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02-16-2007, 11:55 PM
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Heir Presumptive
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Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: Amsterdam, Upstate NY, United States
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by Next Star
I know that the internet is not the most reliable source of information to go by but the web says that Czar is equal to a King and not a Emperor. I doubt that is true because I have only seen one web page with this claim all other claims I have seen it states a Czar is equal to a Emperor which I do believe.
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From memory (anyone can correct me or add to this, I'm about to log off for the night) Czar/Tsar/Kaiser and all it's variations are based on the roman empire title Caesar after Julius Caesar. His name became a title just as Augustus name was used by the emperor's wife as the Augusta.
I've seen a similar situation with the Bonaparte family, in the 19th century one of the leaders decided to use Napoleon's name as a new surname for the main branch that heads the family. So, a name became something else.
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02-17-2007, 06:05 AM
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Administrator in Memoriam
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by Next Star
... Czar is equal to a King and not a Emperor.
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It depends on the country. Russia was an Empire therefore the Czar was an Emperor. In Bulgaria, from 1908 the Tsar (Foxy Ferdinand) was a King.
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02-17-2007, 04:00 PM
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Heir Presumptive
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Foxy Ferdinand!  That made me smile for the day!
Warren, I did not know you knew of the little secret history of King Ferdinand's and his...er.. friends. 
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Everyone thinks of changing the world, but no one thinks of changing himself
-Leon Tolstoy
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02-18-2007, 01:47 AM
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Administrator in Memoriam
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by Toledo
Foxy Ferdinand! That made me smile for the day!
Warren, I did not know you knew of the little secret history of King Ferdinand's and his...er.. friends. |
I think your'e referring to his attendants and picnic companions. Not so secret. 
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02-21-2007, 08:48 AM
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Heir Presumptive
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Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: , United States
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by CasiraghiTrio
My question is about the so-called title "Prince/Princess of Russia." Some very respectable online geneaologies, including Peerage.com, use this for some of the Romanov descendents. But when did this title come into use? Before the revolution, this was unheard of. There was no such thing.
Another one that is equally confusing is "Prince/Princess Romanov/a" because this, also, was not existing in the true Tsarist times.
Who conferred these new titles? When? Was is only for the purpose of giving a courtesy to the family? Did other royal families recognize these titles? I know, obviously, the Soviet Union could never recognize them.
Prince of Russia?! It's so weird to me! Who made this up and why couldn't they use something that was actually "real" for Russian history? |
Only great-grandchildren in the male line of the Tsar were permitted to be a Prince/Princess of Russia with the style of Serene Highness. The eldest male successors of the original holder was permitted to retain this style provided they married equally. HH Prince/Princess of Russia was allowed to the grandchildren of the Tsar in the male line, with the eldest male grandson granted the style of Imperial Highness and Grand Duke of Russia.
The current descendants are not royal, but morganatic agnates of imperial dynasts. They style themselves "Prince/Princess Romanov", but there was no such title in Imperial Russia.
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02-23-2007, 08:59 PM
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Royal Highness
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Location: San Francisco, United States
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Though the morganauts without titles given by the Head of House don't have a solid claim to being "HH Prince/Princess Romanov", couldn't they legitimately use the title Prince/Princess of Holstein-Gottorp?
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Sii forte.
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02-25-2007, 02:15 PM
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Newbie
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Location: Copenhagen, Denmark
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The title of Grand Duke/Duchess with the style of Imperial Highness was given to the children and male line grandchildren of the Emporer.
Great-grandchildren were Prince/ss with the style of His/Her Highness. The eldest son of a great grandson was also HH.
All other members of the family were Prince/ss with the style of His/Her Serene Highness.
Example: HIM Emperor Nicholas I- (his son) HIH Grand Duke Constantine Nicholaievich- (grandson) HIH Grand Duke Constantine Constantinovich- (great-grandson) HH Prince Ivan Constantinovich-(great-great-granddaughter) HSH Princess Ekaterina Ivanovna.
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03-25-2007, 03:45 PM
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Newbie
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Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Copenhagen, Denmark
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HSH Princess Ekaterina Ivanovna died recently ( March 13). She was the last member of the Imperial Family of Russia to be born prior to the revolution. She lived 1915-2007.
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04-21-2007, 04:33 PM
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Newbie
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Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: The Hague, Netherlands
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by OniMichi
the Tsarina was equal to a Queen
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Not Tsarina but Tsaritsa
Tsarevna- princess
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05-08-2007, 03:56 PM
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Courtier
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Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: ******, United States
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Is Grand Duchess the second highest title of a female member of the imperial Russian family behind Empress?
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05-08-2007, 04:52 PM
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Aristocracy
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Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: Wellington, New Zealand
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by Mapple
Yes... but, I think, it is the title of Erzherzog that corresponds to Russian Velikiy knyaz best; not as a translation, of course.
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Erzherzog is actually the German for Archduke,whereas,Grossherzog is the title of a sovereign Grand Duke.The Hungarian,'Herceg',is where the name 'Hercegovina' as in Bosnia-Hercegovina comes from.
Aidan.
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05-08-2007, 06:57 PM
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Heir Presumptive
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by Next Star
Is Grand Duchess the second highest title of a female member of the imperial Russian family behind Empress?
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Yes, it is. A Grand Duchess was the wife of a Grand Duke, a daughter or male-line granddaughter of the Tsar.
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07-25-2007, 10:03 AM
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Commoner
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Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: melbourne, Australia
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titles under the Russian Tradition Order of St John
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12-31-2007, 06:27 AM
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Gentry
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Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: Labasa, Fiji
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Fireweaver
And I thought the British system was confusing... oy!
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In fact the British system is clear cut and precise. The Russian titles especially those that deal with morganatic unions and their descendants really sounds complicated.
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03-02-2008, 01:50 PM
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Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: New York, United States
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Russian Titles
Hello I was thinking it would be a help to have a list of the original Russian titles with their common counterparts in English.
Russian English
Russian ? English czar, tsar
Russian Царица (Tzatitsa) English - czarina, tsarina, tsaritsa
Russian ? English czarevich, czarevitch, tsarevitch, tsarevich
Russian ? English czarevna, tsarevna
Russian Великий Князь (Velikiy Knyaz); Великая Княгиня (Velikaia Kniaginia) or Великая Княжна (Velikaia Knazhna) English grand duke; grand duchess (sometimes Grand Prince, Grand Princess)
Russian ? English count
Russiaan? English prince, princess
As you can see, in English we have several spellings for the same title, I was just wondering what the actual Russian terms are.
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03-02-2008, 02:42 PM
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Serene Highness
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Location: Petrozavodsk, Russia
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I think tsar and czar are correct, but I have no idea what Tsarina means. there is name Tsaritsa in russian.
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03-02-2008, 04:08 PM
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Majesty
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Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: City, Kazakhstan
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According to Longman and Oxford online dictionaries, there is such word “tzaritsa”. The following versions of the female Russian Imperial title are available: tsarina, tzarina, and czarina.
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03-02-2008, 04:31 PM
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Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: New York, United States
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I have a feeling that tsaritsa, tsarina and czarina are English versions of the Russian term.
What is the Russian term for the wife of the head of the Russian empire? Can you spell it in Russian characters?
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"One thing we can do is make the choice to view the world in a healthy way. We can choose to see the world as safe with only moments of danger rather than seeing the world as dangerous with only moments of safety."
-- Deepak Chopra
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03-02-2008, 05:10 PM
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Majesty
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Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: City, Kazakhstan
Posts: 8,009
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The Russian term for the wife of the head of the Russian empire is Tzatitsa, which is spelt as "Царица" in Russian.
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