Romanovs about to return to Russia? - Page 4

Benjamin · #61 07-28-2015, 03:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by lucien

Old pics.

But with the rumour of a `return` of some Romanovs to the Crimea,it did emerge there are more opponents then she could have ever imagined.

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The Russian Nobility Association is hardly known for its steadfast support of Maria Vladimirovna so this probably does not come as "news" to anyone.

Cris M · #62 07-28-2015, 03:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by lucien

Old pics.

Which means absolutely nothing. I'm sure Pope Francis would receive The Grand Duchess of Russia, that Her Imperial Highness will always be invited to European royal events and that she's still welcome in Russia by the country political e religious authorities.

That some Romanovs like to believe she's not the legitimate heir to the Russian Throne is hardly a surprise.

Royalotta · #63 08-10-2015, 02:27 PM

I have a theory on this notion but it doesn't fill me with confidence.

Whilst many people disagree on Maria's role within the Imperial Family, it does seem that Putin and his government have always offered her....well....shall we call it a professional courtesy? When the Prince of Wales was quoted as having suggested that Vladimir Putin was comparable to Adolf Hitler, Maria was fairly vocal in her support for Putin but this went against her insistence that she remains politically impartial. Again, whilst we may all have our own view on the Russian succession, the Russian Orthodox Church seems to back Maria as well. Would this be of use to Putin? Is the offer of Livadia a way to secure more vocal support from the Imperial Family or to secure the backing of the church? Either way, if it is true, it seems it's an offer 'with hooks'.

COUNTESS · #64 08-10-2015, 06:50 PM

Very astute. The seizure of the Crimea and now the offer of Livadia. Helping the crook legitimize his theft.

Royalotta · #65 08-10-2015, 06:58 PM

Which goes against everything she ever said of course. I think it's time she gave up her delusions of grandeur quite honestly. I once respected her and thought she understood that she could only ever be a kind of one woman unofficial embassy for Russian culture but jumping into bed with Putin makes her an opportunist in my eyes.

Ceallach · #66 08-10-2015, 07:06 PM

Putin seems to be offering Livadia, Ropshinsky or Pavlovsky so she doesn't have to choose Livadia. But good luck accepting the offer and avoiding the politics.

http://www.express.co.uk/news/world/...Second-Romanov

Royalotta · #67 08-10-2015, 07:13 PM

What I do find slightly difficult to understand is that Putin has allegedly made the same offer to Dmitri but seemingly, he's never offered him anything in the way of informal recognition has he? At least not as publicly as he has to Maria. Which leads me to think that this is all to do with having the idea of the Romanovs and the Church on his side rather than having any real wish to restore something historical or cultural. And as you rightly say Ceallach, if either one accepts, they can't really avoid politics.

I did wonder if this news was the reason as to why Maria hasn't been invited to any gatherings of the exiles since the story broke.

Al_bina · #68 08-10-2015, 07:30 PM

Who exactly has told you that President Putin wants the restoration? The western mass media "heard the song, but got it wrong".

Royalotta · #69 08-10-2015, 07:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Al_bina

Who exactly has told you that President Putin wants the restoration? The western mass media "heard the song, but got it wrong".

I don't think he's in favour of a restoration, that would remove too much power from him unless it was constitutional and arranged in a way that offered his life presidency/prime ministership legitimacy. I was thinking more of the fact that he'd offered Livadia etc as a bargaining chip.

Ceallach · #70 08-10-2015, 07:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Al_bina

Who exactly has told you that President Putin wants the restoration? The western mass media "heard the song, but got it wrong".

A number of people have proposed it; and the press says they wouldn't be doing so without his approval. But he has not publicly said it.

Ceallach · #71 08-10-2015, 07:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Royalotta

I don't think he's in favour of a restoration, that would remove too much power from him unless it was constitutional and arranged in a way that offered his life presidency/prime ministership legitimacy. I was thinking more of the fact that he'd offered Livadia etc as a bargaining chip.

If he works it as a constitutional monarchy he can put all the power in the position of Prime Minster. Unlike President there is no term limit. So yes he can avoid having to change positions and the repositioning of power and be Prime Minister forever. They are also reportedly giving a choice of three palaces.

Al_bina · #72 08-10-2015, 08:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Royalotta

I don't think he's in favour of a restoration, that would remove too much power from him unless it was constitutional and arranged in a way that offered his life presidency/prime ministership legitimacy. I was thinking more of the fact that he'd offered Livadia etc as a bargaining chip.

" ... he's offered Livadia etc as a bargaining chip" ... Did you personally hear that? It sounds incredulous to me.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ceallach

If he works it as a constitutional monarchy he can put all the power in the position of Prime Minster. Unlike President there is no term limit. So yes he can avoid having to change positions and the repositioning of power and be Prime Minister forever. They are also reportedly giving a choice of three palaces.

I find your opinion on the Russian matters more sensible than others from the enlightened west. I do not think even President Putin can restore the monarchy. "Reportedly giving a choice ..." means nothing.
It remains to be seen whether or not the Russia Federation can become the Russian Empire.

Royalotta · #73 08-10-2015, 08:27 PM

I can only offer an opinion based on what I have read. If it hasn't been offered, it hasn't been offered but my initial point that Maria has sacrificed her impartiality still stands I think.

COUNTESS · #74 08-10-2015, 08:58 PM

I, and I do not know, do not see anything but a showpiece. I don't think Putin gives a hoot about Romanovs. He wants some sort of an image and, as he is a thug, he figures he can hide behind placing a "royal figure", so to speak in a place that might give him more credence. And, dear Al Bina, I do not see a Russian Empire anywhere. He is looking for more legitimacy for himself, in whatever way he can get it.

Al_bina · #75 08-10-2015, 09:19 PM

Rumours and baseless assumptions/hasty conclusions from the western mass media outlets are exhilarating. We shall see what will come out of it.

Royalotta · #76 08-10-2015, 09:32 PM

Maria's defence of Putin over the Prince of Wales' comments did not come from the Western media but rather from Maria herself in one of her grandly worded edicts. Zakatov commented on the offer of a residence in Russia by saying that Maria wouldn't consider it unless it was a legal act and he reaffirmed her position that she doesn't seek any financial restitution, again this was not featured in Western media but in the Russian press.

Al_bina · #77 08-11-2015, 02:37 PM

Naturally, Grand Duchess Maria Vladimirovna welcomed Crimea's return. The Romanovs brought this peninsula into the fold of their empire.
It would be much better, if President Putin did not deign to comment on Prince Charles' remarks.

Duc_et_Pair · #78 08-11-2015, 02:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Royalotta

Which goes against everything she ever said of course. I think it's time she gave up her delusions of grandeur quite honestly. I once respected her and thought she understood that she could only ever be a kind of one woman unofficial embassy for Russian culture but jumping into bed with Putin makes her an opportunist in my eyes.

But more than 80% of the Russians are behind Putin. They are not forgotten the chaos of the Gorbachev and Yeltsin years. The Grand Duchess sides with a man which has Russia behind him. Don Juan Carlos de Borbón litterally was General Franco's puppet. He became King and now sees his son on the throne of Spain...

Being impartial really does not bring you anywhere. Whith whom should Maria ever side in the 98 years since 1917? She has little options left and needs to take the opportunities. Remember the greatest King of France, ever: Henri IV. Paris vaut bien une Messe. More opportunistic than Henri was not possible...

Duc_et_Pair · #79 08-11-2015, 02:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Royalotta

Maria's defence of Putin over the Prince of Wales' comments did not come from the Western media but rather from Maria herself in one of her grandly worded edicts. [...]

Millions went to the streets and shouted Je suis Charlie!. What Grand-Duchess Maria did, was exactly what Prince Charles did: just giving her opinon. That her opinion probably might not be congruent with that of her illustrious far cousin in London, tja... c'est la vie.

Royalotta · #80 08-11-2015, 03:06 PM

The difference is that Maria has always bleated on about being politically impartial. By supporting Putin, she's clearly not doing so and IMO, shows how insincere she's been. Whilst she may personally like Putin, whilst the Russian people may support Putin and whilst she may agree in private with Putin's annexation of the Crimea, it isn't her place to speak out just as it wasn't the Prince of Wales' place to publicly bash Putin. Royals shouldn't intefere in politics. If anything, Russia is living proof of what happens when they do.