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  #461  
Old 09-26-2018, 04:32 AM
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Leopold of Bavaria enjoyed a little race at the Oktoberfest in Munich yesterday, September 25:


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  #462  
Old 09-26-2018, 02:07 PM
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Originally Posted by Kataryn View Post
I think they will stop to use the tile of a "duke in Bavaria".
For those interested in history: the House of Wittelsbach, originally from the villages of Ober- and Unterwittelsbach north of Augsburg in Bavaria, had several lines. The two most important reigned in Bavaria as duke of Bavaria and the other line in the Palatinate as Prince Elector of the Palatinate.



In winter 1919/1620, shortly after the beginning of The Great War of 30 years (which started with the defenestration of Prague), Frederick V. of the Palatinate made the grave error to head the protestant try to take Bohemia back from the catholic Habsburgs of Austria and let himself be voted for and crowned king of Bohemia. The Habsburgs threw him out and he henceforth lived with his wife Elisabeth Stuart, only daughter of James I. of England and VI. of Scotland (a granddaughter of Mary Stuart) in Den Haag, having lost the Palatinate to the Habsburg-troups from Spain and the office of Prince Elector to his Wittelsbach-cousin Maximilian I. of Bavaria. After Maximilian's death, the office of Prince Elector returned to the Palatinian Wittelsbach and a new one was created for the Bavarian Wittelsbachs.



Frederick's and Elisabeth Stuart's daughter Sophie of the Palatinate btw. was married to the Prince Elector of Hannover and protestant her line was elected by the English and Scottish parliament to inherit the Stuart throne.


In 1766 it was clear that the Bavarian lines of the Wittelsbachs would die out with Maximilian III. Joseph, Prince Elector and Duke of Bavaria. meanwhile the Palatinian line of Pfalz-Neuburg (in Bavaria, but they owned the Palatinate) had died out and Karl Theodor, Duke of Pfalz-Sulzbach had become the new Prince Elector. So Max III. Joseph and Karl Theodor signed a treaty declaring the unity of the Palatinate and Bavaria and named Munich as the capital. So when Max died in 1777, Karl Theodor inherited Bavaria and moved to Munich.


One of the first things he did was grant his Palatinian relatives, who had never held Bavarian titles, ducal titles of Bavaria. But not the traditional "von"-title, but the new title "in" Bavaria in addition to their Palatinian titles. So when Duke Max in Bavaria, Count Palatine of Palatinate-Birkenfeld-Gelnhausen married Princess Ludovika of Bavaria, daughter of his cousin Max, the successor of Karl Theodor and by Napoleon's grace king Max I. Joseph of Bavaria, the whole "in Bavaria"-branch of the Wittelsbachs were given the style of Royal Highnesses in addition to their ducal titles.



One of their children was Elisabeth - HRH Elisabeth, duchess in Bavaria, who married Emperor Franz Joseph of Austria.


So the ducal title of "in Bavaria" is the lesser of the two ducal titles in Bavaria. There is no title of Prince/Princess in Bavaria as the original Palatinian titles were Count/Countess of the Palatinate (Pfalzgraf/-gräfin). Max who is a born "Prinz von Bayern" from the Ducal later Royal main line only let himself be adopted to be able to inherit the wealth of the "in Bavaria"-branch of the family, I don't think the title mattered to him as if is lower in rank than the title he was born with. AFAIK his daughters hold both titles (or did before they married): princess "von" and duchess "in" but the "von" members are closer to the throne, so their title is higher in rank.



If you have any further questions, I'll try to answer them.
Do you think HSH Prince Joseph Wenzel of Liechtenstein will claim the British Throne?
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  #463  
Old 09-27-2018, 01:18 AM
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Manuel, Prince of Bavaria, on day 5 of the Oktoberfest in Munich yesterday, September 26:


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  #464  
Old 09-29-2018, 05:33 AM
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Prince Manuel with Princess Anna during the Oktoberfest 2018 at Kaeferschaenke tent at Theresienwiese on 28 September

https://media.gettyimages.com/photos...e-id1042679480
https://media.gettyimages.com/photos...e-id1042679478
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  #465  
Old 09-29-2018, 05:50 AM
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I don't know if I can ask this question here or not, no offense.

But how do those royals earn money if they are not ruling or reigning since the monarchy is abolished?

How do they maintain their lavish lifestyles?
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  #466  
Old 09-29-2018, 05:57 AM
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Originally Posted by HM Empress Ingrid View Post
I don't know if I can ask this question here or not, no offense.

But how do those royals earn money if they are not ruling or reigning since the monarchy is abolished?

How do they maintain their lavish lifestyles?

Most of them have a job and work to earn their money.
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  #467  
Old 09-29-2018, 06:00 AM
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Most of them have a job and work to earn their money.
I see, thank you :)

But I honestly doubt any job would pay so much to ensure a royal lifestyle.

I know Greek Princess is an actress so she can afford that lifestyle. But the rest ?
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  #468  
Old 09-29-2018, 06:13 AM
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Originally Posted by HM Empress Ingrid View Post
I see, thank you :)

But I honestly doubt any job would pay so much to ensure a royal lifestyle.

I know Greek Princess is an actress so she can afford that lifestyle. But the rest ?
Most if not all Royals studied at university and subsequently have jobs fitting.One really doesn't have to be a B actress to live a lifestyle "fitting" while also funded by mommy & daddy too....:)...

Plus,plus,usually the families are already financially independent,always have been.
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  #469  
Old 09-29-2018, 06:33 AM
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I see, thank you :)

But I honestly doubt any job would pay so much to ensure a royal lifestyle.

I know Greek Princess is an actress so she can afford that lifestyle. But the rest ?

Actually many of the german Royal don't have a royal lifestyle and are much in the public. Most it is the Head of the Family and the heir. They often manage the Family fortune and posessions if there is still one. Some of the former reiging german houses specially the one whop reigned in the East part of Germany (which is now Thurngina, Saxony, Saxe-Anhalt, Brandenburg and mecklenbrug) lost their posessions after the Second World War when they had to flew.
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  #470  
Old 09-29-2018, 10:32 AM
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I suppose that apart from the ones that married with billionaires or their daughters/sons few will have luxury lifestyles and most have an upper middle class life, a job etc. Even in reigning families this more and more becomes the norm. And most will be happier for it.
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  #471  
Old 10-06-2018, 07:25 AM
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Leopold of Bavaria was seen on day 14 of the Oktoberfest in Munich yesterday, October 5:


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  #472  
Old 10-06-2018, 02:45 PM
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A lot of Royals during the Oktoberfesten in Munich.
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  #473  
Old 10-18-2018, 12:49 AM
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Max of Bavaria attended the Dom Perignon 'The Legacy' event in Munich yesterday, October 17:


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  #474  
Old 11-21-2018, 08:09 AM
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Head of the House of Bavaria

Currently the Head of the House of Bavaria is Duke Franz (b. 1933), but who is going to be his successor?

A friend and I have a "discussion" going on about this. He means the next Head will be Prince Ludwig (b. 1982), while I think it's going to be his dad Prince Luitpold (b. 1951), with Ludwig as 2nd in line.

Can someone once and for all settle this score? Preferably also with (links to) documents/sources where that information can be found.

Thanks very much in advance.
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  #475  
Old 11-21-2018, 08:24 AM
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It will be Franz's brother Max-Emannuel (or Maximiliam) Wittelsbach. After that, it will pass to a cousin, but the Jacobite succession will remain with Max's daughters and their descendants.
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  #476  
Old 11-21-2018, 09:09 AM
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Yes, Max-Emanuel is second in line, followed by Luitpold.

See Luitpold's Wikipedia entry, which points out that his 1979 marriage to a commoner was initially considered unequal (meaning his children had no succession right), but was declared dynastic in 1999 (meaning Luitpold's oldest son Ludwig will succeed him). Wikipedia cites the authoritative Genealogisches Handbuch des Adels, Fürstliche Häuser XVI.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Prince...varia_(b._1951)

For a genealogy of the 19th-20th century Royal Family of Bavaria, see The Online Gotha, where it can be seen that Luitpold's paternal grandfather Prince Franz was the brother of Franz (current pretender) and Max-Emanuel's grandfather Crown Prince Rupprecht, who also happened to be Luitpold's maternal grandfather (his parents were cousins).

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  #477  
Old 11-22-2018, 12:22 PM
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Indeed, the successor of Duke Franz will be his brother Prince Max-Emmanuel, then followed by their cousin Prince Luitpold and, in turn, by Luitpold's eldest son Prince Ludwig.
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  #478  
Old 11-25-2018, 01:49 AM
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Franz, Duke of Bavaria, Leopold, Prince of Bavaria, Ursula, Princess of Bavaria, Anna, Princess of Bavaria, Manuel, Prince of Bavaria, Felipa, Princess of Bavaria and Christian Dienst attended the PIN Party in Munich, Germany, yesterday, November 24:


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  #479  
Old 11-25-2018, 05:20 AM
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Thank you "High King of Erin", "Gawin" and "MAfan" for your responces.

It's true that Franz' brother Max-Emanuel is the second in line, but since he only has daughters, I found that the Headship of the Bavarian House will go to Luitpold instead of Max-Emanuel first. Correct me if I'm wrong...
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  #480  
Old 11-25-2018, 05:55 AM
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Originally Posted by Ralf View Post
Thank you "High King of Erin", "Gawin" and "MAfan" for your responces.

It's true that Franz' brother Max-Emanuel is the second in line, but since he only has daughters, I found that the Headship of the Bavarian House will go to Luitpold instead of Max-Emanuel first. Correct me if I'm wrong...
That is not the way how it works. It is the same as saying: ow... Prince Charles is already 70, we better make his son Prince William the new King after Elizabeth II. The succession simply follows the established path. And it will go to Prince Luitpold after Duke Max, alike it will go to Prince William after Prince Charles.
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