A bride for Alexei

[MAfan]

Originally Posted by vsriCo

"Royal blood"? You mean Royal status. Plenty of Russian noble families were descended from the previous Rurikid dynasty. Not to mention the Bagrations were most definitely of "royal blood" despite only having the status of nobility within the empire.

I'm sorry, I bad expressed my thought; I mean indeed royal status.

[snowflower]

Originally Posted by MAfan

Evgenia, Olga, Elisabeta or Marina of Greece;

And also the Duke of Edinburgh's sisters from the GRF. I believe that Alix especially would have favoured them, being the daughters of her Hessian niece and also cousins through the Romanov and Danish line. Of course there would be some concern about haemophilia and they were quite poor by royal standards, but I think they had high chances. Olga, Elisabeth and Marine were suitable , but they had the reputation of being somehow spoiled as children and teenagers and they were the granddaughters of darling aunt Miechen

[MAfan]

I had thought to them too, and in first instance I added them to my list; but I've removed them because of the haemophilia problem. Luckily it appears that none of them transmitted the disease to their children.

[Archduchess Zelia]

Ileana of Romania, definately
They also knew each other, I remember seeing some pictures of Alexei & Ileana on Standart I think.

[Vasillisos Markos]

Would the rumors about Ileana's parentage cause some concern for Alix? Were those rumors bandied about in royal circles at the time?

[pamela18335]

Vasillisos, I'm ignorant of any rumors about Ileana's parentage. Is it suggested that she is the progeny of Queen Marie via an affair?

Please enlighten me, and thanks!

[pamela18335]

Originally Posted by MAfan

I had thought to them too, and in first instance I added them to my list; but I've removed them because of the haemophilia problem. Luckily it appears that none of them transmitted the disease to their children.

However, the fact that they apparently were not carriers could not have been known at the time, since the science didn't exist to confirm that fact. That's why I eliminated them as well. Since we are assuming that Alexei reached adulthood in spite of his hemophilia, and given Alix's terrible guilt knowing she had passed this disease on to him, I'm sure she'd have been scrupulous in ensuring that this same tragedy did not repeat itself.

[reginalix]

Originally Posted by pamela18335

Vasillisos, I'm ignorant of any rumors about Ileana's parentage. Is it suggested that she is the progeny of Queen Marie via an affair?

Please enlighten me, and thanks!

Ileana's biological father was actually Prince Barbu Ştirbey like the last kid of the royal family.
Officially it was simply a rumor because Queen Marie didn't love her husband and disdained him and Prince Stirbey was her lover almost officially - but for the romanian people it's the true. Today also.

[MAfan]

Originally Posted by pamela18335

However, the fact that they apparently were not carriers could not have been known at the time, since the science didn't exist to confirm that fact. That's why I eliminated them as well. Since we are assuming that Alexei reached adulthood in spite of his hemophilia, and given Alix's terrible guilt knowing she had passed this disease on to him, I'm sure she'd have been scrupulous in ensuring that this same tragedy did not repeat itself.

Actually, I have a lot of doubts that Alexis would reach the adulthood, but I can't know it dfor sure; after all, his cousin Prince Waldemar of Prussia, suffering of aemophilia as well, died aged 56.
I wonder if Alix would look for some "fresh blood" for his son, in order to avoid problems for the next generations.

[snowflower]

He did managed to survive thorugh the exile and the difficult last months of his loife, so he might have reached his early 20s. I believe that , once he had reached 20, his parents would have already have found him a wife, and would have married them in a hurry , hoping at least to secure the dynasty in their line, and also have a child of Alexei to give them some relief in case he died.

[pamela18335]

Originally Posted by MAfan

Actually, I have a lot of doubts that Alexis would reach the adulthood, but I can't know it dfor sure; after all, his cousin Prince Waldemar of Prussia, suffering of aemophilia as well, died aged 56.

MAfan, as did Queen Victoria's son, Prince Leopold, Duke of Albany, who lived to be 30, married, and had children, both male and female. Of course, Leopold, being male, would not have had a hemophiliac child, since the gene comes from the maternal line. The same would have been true of Alexei, and the only caution would have been to select a wife who would not be a potential carrier.

That the disease was inherited through the mother was known at the time, so I agree that Alix would have likely looked for a suitable bride for Alexei from a Royal line demonstrated to be free of the defect.

[pamela18335]

Originally Posted by reginalix

Ileana's biological father was actually Prince Barbu Ştirbey like the last kid of the royal family.
Officially it was simply a rumor because Queen Marie didn't love her husband and disdained him and Prince Stirbey was her lover almost officially - but for the romanian people it's the true. Today also.

reginalix, is there scientific proof that Stirbey was Ileana's father or is this pure supposition and conjecture that gained the credibility of an urban myth?

[Vasillisos Markos]

Pamela 18335,

I believe there was very strong suspicion that Marie and Prince Barbu were lovers and he is strongly suspected of fathering Mircea and possibly Ileana but without DNA testing, how can anyone know the exact truth? But, if there was a whiff of suspicion, I think Alix would have tried to stop the marriage because of the "taint" surrounding Ileana.

[persian85033]

Originally Posted by MAfan

Olga was 23, Tatiana 21, Maria 19 and Anastasia 17 when they were murdered; and at the time; I was surprised too that no one of them was engaged at the time. I mean, when their mother married aged 22 she was considered even too old for marrying!
Btw, the Earl Mountbatten of Burma was in love with Maria, and always kept a picture of her beside his bed; but the same Maria once said that her intention was to marry a Russian soldier and have twenty children with him.

They weren't children anymore, but young women. Though perhaps if they had been married abroad, perhaps at least one of them may have survived.

Although if Alix and Nicholas wanted their daughters to marry for love, how were they going to do that if the girls never saw anyone? Their lives were so sheltered, it seems to me. How were they going to meet men, or be courted? I've read that their lives were so very sheltered, that they still talked amongst themselves like little girls. I don't know whether to believe that.

[reginalix]

Originally Posted by pamela18335

reginalix, is there scientific proof that Stirbey was Ileana's father or is this pure supposition and conjecture that gained the credibility of an urban myth?

Of course a King can't ask for DNA test in front of his country - and it's not for the crown prince but for the last kids. It's not important.

It's absolutely true that Queen Marie and Stirbey were lovers (letters...). Because of Mircea and Ileana's eyes colour and the no intimate cohabitation on the "female biological" days between the King and the Queen, the ladies in waiting and the Court were astonished about these pregnancies.
Only God knows the real truth and their mother of course.....

[MAfan]

Originally Posted by persian85033

Although if Alix and Nicholas wanted their daughters to marry for love, how were they going to do that if the girls never saw anyone? Their lives were so sheltered, it seems to me. How were they going to meet men, or be courted? I've read that their lives were so very sheltered, that they still talked amongst themselves like little girls. I don't know whether to believe that.

This is another very interesting point...I can think to only two possibilities: they would fall in love with one of their cousins (of course, one of their relatives liked by Alix&Nicholas), and in this case the marriage would be equal with no problems as consequences; or they would fell in love with someone of the entourage of the Imperial Family, someone living and/or working at Alexander Palace (and therefore someone liked by Alix&Nicholas, as Alexander Palace was frequented only by those they liked); but in this case the marriage would likely be unequal, surely involving some problems.
In both cases, it's likely that the four daaughters wouldn't move far from their parents and siblings, making all them (and most of all Alix) happy.

[amedea]

I've read that N&A thought GD Dimitri would have been a suitable choice for one of their daughters until he started to have a life style considered scandalous.
About Alexei I really think a German wife could cause too much problems. So I think suitable brides could have been GDsses Natalia Constantinova and Vera Constantinova and GD Xenia Georgievna.

[fandesacs2003]

Not a German bride, considering the carastrophy of the WW1. I would say one of the Greek Princesses, or a British Princess.
More a Greek because of the closure of the religion, and also that this period after the Grand Duchesss Olga became Queen of Greece, many of her descendancy married back in Russia. Greece was very close to Russia

[fandesacs2003]

Originally Posted by MAfan

Excluding all the Catholic Princesses, because the Pope wouldn't agree about their conversion:
Ingrid or Astrid of Sweden;
Feodora, Carolina Mathilde or Alexandrina Louise of Denmark;
Evgenia, Olga, Elisabeta or Marina of Greece;
Friederike of Hannover;
Irene or Viktoria of Hesse-Philippsthal-Barchfeld;
Viktoria of Schleswig Holstein;
Karoline, Sieglinde or Elisabeth of Lippe-Biesterfeld;
Eleonore of Lippe-Weissenfeld;
Marie Therese, Luise, Marianne, Elisabeth of Prussia;
Ileana of Romania;
Sophie of Saxe-Weimar-Eisenach;
Elisabeth of Saxe-Altenburg;
Sibylle or Caroline of Saxe-Coburg-Gotha;
Elisabeth or Bathildis of Schaumburg-Lippe.

Nice list. The funny think is that IF he had survived and IF he had married Federika of Hannover, she had not became Queen of Greece, she had become Tsarine and she had created the same mess in Russia than she did in Greece!!! So Russian Royalty would had fallen anyway. On the other side Greek Royalty might be still in place!

[MAfan]

Originally Posted by fandesacs2003

Not a German bride, considering the carastrophy of the WW1. I would say one of the Greek Princesses, or a British Princess.
More a Greek because of the closure of the religion, and also that this period after the Grand Duchesss Olga became Queen of Greece, many of her descendancy married back in Russia. Greece was very close to Russia

Actually there wasn't any British Princess suitable for Alexis; the last British Princess born before the present Queen Elizabeth II was her aunt Princess Mary, who was 7 years older than Alexis (and therefore was too old for him).