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  #341  
Old 01-19-2018, 06:16 PM
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Originally Posted by Mbruno View Post
I don't want to get into this debate, but let me just say that succession is not that straightforward. The fact that the last king has a firstborn son who is still alive doesn't automatically make that firstborn son the heir (or make the eldest son of that firstborn son the next in line). That is because all monarchies and /or royal houses have additional rules under which a person who would be in the line of succession by birth can be nonetheless removed from the succession, often together with all of his descendants. Without getting into the merit of the argument, that is what the Duke of Aosta claims to be the case with respect to his cousins.
Apart from the question who is the head of the family, both cousins Vittorio Emanuele and Amedeo of course are Savoias, they are both direct and legitimate male agnates of a long line of Dukes of Savoy.

It is not that a surname is usurped like Bernadotte or Nassau, both princes simply ARE Savoys.
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  #342  
Old 01-19-2018, 07:47 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mbruno View Post
I don't want to get into this debate, but let me just say that succession is not that straightforward. The fact that the last king has a firstborn son who is still alive doesn't automatically make that firstborn son the heir (or make the eldest son of that firstborn son the next in line). That is because all monarchies and /or royal houses have additional rules under which a person who would be in the line of succession by birth can be nonetheless removed from the succession, often together with all of his descendants. Without getting into the merit of the argument, that is what the Duke of Aosta claims to be the case with respect to his cousins.
The trial was certainly not about dynastic rights but about the surname Di Savoia.
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  #343  
Old 01-19-2018, 08:16 PM
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Originally Posted by Cory View Post
The trial was certainly not about dynastic rights but about the surname Di Savoia.
There are no dynastic rights in the Italian Republic, so an Italian court wouldn't be qualified to rule on that matter, would it ? My post was a reply tp LadyRohan's statement that, "with a living Crown Prince and heir", the family branches and headship of the royal house "are what they are".
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  #344  
Old 01-19-2018, 08:58 PM
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Originally Posted by Mbruno View Post
There are no dynastic rights in the Italian Republic, so an Italian court wouldn't be qualified to rule on that matter, would it ? My post was a reply tp LadyRohan's statement that, "with a living Crown Prince and heir", the family branches and headship of the royal house "are what they are".
Obviously Italian courts can't decide on dynastic right of a Throne that dies not exist at the moment
After King Umberto II dynastic right had only Prince Amedeo and his male descendants.
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  #345  
Old 01-20-2018, 03:46 AM
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Obviously Italian courts can't decide on dynastic right of a Throne that dies not exist at the moment
After King Umberto II dynastic right had only Prince Amedeo and his male descendants.
In essence there is no kingdom of Italy, no Italian crown and no Italian succession. What Vittorio Emanuele and Amedeo are: dynasts of one of Europe's eldest and most illustrious royal dynasties.

Whether or not King Umberto II was not supportive of his son's marriage to Marina Doria, in the end he did not exclude his son by formal decision. To keep the unity it is best to let time do healing work: the simple fact that Prince Emanuele Filiberto has no son automatically ends the "dispute" between the Duke of Savoy and the Duke of Aosta.

Their respective sons, Emanuele Filiberto and Aimone, seem to have a normal relationship. Very much mirroring the relationship of Jean d'Orléans with his Spanish cousin Luis-Alfonso.

Of course the dispute will explode again when Emanuele Filiberto acts alike the late King of Michael: "Dynastic statute? My *ss! I want my daughter to become the next Head!" Then Aimone or Umberto will claim to be the 28th (!) consecutive Savoia being the Duke of Savoy.
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  #346  
Old 01-20-2018, 03:57 AM
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Originally Posted by Duc_et_Pair View Post
In essence there is no kingdom of Italy, no Italian crown and no Italian succession. What Vittorio Emanuele and Amedeo are: dynasts of one of Europe's eldest and most illustrious royal dynasties.

Whether or not King Umberto II was not supportive of his son's marriage to Marina Doria, in the end he did not exclude his son by formal decision. To keep the unity it is best to let time do healing work: the simple fact that Prince Emanuele Filiberto has no son automatically ends the "dispute" between the Duke of Savoy and the Duke of Aosta.

Their respective sons, Emanuele Filiberto and Aimone, seem to have a normal relationship. Very much mirroring the relationship of Jean d'Orléans with his Spanish cousin Luis-Alfonso.

Of course the dispute will explode again when Emanuele Filiberto acts alike the late King of Michael: "Dynastic statute? My *ss! I want my daughter to become the next Head!" Then Aimone or Umberto will claim to be the 28th (!) consecutive Savoia being the Duke of Savoy.
HRH Prince Aimone has no dialogue at all with his distant cousin Emanuele-Filiberto.
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  #347  
Old 01-20-2018, 04:21 AM
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Originally Posted by Cory View Post
HRH Prince Aimone has no dialogue at all with his distant cousin Emanuele-Filiberto.
Creative use of the word ‘distant’ to again campaign an agenda, Cory. Could you for once prove these allegations of ‘no dialogue at all’, or simply desist?
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  #348  
Old 01-20-2018, 12:57 PM
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Please, stay on topic.
This is NOT the proper thread for discussions about the succession to the Headship of the House of Savoy and neither about the relationships between other members of the family.
Thanks for understanding and cooperation.
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  #349  
Old 02-03-2018, 06:22 AM
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Duke Amedeo give an interview on January 7

Intervista a S.A.R. il Principe Amedeo di Savoia del 7 gennaio 2018 – Real Casa di Savoia
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  #350  
Old 02-03-2018, 08:44 AM
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Which is now the official site of the Duke?

Any news about Prince Amedeo's health?
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  #351  
Old 02-20-2018, 11:48 AM
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Any news about Prince Amedeo's health?

Is the prince in ill health?
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  #352  
Old 02-20-2018, 01:17 PM
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Is the prince in ill health?
Frail health .
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  #353  
Old 02-20-2018, 01:21 PM
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Frail health .


Sad news. He is not so old.
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  #354  
Old 02-20-2018, 02:15 PM
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Both Vittorio Emanuele (the Duke of Savoy) and Amedeo (the Duke of Aosta) are in frail state, sad to say.
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  #355  
Old 02-20-2018, 02:37 PM
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Sad news. He is not so old.
What he has is not related to age.
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  #356  
Old 02-28-2018, 05:26 PM
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The duke's granddaughters Viola and Vera daughters of princess Bianca attended at the Dior fashion show in Paris on February 27

https://media.gettyimages.com/photos...re-id925022730
https://media.gettyimages.com/photos...re-id924987100
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  #357  
Old 09-11-2018, 01:57 AM
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The Count and Countess Arrivabene Valenti Gonzaga, born Princess Bianca of Savoy-Aosta celebrate today their 30th wedding anniversary and are photographed at home in Venice with their 5 children

http://www.noblesseetroyautes.com/wp...ivabene001.jpg

Viola Arrivabene Valenti Gonzaga and Vera Arrivabene Valenti Gonzaga attends at the launch of Pomellato Balera Party Event on 22 September in Milan

https://media.gettyimages.com/photos...e-id1038013974
https://media.gettyimages.com/photos...e-id1038014200
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  #358  
Old 09-11-2018, 04:08 AM
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The Count and Countess Arrivabene Valenti Gonzaga, born Princess Bianca of Savoy-Aosta celebrate today their 30th wedding anniversary and are photographed at home in Venice with their 5 children

http://www.noblesseetroyautes.com/wp...ivabene001.jpg
Love the doggie!
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  #359  
Old 09-24-2018, 02:11 PM
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Viola and Vera Arrivabene in Paris for the Christian Dior fashion show today

https://media.gettyimages.com/photos...e-id1039296584

Vera and Viola Arrivabene attend the Roger Vivier Presentation Spring/Summer 2019 during Paris Fashion Week on 27 September

https://media.gettyimages.com/photos...e-id1041874920
https://media.gettyimages.com/photos...e-id1041874932
https://media.gettyimages.com/photos...e-id1041874928

On the occasion of the celebrations closing the centenary of the World War and the festive anniversary of the Italian Armed Forces, Princess Bianca , representing the Royal Family, accompanied by her husband Count Giberto Arrivabene Valenti Gonzaga and daughter Vera Arrivabene Valenti Gonzaga, intervened at the religious and military ceremony held at the Redipuglia Military Memorial on 4 November

http://www.crocerealedisavoia.org/wp...redpuglia2.jpg
http://www.crocerealedisavoia.org/wp...ipuglia18a.jpg
http://www.crocerealedisavoia.org/wp...redpuglia4.jpg
http://www.crocerealedisavoia.org/wp...redpuglia3.jpg

video

http://www.crocerealedisavoia.org/wp...-26-42.mp4?_=1
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  #360  
Old 02-21-2019, 12:52 PM
eya eya is offline
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Viola Arrivabene and Vera Arrivabene attend the Luisa Beccaria show during Milan Fashion Week on 21 February in Milan

https://media.gettyimages.com/photos...e-id1131177016
https://media.gettyimages.com/photos...e-id1131177012


And to the Fendi show

https://media.gettyimages.com/photos...e-id1131150213
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