netherlands has only € 250 million ,and not € 2 billion...
But this is not treu, cause they have around € 500 million of shares and obligations in Shell, KLM/Royal Dutch Airlines and the ABN-Amro Bank. They also have a lot of estates and juwelry, and their familytreasure is around € 1.8 billion.

The Watcher 04-27-2004 11:20 AM

-Reckenwalde is still not property of Prince Bernhard, he tried to get it back, but he didn't get it back.
- Palace Soestdijk is not private property, but property of the State.

I think also it is not true what Prince Bernhard told about the wealth of the Dutch Royal Family, there are relations between the family and big investment companies. ( I read about it on the Benelux Royals Message Board, you can better ask there questions about the wealth of Prince Bernhard or the family Orange-Nassau.

ally_cooper 04-27-2004 11:34 AM

Maria del Rosario Cayetana Fitjames Stuart is the 18 th Duchesse of Alba de Tormes and Berwick. She born in Madrid on 28 march 1926. She married a twice: with Pedro Luis Martines de Irujo (17 Nov 1919-6 sep 1972) on 12 oct 1948 and later with Jesus Aguirre Ortiz de Zarate (9 jun 1934-11 may 2001) on 2 mar 1978.

The Duchesse of Alba have six children:
Carlos Fitjames Stuart and Martinez de Irujo: the Heir of the titles and actual Duke of Huescar. He studied Laws and have two sons (Fernando Fitzjames Stuart, born on 14 sep 1990; and Carlos Fitjames Stuart, born in 30 nov 1991) and is divorced. Born in 2-10-1948. (2nd october)
Alfonso Martinez de Irujo y Fitjames Stuat: Duke of Aliaga. Born in 22 oct 1950. He studied Economic Sciences. Have two sons (Luis Martinez de Irujo born on 26 may 1978; and Javier Martinez de Irujo born on jan 1981) and is separated to Princess Maria zu Hohenlohe-Langenburg.
Jacobo Martinez de Irujo: Count of Siruela. Born in 15-7-1954. He studied Philosophy. He is separated and have two sons (Jacobo Martinez de Irujo, born on 23 mar 1981; and Brianda Eugenia Martinez de Irujo, born 11-4-1984).
Fernando Martinez de Irujo: Marquess (is like that?) of San Vicente del Barro and he is single. Born 11 jul 1959. He studied Economics.
Cayetano Martinez de Irujo: Count of Salvatierra. He loves horses and related sports. Have twin sons ( Luis and Amina, born on 25 jul 2001) but he isn't married. Born in 4-4-1963.
Eugenia Martinez de Irujo: Duchesse of Montoro. Born in 10-12-1968. Separated and have a daughter (Cayetana Rivera Martinez de Irujo, born 16 oct 1999).

The Duchesse is eight times Duchesse, 15 Marquise, 19 Countess and 20 times Grand of Spain. Her godpartents were the king Alfonso XIII and the Queen Victoria Eugenia. She is the women with more nobiliary titles in the world. By a decree of Ministers in 2001 he have the Great Cross of Civil Orders of Alfonso X (Gran Cruz de la Orden Civil de Alfonso X el Sabio) in attention to the merits and circumstances of her live.
Since 1990 she was considered that the 14 greater fortune of Europe. She have numerous houses, three palaces, jewels, art (Tizziano, Rembrandt, Velázquez, Goya, Fra Angélicos ans others...)

I feel sorry for the translation but I'm spanish and don't speak English very well.

Duke of Lippe-Saalfeld 04-27-2004 11:58 AM

yes that's treu, Soestdijk Palace is property of the State, my mistake... :blush:, but it was private property until the 1980's (don't know the excact year), then they sold it (together with Paleis de Lange Voorhout and Paleis Kneuterdijk). Noordeinde 66 (the former home of crownprince W-A) is also private property.

They royal family has made a lot of money by trade in the East-Indies (a former Dutch colony), and they also have Russian Romanov-jewlery, cause their ancestor Queen Anna was the daughter of the Russian czar.

ally_cooper 04-27-2004 12:02 PM

I only find a litle of the Duchesse of Medinaceli. Only about her family nothing about her patrimony, I sorry.
The title of Duke of Medinaceli was created in 1479 by the Queen Isabel I the catholic of Castilla.
Victoria Eugenia Fernández de Córdoba y Férnandez de Henestrosa is the 18 Duchesse of Medinaceli. She born in Madrid, 16 apr 1917 to Luis Jesus Maria Férnandez de Córdoba (17th Duke) and Ana María Férnandez de Henestroza.
She married Don Rafael de Medina y Villalonga, 12 jan 1938.
She is six times Duchess, 17 times Countess, 17 times Marqueis and three times Vizondesa.
She have four children:
Ana Luisa de Medina y Férnandez de Córdoba, born 2 may 1940. and married a twice with Max Emanuel zu Hohenlohe-Langenburg (between 3 jun 1961 and may 1982) and with don Jaime de Urzaiz y Férnandez del Castillo (from 29 april 1983). She is the IX Countess od Ofalia and Marqueis od Navahermosa.
She have three son from the first marriage: Marco (1962), Pablo (1963) and Flavia (1964). Only her daughter is married with Jose Luis de Villalonga y Sanz and have three sons: Jose Luis, Rafael and Maximiliano.
Luis de Medina y Fernández de Córdoba, born 1941. He married Maria de las Mercedes Conradi on 1 dec 1985. He is the XVIII Marques of Cogolludo, Duke of Santiesteban del Puerto and Marques of Solera. Have two childreen: Victoria (1986) and Casilda (1989).
Rafael de Medina y Fernández de Córdoba born on 10 aug 1942 and died on 4 aug 2001. He married Natividad Abascal in 14 jul 1977 and they was separated from 1989. He was the XIX Duke of Feria and Maques of Villalba. They have two (handsome and single :lol: ) children: Rafael, the XX duke of Feria and Marques of Villalba (1978) and Luis (1980)
Ignacio de Medina y Fernández born 23 feb 1947. Married a twice with Mercedes Maier in 1976 and Maria da Gloria de Orleans and Braganza in october 1985. He is the XIX Duke of Segorbe, Count of Moriana del Rio and Count of Ampurias. From his second marriage has two daughters: Sol Maria de la Blanca (1986) and Ana Luna (1988)

CathyEarnshaw 04-27-2004 12:14 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Duke of Brunswick-Lüneburg@Apr 27th, 2004 - 9:08 am
ow yes, Prince Bernhard ownes the castle of Reckenwalde, were he was born in 1911 (wich was in East-Germany, now in Poland), but it was nationalised by the state by Hitler and later by the communists in Poland. I don't know if he got his castle back after the fall of Communism. He also has (together with his late wife Queen Juliana) several houses, castles and estates in the Netherlands, like Soestdijk Palace (private property) and the Royal Domain of Eikenhorst (in wich crownprince Willem-Alexander and princess Maxima now live).

Prince Bernhard sayd in november 2003 that the Royal Family of the Netherlands has only € 250 million ,and not € 2 billion...
But this is not treu, cause they have around € 500 million of shares and obligations in Shell, KLM/Royal Dutch Airlines and the ABN-Amro Bank. They also have a lot of estates and juwelry, and their familytreasure is around € 1.8 billion.

Ah, yes, Reckenwalde ... it is now in Poland. There have been numerous issues with compensation for property taken by the Nazis. When Poland acquired that land, the situation changed as so many of the German landowers were not Poles.
The Pless family made some arrangements to become Polish citizens which helped them at the time, but backfired after the second war.

kcc 04-27-2004 01:18 PM

hi marlene. i thought princess michael's mother was a szapary/windisch-graetz(sp) and inherited large estates in the cchec republic that were confiscated after w.w.11.. as her mother took part in anti nazi demonstrations(i think) the czheck. government would most likely look favourably on her or her brothers claims. do you know if her brother has attempted to regain any famil property.

CathyEarnshaw 04-27-2004 01:35 PM

Her mother was a Countess Szpary, a Hungarian title, and Mc's matergrandmother (I think) was the Windisch Graetz. There would be no estates for her mother to inherit as the land does not pass through the females.

MC's maternal grandfather probably owned property in Hungary or the Czech republic, but MC would not have any claims on it, nor would her brother. Her brother could have a claim on her father's property in Silesia, but probably not as the land became Poland before the Communists took control.

Teresa 04-29-2004 01:56 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by ally_cooper@Apr 27th, 2004 - 9:34 am
Maria del Rosario Cayetana Fitjames Stuart is the 18 th Duchesse of Alba de Tormes and Berwick. She born in Madrid on 28 march 1926. She married a twice: with Pedro Luis Martines de Irujo (17 Nov 1919-6 sep 1972) on 12 oct 1948 and later with Jesus Aguirre Ortiz de Zarate (9 jun 1934-11 may 2001) on 2 mar 1978.
..............

And she seems a very nice lady. :)

Here is a picture of the Duchess:https://www.abc.es/informacion/feria2.../interalba.jpg

The Duchess with daughter Eugenia and Eugenia's husband Francisco Rivera Ordoñez:
https://www.antonioburgos.com/mundo/1998/10...odacayetana.jpg

rchainho 10-16-2004 01:36 PM

the expense of monarchy (article)
 
https://members.tripod.com/~constantian/expense.html

semisquare 10-16-2004 01:58 PM

do they have ladied & gentlemen in waiting? if so what are their duties?

Nathalian 01-22-2005 12:30 AM

Money, Money, Money, Money....MONEY!
 
Which are richest RFS of Europe?

HMQueenElizabethII 01-22-2005 12:37 AM

They are very rich.Queen Margrethe sometimes can have big income from her paintings.

Gabriella 01-22-2005 01:17 AM

I think that the Liectenstein royals are the wealthiest. I think Hans Adam is worth about 2 billion dollars.

I have also heard reports that the Dutch royals are extremely weathy. There have been reports that Queen Beatrix is worth about a billion dollars, but she denies that.

sara1981 01-22-2005 01:27 AM

what about HM Queen Elizabeth 2 of Great Britian? because she is more money! Million? wealth? billionaire?

late Princess Diana's father is also wealth and Dodi Fayed's dad also billionaire

have anymore of Royals who more money!

Sara Boyce

Jo 01-22-2005 01:47 AM

I read some where that Denmark is the richest. I think it was in life magazine.

Gabriella 01-22-2005 01:55 AM

I got this courtesy of forbes.com. It was last updated in March 2004.

https://www.forbes.com/billionaires/g.../0315/083.html

The list encompasses all heads of states. Kings/Queens as well as presidents and prime ministers.

As far as European royals are concerned, Prince Hans Adam of Liechtenstein is indeed the wealthiest with 2.2 billion. Queen Elizabeth of Great Britain follows with 660 million dollars and then Queen Beatrix with 260 million.

hillary_nugent 01-22-2005 02:37 AM

I read somewhere once that the Luxembourg royals were the second wealthiest Europeans royal family...

but whoa go King Fahd Bin Abdul Aziz Alsaud of Saudi Arabia who's net worth is $25 billion!

bad_barbarella 01-22-2005 04:44 AM

haha forbes is for gold diggers

hillary_nugent 01-22-2005 04:58 AM

muhahahahaha i'm sure some money driven girl is going through the list hunting for a husband now :P

Alexandria 01-22-2005 10:15 AM

I think that Queen Beatrix is one of the wealthiest in terms of liquid assets.

While Queen Elizabeth is wealthy in the sense that she owns many valuable items such as art work and the like.

I think King Juan Carlos is one of the least wealthiest of the reigning royals.

kinneret5764 01-22-2005 10:25 AM

I think the Dutch Royals are the richest. They have considerable interest in Royal Dutch Shell, KLM Airlines and a number of other huge Dutch conglomerates.

suturegeisha 01-22-2005 07:38 PM

I think it's hard to estimate exactly how wealthy these royals are, simply for the fact that a lot of those figures are ballpark estimates by some random accountant at Forbes. Plus, many non-liquid assets are included in these estimates, like art collections and jewelry.

One thing's for sure- it ain't the Windsors. :)
Lollies!
-Kara-

theprincess 01-22-2005 07:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kinneret5764
I think the Dutch Royals are the richest. They have considerable interest in Royal Dutch Shell, KLM Airlines and a number of other huge Dutch conglomerates.

According to this article from BCC News, Forbes magazine greatly overestimated the net worth of the Dutch royal family. While the family is very rich, they are not the richest family in the world.

Article:
https://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/business/3014110.stm

royal_lady 01-22-2005 08:22 PM

What about the Royal Family of Luxembourg? I read somewhere their fortune is $ 5 Billion. I was sure the Luxembourg Royals are the richest. Do not quote me on this. I'm yet not too sure.

Nathalian 01-22-2005 11:22 PM

I saw that too...and, what about Monaco? It´s been said that Prince Rainier has a fortune of U$ 6 billion...

suturegeisha 01-23-2005 12:12 AM

From MSN Money [not exactly reliable, but eh, what is?] [all estimates given in GB pounds (£)]:

The Liechtenstein royal family is in first place, estimated at £3.3 billion.
The Luxembourg royal family comes in second place with approximately £3 billion.
Then follows the Windsors with £2.4 billion.

The rest of the royals are not ranked, save for the fact that the Norwegian royal family is the "poorest", with assets worth only £90 million.

Now. Included in these estimates is everything associated with these families- art collections, jewelry, cash and investments, non-state maintained properties [like summer homes and ski chalets] and whatnot. These figures are not what they have in the bank.
As far as that goes, however....

Queen Beatrix of the Netherlands is named as the wealthiest reigning monarch, with a reported fortune of £1.2 billion. [Former] Grand Duke Jean of Luxembourg follows her with £800 million, and then comes Prince Hans-Adam of Liechtenstein with £540 million.

And, Nathalian, Prince Rainier of Monaco has an estimated €1.7 billion fortune, of which very little is actually liquid [ie, cold hard cash]. A lot of his worth comes from investments, I believe.

Hope this helps a little. :)
Lollies!
-Kara-

Queens 01-23-2005 11:44 AM

Rich List
 
I wanted to know if one of you guys can generate a list of European Houses (include the non ruling houses too...) from richest to the poorest.... thank you

Bubbette 01-23-2005 12:26 PM

I don't think the Danes are so well off.

KikkiB 01-23-2005 01:06 PM

Neither are the Norwegian royal family. I think their fortune is a small two digit million Norwegian Kroner. The Queen do have some artwork and an appartment (she inherited it from her mother). The other members of the royal family (that being CP Haakon and Princess Märtha Louise) have inherited some money from late King Olav and other family members.

They "rent" the palace, Skaugum (I think) and other mansions around Norway from the state and get an "allowance" from the state for their daily run of the Norwegian Royal family, Inc:D So they are in the bottom league in the royal fortune list, but they have enough money to put food on the table and some more!

Please correct me if I'm worng!

suturegeisha 01-23-2005 11:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rchainho

Thank you so much for the article! It was very, very interesting reading! ;)
Lollies!
-Kara-

Queens 01-24-2005 08:07 PM

GRF wealth
 
does any know how much the GRF are worth now minus miller $$$.... I heard that they got some money from greek gov't....

thanks

carlota 01-25-2005 06:39 PM

liechtenstein royals are the wealthiest ones followed by luxembourg's, then british royals and then the dutch royals. among the poorest, norway and spain.

gaggleofcrazypeople 01-25-2005 07:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Queens
does any know how much the GRF are worth now minus miller $$$.... I heard that they got some money from greek gov't....

thanks

Why would they get money if they are not in power?

norwegianne 01-25-2005 08:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by gaggleofcrazypeople
Why would they get money if they are not in power?

There was a matter of the properties in Greece, which was brought up in a court. The court ruled that the Government of Greece would have to pay the Royal Family money for the properties.

norwegianne 01-25-2005 08:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by KikkiB
Neither are the Norwegian royal family. I think their fortune is a small two digit million Norwegian Kroner. The Queen do have some artwork and an appartment (she inherited it from her mother). The other members of the royal family (that being CP Haakon and Princess Märtha Louise) have inherited some money from late King Olav and other family members.

They "rent" the palace, Skaugum (I think) and other mansions around Norway from the state and get an "allowance" from the state for their daily run of the Norwegian Royal family, Inc:D So they are in the bottom league in the royal fortune list, but they have enough money to put food on the table and some more!

Please correct me if I'm worng!

Skaugum is actually the Royal Family's personal property if I recall correctly (https://www.kongehuset.no is down at the moment so I can't check it there.). It was given to Crown Prince Olav and Crown Princess Märtha as a wedding present. There was some "problems" when the current Crown Prince took over, because of the size of the farm it was his older sister who, by law, should have been offered it first. (Odel-law.)

But anyway.... Norwegian Royal family is probably amongst the poorer of the ruling families of Europe. Queen Maud got a fair share of inheritance from her father, but since King Olav had three children, that inheritance has been separated a few times.

kinneret5764 01-25-2005 09:37 PM

Did Martha-Louise make any money from her CD or children's book? She must have some serious cash stashed away if these sold well.



Quote:

Originally Posted by norwegianne
Skaugum is actually the Royal Family's personal property if I recall correctly (https://www.kongehuset.no is down at the moment so I can't check it there.). It was given to Crown Prince Olav and Crown Princess Märtha as a wedding present. There was some "problems" when the current Crown Prince took over, because of the size of the farm it was his older sister who, by law, should have been offered it first. (Odel-law.)

But anyway.... Norwegian Royal family is probably amongst the poorer of the ruling families of Europe. Queen Maud got a fair share of inheritance from her father, but since King Olav had three children, that inheritance has been separated a few times.


cutie 01-25-2005 09:54 PM

What is the wealth of the Swedish and Danish royal family in relation to the other royal families?

KikkiB 01-26-2005 02:56 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kinneret5764
Did Martha-Louise make any money from her CD or children's book? She must have some serious cash stashed away if these sold well.

She does make money on her books/cds and her fairytaletelling shows (that's what her business is all about). Her husband Ari Behn, doesn't have a fortune or much income (He didn't have it initially anyway, don't konw his fiscal status nowadays).

But they have also had a lot of expendures these past few years. First they bought a large estate and did some remodeling of that. Then they moved to Manhattan, into an appartement that costs 40000 NOK a month, and they also have a nanny. So all in all I think their income is getting more and more like the rest of the Norwegians that work full time :)

bad_barbarella 01-26-2005 06:09 AM

i always thought the windsors would be the richest

norwegianne 01-26-2005 09:03 AM

Every year the Norwegian tax results are announced. The official Royal family is not a part of that, but the latter years since Princess Märtha Louise renounced her official HRH status she has been. You could read in the papers how much her personal fortune was, how much she had earned in the previous year, and how much tax she had paid. You could also find out that about the Princesses Astrid and Ragnhild, I believe. As well as Ari Behn.

Due to privacy reasons the Princesses fiscal information isn't put out in a searchable database on the Internet, as most other Norwegian citizens, but only laid out on actual paper. However, thanks to the tabloids, we can all find it out...

The Court do release an official budget, and account over how they have spent the money they receive from the state. They don't release information on the personal worth of the Royal Family.

cutie 01-27-2005 05:52 PM

Would anyone know the wealth of Swedish and Danish royal family in relation to the other royal families?

Dennism 01-27-2005 05:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by norwegianne
Every year the Norwegian tax results are announced. The official Royal family is not a part of that, but the latter years since Princess Märtha Louise renounced her official HRH status she has been. You could read in the papers how much her personal fortune was, how much she had earned in the previous year, and how much tax she had paid. You could also find out that about the Princesses Astrid and Ragnhild, I believe. As well as Ari Behn.

Due to privacy reasons the Princesses fiscal information isn't put out in a searchable database on the Internet, as most other Norwegian citizens, but only laid out on actual paper. However, thanks to the tabloids, we can all find it out...

The Court do release an official budget, and account over how they have spent the money they receive from the state. They don't release information on the personal worth of the Royal Family.

Yes, this is good in a way that we don´t know too much. Imagine if we knew certain things like...how much money Margrethe spends on cigarettes a year and the annual budget for scrungies for Crown Princess Victoria for example.

Monalisa 02-14-2005 02:52 AM

The salary of royals
 
How much they caost?and how much are their salaries and earnings?



Monalisa:)

Monalisa 02-14-2005 06:28 AM

coast of the MRF!
 
According to the independant moroccan magazine "Telquel",who was the first to have published the cost of the MRF for morocco:


The mensual salary of king Mohammed VI is 35.000 US$,but the caost of whole MRF is 210 MUS$/year,including all charges: the salaries of the other members of the MRF,charges of the royal palaces,charges of the employees of the MRF in divese fields,charges of presents made by the MRF and morocco for their guests,and 146M for charity and assistance to different associations...



The article as is was published by "TelQuel" january18th:






Budget annuel de la monarchie2,28 milliards de DH par anLe roiListes civiles26.292.000Dotations de souveraineté432.164.000La cour royalePersonnel638 382 000Matériel et dépenses diverses1 181 704 000Total2 278 542 000
Chaque année, le budget de l'état inclut deux postes budgétaires destinés à la monarchie.
Le premier concerne directement le roi. Sa première rubrique, "listes civiles", comprend le salaire et indemnités du chef de l’état et de sa famille proche (lire encadré "pensions et salaires royaux"). La seconde, "dotations de souveraineté", comprend surtout deux sous-budgets : 146 millions de dirhams pour les "subventions aux associations et institutions publiques" (Fondation Mohammed V, commissions royales diverses, etc.) et 208 millions de dirhams pour les "dépenses non ventilées" – autrement dit, des dépenses dont personne, hormis les concernés, ne connaît l’affectation ! Une sorte de "caisse noire officielle", en somme.
Le deuxième poste budgétaire, intitulé "Cour royale", est destiné à couvrir les dépenses courantes de la Cour. Il couvre le fonctionnement de tous les palais (personnel, déplacement, entretien…), ainsi que les différents frais afférents à l'exercice de la fonction de roi (déplacements, cérémonies officielles, invitations de chefs d'état et hommes politiques, etc.).





26.292.000 dirhams par an, soit
2,2 millions de DH par mois
Ce chiffre mensuel de 2,2 millions de dirhams est affecté aux "listes civiles". Il faut relever le pluriel, car dans cette somme sont également englobés les salaires de Moulay Rachid, ainsi que des princes et princesses royaux proches. Lesquels? Et combien touche chacun et chacune ? Le budget de l’état ne donne pas de détails. On sait juste que Mohammed VI lui-même touche, en contrepartie de sa fonction de chef d’état, 395.916 dirhams par mois – ce qui reste relativement raisonnable, comparé aux hauts salaires des chefs d’entreprises publiques. Mais attention, la famille royale a des "à-côtés budgétaires", instaurés par feu Hassan II. Le budget de l'état prévoit en effet une pension et rente mensuelles de 1,8 million de dirhams. Ce montant englobe les pensions versées aux frères et sœurs du roi, lui compris. Sans oublier que Moulay Rachid et ses sœurs ont leurs propres listes civiles versées par l'état en contrepartie de leurs fonctions officielles. Selon quelle ventilation, le budget ne le dit pas. Mais un document interne du Palais datant de 1984, que nous avons pu nous procurer, atteste que l’ex-prince héritier Sidi Mohammed percevait un salaire mensuel de 15.000 dirhams, contre 30.000 dirhams pour Moulay Abdellah et 55.000 dirhams, à répartir entre les sœurs de Hassan II.






Subventions du roi et de la Cour310 millions de DH par an
La générosité du roi passe par les caisses de l'état, sous la rubrique "subventions". L’Etat accorde pas moins de 146,6 millions de dirhams par an à Mohammed VI, pour qu’il les redistribue en dons et subventions. Les institutions publiques comme l'Instance équité et réconciliation (IER), la Haute autorité de la communication et de l’audiovisuel (HACA), et d’autres, s'accaparent 83,16 millions de dirhams de ce budget. Mais le roi n’est pas seul à accorder des "subventions". La Cour aussi peut en distribuer. L’enveloppe qui lui est allouée à cette fin est de 163,5 millions de dirhams. La rubrique "subventions" n’est pas propre au Palais. Chaque ministère a la sienne. Celui des Affaires étrangères, par exemple, a distribué en 2004 près de 150 millions de dirhams à des associations privées. Sauf que, dans le cas du Palais, le budget n'explique pas l'affectation de certains montants tirés de cette rubrique. Sous Hassan II, une partie des fonds domiciliés dans cette rubrique étaient destinés à des "personnalités nationales" : hommes politiques, syndicalistes… Ceux dont on dit vulgairement qu’ils ont été "achetés" par la monarchie ont donc été payés sur une ligne budgétaire prévue à cet effet. Il fallait le savoir.












Consommation des palais236,6 millions de DH par an
Les rois aiment les chevaux. La preuve, sur les 11,9 millions de dirhams alloués annuellement à l’achat de produits alimentaires, 10 millions sont destinés à "l’alimentation animale" (c’est écrit comme ça dans le budget). Le gros de la rubrique "consommation" est alloué aux produits énergétiques : 176,9 millions de dirhams par an. 67,3 millions couvrent le carburant et les lubrifiants (seuls l’armée et le ministère de l’Intérieur consomment plus). Les palais consomment 65,3 millions de dirhams par an en électricité (un peu moins que la TVM) et 44,2 millions de dirhams en eau. Pour faire simple, le Palais paie une facture mensuelle d'eau et d'électricité avoisinant les 10 millions de dirhams. Le reste du budget de consommation est dispatché entre l'habillement et les fournitures de bureau. Il en coûte 23 millions de dirhams par an pour les tenues de ces dames et de ces messieurs. Parmi ces tenues, beaucoup d’uniformes de m’khaznia et de gardes royaux, quand même. Mais le budget "caftans" doit être pas mal non plus… Le Palais commande chaque année, enfin, 11,6 millions de dirhams en stylos, papiers et autres fournitures de bureau. A retenir : la facture "abonnements et documentation" s'élève à 3,5 millions de dirhams par an. A ce prix-là (près de 10.000 dirhams par jour !), ces gens-là doivent être abonnés à tous les journaux du monde. Vérification faite auprès de notre service abonnements : pas à Tel Quel, en tout cas.








Parc automobile60 millions de DH par an
Difficile de quantifier le nombre de voitures dont dispose le Palais royal. Le budget dédié au parc automobile se contente de suggérer quelques ordres de grandeur. Ainsi, en 2004, il était prévu de commander pour 4 millions de dirhams de "voitures utilitaires". Ce qui laisse supposer que cette année, aucun ponte de la Cour n’a renouvelé sa grosse berline. Austérité, quand tu nous tiens… A part ça, 18,4 millions de dirhams sont allés à l’entretien et aux réparations. Il n’y a qu’une troisième rubrique de prévue, celle du "fonctionnement". Mais les documents officiels sont embrouillés à ce niveau, les montants se baladant entre les rubriques. Déduisons donc (mais c’est juste une déduction) que ce poste-là réquisitionne tout le reste de l’enveloppe globale, soit 37,6 millions. La nature des frais de "fonctionnement" n’est pas précisée non plus. Qu’y a-t-il dedans ? Des pièces détachées, c’est sûr (on sait que le Palais en stocke énormément) mais aussi… de la location de voitures ! En tout cas, cela se faisait, au moins jusque dans les années 90. On ne sait pas si ça continue. Généralement, les heureux fournisseurs étaient Avis ou Hertz, les plus gros de la place. En 2004, le Palais n’a pas loué de voitures. Majidi serait-il contre ? Suggérons-lui la formule LDD ou "location longue durée". Elle fait fureur, en ce moment, dans les entreprises.



PS:10 Mdhs= 1US$



read more details here:

https://www.telquel-online.com/156/co...re_156_1.shtml




norwegianne 02-14-2005 08:32 AM

Having a monarchy in Norway cost about $35 milions (235 milion NOK) yearly. Most of this money is about keeping the royal residences/gardens, etc... in order, and would have had to be done anyway to preserve a historical heritage.

The King and Queen are paid a little more than a milion USD (7.5 milion NOK), yearly, and the Crown Prince and Crown Princess get around $700,000 (5 milion).

Princess Märtha Louise is not paid by the state, since she renounced her HRH title. Her representation, her dresses etc... is paid for by the King.

Princess Astrid gets honorary pension from the State for her services as Norwegian first lady.

Before the Crown Prince got married he got around $20,000, yearly. A comment was made by an courtier at that time that both he and his sister had to be helped economically by their parents, because what they got from the state wasn't enough to survive on if they were to represent the state in a correct manner.

A suggestion has been made by the court to increase the salary of the royal family by the same percentage when the pay is increased in the rest of the country. (About 4%). https://www.dagbladet.no/nyheter/2005/02/11/423079.html

Monalisa 02-14-2005 12:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by susan alicia
this is holland:

In the Quote of September 2004 the income of various members of the Dutch Royal family are published (it's published yearly by the dutch government)

Beatrix 3.966.000 euro
Willem Alexander 949.000
Maxima 836.000
Bernhard 652.000


those are mensual allowances?i think so!!!

sara1981 02-14-2005 02:47 PM

what about British Royal Family?

Prince Charles and late Princess Diana of Wales
Earl and Countess of Wessex
Andrew,Duke of York and Sarah,Duchess of York
Princess of Royal
HM Queen 2
Prince Philip

and lots of more about member of British Royal Family

Sara Boyce

Monalisa 02-15-2005 07:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sara1981
what about British Royal Family?

Prince Charles and late Princess Diana of Wales
Earl and Countess of Wessex
Andrew,Duke of York and Sarah,Duchess of York
Princess of Royal
HM Queen 2
Prince Philip

and lots of more about member of British Royal Family

Sara Boyce


I read somewhere that the BRF coasts 54millions US$ yearly,but i don't know more details!

Claire 02-17-2005 02:10 PM

The British Royal Family is pretty much paid for by itself. The only person who is on the civil list is HRH The Duke of Edinburgh who gets £359,000. However the government helps to pay for the duties and services of the head of government and those doing duties in her stead. Last year the cost was £36.8 million

The other royals expenses are paid back to the government by the Queen. They get the following amounts:



HRH The Duke of York £249,000

TRH The Duke and Duchess of Kent £236,000

HRH The Princess Royal £228,000

HRH Princess Alexandra £225,000

TRH The Duke and Duchess of Gloucester 175,000

HRH The Earl of Wessex £141,000 **

HRH Princess Alice, Duchess of Gloucester (before her death) £87,000
HRH The Prince of Wales funds himself through funds raised by the Duchy of Cornwall. He also pays Princes William and Harry and undisclosed amount.

** Note that the Countess of Wessex appears no where on this list.

Look at https://www.royal.gov.uk/output/page433.asp.

DDD 02-18-2005 09:36 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by susan alicia
this is holland:

In the Quote of September 2004 the income of various members of the Dutch Royal family are published (it's published yearly by the dutch government)

Beatrix 3.966.000 euro
Willem Alexander 949.000
Maxima 836.000
Bernhard 652.000

In the past three years the royal family lost three salary, Prince Claus, Princess Juliana and Prince Bernhard.
I once read that the total costs are higher than 80 million...
includes Palaces, Gardens, Staff, but most of the money goes tot the security

DDD 02-18-2005 09:42 AM

83.450.000 goes to the royal family.
If the netherlands were a republic the sosts would be less high.
He also needs a place to stay and he also needs security.
The monarchy costs each person 5 euro's...

sara1981 02-18-2005 02:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Claire
The British Royal Family is pretty much paid for by itself. The only person who is on the civil list is HRH The Duke of Edinburgh who gets £359,000. However the government helps to pay for the duties and services of the head of government and those doing duties in her stead. Last year the cost was £36.8 million

The other royals expenses are paid back to the government by the Queen. They get the following amounts:



HRH The Duke of York £249,000

TRH The Duke and Duchess of Kent £236,000

HRH The Princess Royal £228,000

HRH Princess Alexandra £225,000

TRH The Duke and Duchess of Gloucester 175,000

HRH The Earl of Wessex £141,000 **

HRH Princess Alice, Duchess of Gloucester (before her death) £87,000
HRH The Prince of Wales funds himself through funds raised by the Duchy of Cornwall. He also pays Princes William and Harry and undisclosed amount.

** Note that the Countess of Wessex appears no where on this list.

Look at https://www.royal.gov.uk/output/page433.asp.

im american i hardly understand about prices

what about late Diana,Princess of Wales?

Sara Boyce

selrahc4 02-18-2005 02:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sara1981
what about late Diana,Princess of Wales?

Sara Boyce

She was never included on the Civil List

HMQueenElizabethII 02-18-2005 09:24 PM

How about Her Majesty The Queen?

gaggleofcrazypeople 02-18-2005 11:16 PM

She is worth about a billion, so it doesn't really matter how much she makes. She already has enough money to support herself.

msfroyste 02-19-2005 02:14 AM

the Queen is worth well over an estimated usd 10 billion, namely due to the various crown properties. however, on her own, i think it was forbes or fortune magazine who said it, that she was worth somewhere between usd 200 and 500 million, and that amount is her personal fortune.

ElisaR 02-19-2005 07:46 PM

It's also important to point out that the most of these millions are "made" of the two private estates (Balmoral and Sandringham): she has not very much money.

Monalisa 02-22-2005 10:10 AM

BELGIUM :


As provided by Article 77 of the Constitution and according to the law of November 16, 1993, the Civil List for the entire reign of H.M. King Albert II was established (subject to adjustments linked to the consumer price index), as well as a lifetime annuity for H.M. Dowager Queen Fabiola and an annual allowance for H.R.H. Prince Philippe.

The Civil List covers all personal expenses as well as clerical, administrative, office, staff and maintenance of royal palaces and official residences, travel, and entertainment. Security expenses are borne by the government.

Initial figures for 1996 budget are:

The King's Civil List 253,900,000 BEF
Queen Fabiola's annuity 46,900,000 BEF
Prince Philippe 13,900,000 BEF
Royal Family, other allowances 14,800,000 BEF

Total 329,500,000 Belgian Francs
(US$9,852,050)
(1972 survey: $1,485,220)

By contrast, the 1996 Budget allocations for the Prime Minister's Office total 116,000,000 BEF (other ministers receive separate allocations), and for the Belgian Parliament a total of 5,383,500,000 BEF.

Source: letter from Piettre Emmanuel De Bauw, Second Secretary, Belgian Embassy, July 29, 1996; Notice sur la Liste Civile du Roi. Letter from Vincent Pardoen, Intendant of the King's Civil List, September 3rd, 1996. Ministry of Finance Budget of November 24, 1995, as published in the Moniteur Belge, December 30, 1995, Federal Information Service, Brussels.


more informations here:https://members.tripod.com/constantan/expense.html

Monalisa 02-22-2005 10:13 AM

SPAIN :


Total allotment of 924 million pesetas; no amounts allocated directly to other members of the Royal Family. Under Article 65 of the Constitution, this amount is meant to provide for the Family and Household of the monarch.

Total 924,000,000 pesetas
(US$6,837,600)

Maintenance of palaces: by Patrimonio Nacional

Expenses of state visits abroad: covered by budget of Ministry of Foreign Affairs

Source: Chief of Press Relations, Zarzuela, letter of 21 April 1996.

Monalisa 02-22-2005 10:20 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by selrahc4
She was never included on the Civil List


I found that in the website posted below:


UNITED KINGDOM :

The cost of the British monarchy has been the subject of the most intense public discussion and speculation, as well as the most widespread misinformation. This is a complex subject, as nearly every aspect of the "cost" of the British monarchy is rooted in centuries of historical usage, tradition, and sometimes arcane bureaucratic processes. Calculation of costs is further complicated by the fact that "the British monarchy" itself is sometimes delineated with difficulty, and one must constantly define "cost," "British," and "monarchy.". It may be argued that more than any other monarchy, it is more than the sum of its parts. The British monarchy is an integral, and large, institution of national society and identity. The monarch, other members of the Royal Family, the various Palaces and historic buildings, the Crown Jewels, gilt coaches, and other trappings, are icons of the United Kingdom, instantly and universally identifiable.

The monarchy derives its financial support from three basic sources, the Civil List, the Grant-in-Aid, and the Privy Purse, with additional funds voted by Government departments.

The Civil List: "The Civil List is the fixed annual sum provided by Parliament to meet the official expenses incurred by The Queen's Household so that Her Majesty can fulfill her role as Head of State. The Civil List is not in any sense remuneration or ‘pay' for The Queen. It is provided to meet those expenses necessarily incurred to enable The Queen to undertake her many public engagements and duties in [the United Kingdom] and abroad." Some 70% of the Civil List goes to salaries of personnel who work directly for The Queen; non-staff expenses include social functions (some 40,000 people are entertained by The Queen annually) and office expenses at Buckingham Palace. The amount of the Civil List is set by Parliament, and paid by the Government.

Under the current system, effective since 1991, Parliament sets a fixed annual amount for the Civil List for a ten-year period. "The fixed annual amount would exceed expenditures during the first part of the ten-year period, enabling reserves to be established to meet deficits toward the end of the period when, as a result of inflation, expenditures would be expected to exceed the fixed amount." The Civil List was set at £7.9 million to be paid annually for the ten-year period commencing January 1st, 1991, with an annual increase of approximately 6.5% to cover inflation.

Civil List expenditures for 1990, the latest year for which final figures are available, were £5,060,000. Surpluses are carried over from year to year as reserves; any surplus at the end of the current ten-year period will be applied to offset expenses of the Civil List in the following period.

Civil List for 1996 £7,900,000

The Grant-in-Aid is the funds provided by the Department of National Heritage for property services in the Royal or Occupied Palaces (Buckingham Palace, St. James's palace, Clarence House, Marlborough House Mews, Kensington Palace, Windsor Castle, Frogmore House, Hampton Court Mews and Paddocks; in total, some 100 buildings, 6,000 rooms, and 20 acres of roofs. (The Palace of Holyroodhouse is the responsibility of Historic Scotland; the Historic Royal Palaces or Unoccupied Palaces, including the Tower of London and Hampton Court, are looked after by the Historic Royal Palace Agency.)

The Occupied Palaces are used for Head of State and ceremonial purposes, and as official residences by The Queen, other members of the Royal Family, and employees. They also provide offices and workshops for staff and craftsmen. Approximately 75% of the funds are spent on property maintenance, and 25% on utilities, security, fire safety, craftsmen, cleaning, and gardening. "The Occupied Palaces are an important part of the national heritage and the largest part of the Grant-in-Aid is spent on their maintenance and conservation." The properties covered by the Grant-in-Aid are largely in the nature of museums, historic buildings, and monuments. The Grant-in-Aid does not apply to such properties as Sandringham or Balmoral, which are the property of The Queen personally.

Grant-in-Aid, 1994-95 £20,541,000

In 1991, the Royal Household assumed responsibility for property services in the Occupied Palaces, and considerable savings have been achieved. "The Royal Household plans to reduce the annual amount of the Grant-in-Aid to£15 million by the end of the decade. If this is achieved more than £70 million will have been saved, in real terms, since the Royal Household assumed responsibility..."

The Privy Purse derives its funding from the Duchy of Lancaster, income from Privy Purse retained reserves, and payments from the Sandringham Estate. Duchy of Lancaster net surplus for the year ended September, 1994 amounted to £3.9 million. "The funds received by the Privy Purse... [are] used to meet official expenditure incurred by The Queen as Sovereign which has not historically been charged to the Civil List, as well as some of The Queen's private expenditure." Such official expenditure includes providing for official expenses of other members of the Royal Family, pensions and welfare for official staff, and official costs incurred by the Royal Household when The Queen is in residence at Balmoral and Sandringham.

"Since 1399 [the landed estate known as the Duchy of Lancaster] passed to each reigning Monarch, with the Duchy revenue providing a source of income separate from other Crown inheritances." The Duchy estate is divided into surveys for management purposes:

- Crewe Survey, comprising 5,050 acres in Cheshire, Shropshire and Derbyshire

- Lancashire Survey, comprising 11,750 acres in the Fylde and in the Forest of Bowland

- Needwood Estate, 7,540 acres in Staffordshire

- Yorkshire Survey, comprising approximately 19,980 acres between Pickering and Scarborough

- South Survey, comprising approximately 6,450 acres in Northamptonshire and Lincolnshire

The Duchy also owns commercial properties in London and elsewhere, and other investments.

The Prince of Wales, as Heir to the Throne, receives no funds under the Civil List Acts, but, under an arrangement dating back seven centuries, receives the annual net revenues of the Duchy of Cornwall (he is 24th Duke of Cornwall, as Heir to the Throne; the title of Prince of Wales is not automatically conferred on the Heir) for the costs of all public and private commitments. Although these revenues of the Duchy are tax exempt, the Prince has voluntarily given up 25% of this income to the Exchequer. In 1993, at the same time as The Queen volunteered to pay income tax on her private income, the Prince of Wales volunteered to pay income tax on his Duchy income.

The Duchy currently owns approximately 130,000 acres of land in 23 counties. In 1994, the Prince of Wales received £4.5 million before tax from the Duchy of Cornwall.

Other Members of the Royal Family
Other members of the Royal Family have been paid Parliamentary Annuities from Government funds to meet official expenses incurred in carrying out public duties, under the Civil List Acts. Under the 1990 financial arrangements, the following annuities were set for the decade 1991-2000, with an annual increase of approximately 7.5% to cover inflation:

H.M. Queen Elizabeth The Queen Mother £643,000
H.R.H. The Prince Philip, Duke of Edinburgh £359,000
H.R.H. The Duke of York £249,000
H.R.H. The Prince Edward £96,000
H.R.H. The Princess Royal £228,000
H.R.H. The Princess Margaret, Countess of Snowdon £219,000
H.R.H. Princess Alice, Duchess of Gloucester £87,000
H.R.H. The Duke of Gloucester £175,000
H.R.H. The Duke of Kent £236,000
H.R.H. Princess Alexandra, the Honourable Lady Ogilvy £225,000

Since 1975, The Queen has reimbursed the Government for the annuities paid to her cousins, the Duke of Gloucester, the Duke of Kent, and Princess Alexandra. It was announced in late 1992 that, effective April 1993, The Queen would also reimburse the annuities for all other members of the Royal Family, except for H.M. Queen Elizabeth The Queen Mother and the Duke of Edinburgh. H.M. Queen Elizabeth The Queen Mother and the Duke of Edinburgh are now "the only members of the Royal Family other than The Queen in receipt of money from public funds which is not repaid."

The Prince of Wales receives no public funds. Diana, Princess of Wales and Sarah, Duchess of York received no public funds before or after their respective divorces.

Accordingly, the only public funds allocated to members of the Royal Family other than The Queen, which are not reimbursed by The Queen, are:

H.M. Queen Elizabeth The Queen Mother, widow of H.M. King George VI £643,000
H.R.H. The Prince Philip, Duke of Edinburgh, consort of the present Monarch £359,000


Monalisa 02-22-2005 10:23 AM

UNITED KINGDOM (next)more details:



The Duchy currently owns approximately 130,000 acres of land in 23 counties. In 1994, the Prince of Wales received £4.5 million before tax from the Duchy of Cornwall.

Other Members of the Royal Family
Other members of the Royal Family have been paid Parliamentary Annuities from Government funds to meet official expenses incurred in carrying out public duties, under the Civil List Acts. Under the 1990 financial arrangements, the following annuities were set for the decade 1991-2000, with an annual increase of approximately 7.5% to cover inflation:

H.M. Queen Elizabeth The Queen Mother £643,000
H.R.H. The Prince Philip, Duke of Edinburgh £359,000
H.R.H. The Duke of York £249,000
H.R.H. The Prince Edward £96,000
H.R.H. The Princess Royal £228,000
H.R.H. The Princess Margaret, Countess of Snowdon £219,000
H.R.H. Princess Alice, Duchess of Gloucester £87,000
H.R.H. The Duke of Gloucester £175,000
H.R.H. The Duke of Kent £236,000
H.R.H. Princess Alexandra, the Honourable Lady Ogilvy £225,000


Since 1975, The Queen has reimbursed the Government for the annuities paid to her cousins, the Duke of Gloucester, the Duke of Kent, and Princess Alexandra. It was announced in late 1992 that, effective April 1993, The Queen would also reimburse the annuities for all other members of the Royal Family, except for H.M. Queen Elizabeth The Queen Mother and the Duke of Edinburgh. H.M. Queen Elizabeth The Queen Mother and the Duke of Edinburgh are now "the only members of the Royal Family other than The Queen in receipt of money from public funds which is not repaid."

The Prince of Wales receives no public funds. Diana, Princess of Wales and Sarah, Duchess of York received no public funds before or after their respective divorces.

Accordingly, the only public funds allocated to members of the Royal Family other than The Queen, which are not reimbursed by The Queen, are:

H.M. Queen Elizabeth The Queen Mother, widow of H.M. King George VI £643,000
H.R.H. The Prince Philip, Duke of Edinburgh, consort of the present Monarch £359,000

Other Expenses
"In addition to the Civil List and the Grant-in-Aid there are a number of other items of expenditure connected with the public activities of the Royal Family which fall on votes of Government departments," the main items being the Royal Train, No. 32 (The Royal) Squadron, and the Royal Yacht.

The Royal Train: "The Royal train makes efficient use of traveling time by allowing travel overnight. This not only increases the time available for public engagements... but by serving in effect as a mobile hotel for Members of the Royal Family and their staff, the Royal Train minimizes disruption to the general public and saves security costs."

No. 32 (The Royal) Squadron: No. 32 (The Royal) Squadron (formerly The Queen's Flight) is operated by the Royal Air Force, and consists of eleven aircraft and six helicopters, with personnel of 101. The Queen, Queen Elizabeth The Queen Mother, the Duke of Edinburgh, and the Prince of Wales are entitled to use it, and other members of the Royal Family at The Queen's discretion, as well as ministers, senior service officers, and occasionally by visiting foreign heads of state. "Use of The Queen's Flight enhances safety and security as well as minimizing disruption and inconvenience to other passengers on a civil flight," although The Queen has recently used commercial aircraft on overseas travel, and other members of the Royal Family frequently use commercial aircraft on international travel.

H.M.Y. Britannia: Commissioned in 1954, the Britannia "has provided a high profile, prestigious base for Royal tours both in home waters and overseas, [and] provides not only reception rooms for up to 250 guests but includes office space and accommodation for staff... In recent years Britannia has been used for seminars to promote British trade and technology overseas, often in conjunction with Royal visits." Britannia is to be decommissioned in late 1997; it was announced in January, 1997 that Parliament would allocate funds for the construction of a new royal yacht, with furnishings to be provided by The Queen. The new yacht is to enter into service in 2002, in time for the Queen's Golden Jubilee.

Other expenses borne on votes of Government departments on services connected with the Royal Family include the following; figures shown are the amounts for 1994-95, the latest ones available to us:

- Foreign and Commonwealth Office (Marshal of the Diplomatic Corps) £63,061
- Foreign and Commonwealth Office (overseas visits at the request of Government departments) £558,268
- Department of Transport (official travel by train and maintenance of Royal Train) £2,469,000
- Treasury (Central Chancery of Orders of Knighthood) £201,000
- Ministry of Defence (Royal Yacht) £11,424,000
- Ministry of Defence (No. 32 (The Royal) Squadron) £8,960,445
- Ministry of Defence (Royal flights in civil aircraft) £160,000
- Ministry of Defence (Equerries) £224,000
- Central Office of Information (publicity services) amount not available; £308,104 for 1993-94
Many of the Palaces and other properties involved in these expenditures are considered to be major tourist attractions, some are open to the public, most serve public or official functions, some provide residential units for staff, and many are considered to be important parts of the national heritage. Other expenses are collateral to the monarchy, for example in providing for the ceremonial occasions which have become a hallmark of British culture.

It should be noted particularly that the Civil List dates back to the Restoration, at which time an annual grant was made to The King which, in effect, was a Parliamentary contribution to help cover "expenses of Civil Government," including the judiciary and foreign service. "This system was changed in 1760 on George III's Accession, when it was decided that the whole of the cost of the Civil List should be provided by Parliament in return for the surrender of the hereditary revenues [(the Crown Estate)] by the King for the duration of the reign. This arrangement, whereby at the beginning of each reign the Sovereign agrees to continue the surrender of the hereditary revenues [£88.4 million in 1994] in return for the receipt of an annual Civil List, has continued to this day." The present system is for the annual amount of the Civil List to be fixed every ten years; it will thus be considered again in the year 2000.

Thus, if the revenues from the Crown Estate had not been surrendered to the Government at the start of the present Queen's reign in 1952, she would have received £88,400,000 in 1994. Instead, the total of the figures cited above (including even those which, in fairness, should not be attributed entirely as costs of the monarchy, such as No. 32 (The Royal) Squadron, which is not used exclusively by the Royal Family) is £53,810,878. Not all of the figures cited above apply to precisely the same time periods, but they are close, and show that revenues from the Crown Estate contribute about £30,000,000 more to Government coffers than the sums which are paid out in support of the monarchy.

Total £53,810,878

sara1981 02-23-2005 01:19 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Monalisa
I found that in the website posted below:


UNITED KINGDOM :

The cost of the British monarchy has been the subject of the most intense public discussion and speculation, as well as the most widespread misinformation. This is a complex subject, as nearly every aspect of the "cost" of the British monarchy is rooted in centuries of historical usage, tradition, and sometimes arcane bureaucratic processes. Calculation of costs is further complicated by the fact that "the British monarchy" itself is sometimes delineated with difficulty, and one must constantly define "cost," "British," and "monarchy.". It may be argued that more than any other monarchy, it is more than the sum of its parts. The British monarchy is an integral, and large, institution of national society and identity. The monarch, other members of the Royal Family, the various Palaces and historic buildings, the Crown Jewels, gilt coaches, and other trappings, are icons of the United Kingdom, instantly and universally identifiable.

The monarchy derives its financial support from three basic sources, the Civil List, the Grant-in-Aid, and the Privy Purse, with additional funds voted by Government departments.

The Civil List: "The Civil List is the fixed annual sum provided by Parliament to meet the official expenses incurred by The Queen's Household so that Her Majesty can fulfill her role as Head of State. The Civil List is not in any sense remuneration or ‘pay' for The Queen. It is provided to meet those expenses necessarily incurred to enable The Queen to undertake her many public engagements and duties in [the United Kingdom] and abroad." Some 70% of the Civil List goes to salaries of personnel who work directly for The Queen; non-staff expenses include social functions (some 40,000 people are entertained by The Queen annually) and office expenses at Buckingham Palace. The amount of the Civil List is set by Parliament, and paid by the Government.

Under the current system, effective since 1991, Parliament sets a fixed annual amount for the Civil List for a ten-year period. "The fixed annual amount would exceed expenditures during the first part of the ten-year period, enabling reserves to be established to meet deficits toward the end of the period when, as a result of inflation, expenditures would be expected to exceed the fixed amount." The Civil List was set at £7.9 million to be paid annually for the ten-year period commencing January 1st, 1991, with an annual increase of approximately 6.5% to cover inflation.

Civil List expenditures for 1990, the latest year for which final figures are available, were £5,060,000. Surpluses are carried over from year to year as reserves; any surplus at the end of the current ten-year period will be applied to offset expenses of the Civil List in the following period.

Civil List for 1996 £7,900,000

The Grant-in-Aid is the funds provided by the Department of National Heritage for property services in the Royal or Occupied Palaces (Buckingham Palace, St. James's palace, Clarence House, Marlborough House Mews, Kensington Palace, Windsor Castle, Frogmore House, Hampton Court Mews and Paddocks; in total, some 100 buildings, 6,000 rooms, and 20 acres of roofs. (The Palace of Holyroodhouse is the responsibility of Historic Scotland; the Historic Royal Palaces or Unoccupied Palaces, including the Tower of London and Hampton Court, are looked after by the Historic Royal Palace Agency.)

The Occupied Palaces are used for Head of State and ceremonial purposes, and as official residences by The Queen, other members of the Royal Family, and employees. They also provide offices and workshops for staff and craftsmen. Approximately 75% of the funds are spent on property maintenance, and 25% on utilities, security, fire safety, craftsmen, cleaning, and gardening. "The Occupied Palaces are an important part of the national heritage and the largest part of the Grant-in-Aid is spent on their maintenance and conservation." The properties covered by the Grant-in-Aid are largely in the nature of museums, historic buildings, and monuments. The Grant-in-Aid does not apply to such properties as Sandringham or Balmoral, which are the property of The Queen personally.

Grant-in-Aid, 1994-95 £20,541,000

In 1991, the Royal Household assumed responsibility for property services in the Occupied Palaces, and considerable savings have been achieved. "The Royal Household plans to reduce the annual amount of the Grant-in-Aid to£15 million by the end of the decade. If this is achieved more than £70 million will have been saved, in real terms, since the Royal Household assumed responsibility..."

The Privy Purse derives its funding from the Duchy of Lancaster, income from Privy Purse retained reserves, and payments from the Sandringham Estate. Duchy of Lancaster net surplus for the year ended September, 1994 amounted to £3.9 million. "The funds received by the Privy Purse... [are] used to meet official expenditure incurred by The Queen as Sovereign which has not historically been charged to the Civil List, as well as some of The Queen's private expenditure." Such official expenditure includes providing for official expenses of other members of the Royal Family, pensions and welfare for official staff, and official costs incurred by the Royal Household when The Queen is in residence at Balmoral and Sandringham.

"Since 1399 [the landed estate known as the Duchy of Lancaster] passed to each reigning Monarch, with the Duchy revenue providing a source of income separate from other Crown inheritances." The Duchy estate is divided into surveys for management purposes:

- Crewe Survey, comprising 5,050 acres in Cheshire, Shropshire and Derbyshire

- Lancashire Survey, comprising 11,750 acres in the Fylde and in the Forest of Bowland

- Needwood Estate, 7,540 acres in Staffordshire

- Yorkshire Survey, comprising approximately 19,980 acres between Pickering and Scarborough

- South Survey, comprising approximately 6,450 acres in Northamptonshire and Lincolnshire

The Duchy also owns commercial properties in London and elsewhere, and other investments.

The Prince of Wales, as Heir to the Throne, receives no funds under the Civil List Acts, but, under an arrangement dating back seven centuries, receives the annual net revenues of the Duchy of Cornwall (he is 24th Duke of Cornwall, as Heir to the Throne; the title of Prince of Wales is not automatically conferred on the Heir) for the costs of all public and private commitments. Although these revenues of the Duchy are tax exempt, the Prince has voluntarily given up 25% of this income to the Exchequer. In 1993, at the same time as The Queen volunteered to pay income tax on her private income, the Prince of Wales volunteered to pay income tax on his Duchy income.

The Duchy currently owns approximately 130,000 acres of land in 23 counties. In 1994, the Prince of Wales received £4.5 million before tax from the Duchy of Cornwall.

Other Members of the Royal Family
Other members of the Royal Family have been paid Parliamentary Annuities from Government funds to meet official expenses incurred in carrying out public duties, under the Civil List Acts. Under the 1990 financial arrangements, the following annuities were set for the decade 1991-2000, with an annual increase of approximately 7.5% to cover inflation:

H.M. Queen Elizabeth The Queen Mother £643,000
H.R.H. The Prince Philip, Duke of Edinburgh £359,000
H.R.H. The Duke of York £249,000
H.R.H. The Prince Edward £96,000
H.R.H. The Princess Royal £228,000
H.R.H. The Princess Margaret, Countess of Snowdon £219,000
H.R.H. Princess Alice, Duchess of Gloucester £87,000
H.R.H. The Duke of Gloucester £175,000
H.R.H. The Duke of Kent £236,000
H.R.H. Princess Alexandra, the Honourable Lady Ogilvy £225,000

Since 1975, The Queen has reimbursed the Government for the annuities paid to her cousins, the Duke of Gloucester, the Duke of Kent, and Princess Alexandra. It was announced in late 1992 that, effective April 1993, The Queen would also reimburse the annuities for all other members of the Royal Family, except for H.M. Queen Elizabeth The Queen Mother and the Duke of Edinburgh. H.M. Queen Elizabeth The Queen Mother and the Duke of Edinburgh are now "the only members of the Royal Family other than The Queen in receipt of money from public funds which is not repaid."

The Prince of Wales receives no public funds. Diana, Princess of Wales and Sarah, Duchess of York received no public funds before or after their respective divorces.

Accordingly, the only public funds allocated to members of the Royal Family other than The Queen, which are not reimbursed by The Queen, are:

H.M. Queen Elizabeth The Queen Mother, widow of H.M. King George VI £643,000
H.R.H. The Prince Philip, Duke of Edinburgh, consort of the present Monarch £359,000

I understand why late Diana,Princess of Wales and Sarah,Duchess of York cant getting public funds from Prince of Wales because i understand why! Princess Diana got divorces from Prince Charles in 1996 but Diana still work lots before she died in 1997.

if Diana would funds herself after divorces? and Sarah,Duchess of York also? but i little confuses with posts!

Sara Boyce

semisquare 03-21-2005 04:06 PM

does anyone think that the cost of having a royal family out ways the money they can bring in? case in point is the brit's royal family-i've read it somewhere they bring in a lot of money because people are willing to travel to see different royal events.

rchainho 03-31-2005 05:49 PM

does anyone has the list of the top 10 richest royal families?

Humera 04-01-2005 08:08 PM

I dont know about the various regions, but I believe Sultan Hassanal Bolkiah of Brunei is the richest monarch in the world. He used to be the wealthiest person in the world but that was before his brother squandered away billions. He is undoubtedly the richest monarch in Asia.

"Brunei Darussalam on the island of Borneo is the closest South East Asia comes to utopia. It’s a land of sandy beaches, forests, rivers- and no taxes. Although it’s one of the smallest countries, the Sultanate of Brunei is one of the richest nations in Asia. The Sultan of Brunei is the world’s richest monarch; the people have the highest per capita incomes in the world; there are no personal taxes; healthcare and education are free; and houses and cars are subsidised."
https://www.journeymart.com/DExplorer...ei/default.asp

The Saudi King is also among the wealthiest in the world, certainly in the Middle East.

lamass 04-02-2005 12:05 PM

i heard that the liechtenstein family is really wealthy for europe. they have some billion to their name.

Warren 04-02-2005 12:22 PM

King of Thailand
 
From the Sydney Morning Herald 24.7.03 ...

THAI KING CAN WHISTLE A HAPPY TUNE

Unlike their European counterparts, who are mostly sustained by taxes, Thailand's Royals pay their own way. And they do so via the Crown Property Bureau, created in the 1930s when Thailand was transformed from an absolute monarchy - the Royal Family owned literally everything - to the constitutional monarchy it is today.

The CPB inherited about half of downtown Bangkok and owns controlling stakes in blue-chip companies. It has been conservatively valued at A$40 billion.

Its finances are known to only a handful; the King and a board of aristocratic courtiers and ex-politicians, and Thailand's Finance Minister who is also a director of CPB.
.

Alisa 04-02-2005 03:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bad_barbarella
i always thought the windsors would be the richest


The Liechtenstein Princely family are the wealthiest in royal/princely family in Europe. Their wealth is their own. It is mostly contained in the vast majority of land and property that they own, not to mention their immense art collection that contains some of the most famous and valuable art pieces in the world.

Here is the Forbes 2005 of the richest royals

click royals and rulers in the left margin

Nathalian 04-02-2005 11:38 PM

Alisa....I couldn´t open your site....could you send again...I know that the last is the Belgians....they ONLY (ironic only) have 45 million dollar....

Warren 04-03-2005 04:22 AM

Luxembourg
 
These are from previous posts ...

[QUOTE] The Luxembourg royal family comes in second place with approximately £3 billion.

[Former] Grand Duke Jean of Luxembourg follows with £800 million
[QUOTE] .


Does anyone have any knowledge of what assets these figures are based on?
.

Alisa 04-03-2005 02:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nathalian
Alisa....I couldn´t open your site....could you send again...I know that the last is the Belgians....they ONLY (ironic only) have 45 million dollar....

I hope this works:
https://www.forbes.com/billionaires/2...hisSpeed=40000

Benjamin 05-16-2005 05:58 PM

Wealth of Europe's Royals
 
R E G A L R I C H E Shttps://a740.g.akamai.net/f/740/606/1...images/dot.gif
Jun. 3, 2002/Vol. 159 No. 22


Secrets of the Counting House

When the family jewels run to crowns, scepters and diamond-encrusted tiaras, making ends meet is clearly not a pressing concern. But not all of Europe’s royal families can lay claim to a king’s ransom

https://a740.g.akamai.net/f/740/606/1...images/dot.gifBy JOE PERRYhttps://a740.g.akamai.net/f/740/606/1...images/dot.gif
LIECHTENSTEIN
They reign over a mere sliver of a state, but their fortune is decidedly big league. The Liechtenstein family’s wealth, which predates their purchase of the principality that bears their name, was once concentrated in vast land holdings in the Holy Roman Empire. The family still has estates in Austria, but today their estimated $4.6 billion fortune derives mostly from a priceless art collection and the family-owned finance company, LGT Group, with recent profits of more than $43 million and $27 billion in assets under management in its banking division.

LUXEMBOURG
A 1999 survey by EuroBusiness magazine ranked Luxembourg’s grand ducal family — who, like the Liechtensteins, reign over a small country with an unusually high concentration of banks — as Europe’s second-richest royals, with an estimated fortune of $4.3 billion. Much of their wealth is in land and investments.

THE NETHERLANDS
The House of Orange can bask in the golden glow of a fortune estimated at more than $3 billion. The family is thought once to have owned as much as a quarter of the Royal Dutch/Shell Group. Their diversified portfolio includes a range of investments, as well as an extensive art collection and large amounts of landholdings. The state has placed three palaces at the disposal of the royal family

BELGIUM
Intense speculation last year about the size of their fortune prompted the royal family to issue an unusual clarification on the subject. The official figure of nearly $11.5 million is far below previous estimates, like the EuroBusiness sum of $2 billion. The royal family says that figure also included state assets. But the palace’s total does not count a villa in France and a yacht, or art and other land holdings.

DENMARK
Queen Margrethe’s annual $6.75 million allowance contributes to the maintenance of the royal family. EuroBusiness has estimated that the family also has a relatively modest fortune of $15 million in an investment fund. However the palace — which refuses to release details of the royals’ wealth — says this is "too high."

NORWAY
King Harald V is said to have inherited a significant fortune, much of it in property in Britain, from his father Olav V, a grandson of Britain’s King Edward VII. EuroBusiness estimated the family’s total private wealth at around $130 million, but the palace refuses any comment on the matter.

SWEDEN
The 10 palaces King Carl XVI Gustaf and his family have at their disposal are state-owned, and he pays taxes at the same rates as any Swede. The Swedish court confirms that the King’s private fortune is in the range of $20 million.

MONACO
Like many of the residents of this ministate, Prince Rainier has a sizable, tax-exempt personal fortune. His Grimaldi family owns about a fourth of Monaco’s 195 hectares and 69% of SBM — the company that owns Monte Carlo’s Casino — which had profits of around $27 million. The family’s art collection is said to include works by Rubens and Goya.

SPAIN
Little is known about the reigning Bourbon family’s wealth. Everything from the royal yacht to family jewels is state property and they have few personal assets. Though well-connected — Queen Sofia was born a Greek princess — they’re thought to be among Europe’s least-rich royals.

(Article taken from https://www.time.com/time/europe/maga...hy/riches.html)

bigheadshirmp 05-16-2005 06:32 PM

Hans Adam II
Prince, LiechtensteinNet Worth: $2.2 billion
A despot reigns over the tiny tax haven of Liechtenstein. Hans Adam grabbed near-absolute power in a referendum last year--he can now hire and fire the government, veto laws and appoint judges at will. Family holdings include three 17th-century palaces and four houses in central Vienna, a priceless art collection that includes works by Rembrandt and Rubens and an estimated 20,000 hectares of land in Austria. Also owns the decidedly opaque LGT private bank. Hans Adam is set to turn power over to his son, Crown Prince Alois, later this year.from www.forbes.com

Richest royal in europe~:D as of 2004

bigheadshirmp 05-16-2005 06:33 PM

Queen Elizabeth II
Queen, U.K.Net Worth: $660 million
Christened in the Buckingham chapel and homeschooled in art and music, Queen Elizabeth II was coronated in 1953 at age 27. Safeguards invaluable, state-owned treasures like the Crown Jewels. Her personal portfolio includes fine art, gems, antiques and a stamp collection begun by grandfather King George V. Also owns real estate and equity stakes. While the Queen closely guards the details of her purse, she seems less successful maintaining mums-the-word on palace affairs. Recent tabloid headlines included news that Princess Diana foretold her "accidental" death in her diary.

bigheadshirmp 05-16-2005 06:44 PM

Queen Beatrix Wilhelmina Armgard
Queen, The NetherlandsNet Worth: $260 million
Another eventful year for the House of Orange. Good news: Queen Beatrix's new daughter-in-law, Maxima, gave birth to a baby daughter, Catharina-Amalia, in early December. But also a black eye: Her second son, Johan Friso, is renouncing his claim to the throne after it was revealed that his future wife had been involved with a mobster. None of which, of course, has affected the family fortune, made up of antiques, real estate and investments in national stalwarts like Royal Dutch Petroleum and ABN Amro.



they only have 3 european royals in the list...the others are from the middle east, asia, and cuba

bigheadshirmp 05-16-2005 07:01 PM

Hans Adam II
Prince, LiechtensteinNet Worth: $2.2 billion
A despot reigns over the tiny tax haven of Liechtenstein. Hans Adam grabbed near-absolute power in a referendum last year--he can now hire and fire the government, veto laws and appoint judges at will. Family holdings include three 17th-century palaces and four houses in central Vienna, a priceless art collection that includes works by Rembrandt and Rubens and an estimated 20,000 hectares of land in Austria. Also owns the decidedly opaque LGT private bank. Hans Adam is set to turn power over to his son, Crown Prince Alois, later this year.from www.forbes.com

Richest royal in europe~:D as of 2004

azile 05-31-2005 02:33 PM

Civil List income and extravegant Royal spending
 
I just returned from a wonderful 2-week trip to England. While we saw many wonderful and beautiful sites, we particularly focused on sites relating to the Royal Family and it’s history while in London.



Until now, I have been a huge fan of the British Royal family, and have followed them since I was a little girl. My interest has recently expanded into interest in all of the European Royals.



However, at the end of this trip I was left feeling quite disappointed. There were two things that contributed to this:



1. Overly expensive entrance costs to royal sites- while I understand that it costs great amounts to keep public attractions open, I was struck by the irony that I was paying large sums of money to visit sites under the ownership of the richest woman in the world! Since civil list income goes toward the maintenance of these locations, I was a little shocked that British taxpayers are expected to hand over their tax dollars PLUS pay entrance fees to these places.



At Windsor, there was great emphasis placed on the entrance fees as covering renovations resulting from the 1992 fire. However, when you look at the overall budget for the renovations, a small percentage has come from the entrance fees while most of the costs were covered again by British tax dollars. An even smaller amount was paid by the Royal Family itself and, because the Castle is not insured, there was no insurance money to be collected.



The Royal Collections are, I understand, property of the Crown and I was wondering why it is so expensive to visit them!





2. Negative public opinion against the Royal Family- visiting with British friends (and their friends!) I was very surprised by the huge amount of disgust that exists for the Royal Family. One person described their existence as “state-sanctioned thievery” and it was very clear that many people resent funding the extravagant lifestyles of the Royals. One person cited (and this could be corrected if need be) that the apartments in Kensington Palace are rented to royals for 69 pounds per month, when the actual real estate value would be several thousand pounds per month. The BBC documentary about Windsor Castle showed the wine steward opening up hundreds of extremely rare and even more extremely expensive vintage wines for a banquet- the total sum of wine alone being in the range of several hundred thousand pounds. There are reports about continuous spending on new polo ponies, home renovations (for personal and not state reasons) and so on. This all seems to have left a very bitter taste in the mouths of the average British citizen.



My question is this- what kind of accountability is there for Royals who draw income from Civil Lists? Is Britain the only monarchy funded by a Civil list? What other monarchs have similar income and what is the public opinion in these countries?



I’m interested to hear your thoughts on this topic!



Eliza

EmpressRouge 05-31-2005 03:18 PM

I'm no expert on this area (and I could be wrong on some of these things) but here our some of my thoughts.
1) expensive entrance fees: I was in London recently (Nov. 04), and though I did not go to Windsor, I noticed the high prices on admission to places like Kensington. However, I then noticed how high prices are on everything in Europe, especially with the depreciation of the US$ in recent years.
2) The Queen's property. A lot of the property (castles, jewelry, paintings) the queen "owns" is property of the state, and thus as Head of State, it's all under QEII's name. She CANNOT sell any of these state properties (e.g. sell Buckingham Palace to pay a debt). Thus, the queen (and the rest British royal family) has a lot of wealth, but not that much liquid assets. The opposite is true with the Dutch and Liechtenstein royal families, who have a lot of investment in stocks, bonds, etc. In order words, the Brits don't get a ton of spending cash, but get the perks of living castles and using helicopters to fly to golf courses.
3) The Costs: I've read an article (forget name) in which the writer followed Prince Philipp around for a day. He commented that for the amount of work the 80+ yr. old does, his salary is very low (granted it's a lot of waving and ribbon cutting, but the schedule is crammed w/ more than 10 of those a day). In countries w/o monarchies, the amount of money saved from the civil lists are still being spent, just in other places. State galas w/ vintage wines are still held and cost the same, if not more than having a royal family, but are distributed throughout various gov't departments making look like less money. Plus, at least in the case w/ the Brits, the royal family brings in lots of tourist dollars.

Iain 06-01-2005 11:02 AM

I think that the expensive entrance to Windsor may be because when the castle went on fire there was a great uproar when Tony Blair said that the tax payer would pay for the restoration. The public made it clear that they would not pay.

I read that it costs more to keep the Windsors than all the other European monarchies put together. The other royals tend to be careful with money. They often travel by public forms of transport whereas the Windsors think nothing of spending a fortune on private planes etc. to get them where they are going. All this throwing money around really grates on the ordinary man in the street.

Are they worth all that money? well no. If you look at the queen's year you see that she has a months break over Christmas and New Year, another month at Easter and a three month break in the summer when she hides away at Balmoral. During those five months she carries out no public duties. For the remaining seven months she stays at Windsor every weekend from Friday to Monday and carries out no public duties on those days. That leaves 3 days when she does carry out duties. This means that there are only 84 days in the year when she carries out public duties. That is 11 weeks out of 52. Not bad work if you can get it.

There's not a great deal of love for them in Britain and here in Scotland they are seen as being aloof and out of touch. The Scots have always regarded themselves as good Europeans and prefer the more down to earth monarchies that you find elsewhere in Europe. In fact, the Scots monarchs walked among their people and were regarded as "the first among equels." It was only when James VI took the English throne and emigrated to London that the rot set in.

I think the other royal families are far better value for the money.

Nichola 06-01-2005 12:00 PM

I can honestly say that when I have visited royal residences, I have found the entrance fee great value for money.

When I visited Buckingham Palace, and Windsor Castle, the fee was under £10, and well worth the experience. For example, at Windsor Castle there is the State Appartments to visit, St George's Chapel, Queen Mary's Dolls House, and the grounds in general, and the visit could easily occupy a whole day!

If I had, for example, gone to another tourist attraction, such as Madame Tussauds, they are generally a lot more expensive.

lashinka2002 06-01-2005 12:42 PM

[QUOTE=Iain]
Are they worth all that money? well no. If you look at the queen's year you see that she has a months break over Christmas and New Year, another month at Easter and a three month break in the summer when she hides away at Balmoral. During those five months she carries out no public duties. For the remaining seven months she stays at Windsor every weekend from Friday to Monday and carries out no public duties on those days. That leaves 3 days when she does carry out duties. This means that there are only 84 days in the year when she carries out public duties. That is 11 weeks out of 52. Not bad work if you can get it.
QUOTE]

Please remember that the Queen is also in her 80's and must work at a pace that won't kill her. Same with Prince Philip. She probably put in alot more time when she was younger.

Also, wheras other Royal famalies from other countries may travel relativley unknown on public airlines that is virtually impossible for the BRF. They are internationally famous & would certainly be hounded by the public & the paparazzi virtually every moment of the flight.

Iain 06-02-2005 05:41 AM

[QUOTE=lashinka2002]
Quote:


Please remember that the Queen is also in her 80's and must work at a pace that won't kill her. Same with Prince Philip. She probably put in alot more time when she was younger.

I'm sorry, but Elizabeth has followed that same routine throughout her reign


Also, wheras other Royal famalies from other countries may travel relativley unknown on public airlines that is virtually impossible for the BRF. They are internationally famous & would certainly be hounded by the public & the paparazzi virtually every moment of the flight.
Princess Anne thinks nothing of travelling by public transport so if it's good enough for her it should be good enough for the rest of them. Also, a few years ago Elizabeth had to travel on a public airline to New Zealand because the New Zealand government refused to pay for a private jet.

azile 06-02-2005 02:06 PM

That's interesting- I have also read that it costs more to "upkeep" the Windsors than the rest of the European monarchs combined.

Are the other European monarchies on civil lists or do they live exclusively off their own income?

Eliza

norwegianne 06-02-2005 03:07 PM

Most of the European monarchies get money from the state for the work they perform.


The topic has been discussed before, in this post.

EmpressRouge 06-02-2005 03:19 PM

Also the British royal family is a lot bigger than the ones on the Continent. Besides the Queen, the Duke of Edinburgh, and their kids, it also includes the Queen's cousins, the Duke and Duchess of Gloucester, Duke and Duchess of Kent, Princess Alexandra of Kent, and Prince and Princess Michael of Kent. It's so large becz they are more high profile, have more duties, and have to serve Britain and the rest of the Commonwealth. The RFs of other European nations usually consists of the monarch and his/her immediate family thus have a smaller civil list.

Iain 06-03-2005 06:50 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by EmpressRouge
Also the British royal family is a lot bigger than the ones on the Continent. Besides the Queen, the Duke of Edinburgh, and their kids, it also includes the Queen's cousins, the Duke and Duchess of Gloucester, Duke and Duchess of Kent, Princess Alexandra of Kent, and Prince and Princess Michael of Kent. It's so large becz they are more high profile, have more duties, and have to serve Britain and the rest of the Commonwealth. The RFs of other European nations usually consists of the monarch and his/her immediate family thus have a smaller civil list.

Many of the other royal famlies are just as large as the British one but they realise that the tax payer is not willing to pay to keep them all. In Britain the Gloucesters , the Kents and Andrew etc. are known as "the hangers on" in other words, the are out for all they can get. They take the money and do very little for it. The late queen mother got £643,000 from the civil list. Why on earth would a 100 year old woman need all that money? Even with all that money she was notorious for running up large bills and not paying them. It got so bad that some suppliers refused to let her have anything and often the queen had to pay her mothers bills.

As far as people in Britain can see, the Windsors are not worth the money and the other royal families seem to do far more and are far closer to their people.

azile 06-03-2005 12:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Iain
As far as people in Britain can see, the Windsors are not worth the money and the other royal families seem to do far more and are far closer to their people.

This is the most common sentiment I heard from the British people I met with during my travels. Please correct me if I am wrong, but I don't have the sense that other monarchs are met with this incredibly low public opinion.

Eliza

His Lordship 06-06-2005 05:27 PM

Sara,

I am having some difficulty understanding your questions. Is there a way maybe I could help you find the right words for your questions? I have worked teaching with men and women, who for them English is their second language, and I would be more than happy to assist you.

Claire 06-06-2005 05:51 PM

It is difficult to say as I don't think the divorce settlements of The Prince and Princess of Wales and that of the Duke and Duchess of York was made public.
Diana got quiet a hefty sum, if the tabloids are to be believed, and Charles was to continue paying for her lodgings, clothing and sundry after their divorce. Until her death, Prince Charles still paid the expenses of Princess Diana.

Not certain how much Sarah got, as she put in her autobiography that she worked hard to pay back her loans and debt. So maybe it wasn't in cash or something. Sarah gets money from her books, for her role as spokewomen for Weight Watchers and from other things.

sara1981 06-06-2005 07:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Claire
It is difficult to say as I don't think the divorce settlements of The Prince and Princess of Wales and that of the Duke and Duchess of York was made public.
Diana got quiet a hefty sum, if the tabloids are to be believed, and Charles was to continue paying for her lodgings, clothing and sundry after their divorce. Until her death, Prince Charles still paid the expenses of Princess Diana.

Not certain how much Sarah got, as she put in her autobiography that she worked hard to pay back her loans and debt. So maybe it wasn't in cash or something. Sarah gets money from her books, for her role as spokewomen for Weight Watchers and from other things.

you're right about your answer question

but im not sure Prince Charles give money to Princess Diana? and Prince Andrew give money to Sarah,Duchess of York? if you have question about that! if im mistakes or correct

Sara Boyce

azile 06-09-2005 06:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by EmpressRouge
Also the British royal family is a lot bigger than the ones on the Continent. ....It's so large becz they are more high profile, have more duties, and have to serve Britain and the rest of the Commonwealth. The RFs of other European nations usually consists of the monarch and his/her immediate family thus have a smaller civil list.

But that's exactly my point- most European monarchies are more streamlined and support more rational numbers of people. Why does the British monarchy support people who are, essentially, meaningless. How mny people does it take to adequately attend to royal functions? Why can't Sophie and Edward continue in their professions, the areas of work they loved (and Edward fought to be able to do)?

Would the monarchy be really be lessened if Princess Michael of Kent had to go out and get a real job?

Eliza

His Lordship 06-09-2005 06:24 PM

It is noteworthy that many other royals in other families around Europe do have real jobs in the sense of how we all do. They maintain their style and titles, but still go to the office everyday.

HRH Prince Richard in England is architect for example. He works. His children work and yet he still carries out official engagements.

Part of the problem with Edward and Sophie, and I agree and give them both credit in the sense of just wanting to work like the rest of the world, is that it hit a little too close to home and some felt they may be given special treatment in their lines of work because of who they are.

It does not help that Sophie was trapped by that horrible reporter and recordered making those comments about three years ago. But, she also should have known better to keep her mouth shut.

Andrew served honorably in the military.

Prince Charles has his various schemes and also has his Duchy of Cornwall business with food and patio furniture.

Prince Michael serves on several boards of companies and Princess Michael writes and lectures.

Lady Helen Taylor works with her husband and his gallery and is also an ambassador for Armani.

Viscount Linley has his shop which makes furniture and knicknacks. He is extremely talented.

Lady Sarah is an artist.

So, yes, they do work.

Camilla never had a "real" job, but she had the toughest job their is according to my mother, being a wife and mom and keeping house.

His Lordship 06-09-2005 06:26 PM

By the way, most British I talk to shudder if you call them subjects of the Queen, they tell me they are citizens of Great Britain and not subjects as the media uses when talking of the Queen and the people she is head of state over.

Idriel 06-09-2005 07:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by azile1710

Would the monarchy be really be lessened if Princess Michael of Kent had to go out and get a real job?

Princess Michael of Kent works as His Lordship rightly said. Her books are best sellers and she is respected as an historian as well as an author.
The Kents do NOT touch a single penny on the civil list. They have to make their own living and British people do not support them. Their apartments in Kensington Palace were a wedding gift from the Queen. They were originally allowed to live there forever for free but under the pressure of the House of Commons, the Queen has to take her gift back (I don't know if you imagine how humiliating that must be), that is make the Kents pay a rent. Now, in five years they will be expelled because those same people from the Commons think they don't pay enough!
I must add that despite being not paid, being constantly ridiculized and attacked by the press (who loves spreading false rumors about M-C, like the infamous 'racist' remarks on a restaurant), the Kents perform Royal duties in England and abroad (obviously you'll never hear about them).
I am just writing that so you be careful and critical next time you read something about the Kents.

About the monarchy's popularity, I have no impression that this institution is in danger. From what I hear around me (I live in the UK), from what I read (polls, political articles, etc.) there is few really angry republican, a majority of monarchists (or people who think there's no point in axing the monarchy) and a increasing amount of people who don't give a toss about the Windsors.

EmpressRouge 06-09-2005 07:54 PM

Even if the British monarchy is abolished, it won't be during QEII's reign. She has worked hard for over half a century, and they wouldn't do it to her at this age. If a republic were to be declared, it would probably come at Charles' expense.

His Lordship 06-09-2005 08:33 PM

I think it may get smaller...but in a practical sense, all the tourism dollars that go into the British economy....billions...

Also, the Household staff and the Keeper of the Privy Purse worked out the financial details in terms of how much it costs EACH Briton to pay the upkeep of the Royal Family and it came out to less than 2 pounds a year. You are talking roughly 56 million people....give or take a few.


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