Anna Anderson's claim to be Grand Duchess Anastasia

[Menarue]

Is the failure of this book due to not many people believe the Anastasia myth any more and now realise that unfortunately no one escaped?
The too few bones would only be natural with all the moving and trying to burn etc of the bodies but I am looking forward to hearing what conclusions the next search will bring.

[Anna was Franziska]

Your credibility is zero!

Nice try Chat, but it really doesn't hold up, especially not coming from you. Don't even get me started on all the people you've called liars or accused of denying AA for some imagined ulterior motives. (Olga, Gilliard, Ernie, Dmitri Leuchtenberg, Bux, etc. etc., along with everyone involved in the DNA tests you refuse to accept) Yes, I do think some AA supporters lied, or embellished, and I admit that. However, the difference is, I have much more than speculation to back me up- now that the DNA has given us the right answer, we know for sure who was lying or mistaken, and who was not. AA was proven not to be AN. This means it's totally sensible to assume some of the AA supporters were lying, and others were simply wrong. On the other side, it's now grasping at straws to call those who opposed her liars, since history and science have proven them to be correct in not accepting her, since she was an imposter.. Remember what I told you about the innocence project, once the DNA results come in, it doesn't matter about the 'rest of the story' or the 'testimony' or 'eyewitnesses', the court knows they were all inaccurate (either intentionally or accidently) This is what I mean by logical deduction and common sense, and putting two and two together. That's the way it is, it's not me making it up! If you can't accept this reality and move on, I'm sorry.

[ChatNoir]

Originally Posted by Anna was Franziska

Nice try Chat, but it really doesn't hold up, especially not coming from you. Don't even get me started on all the people you've called liars or accused of denying AA for some imagined ulterior motives. (Olga, Gilliard, Ernie, Dmitri Leuchtenberg, Bux, etc. etc.)

No, please do not get started, because I have substantiated all my claims while you have not!

Yes, I do think some AA supporters lied, or embellished, and I admit that. However, the difference is, now that the DNA has given us the right answer, we know for sure who was lying or mistaken, and who was not. This means it's totally sensible to assume some of the AA supporters were wrong, and grasping at straws to call those who opposed her liars. Remember what I told you about the innocence project, once the DNA results come in, it doesn't matter about the 'rest of the story' or the 'testimony' or 'eyewitnesses', the court knows they were all inaccurate (either intentionally or accidently) This is what I mean by logical deduction and common sense, and putting two and two together. That's the way it is, it's not me making it up!

And if that were the way it is, this discussion would be over.

[Anna was Franziska]

No, please do not get started, because I have substantiated all my claims while you have not!

Is that so? Then please tell me why the DNA tests are not valid, why the intestines were not AA's, why the hair was not AA's, and why the bone fragments found in Russia last year are not the last two missing children. Until you can do all of this, none of your old quotes from decades ago are ever going to matter and certainly not change a thing. You have produced no proof any of those things are wrong, and since they're not, AA is not AN, end of story. If you still think the pro AA side is a valid viewpoint that deserves equal consideration with the side that's proven her an imposter, you are, to put it kindly, mistaken. You can't make reality go away.

[ChatNoir]

As I have said before: Nothing has so far been proven in a court of law.

[Warren]

As poor Anna Anderson has been relegated to the background in the latest arguments over the amount of wood required to destroy the bodies and whether lye was used or not and other burning questions (no pun intended), those posts have been moved to the Have the remains of the Imperial Family been found? thread.

Warren
Russian moderator

[Elspeth]

Originally Posted by ChatNoir

As I have said before: Nothing has so far been proven in a court of law.

And this is relevant because...?

[ChatNoir]

Originally Posted by Elspeth

And this is relevant because...?

Because it means that Anastasia Manahan has not legally been determined to be Franzisca Schanzkowska.

[Menarue]

Well who has Anastasia Manahan been legally proven to be?

[AnastasiaEvidence]

Everything has already been legally proven...including AA's real identity that was FS, NOT Anastasia. It is backed up by DNA evidence and romanov family members! There is so much evidence too much for the AA supporters to handle and accept. Reality is just too difficult for them to deal with. DNA is legal identity evidence.

The quotes of the Romanov relatives have evidence and information that proves AA is NOT Anastasia. The people who doubt this can't find any evidence to prove the DNA tests wrong.

[Russophile]

Originally Posted by Menarue

Well who has Anastasia Manahan been legally proven to be?

Anastasia Manahan. . . .

[OlgaNikolaievna]

The DNA is all we need! The whole world accepts this reality it's only those who want to keep believing in claimants that make these strange ideas up. The reason it's not in court is because the Anderson supporters have not taken it because the DNA is against them and those who believe the DNA knows it's not necessary.

[BorisRom]

In English:
"Anna - Anastasia":
Anna-Anastasia (Âëàäèìèð Ìîìîò) / Ïðîçà.ðó - íàöèîíàëüíûé ñåðâåð ñîâðåìåííîé ïðîçû

"The Night without a Dawn":
The Night without a Dawn (Âëàäèìèð Ìîìîò) / Ïðîçà.ðó - íàöèîíàëüíûé ñåðâåð ñîâðåìåííîé ïðîçû

[OlgaNikolaievna]

Those articles do not seem very factual.

In conclusion I want to remind once again, that Anastasia Nikolaevna Romanova was born on June, 18, 1901 in Petergof, and died on February, 12, 1984, in Sharlottsville. According to her will, her ashes after cremation have been transported to Bavaria and have been buried on the family cemetery of the Dukes Leihtenbergskiy in Zeeon. She has lived a difficult life, keeping honor and dignity of Grand Princess. Yekaterinburg, 2007

This is a very incorrect and not factual conclusion! It is so sad to see a writeup where poor Anastasia who died so horribly at only 17 and never had a chance for a real life to be declared to be the same person as Anderson, the crazy, dirty old woman in Charlottesville who had no honor or dignity with her life of lies and her nasty dirty house! They were not the same person, give Anastasia her dignity please!

[AGRBear]

Originally Posted by OlgaNikolaievna

Those articles do not seem very factual. This is a very incorrect and not factual conclusion! It is so sad to see a writeup where poor Anastasia who died so horribly at only 17 and never had a chance for a real life to be declared to be the same person as Anderson, the crazy, dirty old woman in Charlottesville who had no honor or dignity with her life of lies and her nasty dirty house! They were not the same person, give Anastasia her dignity please!

This post is not an argument as to AA being GD Anastasia or not. This is not about DNA. This about downgrading a person who has a title (Grand Duchess to Baroness) who have ended their lives similar to that of AA. When you voice this kind of opinion, it is obvious that you have never experienced the problems of "depression" often times suffered by survivors and/or aging of a loved one. Since I'm not privy to AA's mental records as she aged, I do not know if she was suffering from depression or just the general mental deterioration of aging or,maybe, both, which happens to the majority of the population when they reach a partiular age. Both depression and mental deterioration often have similar traits. It happens to the titled and to the homeless we see sleeping in boxes in some dark passage way.

It bothers me when people make claims that an aging Grand Duchess would never have too many cats, not clean her own house or dress what the you or I wouldn't be caught dead in wearing. This just isn't true.

As for providing a memory of Grand Duchess Anastasia, everyone can do this or not do this in their own personal way. Russia has told us that they have buried her with her family and on the 90th anniversary of Nicholas II's and the others death, it was celebrated with flare this last July.

Meanwhile, I will continue to ask questions about the events around the Russian Royal Family's death. This does not mean I am continuing because I want to find something dishonorable about any of them. I continue because I think someone needs to ask questions and make sure we get the truthful answers this time around.

AGRBear

[Anna was Franziska]

From the text follows that there were only three corsets with diamonds. And where have the corsets of Maria and Alexey been then?

Maria didn't get to sew any jewels in, since this was done after she left with her parents for Ekaterinburg, and the others who stayed behind and came later were the ones who did the sewing. This is told in "Last Days of the Romanovs." Alexei was a boy, and boys don't wear corsets.

[Elspeth]

Originally Posted by ChatNoir

Because it means that Anastasia Manahan has not legally been determined to be Franzisca Schanzkowska.

The point is that there hasn't been a legal challenge, and so the fact that there hasn't been a legal decision is irrelevant; it's just part of the package that goes along with the absence of a legal challenge.

Perhaps the more important point is why there hasn't been a legal challenge of the DNA results, if the outcome would be so conclusive.

[COUNTESS]

There is no such thing, as a "general mental deterioration", in aging. Many elderly people retain their ability to be sharp and mentally acute. Some, do have unfortunate diseases, such as Alzheimers and related illness. This is not "general". AA may have suffered from one of these problems, or she might have been mentally from a very early age.

[Anna was Franziska]

Franziska Schanskowska, the person generally accepted as being AA by most scientists, historians and news services, was declared mentally insane in 1916. AA tried to kill herself in 1920, which would fit in with FS's problems. Also, AA was put in and out of asylums all her life. She always displayed signs of mental illness such as mood swings, odd behavior, having dozens of animals in a filthy house, paranoia, and, of course, pretending to be a dead princess. IMO, she did probably eventually come to believe her fantasy in old age, at least by the time she married Manahan. But in the first couple of decades of her claim, I really do think she knew exactly who she was and what she was doing. This is why she hid under the sheets, avoided certain people, and refused to testify in court on her own behalf. (now Chat is going to tell you all this was caused by the 'trauma' of "Ekaterinburg" and that 'she was above the courts', oh well, I'll let you decide which one makes more sense)

[ChatNoir]

Originally Posted by Anna was Franziska

Franziska Schanskowska, the person generally accepted as being AA by most scientists, historians and news services, was declared mentally insane in 1916. AA tried to kill herself in 1920, which would fit in with FS's problems. Also, AA was put in and out of asylums all her life. She always displayed signs of mental illness such as mood swings, odd behavior, having dozens of animals in a filthy house, paranoia, and, of course, pretending to be a dead princess. IMO, she did probably eventually come to believe her fantasy in old age, at least by the time she married Manahan. But in the first couple of decades of her claim, I really do think she knew exactly who she was and what she was doing. This is why she hid under the sheets, avoided certain people, and refused to testify in court on her own behalf. (now Chat is going to tell you all this was caused by the 'trauma' of "Ekaterinburg" and that 'she was above the courts', oh well, I'll let you decide which one makes more sense)

I think you forget the FACT that NO doctor ever questioned AA's sanity. Never. And she was NEVER put into an asylum for the reason of being insane. NEVER!
Please do your homework.