Queen Noor's relationship with her in-laws & (step) kids

[lilydale]

I'm curious about Queen Noor's relationships with her stepkids - can anyone give me some insight? Are they close, are there any she doesn't get along with? She raised Abir, Haya and Ali as her own correct? I was surprised that Haya doesn't have anything about Noor on her site, or if she did I missed it.

 

[pegassuss2525]

Most of it is common knowledge. It has been reported several times by several different sources. Queen Zein did raise Abir, Haya, and Ali. Zein and Noor had a very strained relationship. However, Noor's relationship with her stepchildren really hasn't affected her children's relationships with their brothers and sisters. Iman looks up to Abdullah and idolizes him. He is a combination big brother/father to her. He even named his daughter after her. Hashim gets along great with his older brothers. Hamzah gets along quite well with his sisters and for the most part with his brothers. It is the basic stepfamily syndrome on a grander scale.

 

[lilydale]

Noor couldn't have been too bad of a step-mother if Feisal and Abir are close to her.

 

[shannen26]

I agree with u, I really don't know what happened btw her, Ali and Hayah, with the others it's easy to guess-

 

[shannen26]

in a site: King Hussein's Office, u'll find Speeches and inside them the last letter to P Hasan, in which he talks about Noor and Hamzah, stating that many were envious of Hamzah- another letter is to P Abdullah, and a letter from P Abdullah to his father. Plus, a letter from P Hasan to KA and CP Hamzah, they are very interesting, read them !!!!

 

[shannen26]

they spent most of the day at Q Zein's- then, when they were , Hayah and Abeer were the 1st, about 11, they were sent abroad to school- the reason why- don't know .... QN is not always saying the truth in her book. I only know that Ali and Hayah dislike Q Noor, Hayah refers to her as- my father's wife- QN did admit once, in an interview, that something did not work btw her and KH's kids. I also have a feeling Ali and Hamzah are not so close as 2 brothers should be.

 

[alia_musallam]

Shannen26, I'm not saying that he's not a nice guy, in fact he is extremely charming and quite sexy but I just don't think he has what it takes to be King which is where this post came from in the first place. I'm sure his friends really like him, they wouldn't be friends with him otherwise... well, apart from the fact he's the king's brother and in amman that can get being ali's friend can get you far, in fact if I thought about it I'd probably feel sorry for him not knowing who likes him for who he is and not what he is... but that still doesn't condone his behaviour!

And from above posts, yes i agree that there are many reasons he's acts as he does and none them really his fault but it still doesn't make him a great role model for the young people in my country!

 

[alia_musallam]

I understood the same as you shannen26, that they have never got on with QNour as she, despite what she claims in her book, never treated them in the same way as she did her own children because they constantly reminded her of QAlia, the love of her husbands life. I believe that she is a very insecure woman but with great ambition for her own children and i personally do not believe everything she wrote in her book.

 

[wymanda]

Originally posted by alia_musallam@Jan 15th, 2004 - 3:48 am
I understood the same as you shannen26, that they have never got on with QNour as she, despite what she claims in her book, never treated them in the same way as she did her own children because they constantly reminded her of QAlia, the love of her husbands life. I believe that she is a very insecure woman but with great ambition for her own children and i personally do not believe everything she wrote in her book.

alia mussalam,
Now that I have realised that you are Jordanian I can see why you are so critical of Queen Noor. She is quite honest in her book saying that the Jordanian people always mistrusted her because she is American. It is only natural that a mother would be closer to her own children and Hayah, Ali etc had lost their mother in a tragic way so obviously clung to their grandmother.

I visited your country a couple of years ago and loved everything that I saw. You are truly fortunate to live in a country where such pride is taken in you history.

 

[justine]

Wymanda,
I just have to add my unwarranted comment...
I am American and have no ethnic ties to the Middle East, and even I don't believe all of what Queen Noor ever says.

It's always easiest to say "they don't treat me well because I am an outsider" but she has been a Jordanian queen for a few decades now. There are many other foreign queens in various countries on the globe who have been able to fit into their adopted country.

anyway...as I said...just my opinion

 

[wymanda]

Justine,
I just feel that, whether you like Noor or not, It must have been extremely difficult for a young woman like her to go into a marriage where there were three young children who had lost their mother in such a tragic way. Of course they would be resentful of someone they saw as taking her place and, possibly theirs, in their fathers life.

Also, any mother, no matter how sainted her intentions, is going to be closer to her own children than she will be to those of her predecessor. This happens in many families whether they be royal or not as a result of divorce or death.

I think that Noor would have tried not to replace Queen Alia but to be a freind to her step children. Remember that Abdullah and his siblings still had a mother as did the children of King Husseins first wife. A similar situation exists in England where Camilla is very much a part of Prince Charles life but does not seek to be "Mother" to his sons - that was Diana's role. Camilla seeks to relate to William & Harry as a freind and, from what I have read, is successful in that role.

 

[alia_musallam]

But wymanda do you really think that aged 3 and 18 mths they really felt such complex feelings? There are many successful second marriages where the stepmother has brought up the kids as her own, to the point that they call her mama... in the example you give of camilla and charles, the boys were quite old when their mother died and obviously have many memories of her, but ali, haya and abeer were all very young when it happened...

I think that Noor would have tried not to replace Queen Alia but to be a freind to her step children. Remember that Abdullah and his siblings still had a mother as did the children of King Husseins first wife

So why didn't Nour taken on the role of the mother to these three instead farming of farming them out to her mother-in-law who she apparently didn't get on with?

I'm not critical of Nour because she is american, that would be ridiculous of me especially as she has done lots for jordan and I'm not that petty. In fact I think that because she is american she got away with alot more than if she had been arab, she was really the first glamourous queen to publicise our country, i just feel in my heart of hearts that she had ulterior motives. Personally I think her book is rather trashy and my father won't let it in the house (as a great Prince Hassan supporter)!

 

[Banadoora]

I don't know the way Q Noor treated her stepchildren and I don't know the way they feel about her. In my opinion, we'll never know something like that. I've read her book this summer and got the idea that she was much closer to her children than she was to her stepchildren. She said that she and K Hussein had some problems with the older stepchildren (most likely P Muna's kids) earlier on in the marriage and that the older stepchildren were influencing the younger stepchildren (most likely Q Alia's kids) into thinking the same way about her and K Hussein.

Later on, towards the end of the book (i wish that I knew the page numbers but I can't find them) she was writing about K Hussein, P Hamzah and P Hashem taking a walk together and described them as her three men, without mentioning anything about Ali. She didn't write anything at all of the grown up Abeer, Haya and Ali. For example, she described the medical problems of her children but not those of Alia's kids. I thought that was odd, since she was a mother figure for them from a very young age.

But I don't know anything about her. I could've misunderstood these things or drawn the wrong conclusions about them.

 

[wymanda]

Originally posted by alia_musallam@Jan 15th, 2004 - 11:44 am
So why didn't Nour taken on the role of the mother to these three instead farming of farming them out to her mother-in-law who she apparently didn't get on with?

Personally I think her book is rather trashy and my father won't let it in the house (as a great Prince Hassan supporter)!

Who says she "Farmed them off" to her mother-in-law?

I know very little about King Husseins mother or the arab family system but is it possible that their grandmother had become a constant in their lives during the period between their mothers death and KH's marriage to Noor? Also, you say that Noor did not get on with her mother in law - my assumption would be that perhaps this lady was deliberatly making trouble with Noor through her older grandchildren??

You mention that your father will not allow Leap of Faith into your house? I take it then that you have not read the book?? Even if your father is a supporter of Prince Hassan, what does the banning of the book achieve? That sort of control is what is making us westerners suspicious of the eastern way. It equates with the portrayal in another very good book "Forbidden Love".

 

[wymanda]

Originally posted by Banadoora@Jan 15th, 2004 - 4:27 pm
Later on, towards the end of the book (i wish that I knew the page numbers but I can't find them) she was writing about K Hussein, P Hamzah and P Hashem taking a walk together and described them as her three men, without mentioning anything about Ali. She didn't write anything at all of the grown up Abeer, Haya and Ali. For example, she described the medical problems of her children but not those of Alia's kids. I thought that was odd, since she was a mother figure for them from a very young age.

But I don't know anything about her. I could've misunderstood these things or drawn the wrong conclusions about them.

I understand that the book was written primarily for the American audience which would be interested more in the half american children of Noor than in the children of King Hussein's other wives.

 

[alia_musallam]

You mention that your father will not allow Leap of Faith into your house? I take it then that you have not read the book?? Even if your father is a supporter of Prince Hassan, what does the banning of the book achieve? That sort of control is what is making us westerners suspicious of the eastern way. It equates with the portrayal in another very good book "Forbidden Love

Of course I've read it or I wouldn't be talking about it... He won't let it in the house because he thinks its self-promotional piece of trash and he thinks that she is a vile woman. He did actually go and out and buy it, read it and then threw it away! That's not to say that the rest of the family wasn't allowed to read it, coz we did... I personally don't think that that is what you like to call 'the eastern way' more than my father's temper! And 'Forbidden Love', correct me if i'm wrong, was the book written by the Christian girl about her Muslim friend who was killed because she was in love with a Christian boy, was it not? Well that was full of errors, and again I found it was like the 'Princess' series, books you read on the plane because they are easy to read and not particularly intellectually challenging... That's not to say I agree with honour killings because I don't, I just found it rather trashy... as you put it 'written for an american audience'.

The only reason he didn't throw that away too, was because at the end it thanked Prince Hassan for all his work in the field...

 

[Sean.~]

Originally posted by wymanda@Jan 14th, 2004 - 7:03 am
I understood from her book that Queen Noor took on the upbringing of Queen Alia's three children from the time of her marriage. Perhaps they spent a lot of time with their grandmother whilst KH & QN were overseas?

Well, whether true or not (and from what I know it isn't all that true) it is highly doubtful she would have said otherwise. I mean, come on!!
It would not go with the image of caring wife and mother she has created for herself (and I'm not saying that she's necessarily uncaring).

Besides, it's often hard being a step-mother for a myriad of reasons, particularly when you are facing so many other challenges (new country, language, culture, religion, husband, family, leadership role, etc.). Anyway, you all make good points.

Although, it should be noted that Noor in reality isn't exactly the polished, gentle 'stand by her man' kind of consort that many in the West see her as. She was very politically active (and influenced the King) and was and still is ambitious. She's prone to spin like all savy politicos(just listen to some of her comments and answers and then analyse them while comparing them to historical facts). It is also widely known that she didn't take criticism well or tolerate opposition (like the time she was crticized in Jordan for cyring at Rabin's funeral).

Sean ~

 

[alia_musallam]

To Sean's last point

It is also widely known that she didn't take criticism well or tolerate opposition (like the time she was crticized in Jordan for cyring at Rabin's funeral).

I'd like to add that lots of the stories you hear about Nour in Jordan are about her dislike of criticism and opposition and sometimes end up being quite funny or rather absurd (such as the whole Royal Court being brought to a standstill because Nour didn't like something) and that's why people didn't like her...

You do realise that Princess Nour's father was only informed that his daughter was going to marry CP Hamza three days before the actual engagement (ie. no jaha, the traditional asking for the hand of the bride), he wasn't allowed to call his daughter and congratulate her, nor bring his children (from his 2nd marriage) to the wedding... all because QNour and his ex-wife are best friends and his daughters (Nour and her sisters) were staying with QNour (he and his ex-wife don't get on, he is also on good terms with QNour's foe Prince Hassan to add injury to insult in her mind). This is shocking behaviour in my humble opinion as Nour's father is a relation of the JRF and should have been treated in a far more decent manner, and it's not as though he wasn't close to his daughters as they came to stay with him in Jordan every year. There are rumours that he didn't even get to sign the papers but that all of the CP's brothers did instead (though that could just be beacuse the King might be considered the head of his side of the family too)...

 

[almahboubah]

I don't believe that's true. After all, there were rumours going around at least two weeks before the occasion that CP was getting engaged. Plus, in islamic and arabic tradition , the groom should ask for the girls hand in marriage from her father and CP hamzah, as a tradional arab and muslim, I'd expect him to do that. I don't think they would've got engaged without her fathers permission or at least blessing.

 

[alia_musallam]

Well apparently one of the others called her father and said that they were going to get engaged, whihc of course he said yes to, but they was nothing formal on CP's behalf...

 

[shannen26]

would u plz read- Nine parts of a desire- a book by G. Brooks- she interviews KH and QN, and many J ppl in 1990 and in '91, c the chapter - A Queen- yes, QN was so much hated by J ppl, but in the period time when she worked her way in the White House, during the Gulf War, to make US Gov understand her hubby0s point of view, soon J ppl forgot what QN had done for the country and for KH- she was defending her own kids, had Q alia lived, she would have done the same. She's no insecure or nothing like that, on the contrary...... Alia, do u really think P Sarvath would have been a better Queen, so....plz, tell me why u're thinking that.

if u and your family are supporters of P Hasan, well, just try not to slander QN , and the rest of JRF, plz, I quote KH- The Princes and the Princesses are my children and the grandchildren are mine, too- wasn't he clear enough for u, there's no place for your Prince and his family in Jordan.

Alia, QN had her own right to do whatever she liked on her son's wed- as her husband is not here anymore,- so, plz, if u dislike QN and her kids, even your own King, just don't mention them...... of course, Hamzah and KA and his brothers had the last word , as always, it's sad u were so influenced by your father, try to think that KH' side are the leaders, P Hasan just lost everything......

I'm pretty sure Ali will do something great, he has everything 1 needs to be a great man, if only his brother gave him the chance......

 

[wymanda]

Hear, Hear.
I couldn't agree with you more shannen. alia is obviously an obedient and dutiful daughter and we should respect her for it. However, she needs to respect the way KH left his kingdom and the way he wished his family to govern Jordan.

One thing that impressed me when I visited Jordan was the way that the King and his family are so much a part of daily life. Here in Australia we are ambivalent as to whether we want a Queen or if we should become a republic. Even to the fact that the only public place you will see an image of Queen Elizabeth is in the Returned Servicemens Clubs. There are no pictures in/on public buildings anymore.

 

[bluetortuga]

Let's not jump on Alia. What she has to say has merit. I must admit I found it strange that we never saw pictures of Prince Asem bin Nayef at CP Hamzah and P. Noor's wedding. I wondered why this was so. Now I've figured it out. If a father attends his daughter's wedding, wouldn't he want his picture taken with the bride. Would there not be a picture of him and the bride together. But we only see pictures of P. Noor's mother. I just found this odd. I sensed from this that there was tension in the family somewhere; or that maybe P. Asem bin Nayef was not happy with his daughter marrying CP Hamzah. These are just my thoughts on the matter.

Maybe things will change by the time the official celebration is to take place. None of them are perfect. I have my issues with Q. Noor as I do with KA and Q. Rania. And learn from this: Q. Noor is treated in the same way Q. Rania will be treated if KA leaves his throne to Hamzah. There is no way Hamzah will be king. I think that KA is watching all this carefully and making arrangements to make sure his wife's and children's futures are secure should anything befall him. He's not the greatest but he's not dumb either.

 

[alia_musallam]

I don't hate the JRF, and yes I am an obedient and dutiful daughter in the fact I have been brought up to respect them as the rulers of my country, and do. It might be ignorance of any other system as Sean suggests but I do support them, all of them apart from QNour. I have nothing against His Majesty KA nor QRania, though I think he lacks his father's charisma, he also comes across as far more stable and less likely to make rash decisions. QRania, though spending lots of money on clothes, jewellry and houses which is what us arab girls are like, has again brought Jordan back to the eyes of the Western media, and the two of them together have already started making Jordan an easier place to live in (though old-timers like my father denounce the informality of royal protocol nowadays, and are very disapproving of the behaviour of young Jordanians going to bars, nightclubs, etc. (for some reason he doesn't seem to mind so much when its his own children in London but to see it Amman he finds outrageous)). Personally I think that Jordan has taken a turn for the better under KA which it would not have done under his late majesty. This is no longer the time for the totalitarian regimes of the 70s, and I think that KA realises that.

As for whether there is a place for Prince Hassan and his family in Jordan, I think that is one of the most ridiculous things I have ever heard. If you knew what you were talking about and sincerely respected the JRF then you too would realise that the only place for him is Jordan. The people still love him, probably more so now as he no longer wields any influence, and he has done so much for our country, far more than than QNour or QRania will have ever done. He was his late majesty's closest friend and companion, his trusted ally above all others, but we all know how the story ended, and have different ideas as to why. This does not mean that he should have to leave, he has served his country all his life and the least one could do for him is show him some respect. As for PSarvath being Queen, I think that she would have made a wonderful queen. She speaks beautiful Arabic, bilingual Urdu and English, fluent French and quite a bit of German I believe. She was brought up all over the world, her parents were both highly intelligent and very well connected, as a consequence so is she. She is also very happy to take on a supporting role as we have seen in her duties as CPrincess, unlike QNour. And last but not least, she has done so much for Jordan: she has taken on the burden of improving the education system providing schools at times when there weren't enough (namely after the great Palestinian migrations to Jordan), schools for the disabled, the first truly bilingual school in Jordan, improving the education system as a whole with the help of her husband. She also was a great friend of his late majesty's and he respected her opinion as the extremely intelligent woman that she is.
I do not begrudge the King that he is now King and not Prince Hassan, as the late majesty's eldest son it only seems natural that he should have succeeded, however I do begrudge the family the way in which Prince Hassan has been treated, and I think that Jordan would be a far better place if this division could be overcome so that KA and his uncle could work together, it would also be a much better situation for his son PRashid, who has inherited his parents intelligence.

On the subject of QNour, you obvoiusly do not understand my society if you say things like "QN had her own right to do whatever she liked on her son's wed- as her husband is not here anymore". She does not have any right whatsoever. An engagment is a family affair led by the heads of both families, in this case the King and PAzem. She had no right to help stir up conflicts between her future in-laws, and in fact should have been doing her best to quell them, to lessen the tensions at the ceremony itself. Bluetortuga, you are right when you say that PAzem was noticeably missing from the photos and it wasn't because he didn't want his duaghter to marry CP so much as his ex-wife and QNour doing their best to make him feel uncomfortable and unwelcome.

I'm not trying to spread slander about QNour, as I have too much respect for her late husband, but I thought that you might appreciate learning different sides to the story and what people think who actually know something about the situation on the ground rather than from Hello or other high-brow tabloids or QN's book.

 

[shannen26]

Alia, I never read Hello, should we take our infos from u ? u're so one- sided, yes, u did slander QN, u called her a -vile- that was awful, to say the least. Anyway, I'm sure KA had his say about everything at Hamzah's wed- he's the Head of the Family, so he's entitled to do as he pleases.
Winmanda, I agree about all your posts, I'm not surprised u're from australia..... we, who come from the West, I'm from Italy, can keep our mind as open as we wish to, no1 tells us what we must think or say or do.

 

[alia_musallam]

Me calling her vile was just an expression of my personal opinion. And yes I admit that my opinion of her is one-sided, but i have never said otherwise, and I have never expected you to take any info I've posted as god's honest truth, because it isn't, it is mostly from Amman gossip and my interpretation of QNour's actions, but I would expect you to at least appreciate that there might be another side to yours, and that my opinions might have challenged you in some way to come up with some interesting counters. As for you having an open mind, well I hate to say it but I think your posts about Ali showed us how close minded you actually are.

 

[madonna23]

do you think sarvath's being a non-arab has anything to do with her lack of popularity? if she became queen would that have hurt her? i know noor was american but she was part arab...sarvath is not arab at all. what do you think?

 

[alia_musallam]

Though she's not Arab, her family allegedly came from the Hijaz with the first Muslim conquerors and they are still considered Qureishi, and a very good Muslim family. I think people in power didn't like her because she was not the type to play games, flatter egos and pander to people's opinion when she thought they were wrong, which I must admit we Arabs are very good at doing. She comes across as very intelligent and very frank with her opinions (something we aren't good at as a people) and I think that the political elite did not like that, especially as most of them got to where they were by doing the exact opposite.

It was not the Jordanian people who didn't like her as much as the Jordanian politicians and QNour.

 

[SemiPatriot83]

Does anybody know the relationship between Q. Noor and P. Sarvarth? Do they get along?

 

[madonna23]

i don't think they hate each other...too strong of a word, no? i think they dislike each other...it could be for a number of reasons...but i think it's mostly because when hassan was crown prince, there was a lot of talk that sarvath and hassan were spreading rumors about noor...