Media Reports: Plot to overthrow King Abdullah II (April 2021)


If you have answers, please help by responding to the unanswered posts.
See posts with no answers
Alisa said:
Wow...this speaks volumes. Is Jordan under a dictatorship now? !?

It sounds like Prince Hamzah was forced to sign this sworn statement of allegiance . I wonder if his family or life was threatened. The empassioned person on the video would not so quickly sign such a document .
Click to expand...

Jordan has always been a sort of dictatorship. The meaning of a dictatorship is: all powers in hands of one person or vested in a clique around said person. Of course the word brings connotations to a Kim Jong-Il, a Mu'ammar Khadaffi or a Joseph Stalin.

The original meaning is "he, who dictates" and it was a functionary appointed by the Senate of Rome to wield all power for a limited period. Julius Caesar and his adpted son (and nephew) Augustus were appointed dictators too, in the original meaning of the word.
 
StefanDi said:
So now it is illegal to discuss or share news about this online in Jordan...

https://www.reuters.com/article/us-...yal-feud-state-news-agency-idUSKBN2BT0R9?il=0

DUBAI (Reuters) - Jordan’s public prosecutor banned on Tuesday all media and social media from publishing content about frictions between King Abdullah and his half brother Prince Hamza, the state news agency Petra reported.
Click to expand...

Which I guess goes to show that Hamzah was right about at least some of his observations...
 
And again with this story, if Hamzah really pledged his loyalty and everything is "fine" now, why has he not been seen or heard?

One would think having him back out again and conducting business relatively normally would placate or diffuse his supporters. This doesn't seem to be the way to do that.
 
Last edited:
Is it possible King Abdullah is not the one who got upset with Hamzah, but someone else? On the other hand, who else is able to order the head of the military around...?

Could someone have had it out for Hamzah and persuaded the king he was trouble?

Speculation is about all we've got atm.
 
Prinsara said:
Is it possible King Abdullah is not the one who got upset with Hamzah, but someone else? On the other hand, who else is able to order the head of the military around...?

Could someone have had it out for Hamzah and persuaded the king he was trouble?

Speculation is about all we've got atm.
Click to expand...

You're right, it is all speculation and the media who've reported on it have turned it into a succession issue when it likely never was. I don't believe there is a succession issue in Jordan. The king named his obvious succsor, his eldest son, and people moved on. Even if they weren't happy with it, it was completely expected and not a surprise. These headlines make for more exciting intrigues for a country that doesn't get a lot of press internationally.
 
Eskimo said:
I wouldn’t put it past Noor :whistling:
Click to expand...

Actually Queen Noor rarely does any tv but when she does it's with serious outlets on humanitarian causes. That was Rania on Oprah, the View, Today show, Harper's Bazaar... ;)
 
Message from the King Abdullah:


"The challenge over the past few days was not the most difficult or dangerous to the stability of our nation, but to me, it was the most painful. Sedition came from within and without our one house, and nothing compares to my shock, pain, and anger as a brother and as the head of the Hashemite family, and as a leader of this proud people."


"I decided to deal with the matter of Prince Hamzah within the Hashemite family, and I entrusted this to my uncle, His Royal Highness Prince El Hassan bin Talal. And Prince Hamzah pledged before the family to follow in the steps of the ancestors, remain loyal to their mission, and to put Jordan’s interest, Constitution, and laws above all considerations. Hamzah today is with his family, at his palace, in my care."


https://rhc.jo/en/media/news/king-sends-letter-jordanian-people
 
:ermm::ermm::ermm:
Yeah, again, if Hamzah's repented and reformed, why isn't he saying so?

And considering this was originally framed as "a threat to the nation's stability and security"...

Another WaPo opinion piece: https://archive.ph/liIHs
 
Last edited:
It is indeed very interesting how this matter was handled. I truly do not have an opinion, however, I am genuinely curious what the phrase "in my care" means.
 
Prinsara said:
:ermm::ermm::ermm:
Yeah, again, if Hamzah's repented and reformed, why isn't he saying so?

And considering this was originally framed as "a threat to the nation's stability and security"...

Another WaPo opinion piece: https://archive.ph/liIHs
Click to expand...



Interesting opinion piece.

I wonder how Hamzeh feels about staying in Jordan under the “care” of his brother. Abdullah was pretty direct in giving his version of events.
 
eya said:
Message from the King Abdullah:

"The challenge over the past few days was not the most difficult or dangerous to the stability of our nation, but to me, it was the most painful. Sedition came from within and without our one house, and nothing compares to my shock, pain, and anger as a brother and as the head of the Hashemite family, and as a leader of this proud people."

"I decided to deal with the matter of Prince Hamzah within the Hashemite family, and I entrusted this to my uncle, His Royal Highness Prince El Hassan bin Talal. And Prince Hamzah pledged before the family to follow in the steps of the ancestors, remain loyal to their mission, and to put Jordan’s interest, Constitution, and laws above all considerations. Hamzah today is with his family, at his palace, in my care."

https://rhc.jo/en/media/news/king-sends-letter-jordanian-people
Click to expand...

Words like 'sedition' and he is (with his family) 'in my care' don't suggest a bright future for Hamzah.

My guess would be that Hamzah was indeed trying to put Jordan's interests above all considerations... but he had a different opinion of what that meant in practice than his half-brother.
 
Somebody said:
Words like 'sedition' and he is (with his family) 'in my care' don't suggest a bright future for Hamzah.

My guess would be that Hamzah was indeed trying to put Jordan's interests above all considerations... but he had a different opinion of what that meant in practice than his half-brother.
Click to expand...



Agreed.

It really doesn’t sound good for Hamzeh. I was a bit surprised- maybe I shouldn’t be- that Abdullah was direct in condemning his brother and frankly putting his future in such an ominous light. Is this the image he wants to project to the world? I guess it depends on your opinion regarding what Hamzeh did vs the palace PR. Still....
 
eya said:
Message from the King Abdullah:


"The challenge over the past few days was not the most difficult or dangerous to the stability of our nation, but to me, it was the most painful. Sedition came from within and without our one house, and nothing compares to my shock, pain, and anger as a brother and as the head of the Hashemite family, and as a leader of this proud people."


"I decided to deal with the matter of Prince Hamzah within the Hashemite family, and I entrusted this to my uncle, His Royal Highness Prince El Hassan bin Talal. And Prince Hamzah pledged before the family to follow in the steps of the ancestors, remain loyal to their mission, and to put Jordan’s interest, Constitution, and laws above all considerations. Hamzah today is with his family, at his palace, in my care."


https://rhc.jo/en/media/news/king-sends-letter-jordanian-people
Click to expand...

It mainly shows the King's unsecurity and feeling the heat. A modern and constitutional monarch can handle fair and reasonable criticism on the Government and not directly frame it as "a coup".

It also shows how influential Prince Hassan is. Both the King and Prince Hamzah seem to accept Prince Hassan as mediator.
 
Poor Queen Noor; Hamzah is her son. Also, are there too many of the al-Hashemis? Are they having too many children for the monarchy? Are there too many al-Hashemis chasing the few good "royal" jobs?
 
Susan D said:
Poor Queen Noor; Hamzah is her son. Also, are there too many of the al-Hashemis? Are they having too many children for the monarchy? Are there too many al-Hashemis chasing the few good "royal" jobs?
Click to expand...

Hussein married four times (the next wife was always younger than the last, the first two wives were never made queens) and had children with each (total 11 children + 1 adopted), so there you have it. TBF, he's not the only one (look at the Brunei king or those Arabian princes/sheikhs). But his father, King Talal, only had 4 children (including Hussein).

Duc_et_Pair said:
It also shows how influential Prince Hassan is. Both the King and Prince Hamzah seem to accept Prince Hassan as mediator.
Click to expand...

Well, Hassan seems to be a well respected man (and possibly could be a good king). Rumour has it that Hussein didn't like the change he did when he's regent (while Hussein undergoing treatment) and Noor doesn't get on well with Sarvath (Hassan's wife) so he might not appoint Hamzah as his successor.

I honestly can't understand the favouritism over Hamzah. I mean, if Abdullah wasn't a choice because he's half British (so is Faisal), then why not Ali? Ali is full Jordanian and it was said that Hussein really loved Alia to the point of naming the airport after her. And if people have problem with Rania's spending, as if Noor lived frugally when she's queen ...
 
yukari said:
Hussein married four times (the next wife was always younger than the last, the first two wives were never made queens) and had children with each (total 11 children + 1 adopted), so there you have it. TBF, he's not the only one (look at the Brunei king or those Arabian princes/sheikhs). But his father, King Talal, only had 4 children (including Hussein).
Click to expand...
Hussein had a reputation as a playboy and never shook off his roving eye. I once watched a documentary (this was 10-15 years ago) which claimed that Noor got fed up in the 90s and spent a lot time abroad as a result. They only reconciled after his cancer diagnosis.
 
After the royal court published the statement signed by Prince Hamzah and people were reassured that the problem was on its way to being resolved within the family, an audio recording of the prince's discussion with the Army chief of staff was leaked. أPrince Hamzah`s very sharp words to the chief of staff increased the public’s sympathy for him, and people began to ask publicly on social media, "Where is Prince Hamzah?"
Even yesterday after the king`s letter was released another recording was leaked (Probably recorded on Saturday) in which Prince Hamzah said:
They want a reaction (referring to the authorities)... They want an excuse .. I told all my acquaintances abroad ... I expect that they will cut off the Internet from us in a short time .. and we will see. This requires patience. Then he said, laughing: Of course, if we disappear, everyone is free ... But I expect the most important thing that there is no threat of violence or anything similar ... But showing what happened may be required in the coming period.
Click to expand...

I wonder who is leaking these recordings & why? I think that the government is somewhat correct in its claim that there are outside parties involved in what is happening now.
 
:previous:
Queen Noor?
Hamzah in his first record to BBC said he sent recordings and proves to his family and friends aboard,so i guess we will have more leaks
 
Rossina said:
After the royal court published the statement signed by Prince Hamzah and people were reassured that the problem was on its way to being resolved within the family, an audio recording of the prince's discussion with the Army chief of staff was leaked. أPrince Hamzah`s very sharp words to the chief of staff increased the public’s sympathy for him, and people began to ask publicly on social media, "Where is Prince Hamzah?"
Even yesterday after the king`s letter was released another recording was leaked (Probably recorded on Saturday) in which Prince Hamzah said:


I wonder who is leaking these recordings & why? I think that the government is somewhat correct in its claim that there are outside parties involved in what is happening now.
Click to expand...

And that's the problem. Too many interests in Jordan from the outside, US, Israel and US like always. Let's hope Abdallah manages to calm it down for the stability of the region not only for his own sake.
I doubt Hamza understands the whole thing, if he did was has been reported (playing a big role in it), it was a very risky thing.
Seems as if Abdallah was a very good choice.
 
cathy50 said:
And that's the problem. Too many interests in Jordan from the outside, US, Israel and US like always. Let's hope Abdallah manages to calm it down for the stability of the region not only for his own sake.
I doubt Hamza understands the whole thing, if he did was has been reported (playing a big role in it), it was a very risky thing.
Seems as if Abdallah was a very good choice.
Click to expand...

Neither the US nor Israel has the faintest interest in destabilizing Jordan and both publicly backed the king several days ago.

Seems as if Abdullah is keeping his brother prisoner on false, ill-specified charges and refusing to let people discuss the matter.
 
Mademoiselle Lilo said:
:previous:
Queen Noor?
Hamzah in his first record to BBC said he sent recordings and proves to his family and friends aboard, so i guess we will have more leaks
Click to expand...

Maybe someone else. In his press conference, the Minister of Foreign Affairs stated that Prince Hamzah was in full contact and coordination with Basem Awadallah regarding his movements. I am surprised by this link TBH. :ermm: Awadallah is a hated figure in Jordan, he has always been blamed by the public for privatization policies adopted by the government in the years prior to the Arab Spring. He was very close to King Abdullah II and served for some time as his office manager and later as the Head of the Royal Court. The last position he held was the king's special envoy to Saudi Arabia. However, he later managed to be very close to the Saudi CP Mohammed Bin Salman too and became an advisor to him. In addition to his connection to the Saudi Crown Prince, Awadallah obtained Saudi citizenship and worked for several institutions in Saudi Arabia, Bahrain, and the UAE, where he holds the position of CEO to a company named "Tamouh".

My point is: If Prince Hamza is really seeking reform as he claimed, why he linked himself to Mr. Awadallah?
 
Last edited:
Eh...Hamzah tried to push his weight around and here is the result. He won't be executed or anything. But I'm not surprised he's under "house arrest." Jordan is not the Western world and he won't be treated as if it it were. He failed at whatever it was he was trying to attempt ,and now he is facing the consequences. I'm sorry for his family, but not that much for him. He knew what Abdullah might do, unless he was raised under a rock. If he didn't like what was going on in Jordan he should have gone to live with his mother in the UK. Not start a poor attempt at some kind of coup from the same Royal Compound that almost the whole family, Including Abdullah, lives in.
 
Last edited:
Perhaps he hoped to imrpove matters for the people of Jordan. HIs going away to live abroad would not do much for them...
 
Denville said:
Perhaps he hoped to imrpove matters for the people of Jordan. HIs going away to live abroad would not do much for them...
Click to expand...

I completely understand that. And as a Westerner, great!

As for Hamzah? No. An idea executed in particularly stupid fashion. And now he 's paying the price. And that's if I accept that he started this for the good of the Jordanian people and not for a bruised ego that never recovered from being demoted from the position of Crown Prince. Which, quite frankly could be just as valid a reason for all this mess.
 
I think it's been somewhat established at this point that there likely wasn’t any attempted coup and this is an excuse about or to cover up something else. The fact that Hamzah is not being allowed to openly and publicly repent is speaking volumes.
 
Last edited:
Prinsara said:
I think it's been somewhat established at this point that there likely wasn’t any attempted coup and this is an excuse about or to cover up something else. The fact that Hamzah is not being allowed to openly and publicly repent is speaking volumes.
Click to expand...


I don't agree that there is proof that there was no coup. But it doesn't matter. Hamzah fraternized with people that are against the non-democratic government of which his brother is the King , for either the good of the Jordanian people or his own ego, or both. He did this from within the Royal Compound where he and his brother live, and has now been metaphorically spanked and put in time-out. He can leave when he's freed, stay and keep his mouth shut, or keep it up and get punished, perhaps more harshly if there's a next time.
Does it suck to our Western sensibilities? Yes. But again, this isn't the West and Jordan is NOT a democratic country.
 
Last edited:
Right, well you can keep claiming Hamzah's an idiot for trying [something] against an authoritarian government, when we don't even know what the [something] is, or that there's any proof that he's to blame or to what extent, versus the government just saying that he is. I'm not inclined to take their non-transparent word for it.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.

Latest posts

Back
Top Bottom