The Royal Forums Coat of Arms


Join The Royal Forums Today
Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
 
  #61  
Old 04-04-2021, 06:33 AM
Heir Presumptive
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Hamburg, Germany
Posts: 2,229
Good gracious, another royal brothers at war.. I donīt think the arabian system of choosing an heir is a good solution. It causes much more frustration and jealousy than the system in which the heir/ess in being born into this position. And perhaps it wasnīt very wise of the ailing King Hussein to install Hamzah as CP when he knew Abdullah had children of his own...?
__________________

Reply With Quote
  #62  
Old 04-04-2021, 06:38 AM
Tilia C.'s Avatar
Super Moderator
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: O, Germany
Posts: 5,690
While not acknowledging that he was involved in the plot, the video message still makes it decidedly clear that Prince Hamza is in political opposition to his brother King Abdullah. No names are mentioned, but it's obvious that he's criticizing the king's policies, and that he's not intending to back down meekly.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Heavs View Post
As of 15 hours ago Noor was retweeting fairly standard stuff for her:

https://twitter.com/QueenNoor/with_replies

I assume she, Raiyah and Ned are all still in the UK and she may have been involved with his lawyer handing the video to the BBC.

I think she should stay publicly silent for now until more is known. I'm sure she is working and worried behind the scenes.
Well, Noor has changed tactics since you posted.
Quote:
Praying that truth and justice will prevail for all the innocent victims of this wicked slander. God bless and keep them safe.
and a re-tweet from Amnesty. She must be rather worried.
__________________

__________________
Reply With Quote
  #63  
Old 04-04-2021, 06:45 AM
Heir Presumptive
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Hamburg, Germany
Posts: 2,229
Quote:
Originally Posted by Princess Mahala View Post
King Hussein chose his brother Hassan because of the constant assassination attempts and Abdullah was too young at the time. I think he waited too long to remove Hassan because he became so popular and Abdullah was the oldest but hardly knew any Arabic and wasn't prepared, but his purported favorite, hamzah, was too young. It was said he worried for Hamzah to have a normal life and go to school and left it on good faith that Abdullah would step aside one day...
Why would he have thought that?! If he did, it would have been terribly naive of him. And I donīt regard King Kussein as a naive man at all. Besides that, the monarchial system isnīt made for the sovereign to just step aside if there isnīt a very serious and grave reason to do so, only for another member to "take over"! And let us not forget that Abdullahs reign has been a widely successful one for over 20 years! Yes, there might be things going wrong and things we donīt know behind the scenes (the same can be claimed for many governments around the world..), but the King succeeded to keep a respectable stability in this troubled, some might say, dangerous region, handling with a major refugee crisis since many years.
Reply With Quote
  #64  
Old 04-04-2021, 07:36 AM
Duc_et_Pair's Avatar
Imperial Majesty
 
Join Date: Mar 2014
Location: City, Netherlands
Posts: 10,868


The King, helped by his security forces, managed to suppress free speech and therefore criticism, resulting in a sort of 'stability'.

The Hashemite Kingdom of Jordan is perceived as highly corrupt, with little progress made towards controlling corruption. That is what King Abdullah can be blamed for. He actually uses corruptism, nepotism, favoritism and kleptocracy as useful instruments of his politics. That it absolutely harms Jordan in general and the average Jordanian in particular, never seemed to be someting of the King's concern.

After all, the King can rely on his Intelligence agencies which, through a complex spying system, play a central role in preserving "stability" (read: oppress discontent).
Reply With Quote
  #65  
Old 04-04-2021, 07:58 AM
Majesty
 
Join Date: May 2014
Location: Pittsburgh, United States
Posts: 7,006
Quote:
Originally Posted by wartenberg7 View Post
Why would he have thought that?! If he did, it would have been terribly naive of him. And I donīt regard King Kussein as a naive man at all. Besides that, the monarchial system isnīt made for the sovereign to just step aside if there isnīt a very serious and grave reason to do so, only for another member to "take over"! And let us not forget that Abdullahs reign has been a widely successful one for over 20 years! Yes, there might be things going wrong and things we donīt know behind the scenes (the same can be claimed for many governments around the world..), but the King succeeded to keep a respectable stability in this troubled, some might say, dangerous region, handling with a major refugee crisis since many years.

Islamic monarchies are different from European monarchies in the sense that the King may appoint his successor among members of his family, although in Jordan the successor must necessarily be either one of the King's brothers or his eldest son.

I don't think King Hussein expected Abdullah to step aside for Hamzah, but rather he wanted Hamzah to be named Abdullah's successor, which he was temporarily, before Abdullah rescinded that and named Prince Hussein as Crown Prince.
Reply With Quote
  #66  
Old 04-04-2021, 09:07 AM
Commoner
 
Join Date: Sep 2020
Location: Puttaparthi, Croatia
Posts: 10
well, their family gatherings are about to get awkward
btw, if he gets really bored, maybe he can become pen-pals with Princess Latifa
Reply With Quote
  #67  
Old 04-04-2021, 09:58 AM
lula's Avatar
Imperial Majesty
 
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: , Spain
Posts: 19,650
I think we should remember what happened in 2017, and to what extent a similar situation may be occurring now. Perhaps the key is to know where the interference of neighboring countries begins and ends, or to what extent the management of the king and his government is increasingly criticized within Jordan.

December 2017

King of Jordan arrests own brothers for links to Saudi Arabia as regional tensions grow

https://www.express.co.uk/news/world...rabia-iran-war
Reply With Quote
  #68  
Old 04-04-2021, 10:22 AM
Rossina's Avatar
Super Moderator
Royal Blogger
 
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: *****, India
Posts: 7,190
Prince Hamza planned to 'destabilise Jordan' with foreign parties, says country's deputy PM

https://news.sky.com/story/prince-ha...ty-pm-12265810
__________________
TRF Rules ** MEMBERSHIP FAQ** TRF Blog
Reply With Quote
  #69  
Old 04-04-2021, 10:32 AM
kathia_sophia's Avatar
Heir Presumptive
 
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: South, Portugal
Posts: 2,894
Quote:
Originally Posted by bebita99 View Post
well, their family gatherings are about to get awkward

well if he gets really bored, maybe he can become pen-pals with Princess Latifa
Yes, it will be awkward, especially in Ramdan, which is around the corner (they usual gather at Ramdan festivities, but not sure how they'll do this year with Covid-19).
__________________
♫A man is not old until regrets take the place of dreams.♥
Reply With Quote
  #70  
Old 04-04-2021, 11:07 AM
Prinsara's Avatar
Serene Highness
 
Join Date: Feb 2020
Location: A place to grow, Canada
Posts: 1,030
WaPo: "In Jordan, that news of the alleged coup has gone public by way of brief statements and virtual silence from the local press has spurred several political observers to speculate that the coup may be a cover story for another political maneuver, said Jordanian political analyst Amer Sabaileh.

“There is a lot of confusion, but in Jordan everyone is asking for reform, not to topple the government. I don’t see the elements for a plot,” said Sabaileh. “What we do know is that there are some mediocre people who are running the show when it comes to politics and, after yesterday, the government is under even more pressure to make themselves seem credible.”
Reply With Quote
  #71  
Old 04-04-2021, 11:15 AM
Princess Mahala's Avatar
Courtier
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: *, United States
Posts: 644
Quote:
Originally Posted by lula View Post
I think we should remember what happened in 2017, and to what extent a similar situation may be occurring now. Perhaps the key is to know where the interference of neighboring countries begins and ends, or to what extent the management of the king and his government is increasingly criticized within Jordan.

December 2017

King of Jordan arrests own brothers for links to Saudi Arabia as regional tensions grow

https://www.express.co.uk/news/world...rabia-iran-war
I think this just shows the increasing paranoia of King Abdullah! He was practically a British and Western educated man when he came to power. He was in the military but he's had to fight hard to prove himself and keep his position stable. Part of his success (in keeping the throne) is the unwavering support he's managed from international community and creating the image Jordan is the last bastion of stability, that without him it would fall apart. No one wants that obviously so they turn a blind eye.

I'm afraid if there isn't any concrete evidence against Hamzah and things get more serious there won't be many powerful people outside Jordan willing to risk their relationship with the King to help him.
Reply With Quote
  #72  
Old 04-04-2021, 11:50 AM
Prinsara's Avatar
Serene Highness
 
Join Date: Feb 2020
Location: A place to grow, Canada
Posts: 1,030
Here's a thought — if "the government" has harder evidence against Hamzah and the others who were arrested, why aren't they revealing it in clearer and more detailed charges? Why stay so vague? I know habeas corpus isn't part of their legal system, but you'd think they'd want to produce a more damning case for the world and make themselves look better.
Reply With Quote
  #73  
Old 04-04-2021, 12:06 PM
Rossina's Avatar
Super Moderator
Royal Blogger
 
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: *****, India
Posts: 7,190
Quote:
Originally Posted by Prinsara View Post
Here's a thought — if "the government" has harder evidence against Hamzah and the others who were arrested, why aren't they revealing it in clearer and more detailed charges? Why stay so vague? I know habeas corpus isn't part of their legal system, but you'd think they'd want to produce a more damning case for the world and make themselves look better.
According to the Deputy Prime Minister, investigations with the detainees are still ongoing. He did mentioned some details of the contacts between Prince Hamzah or those close to him with the accused Bassem Awadallah and Sharif Hassan bin Zaid.

Mr. Safadi also reported that the authorities detected a call yesterday between Princess Basmah, the wife of Prince Hamzah, and a person known to have ties to some external parties, as this person offered her to send a private plane to evacuate the family outside Jordan.
What is really disturbing IMO in the minister's statements is his speech about referring the issue to the court. Will Prince Hamzah be subjected to a public trial? Is that possible? Well, If it happened, That would be a big development for sure.
Reply With Quote
  #74  
Old 04-04-2021, 12:34 PM
Princess Mahala's Avatar
Courtier
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: *, United States
Posts: 644
I wouldn't blame Basma for wanting to get out of there. Logically I'm sure they'd take help from anyone so including this story as evidence against Hamzah it's one more way of stacking the cards against him. Right now evidence only points to admitted criticizing the king not a real plot to overthrow.

At the moment Abdullah seems to be letting security forces handle and accuse his brother. Maybe he's being careful not to be seen as directly supporting this detention as events could galvanize more Jordanians against him.
Reply With Quote
  #75  
Old 04-04-2021, 12:37 PM
Mademoiselle Lilo's Avatar
Super Moderator
Royal Blogger
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: T/H, Morocco
Posts: 9,433
i must be the only one whos not surprised at all by the last night events...
i don't kkow about Prince Hamza involvement but there is a deep feeling of unsatisfaction among the population after 20yrs of King Abdullah reign,Prince Hamza critics to the gouvernement and his country politics are only a symbol of the growing unsatisfaction in Jordan: we have seen the teachers mouvement that tell now is not solved,we have seen how things were almost got out of control after what happen in Salt hospital and many others populations protestants in streets from time to time...
Now the question is :did prince Hamza really attempt to overthrow his brother?
Or tnhis brother and the regime are only worried about his popularity and his growing critics that become bild by time?
Reply With Quote
  #76  
Old 04-04-2021, 01:03 PM
Nobility
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: City, United States
Posts: 437
Whether or not Hamzah tried to destabilize the regime, he has now made clear that he is a critic of the current government. That makes this situation hard to resolve.

I don't see an easy way out Abdullah. If he takes drastic steps, like imprisoning or executing Hamzah, he'll turn him into a martyr and diminish Jordan's international standing. If he takes less drastic steps, like banishing or silencing Hamzah, he'll turn Hamzah into a permanent rallying point for anyone who wants to overthrow the regime.

My guess is they'll force Hamzah to recant his criticisms and swear his allegiance to Abdullah publicly and then keep constant pressure on him until things calm down.

The Washington Post is reporting that Abdullah will deal with Hamzah "within the framework of the family," rather than sending him directly to the trial through the security courts.

The paper also claims that over the last month, protesters have been chanting, “Oh Hamzeh, son of Hussein, the country is lost, where are you?”

https://www.washingtonpost.com/world...top-table-main
Reply With Quote
  #77  
Old 04-04-2021, 01:33 PM
Rossina's Avatar
Super Moderator
Royal Blogger
 
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: *****, India
Posts: 7,190
Quote:
Originally Posted by kalnel View Post

I don't see an easy way out Abdullah. If he takes drastic steps, like imprisoning or executing Hamzah, he'll turn him into a martyr and diminish Jordan's international standing. If he takes less drastic steps, like banishing or silencing Hamzah, he'll turn Hamzah into a permanent rallying point for anyone who wants to overthrow the regime.
I don't thing King Abdullah will consider such a brutal punishment to his brother. Neither he nor his father before him actually did that to their opponents. I think that the harshest punishment that would be inflicted on Prince Hamzah in the event of his conviction is imprisonment, and I except it would be an appropriate place that suits his position.
I feel sorry for Basmah and the children. Will they remain home arrested with him? If so, Will they be allowed to attend schools.
Reply With Quote
  #78  
Old 04-04-2021, 01:47 PM
Commoner
 
Join Date: Sep 2020
Location: Puttaparthi, Croatia
Posts: 10
If Hamzah is against the regime wouldn't it be better for him to form an opposition and try to win on the next parliamentary elections
Reply With Quote
  #79  
Old 04-04-2021, 01:51 PM
Rossina's Avatar
Super Moderator
Royal Blogger
 
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: *****, India
Posts: 7,190
Princess Firyal comments, OMG!

She is the former wife of Prince Mohammad Bin Talal, King Hussein`s brother, and the mother of his two sons Talal & Ghazi.
Quote:
@FiryalOfJordan:The seemingly blind ambition of Queen Noor & her sons is delusional, futile, unmerited, false sense of entitlement. they all should know better. Such as the constitutional succession act, father to the eldest son, experienced with uninterrupted service record. Grow up, Boys.
https://twitter.com/FiryalOfJordan/s...18429381849095
https://postimg.cc/RJ7jmBfP
__________________
TRF Rules ** MEMBERSHIP FAQ** TRF Blog
Reply With Quote
  #80  
Old 04-04-2021, 02:09 PM
Commoner
 
Join Date: Sep 2020
Location: Puttaparthi, Croatia
Posts: 10
She is saying sons and boys...i'm following instagram accounts and have noticed not only Hamzah but Hashim also paying visits to the locals lately, but they were never together. I assumed it was the King that sent them to mingle with local people at terrain to listen to their problems. Anyway Firyal calls herself a humanitarian...how conceited can you be to give that title to yourself
here are the instagram accounts


https://www.instagram.com/princeshamzahandhashem/
https://www.instagram.com/hrhprincehashim/
__________________

Reply With Quote
Reply

« Ramadan: 2007-2021 | - »

Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Media reports: Divorce for King Mohamed VI and Princess Lalla Salma fanletizia King Mohammed VI and Princess Lalla Salma and Family 237 06-18-2020 09:34 PM
"Prince Philip: The Plot to Make a King" (2015) - Channel 4 Documentary Dman The Electronic Domain 23 08-06-2015 06:26 PM
Royal Blackmail Plot: October 2007 wbenson British Royals 60 10-30-2007 02:39 AM




Popular Tags
#royalrelatives #royalgenes abu dhabi american baby names biography britain britannia british royal family british royals buckingham palace camilla's family camilla parker bowles carolin china chinese ming dynasty asia asian emperor royalty qing clarence house cpr dna dresses duchess of sussex duke of cambridge duke of sussex earl of snowdon edward vii elizabeth ii emperor family tree general news thread george vi gradenigo hereditary grand duchess stéphanie hereditary grand duke guillaume history hochberg hypothetical monarchs jewellery jewelry kensington palace list of rulers maxima monarchy mountbatten names nepal nepalese royal family plantinum jubilee pless prince charles of luxembourg prince harry princess alexia (2005 -) princess ariane princess chulabhorn princess dita princess eugenie princess laurentien princess of orange queen elizabeth ii queen louise queen victoria resusci anne royal court royal jewels royalty of taiwan russian court dress spain thailand thai royal family unfinished portrait united states united states of america wales


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 12:22 AM.

Social Knowledge Networks

eXTReMe Tracker
Powered by vBulletin
Copyright ©2000 - 2021
Jelsoft Enterprises
×