Grigori Efimovich Rasputin (1869-1916)

[Vasillisos Markos]

Thanks. I am reading Lost Splendor now but am only up to Chapter III so far.

 

[Al_bina]

Page 286 of Warwick's bio. on Ella says she sent a telegram to Zenaide Yussopov stating "My prayers and thoughts are with you all. God bless your dear son for his patriotic act."
The source of this is Felix's autobio. "Lost Splendor."

Citing various correspondence between members of the polite society, Pikul ("The evil power") also mentioned that the Rasputin's murder was viewed as an act that could avert the looming revolution and prompted Nicholas II to take measures to stabilise Russia and to start the much-needed industrialisation process.

 

[pamela18335]

Alix and Rasputin

You know, it doesn't really matter whether Rasputin was a charlatan, or whether he really was able to influence the course of a number of Alexei's hemophiliac crises. I suspect the answer lies somewhere in the middle. Many have mentioned the hypnotic nature of Rasputin's eyes. It is quite reasonable to theorize that using a form of hypnosis, he was able to mitigate Alexei's pain, fear and anxiety, all of which could have contributed to easing a crisis. As others have mentioned, he certainly could quell Alix's anxiety, and that would also have transmitted to her son. In any case, Alix was convinced that whether Alexei lived or died rested solely in Rasputin's hands (via God, of course!). I'm quite certain that had Alexei been healthy, Rasputin would never have gained entry into the Palace.

Above all else, Alix wanted to preserve the throne for Alexei and see him inherit. It was not an unreasonable hope with respect to Alexei, as her uncle, Prince Leopold, Duke of Albany, also a hemophiliac, lived to be 30, dying in 1884.

One wonders (okay, I wonder ) what might have happened if (1) there hadn't been a revolution and (2) had Alexei grown into adulthood. It would have been most difficult for Nicky and Alix to find a suitable bride for him who would agree to marry the tsarevich given the nature of his health. One thing is certain: Since hemophilia is an X-linked recessive trait, had Alexei had any male issue, none would have been a hemophiliac (unless the mother was also a carrier as Alix had been).

 

[Vasillisos Markos]

This may be a tad off topic because this thread is devoted to Rasputin but I don't think Alexei would have had any trouble finding a bride. As you point out, his wife would be the one, if she carried the gene, to pass along hemophilia and I'm sure the Russian Royal Family would only agree to a bride who had no history of hemophilia in her family. As for his delicate health, the bride might not like the idea of being widowed but the goal would be to produce heirs.

 

[Russophile]

Pamela, when I finish Radzinski's book on Rasputin, I'll let you know about his assessment of Father Grigory. I suspect, as well, that it is somewhere in the middle: Some faith, some form of hypnotic power, and some sleight of hand.

 

[pamela18335]

Russophile, I hope you are enjoying Radzinski's book. I read it some time ago, but for the life of me, I cannot remember what his conclusions were, so I'll be happy to have you refresh my memory (which is becoming quite sieve-like!).

 

[Russophile]

Russophile, I hope you are enjoying Radzinski's book. I read it some time ago, but for the life of me, I cannot remember what his conclusions were, so I'll be happy to have you refresh my memory (which is becoming quite sieve-like!).

I just got back from vacation so I'm still in the middle of "Born to Rule". However! I read Radzinski's "The Last Tsar" and I do know that he (Radzinski) tends to meander around so I have to clear my schedule to get a clear picture of it.

 

[pamela18335]

Russophile, hope you had a great vacation!

I enjoyed "Born to Rule", though, if I recall correctly, the author made a few mistakes. I don't go on vacation until September, and right now, I'm going through Amizon to find my vacation reading.

I'm relieved to hear that you find Radzinski a bit scattered...some of his writing (in both his Tsar Nicholas and Rasputin books) seems to me akin to "stream of consciousness" rambling. I, too, found it necessary to focus and concentrate, rather than just being able to read smoothly.

~aaackkkk~ Amazon, not "Amizon"! I can spell, really I can!

 

[Russophile]

Russophile, hope you had a great vacation!

I enjoyed "Born to Rule", though, if I recall correctly, the author made a few mistakes.

Can you point these out to me please so I may be on the alert? So far, nothing about Rasputin that I can find in the book.

 

[pamela18335]

Can you point these out to me please so I may be on the alert? So far, nothing about Rasputin that I can find in the book.

Russophile, bless your heart, you've just given me a fun reason to reread "Born to Rule"!

 

[Vasillisos Markos]

I read "Born to Rule" and cannot recall any major mistakes, but then I was reading it more for fun and did not deliberate over the book like I have with others. I do remember that I learned much about Marie of Rumania and Maud of Norway which piqued my interest in those two Queens. Sophie's lot was tragic but not as tragic as Alexandra's and Ena's was up and down through the years.

 

[Russophile]

I read "Born to Rule" and cannot recall any major mistakes, but then I was reading it more for fun and did not deliberate over the book like I have with others. I do remember that I learned much about Marie of Rumania and Maud of Norway which piqued my interest in those two Queens. Sophie's lot was tragic but not as tragic as Alexandra's and Ena's was up and down through the years.

Copy that. I have been enamoured of Marie/Missy since I have been to Maryhill. Maud piqued my interest as well.
It would be lovely to find out any errors. So much of history is from people's points of view which color it--however, what one person saw as their "truth" another's view could be vastly different.
I am at the part in "Born To Rule" where Anna Virubova had her accident. She was "near death" and Rasputin told her to open her eyes and she would be well. Maybe Anna and Alexandra *thought* she was near death that her condition was worse than what reality was so they attributed her miraculous recovery to Rasputin's "powers".
Ah! Such is history. . .

 

[Anne83]

G.E.Rasputin was a sick person who manipulated innocent and naive people
I believe he did worse things than those reported Evil things that we may never learn

 

[Russophile]

G.E.Rasputin was a sick person who manipulated innocent and naive people
I believe he did worse things than those reported Evil things that we may never learn

Like?? Whaddya think? We all know what a lecherous beast the guy was. I'm sure some women found that sexy in a perverted sort of way. Heck even Felix Yussopov was attracted to the guy.

 

[Anne83]

I'm sure Rasputin had odd sexual preferences
For starters...

 

[Russophile]

I'm sure Rasputin had odd sexual preferences
For starters...

There was talk he was involved with that cult that believed in stripping dancing naked and having orgies. I don't think he was an active participant and believer, however! Russo thinks he certainly took pages from their book to justify himself and his urges.
The Khlysky's I believe.

 

[Anne83]

Really? I believe he did participate
And no matter how shocking this may sound, he had a soft spot for little children too
A sick man I told you

 

[Russophile]

I am sure he participated only to the effect that he got what he wanted. Though I don't think he held their beliefs to heart. He just used them to further his aims, sex, women, Felix, Irina, power. That sort of thing.

 

[Vasillisos Markos]

I never heard about the children. What makes you think so? And I think Felix may have been somewhat attracted to Rasputin but he lured Rasputin to the mansion because Rasputin was attracted to Irina, Felix's wife!

Russo, we are of the same mind. Yikes!! LOL

 

[Russophile]

Russo, we are of the same mind. Yikes!! LOL

Yeah, he was a piece of work, that is for sure. I still need to get into Radzinski's book. I took a detour and went into GD Marie the Younger's book "Education of a Princess". I had read it about 15 years ago and I am amazed at how much I had forgotten. Almost to the Rasputin part.

 

[Anne83]

You talk about books I wasn't talking about books
Oral narrations and traditions are more informative
Excuse me I can't say anything else

 

[pamela18335]

C'mon, Anne, you can't just leave us hanging like that!

I think that Rasputin was certainly not the nicest of persons (to put it mildly), but I've never thought of him as being wholly 100% evil! I know you've said that what you're saying isn't from books, but books are where most of the documented info, good and bad, is located.

Alix being Alix, I very much doubt that he ever had any carnal involvement with either her, her daughters, and certainly not Alexei.

And Russophile is right...he was a believer in the Khlysty precepts, one of which was that you had to sin in order to repent.

 

[Russophile]

You talk about books I wasn't talking about books
Oral narrations and traditions are more informative
Excuse me I can't say anything else

Well when you can please do explain what you mean about the Oral narrations.
Don't forget, the origional story of The Iliad and the Odyssesy was oral until someone wrote it down and I'm sure many pertinent things were lost in translation.

 

[Anne83]

Why am I silent? Because I'm writing a book about all these things I have heard from senior members of my family
Read my book and you will become wiser

 

[Vasillisos Markos]

Why am I silent? Because I'm writing a book about all these things I have heard from senior members of my family
Read my book and you will become wiser

Maybe . . .

 

[Russophile]

Why am I silent? Because I'm writing a book about all these things I have heard from senior members of my family
Read my book and you will become wiser

Post a link where it can be found.

 

[lucien]

Maybe . . .

Grin...doubt it too...


I look forward of having the new book by Margarita Nelipa ,The Murder of Grigorii Rasputin.She had access to original documents on Rasputin,in russian ofcourse yes,but she masters that language too.

It is a really well researched and detailed book by Australian Margarita Nelipa,a government pathologist of Russian descent,and a loved friend.

The book is availeble at Gilberts Royal Books and Librairie de Galignani (Paris).Absolutely worthwhile,finally not a hearsay wet finger sort of ill documented and screamingly false factuals.The plain thruth,a must read!Nah,I don´t get any royalties for saying this,I say it because that is how it is.I always do,as all well know ofcourse!...

 

[Russophile]

I'll pass. I'm not a fan of hers.

 

[Ducii]

The best book I´ve ever read about Rasputin is written byl Edward Radzinsky (or Radzinskij), he is Russian and he wrote many other interesting books about russian history. I think he tries to be objective, he doesnť say that Rasputin was good or bad but you can find in his books many interesting facts and make your own opinion.

 

[pamela18335]

Those of you discussing the new Rasputin book might find the referenced forum from Alexander Palace Time Machine of interest. I must say, I'm awfully tempted to order the book....

A New Rasputin Biography by Margarita Nelipa