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Elise,LadyofLancaster 10-25-2003 02:55 AM

Albert, Prince Consort (1819-1861)
 
:heart: https://chrisb.4ce.co.uk/bewick/pictures/albert.jpg :heart:

Fireweaver 10-25-2003 04:04 AM

He was a very good consort to Victoria, and wasn't treated that kindly by the British people.

TOMMIX 10-26-2003 05:38 PM

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HRH Prince Albert just before he died in 1861-

TOMMIX 10-26-2003 05:41 PM

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A young and dashing Prince-

TOMMIX 10-26-2003 05:47 PM

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Another painting of a dashing Prince Albert-

TOMMIX 10-26-2003 05:50 PM

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HRH Prince Albert, the Prince Consort-

TOMMIX 10-26-2003 05:52 PM

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A sketch of a young Prince Albert done by Queen Victoria-

TOMMIX 10-26-2003 05:55 PM

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A painting by Winterhalter: Queen Victoria, Prince Albert and their young family-

Josefine 10-26-2003 05:55 PM

Can someone post some fact about him....

TOMMIX 10-26-2003 06:18 PM

1 Attachment(s)
Quote:

Originally posted by Josefine@Oct 26th, 2003 - 5:55 pm
Can someone post some fact about him....
Please look at this website. It has informtion about Prince Albert-
https://histclo.hispeed.com/royal/eng/royal-ukalbert.htm

Elise,LadyofLancaster 10-30-2003 03:06 PM

https://www.btinternet.com/~sbishop100/albmid.jpg

Elise,LadyofLancaster 10-30-2003 03:08 PM

https://www.btinternet.com/~sbishop100/va1860.jpg

Elise,LadyofLancaster 10-30-2003 03:10 PM

https://www.btinternet.com/~sbishop100/fam1859.jpg

Ratherread 12-20-2003 07:07 PM

I've read just about every biography of Queen Victoria ever written. She fell in love with Albert literally at first sight, and remained in love with him till he died.
She wore mourning for him for the rest of her life.

He was a very intelligent man, and accomplished as well. He designed Osbourn House and Balmoral. He could compose music and was a patron of the arts. He was also a savvy politician whose great dream was to see his beloved Germany a constitutional monarchy like Great Britain. If he had lived to see World War I, ti would have broken his heart. Also, he was the one who popularised the Christmas Tree.

tiaraprin 08-20-2005 07:14 AM

Albert was the child of a broken home. His mother Louise, tired of her husband's affairs, had one of her own. She was banished by Albert's father (the hypocrite) and died shortly afterwards.

Biri 07-30-2009 10:28 AM

And he was present at the birth of all his children!
And it occurred very rarely in that times.
Which contemporary father experienced that so many times?

Leslie2006 08-07-2009 05:03 PM

Good point! Most fathers-to-be were not allowed in the birthing room, and were kept outside the doors while the child was being born. It wasn't considered 'proper' for a man to witness the birth of his child.

RoyalistRiley 08-08-2009 01:57 AM

He was certainly a man of many talents - campaigner aganist slavery, architecht, 'reformer and thinker' , administrator and faithful husaband/family man. Just what 21st century society needs!

principessa 08-27-2009 06:05 AM

Focus.de has a report about Albert.

Prinz Albert: Deutscher Moralist im sündigen England - Prinz Albert - FOCUS Online

Dierna23 09-08-2009 11:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tiaraprin (Post 267373)
Albert was the child of a broken home. His mother Louise, tired of her husband's affairs, had one of her own. She was banished by Albert's father (the hypocrite) and died shortly afterwards.

Yes, that's true. I was born and raised in St. Wendel, the city to which Luise of Saxe-Coburg escaped. There are many stories about her, she married her secound husband in St. Wendel and was very popular to the people of St. Wendel, streets and restaurants are named after her. Later she went to Paris and died there after suffering from cancer at the age of 30.

Two years ago there was an exhibition in the Museum of St. Wendel and I was able to see Luise's gown, Alberts christening robe and other dresses he had worn as a toddler. It was amazing! :flowers:

Vasillisos Markos 09-23-2009 11:40 AM

Albert was a skilled politician who helped Victoria rule her empire and restore respect to the throne, something which her Hanoverian relatives had squandered for many years. Victoria's seclusion after Albert's untimely death cost her some support from her subjects but her longevity and re-emergence into public undoubtedly helped restore their affection for the "old gal."

Iluvbertie 09-23-2009 05:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Vasillisos Markos (Post 995262)
Albert was a skilled politician who helped Victoria rule her empire and restore respect to the throne, something which her Hanoverian relatives had squandered for many years. Victoria's seclusion after Albert's untimely death cost her some support from her subjects but her longevity and re-emergence into public undoubtedly helped restore their affection for the "old gal."


Just a note - Victoria didn't 'rule' anything - she reigned and her governments (yes plural as by the time she came to the throne many of the colonies had their own local governments with wide ranging powers although not over foreign policy) did the ruling. She was a constitutional monarch with a parliament making the rules and she had the rights to 'advise, warn and be consulted' and the responsibility to sign the laws. She didn't make the laws and, as had been shown in 1832, the monarch was largely under the control of the PM (the PM told the King to swamp the House of Lords with enough peers to pass the Great Reform Act if the Lords refused to pass it - the King made it known that he would do so so the Lords past the Act). If she ruled she wouldn't have had Gladstone as PM. She was totally unconstitutional over the Bedchamber Affair and Albert made sure that that never happened again. She got away with it the first time because the change wasn't the result of an election and the support in the Commons for Peel wasn't all that great but she wouldn't have been able to do it if the majority in favour had been greater as an election would have been fought over the rights of the monarch and she would have lost, I believe.

Vasillisos Markos 09-23-2009 11:02 PM

Thanks for correcting me for using "rule" instead of "reign" but I did not mean to imply that Victoria was a legislator and I doubt if many took my post to mean that. I'm glad you only posted a "note" and not a "song." :-)

silverstar 11-25-2009 08:26 PM

Prince Albert of Coburg... Consort to Queen Victoria
 
Prince Albert of Saxe-Coburg and Gotha 26 August 1819 – 14 December 1861) was the husband of Queen Victoria.

He was born in the Saxon duchy of Saxe-Coburg-Saalfeld to a family connected to many of Europe's ruling monarchs.
At the age of 20 he married his first cousin, Queen Victoria, with whom he had nine children.

At first, Albert felt constrained by his position as consort, which did not confer any power or duties upon him.
Over time he adopted many public causes, such as educational reform and the abolition of slavery, and took on the responsibilities of running the Queen's household, estates and office.

He was heavily involved with the organisation of the Great Exhibition of 1851. Albert aided in the development of Britain's constitutional monarchy by persuading his wife to show less partisanship in her dealings with Parliament—although he actively disagreed with the interventionist foreign policy pursued during Lord Palmerston's tenure as Foreign Secretary.


He died at the early age of 42, plunging the Queen into a deep mourning which lasted for the rest of her life.
Upon Queen Victoria's death in 1901, their son, Edward VII, succeeded as the first monarch of the House of Saxe-Coburg and Gotha, named after the ducal house to which Albert belonged.

Albert was a dashing prince, highly intelligent , a man who .. had he lived, would have had a profound effect and influence on the later 19th century.

His grandson was to return to Germany and claim the ancient title of Prince of Coburg
along with all the immense wealth, buildings and landholdings.
He lived through 2 tragic wars which brought an abrupt end to his family dynasty in far off Germany
go here .......

www.veoh.com/browse/videos/category/educ...ch/v18977660FQ6BjEnj


.

Vasillisos Markos 11-27-2009 09:54 PM

I watched a brief introduction to a video about Prince Albert. In that clip, a commentator quoted Disraeli as saying that if Prince Albert had lived long enough, he would have been a dictator. Did Prince Albert love power that much? Did he try to exercise power over Queen Victoria? The brief clip tried to show that his unhappy childhood left him with a desire to control events and people.

Iluvbertie 11-27-2009 11:05 PM

I don't about Disraeli's comment remembering that every PM from Peel onwards sought out his advice at times but he most certainly ruled Victoria and was by her side when she saw ministers and even on many occasions he saw the ministers alone.

Vasillisos Markos 11-27-2009 11:17 PM

Yes, I imagine that the ministers quickly caught on that if they wanted to "influence" Victoria, or at least get her to agree to their positions, they would necessarily have to deal with Albert. But do any historians believe that he would have been a dictator? It is one thing to control a person, many consorts have tried, and a few have succeeded, but to be a dictator?? That is a harsh assessment that I have never heard leveled at the Prince.

LordMountbatten 05-22-2010 10:01 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fireweaver (Post 37727)
He was a very good consort to Victoria, and wasn't treated that kindly by the British people.

I agree, and Queen Victoria had loved him very much. Prince Albert's paternity was also clouded with rumors about his illegitimacy. Even though his father recognized him as his own son. It was still alleged that he is not Ernst I's son because of rumors that both his parents were having affairs.

royalflush 05-22-2010 07:41 PM

Was Queen Victoria's marriage to Prince Albert a love match? I can see that QV respects PA because she listens to his advice and even mourns his death for the rest of her life. Isn't that love?:)

Iluvbertie 05-22-2010 08:47 PM

Victoria certainly fell in love with Albert from the beginning. In time Albert came to love her as much as she loved him.
Much the same as their great-great-grandchildren really - Elizabeth II and Prince Philip. Elizabeth fell in love with Philip aged 13 but his love for her came later but is just as deep and abiding.

callista 05-23-2010 12:05 AM

That's great to know. I've always thought that royals get married only for security purposes. :)

Vasillisos Markos 05-24-2010 11:15 AM

Victoria and Albert's love was genuine and their love also manifested itself in their physical relationship as well as companionship. It is believed that Beatrice burned many of the Queen's diaries and letters because Victoria was very explicit about the physical love she shared with Albert.

RubyPrincess168 10-17-2010 03:44 AM

I'm reading an older biography of Queen Victoria and was surprised to learn the Prince Albert was really the one who felt that the BRF should be non-partisan or "above" politics. Queen Victoria had been a Whig, and other monarchs had been Whigs or Tories, but Prince Albert felt they should not take sides. This has continued on to this day.

silverstar 10-17-2010 10:13 AM

Yes Prince Albert is an important figure.... tall , handsome...
Victoria was obviously smitten by this German Prince
.... I wonder how good his english was ? did he learn English at school ?

Princess Elise 10-17-2010 11:47 AM

I think he made an excellent husband. I always only hear good things about him. I watched the movie "The young Victoria" after hearing it had much to do with him and Queen Victoria and I absalutely loved it.

silverstar 10-17-2010 12:37 PM

LOOKS like he was very tall too... he towered over his young bride !
go here
Celebheaven • View topic - Queen Victoria

Iluvbertie 10-17-2010 04:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by silverstar (Post 1148513)
LOOKS like he was very tall too... he towered over his young bride !
go here
Celebheaven • View topic - Queen Victoria

However she was under 5 ft tall (I think she was about 4'9" or so but she was small) so comparing their heights that must be taken into account.

Vasillisos Markos 10-17-2010 10:30 PM

Victoria was very short and consequently nearly everyone towered over her but she had a presence about her which made up for her height. I guess that is what one calls majesty.

Osipi 10-17-2010 11:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Vasillisos Markos (Post 1148703)
Victoria was very short and consequently nearly everyone towered over her but she had a presence about her which made up for her height. I guess that is what one calls majesty.

I think that is one reason that the crown in miniature was made for her.

The two of them together I think is an example not surpassed until we really look at how HM and the DoE have endured all these years. The difference is that Philip ruled the roost as far as family matters go and did/does not interfere with his wife's role of being queen. Albert and Victoria I think ruled jointly if only in her name.

XeniaCasaraghi 06-19-2011 05:28 PM

I have a crush on Prince Albert. I have a crush on a man who has been dead for 150+ years. But man does he embody the term "Prince Charming".

Warren 07-01-2011 10:51 PM

We appear to have lost sight of Prince Albert as the thread has veered off into an ongoing discussion of member's favourite actors and current crushes.
Posts of no relevance have been removed and posts relating to "The Young Victoria" are now in the Royal Library film thread.

Warren
British Forums moderator

pgm1952 07-09-2011 08:40 PM

From all I have read on him and Victoria, it seems he was quite sensative and she was very forward. There have been hints that his death was, apart from the obvious illness typhoid, the result of being overworked by Victoria and the strain of dealing with her ever present temper.

XeniaCasaraghi 07-09-2011 09:42 PM

How exactly is talking about the actors who played Prince Albert in movies relating to Prince Albert "off topic" in a Prince Albert thread?

IloveCP 07-18-2011 04:30 AM

Albert was a wonderful man and,there will be no one else like him.

expat 07-18-2011 07:30 AM

There is no doubt that for Victoria there was no one as wonderful, good, handsome etc as her Albert. She let him work himself to death over official papers though.
Whether his children thought the same I am not so sure.

XeniaCasaraghi 07-21-2011 04:45 PM

Didnt Victoria blame her son for Albert's death? Because Albert had to travel to have a talk with him about his idiotic behavior?

Marie of The Sea 07-21-2011 05:29 PM

Exactly, Victoria blamed their eldest son, the Prince of Wales, for
Albert's early death because he travelled to see Edward At Cambridge when he was ill with a cold or possibly pneumonia. The weather was foul and Albert soon succombed to the illness. Two weeks later. Victoria said she shuddered every time she saw Edward.

IloveCP 12-21-2011 09:47 PM

Helen Rappaport: 150 Years After His Death, Prince Albert Remains Uncelebrated

I agree with this article.Albert was very underrated and should deserve more attention.

Vasillisos Markos 12-21-2011 11:42 PM

Interesting article. His death does seem to be overlooked today but it is 150 years later. I was amused to read about draping the beehives in black as a way to tell the bees that there has been a death in the family.

XeniaCasaraghi 12-26-2011 06:27 PM

I like Albert and he was a fantastic Consort to Victoria, according to some he was the one who ran the country while he was married to her. I am definitely a fan of Albert despite the fact that he was pretty. I wonder if one of the reasons Albert is so uncelebrated is because of WWI and WWII and the fact that the BRF want to ignore their German history.

Tsar bobo Iv 05-31-2012 05:47 PM

they r one of my favorite royal couples ever
it was so sad when he died if i found luv like her i'd go into deep mourning 2
also so many things he missed out on very depressing

CyrilVladisla 06-28-2014 09:20 PM

Queen Victoria's Sapphire and Diamond Tiara was designed by Prince Albert as a gift.
In Kings & Queens of Great Britain, David Soud wrote:

In 1848, while revolutions swept across the continent, Albert spoke eloquently for reform. His position as president of the Society for the Improvement of the Conditions of the Labouring Classes made his position clear.
For his daughter Princess Victoria's coming-out, Prince Albert designed her dress.
He designed all the lace flounces, ribbons, and a wreath of convolvulus and jewels in the Princess Royal's hair.
Prince Albert had a Christmas tree brought from Germany.

Prince Albert sent decorated trees to schools in Windsor and to local army barracks. :xmastree::xmastree::xmastree:

The Oddment Emporium, Christmas with the Saxe-Coburg and Gothas When...
with a print of the Royal Family gathered about the Christmas tree.

scooter 08-31-2014 09:42 PM

And not to mention, just at his death the civil war in the US errupted which cut off the cotton flow to the mills of England. A most inauspicious time for QV to take to her bed as the Widow of Windsor.

Curryong 11-09-2014 12:37 AM

A nice gesture by a loving father but Albert was perhaps not the man of superb taste he believed himself to be. He certainly enjoyed designing jewellery, clothing, rooms' interiors, etc. The results could be seen at Balmoral and Buckingham Palace.

Perhaps he was also responsible for the poodle motif on a reticule (handbag) of Victoria's when the couple visited Napoleon and Eugenie in France!

In the last few years there have been various other theories put forward for Albert's death, stomach cancer and Crohn's disease amongst them. He certainly was overly conscientious and may well have also worried himself into an early grave.

Rudolph 12-14-2015 07:13 AM

HistoricRoyalPalaces ‏@HRP_palaces
Today in 1861: Prince Albert dies of typhoid fever at Windsor Castle. Read about his marriage to Queen Victoria:

Read Some Fascinating Facts About Queen Victoria & Her Private Life

CyrilVladisla 09-22-2016 10:03 PM

What caused Prince Albert's demise?
Prince Albert's death finally solved 150 years, he was suffering Crohn's disease | Daily Mail Online

In 1848, while revolutions swept across the continent, Prince Albert spoke eloquently for reform. His position as president of the Society for the Improvement of the Conditions of the Labouring Class made his position clear.

Curryong 09-22-2016 11:13 PM

He was certainly quite a delicate man. I've never believed that Prince Albert died from typhoid. However, I have read the theory of his last illness being Crohn's disease before. I guess the definitive truth will never be known now.

Denville 09-23-2016 04:51 AM

It seems as if it was typhoid, but the story is that his heatlh had been getting a lot worse and that he had aged rapidly in the last years of his life. He worked hard, was a worrier and possibly wore himself out and was easy prey to a germ. he got chilled and wet, when he went to see Bertie to talk to him about his fling with Nellie Clifden and became ill.

MAfan 09-23-2016 04:54 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Curryong (Post 1926034)
However, I have read the theory of his last illness being Crohn's disease before.

And in fact the article posted above dates back to December 2011. Not real news.

soapstar 09-25-2016 07:11 PM

I've deleted a number of posts because they contained unsubstantiated gossip/speculation. Please remember that one of our forum rules states, that opinions should be backed up with facts from reliable sources. Thanks.

LadyAlice 09-27-2016 12:43 PM

The Louise one and her baby is based on some facts. Please refer to her biography unconventional daughter which goes into it far more deeply. The fact is that her and others who were close to her more importantly the family who adopted her son are in fact closed however some diaries and letters are in exisitant that's support that she had a child.

I was asking a hypothetical question based on that fact to what would've Prince Albert made of an illegitimate grandchild

Denville 09-28-2016 12:22 AM

I am sure Albert woudl have been absolutely horrified, but I dont know of any rael evidence that Louise had a child.... can you quote?

CyrilVladisla 09-28-2016 10:17 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Denville (Post 1927414)
I am sure Albert woudl have been absolutely horrified, but I dont know of any rael evidence that Louise had a child.... can you quote?

Louise had given birth to a baby when she was eighteen.
What was the secret of Queen Victoria's rebel daughter?...

amaryllus 09-28-2016 10:50 PM

Princesss did though... Princess Alexandra own sister slept with a soldier and gave the baby up. And Louise had more freedom than usual to move about thanks to her art classes. So I can see it happening.

Curryong 09-29-2016 03:59 AM

The Spectator reviewer of that book in the above link points out that author Lucinda Hawksley presents no hard evidence at all for birth of any child. It's all speculation. Another reviewer I read and posted a link to here said the same.

Queen Victoria noticed everything and everybody and I don't think a daughter coming up to her eighth/ninth month would have escaped her notice! Princess Thyra, Alexandra's sister, did have a baby (the young father concerned shot himself after an interview with the King.) However, she was sent away in the latter months of pregnancy on 'a visit to her brother', the Greek King.)

Louise was at court the entire time she was supposedly pregnant. Victoria had had nine children, many of her her ladies in waiting had also produced large families. What are the odds of a very slender young girl getting away with a pregnancy under their eyes?

I read in a biography years ago too, that just before Louise's marriage Victoria wrote to the Duke of Argyll, Lorne's father, warning him that Louise was most unlikely to have children, was in fact barren. Whether this was the result of sparse periods or something else isn't known, but the Royal doctors seem to have been consulted about it and must have given a negative verdict about Louise's fertility.

I'm reading a biography of Prince Leopold at the moment by Charlotte Zeepvat. In it she describes Queen Victoria's reluctance to employ Stirling in the first place. He was a young army officer, not medically trained, (the start of his service coincided with the beginning of Leopold's epileptic fits which he suffered for the rest of his life.) Victoria didn't like smart young army officers who were used to London Society, but allowed herself to be persuaded into giving him a chance.

Leopold liked him, but Stirling soon blotted his copy book with Victoria by being fierce to one of her Highland servants. The man, called Robinson, acted as valet to Stirling but proved incompetent and was told off by his master. That was a sin of the deepest dye as far as Victoria was concerned. No-one spoke in a rude way to her Highlander servants, not even her family, and that, mixed with renewed worries about Leopold's health, (how would Stirling have managed an epileptic fit or fainting spell) meant he had to go.

Nothing to do with impregnating her daughter! Incidentally, during Stirling's brief term of service, Leopold, Arthur and Louise all came down with whooping cough. Very romantic!

Denville 03-13-2017 02:19 PM

Im sure she didn't have a baby. I think that if she had become pregnant queen Vic would have coped but there woud be something that survived In the historical record such as her going away somewhere or being ill... and there isn't.

Queen Claude 11-17-2017 07:01 PM

What really killed Prince Albert? TV drama Victoria prompts fresh debate over his mysterious death aged 42

  • The official cause on his death certificate is 'typhoid fever: duration 21 days'
  • Yet a stunned public were sceptical over diagnosis as his illness was kept quiet
  • There were no reported cases anywhere Albert visited 3 weeks before death
  • University lecturer Dr Derek Gatherer considers the diagnosis and alternatives
  • Experts have proposed he actually succumbed to a more modern affliction
ITV's Victoria prompts debate over Prince Albert's death | Daily Mail Online

Curryong 11-17-2017 08:45 PM

Why would the public at the time have been sceptical? Loads of people in mid Victorian England (and all over the world) succumbed to disease and infection after very short illnesses at younger ages than Albert. The whole of the symptoms wouldn't have been published by the Royal doctors anyway. And nothing that I have read, and I've read lots on the Victorian period as I studied it at Uni and have for decades afterwards, suggests that people at the time were sceptical about typhoid as a cause of death for the Prince Consort.

It's only been in more recent times that the typhoid diagnosis has been challenged. The doctors in the Royal Household weren't exactly cutting edge, and for at least fifteen years I've read various modern medical authorities who are convinced that they got it wrong and Albert may have passed because of Krohn's decease or cancer of the stomach or several other ailments of the intestines like that. Albert did not have a strong constitution and for several months had had pain after meals and been chewing on the 19th century equivalent of antacid tablets. He'd also come home shortly before his last illness with a chill after going to Cambridge to tell the young Prince of Wales off about an affair with an actress.

On the other hand, the drains around Windsor were notorious and there had been cases of typhoid in the town around the time of Albert's death. I believe he may well have had symptoms of typhoid (and 19th century doctors, even stupid ones, were more likely to recognise the symptoms of typhoid than doctors nowadays) as well as something like Krohn's (which was untreatable in those days) and so that's what carried him off at 42.

Denville 11-18-2017 04:36 AM

Yes while his death at 42may seem shocking to us, at the time it wasn't unusual even in the upper classes who had relatively good health care(the poor had none) and enough money to eat well and be comfortable.
People died a lot younger and diseases which are now treatable were often fatal.

eya 04-05-2018 01:36 AM

Private papers and collections belonging to Prince Albert, are to be published online for first time

Prince Albert´s papers and collections to be published... | Daily Mail Online

https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/...line-victorian

CyrilVladisla 07-20-2018 08:58 PM

Did Prince Albert, The Prince Consort have anything to do with the selection of Princess Alexandra of Denmark as a wife for his son, Prince Albert Edward?

It was informative to learn that Prince Albert did have a selection in his son's future spouse. It was unfortunate the Prince Consort did not live to see Albert Edward marry Alexandra.

How much did Queen Victoria speak to Princess Alexandra about Albert, Prince Consort?

Prince Albert wrote to his brother, Ernest of Saxe-Coburg-Gotha, on the birth of his daughter, Princess Victoria, in 1841, 'Albert, father of a daughter, you will laugh at me.'

Curryong 07-20-2018 09:52 PM

Yes. He and Victoria went through photographs of eligible princesses and reports of the front runners sent by Vicky from Berlin.

In spite of possible political complications (the BRF was pro-Prussian and the fact that Alexandra was Danish not German was generally deplored) Albert thought Alexandra was lovely, and in fact he stated that if he were single he would marry her himself. Victoria, who, like her husband, admired beauty in both men and women, wrote that in her diary.

Both parents were astounded that the young POW didn't appear to be keen to be married off and they worried because the Tsar seemed to be looking in Alexandra's direction for the Tsarevitch Nicholas (who died young, while engaged to Alexandra's sister Dagmar.)

Denville 07-21-2018 06:35 AM

I think they foolishly thought that any wife Bertie had, HAD to be pretty to dissuade him from fooling around. Didn't work.....
and Alix's being Danish did lead to some tension within the family, but I think that the fact that she was young malleable and a beauty, pushed Victoria to think that Aliix was the ideal wife...

wartenberg7 07-21-2018 07:44 AM

How old was Edward when he got married - 19, 20? A boy, in nowaday´s standards. How can one really think if a young man at that age seeing a photograph of any pretty girl was not thinking he would be falling in love?! But of course this has nothing to do with love. Certainly you cannot compare 19th century standards with our lives today - and the view of society towards marriage and men and women in general is galaxies away from how we live today!
Alix and Bertie met, because it was expected of them, found each other luckily attractive, did their duty in the 1st few years (produced heirs) and that was that....
Actually a very sad story...!

Denville 07-21-2018 07:59 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by wartenberg7 (Post 2135671)
How old was Edward when he got married - 19, 20? A boy, in nowaday´s standards. How can one really think if a young man at that age seeing a photograph of any pretty girl was not thinking he would be falling in love?! But of course this has nothing to do with love. Certainly you cannot compare 19th century standards with our lives today - and the view of society towards marriage and men and women in general is galaxies away from how we live today!
Alix and Bertie met, because it was expected of them, found each other luckily attractive, did their duty in the 1st few years (produced heirs) and that was that....
Actually a very sad story...!

I don't quite see whtat is sad about it. tThey didn't have a wildly happy marriage but they did their best and supported each other, for nearly 50 years. they were not going to have a free choice of partners, but they weren't compelled inot the marriage and they did start out with some attraction and fondness. It was sad that Alix went deaf, which didn't help her with maintaining the sort of social life that was expected of royals an upper class people at the time.. It also alienated her a bit from Bertie.. and she was rater jealous of some of his mistresses. However, she had her platonic admirer, her children and a comfortable life. She visited Denmark when she had times she was fed up wth her husband...

Gawin 07-21-2018 11:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Denville (Post 2135676)
I don't quite see whtat is sad about it. tThey didn't have a wildly happy marriage but they did their best and supported each other, for nearly 50 years. they were not going to have a free choice of partners, but they weren't compelled inot the marriage and they did start out with some attraction and fondness. It was sad that Alix went deaf, which didn't help her with maintaining the sort of social life that was expected of royals an upper class people at the time.. It also alienated her a bit from Bertie.. and she was rater jealous of some of his mistresses. However, she had her platonic admirer, her children and a comfortable life. She visited Denmark when she had times she was fed up wth her husband...

I think Alexandra did her best but I wouldn't say that about Edward. After all, she couldn't control her deafness but Edward could have kept his pants on if he'd chosen to. His failure to do so contributed far more to their alienation than her deafness.

Susan D 07-21-2018 11:27 PM

I think that Queen Alexandra was treated very badly and I don't believe that we have been told the whole story. She seems to have been chosen because of her looks (just like Empress Elisabeth in Vienna) and she probably had no say in whom she would marry. In fact, it was not until the 1880s that the princesses were allowed to choose whom they would marry!

Denville 07-22-2018 02:51 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Susan D (Post 2136009)
I think that Queen Alexandra was treated very badly and I don't believe that we have been told the whole story. She seems to have been chosen because of her looks (just like Empress Elisabeth in Vienna) and she probably had no say in whom she would marry. In fact, it was not until the 1880s that the princesses were allowed to choose whom they would marry!

She did have a say. She could have said no, and Im sure she would never have considered it. She said she loved Bertie, and she grew to love England and was happy and popular in her adopted home. And it wasn't likely, Ini a royal marriage that the husband would remain faithtful. I think that after having 6 children in a few years Alix was glad to give up her sex life..
I doubt if she would have been happy as a spinster daughter....

Denville 07-22-2018 05:22 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gawin (Post 2136008)
I think Alexandra did her best but I wouldn't say that about Edward. After all, she couldn't control her deafness but Edward could have kept his pants on if he'd chosen to. His failure to do so contributed far more to their alienation than her deafness.

They grew apart, but retained a basic fondness and relationship. Alix enjoyed social life as a young bride and they had that in common, but her deafness did make her more inclined to stay home and be with her children and her familiar friends. She wasn't very clever and while Bertie was no giant intellect, he did have more interests which Alix didn't really share...so it was pretty much on hte cards that they would grow apart...
And while she had enjoyed society fora few years, I think that even without the deafness, she would have probably become more of a homebody, and had less to share with her husband.
She was possessive of the children, and didn't treat her daughters, esp Victoria very well...

wartenberg7 07-22-2018 05:23 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Denville (Post 2136053)
She did have a say. She could have said no, and Im sure she would never have considered it. She said she loved Bertie, and she grew to love England and was happy and popular in her adopted home. And it wasn't likely, Ini a royal marriage that the husband would remain faithtful. I think that after having 6 children in a few years Alix was glad to give up her sex life..
I doubt if she would have been happy as a spinster daughter....


I don´t think when a teenage girl says she loves a guy, perhaps in 98,5 % cases, it cannot possibly be enough for a longlasting marriage. Who knows at that age, no matter 19th century or nowadays, what love is and means!? This week I love boy x, next week it´ s y....
I guess she said so because she wanted to be a good, obedient little daughter... And I do not believe a second that future royal spouses got married, thinking "Oh, I´ ll be betrayed one day anyway..."
And please, NOBODY is glad to give up ones sex life in normal, healthy circumstances:whistling::ermm:!


I do have some sympathy for Bertie and his antics, too, as they surely are the result of Victoria´s and Albert´s much too much high aspirations in every regard towards this rather mediocre boy. But thinking how much she must have suffered while he was all over the place having mistresses in all over europe, having orgies, having sex with 2 or 3 women at the same time (hope she didn´t know about that, poor soul...) makes me feel terribly sorry for that lady.
And the Prince of Wales later kept her systematically away, perhaps because he feared he couldn´ t do what he wanted to when Alix accompanied him. Once she begged to join him on a trip to India but was categorically refused to do so. She must have lead a pretty lonely life, and the deafness did her bit. That´s why she clung so much to especially Eddy and Georgie.

Denville 07-22-2018 05:45 AM

I think you are seeing Alix as a 20th or 21st C girl. She wasn't. She was a 19th Century princess... with very differnet experiences and outlook

Iluvbertie 07-22-2018 06:15 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by wartenberg7 (Post 2136073)
I don´t think when a teenage girl says she loves a guy, perhaps in 98,5 % cases, it cannot possibly be enough for a longlasting marriage. Who knows at that age, no matter 19th century or nowadays, what love is and means!? This week I love boy x, next week it´ s y....
I guess she said so because she wanted to be a good, obedient little daughter... And I do not believe a second that future royal spouses got married, thinking "Oh, I´ ll be betrayed one day anyway..."
And please, NOBODY is glad to give up ones sex life in normal, healthy circumstances:whistling::ermm:!

But after the sixth child died she was told not to have sex anymore so she wasn't in a normal healthy situation anyway. Had she had another pregnancy there was a good chance she would have died and so aged in her mid-20s she had to give up sex leaving her husband with the same choice - no sex or have mistresses.

Denville 07-22-2018 07:06 AM

I've never heard this, but when her health was not that good (attack of rheumatic fever during pregnancy), her deafness etc.. I think that 6 children in about 7 years ddi exhaust her and she was glad to stop having babies...
I don't think that sex was high on herlist of priorities, it wasn't, for many women at the time, when there was no effective contraception.. THey didn't see it as a fun activity.. it was soemthign that led to painful pregnancy and labour, and risking your life...

Tsaritsa 07-22-2018 07:59 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Denville (Post 2136098)
I've never heard this, but when her health was not that good (attack of rheumatic fever during pregnancy), her deafness etc.. I think that 6 children in about 7 years ddi exhaust her and she was glad to stop having babies...
I don't think that sex was high on herlist of priorities, it wasn't, for many women at the time, when there was no effective contraception.. THey didn't see it as a fun activity.. it was soemthign that led to painful pregnancy and labour, and risking your life...

Her ma-in-law, Victoria, is alleged to have adored 'making them' stage of having babies. She didn't like the bits that followed.

Denville 07-22-2018 08:03 AM

Yes Victoria was highly sexed, not all women were. That's why I said "many women". Alexandra was a 19th woman, and she didn't see sex, marriage or fidelity in the same way that a modern woman might ...

Gawin 07-22-2018 09:19 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Denville (Post 2136072)
They grew apart, but retained a basic fondness and relationship. Alix enjoyed social life as a young bride and they had that in common, but her deafness did make her more inclined to stay home and be with her children and her familiar friends. She wasn't very clever and while Bertie was no giant intellect, he did have more interests which Alix didn't really share...so it was pretty much on hte cards that they would grow apart...
And while she had enjoyed society fora few years, I think that even without the deafness, she would have probably become more of a homebody, and had less to share with her husband.
She was possessive of the children, and didn't treat her daughters, esp Victoria very well...

Good grief! Why does the burden fall on Alexandra? Why point out her flaws but not Edward's?

Yes, Alexandra was a possessive mother who expected Princess Victoria to be on her beck and call. But Edward didn't always treat Alexandra well. Not all royal husbands cheated on their wives, including Alexandra's son, her father, and her brother-in-law Alexander of Russia.The fact that Alexandra actually loved Edward could only have increased her pain and disappointment. Of course she disliked society if it meant facing all the woman her husband had slept with. Edward was very self-indulgent and chose to fritter away his life on parties, mistresses, food, and gambling. His inappropriate associations even led to his being called to testify in court twice. His behavior was hardly befitting the heir to the throne.

Alexandra, on the other hand, always conducted herself with dignity. Give the woman her due. What if Edward had found himself married to someone like Marie of Romania, who took her her own lovers and whose children's paternity has been questioned? Fortunately for Edward, Alexandra chose to keep her mouth shut, look the other way, and take out her unhappiness on their children.

wartenberg7 07-22-2018 10:29 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Denville (Post 2136115)
Yes Victoria was highly sexed, not all women were. That's why I said "many women". Alexandra was a 19th woman, and she didn't see sex, marriage or fidelity in the same way that a modern woman might ...


That´s why they went hysteric and fainted all the time (not only because of the tight corsets), because these upper class women tried to surpress their sexuality, as Psychoanalysis found out.
I believe we have nowadays a very limited and strange view upon these past eras. I strongly believe that sexuality was always a very strong and important force in both male or females lives. In some circles women claimed to be "not interested in such activities at all" (which was of course a big fat lie!) because they thought this was the right thing to say for a "decent" woman. All those who admitted it was such great fun had been seen as sluts...


By the way, it wasn´t hard to be "sexed" with a hubby like Albert...:lol:

Curryong 08-11-2018 09:31 PM

Vicky was born in 1840, but it's true that nobility and Kings placed great emphasis on having sons. Nevertheless, Vicky became Albert's favourite child (he could discuss things with her that he couldn't with his other children.) Ernst, Albert's brother, never had legitimate children of his own as he reputedly suffered from syphilis.

Denville 08-12-2018 04:29 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Curryong (Post 2141258)
Vicky was born in 1840, but it's true that nobility and Kings placed great emphasis on having sons. Nevertheless, Vicky became Albert's favourite child (he could discuss things with her that he couldn't with his other children.) Ernst, Albert's brother, never had legitimate children of his own as he reputedly suffered from syphilis.

But he had illegitimate children, did he? Did he not attempt to father children with his wife because of the syphilis?

CyrilVladisla 08-12-2018 09:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Denville (Post 2141319)
But he had illegitimate children, did he? Did he not attempt to father children with his wife because of the syphilis?

Did Duke Ernest II of Saxe-Coburg-Gotha have any children at all? I was under the impression he had no illegitimate children.

CyrilVladisla 12-14-2020 02:26 AM

Prince Albert paid a visit to Ireland with Queen Victoria.
https://www.alamy.com/stock-image-eng...162594885.html

An Ard Ri 12-14-2020 05:00 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CyrilVladisla (Post 2360578)
Prince Albert paid a visit to Ireland with Queen Victoria.
https://www.alamy.com/stock-image-eng...162594885.html

The queen visited Ireland a total of 4 times.

1849 with Prince Albert
1853 with Prince Albert
1861 with Prince Albert
1900

Prinsara 10-18-2021 06:10 PM

As far as biographies go, I'm still fond of Stanley Weintraub's Uncrowned King, which was one of the first royal books I read. I thought I would like A.N. Wilson's biography as much as I liked his earlier one of Victoria, but not so much.

He's a very complicated guy for someone who lived a very straightforward life. I forget which book it was that posed whether his basically-unconstitutional hold on power would have actually become a problem had he lived longer...

Prinsara 10-18-2021 06:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CyrilVladisla (Post 2141521)
Did Duke Ernest II of Saxe-Coburg-Gotha have any children at all? I was under the impression he had no illegitimate children.

The Duke of Connaught and (I believe) Prince Louis of Battenberg were visiting Coburg and apparently much of the town was waving at them and greeting them in a very casual manner. Louis asked Arthur what was going on and he said they were the "dear, good Ernst" (the Duchess of SCG's term)'s illegitimates. ;)

Curryong 10-18-2021 07:00 PM

Yes, Ernst was certainly the direct opposite of Albert in the sexual morality department. He had many illegitimate children, and was another of those husbands who reputedly gave their wives an STD which ultimately prevented them from having any children of their own.

duchessrachel 10-19-2021 01:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Prinsara (Post 2432123)
As far as biographies go, I'm still fond of Stanley Weintraub's Uncrowned King, which was one of the first royal books I read. I thought I would like A.N. Wilson's biography as much as I liked his earlier one of Victoria, but not so much.

He's a very complicated guy for someone who lived a very straightforward life. I forget which book it was that posed whether his basically-unconstitutional hold on power would have actually become a problem had he lived longer...

Thank you. That is the one I have been considering so I will read it.

Mbruno 10-19-2021 01:35 PM

Why was Prince Albert frequently painted wearing both the Order of the Garter and the Order of the Golden Fleece?

I understand that the Prince would normally wear the insignia of the Garter when required for official functions, but did he actually wear the Golden Fleece regularly in the UK? I find it somewhat strange given that it is a foreign order.


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