Duke Franz and the Royal House of Bavaria 1: Ending 2021


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Alison H said:
This came up when I went to the Nymphenburg during a Christmas market trip to Munich a couple of years ago. As I understand it, the title will pass to a second cousin ... who is rather confusingly also a first cousin, as his parents were cousins, but he's a second cousin on his father's side.
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This is the case for the Title Duke of Bavaria and the Headship ofthe Royal House. Second in line after Duke Max is Prince Luitpold, whose paternale grandfather Prince Franz was one ofthe youngers sons of King Ludwig III. And his mothjer was Princess Irmingard, one of the daughers of Crown Prince Rruprrecht from his second marriage.

The Title Duke in bavaria is another case. Duke Max was adoptedby his maternal great-unlce and he was choosen because has is also descendning from the ducal line which is not the case for the other members of the Royal lince with the exception of his brother. so he inhertied the vast propert of the Ducal line.Apparently it was already partly given to his daughters so for example Duchess Anna manages and probably owns the ducal brewery in Tegernsee and Duchess Helene owns the property at Kreuth.
 
What a nice interview with the duchess and I wondered if Elisabeth Douglas is Lutheran?
 
An Ard Ri said:
What a nice interview with the duchess and I wondered if Elisabeth Douglas is Lutheran?
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Don't know if she still is but the Douglas are protestant so whe was raised protestant.

She is really a very charming and witty Lady. 1,5 years i ago i made a guided Tour with her through Tegernsee Castle and she told so many little anekdotets. she does that once a wekk during the Tegernseer Weeks ans this is they opportunity to have a look into the Castle.
 
Anna in Bayern-von Maltzan with husband Andreas von Maltzan and sister Marie Caroline of Württemberg attended the handover of Wildbad Kreuth to tenant Korbinian Kohler who is planning a unique mental retreat and will take over the complex south of Kreuth, Germany, from April 1, 2021.


** gettyimages gallery **
 
iceflower said:
On December 23, Marie Caroline of Württemberg with brother-in-law Andreas von Maltzan and sister Anna in Bayern-von Maltzan attended the handover to tenant Korbinian Kohler who is planning a unique mental retreat and will take over the stately complex Wildbad Kreuth, south of Kreuth, Germany, from April 1, 2021.


** gettyimages gallery **
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Here is an Article in german. Andreas von Matlzahn manages since 4 months the duties of Duchess helen who wons Wildbad Keuth. he has together with her sisters Anna and marie Caroline and their father Duke Max a Wildbad kreuth Family and Co GmbH foudnet which is managed by Andreas von Maltzahn.
 
Franz, Duke of Bavaria, attended a tree planting ceremony in honour of late artist Joseph Beuys in Munich on May 12:


** Pic ** gallery **
 
The 87-years old Duke Franz of Bayern has posed in an official photograph with his longtime partner Dr Thomas Greinwald. This is to my knowledge the first time that the head of a European royal house presents their same-sex partner to the public and that it's done during pride month can't be a coincidence.
The photographer is Erwin Olaf who's earlier taken photos of the Dutch Royal family.

Welcome out of the closet Franz [emoji2380]

https://1.bp.blogspot.com/-ufZGkKvQ...1024/d7e56016-ab3a-4178-8b80-d7762a53f0c3.JPG

https://eurohistoryjournal.blogspot.com/2021/06/new-pictures-of-duke-franz-of-bavaria.html?m=1
 
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JR76 said:
The 87-years old Duke Franz of Bayern has posed in an official photograph with his longtime partner Dr Thomas Greinwald. This is to my knowledge the first time that the head of a European royal house presents their same-sex partner to the public and that it's done during pride month can't be a coincidence.
The photographer is Erwin Olaf who's earlier taken photos of the Dutch Royal family.

Welcome out of the closet Franz [emoji2380]

https://1.bp.blogspot.com/-ufZGkKvQ...1024/d7e56016-ab3a-4178-8b80-d7762a53f0c3.JPG

https://eurohistoryjournal.blogspot.com/2021/06/new-pictures-of-duke-franz-of-bavaria.html?m=1
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A very welcome sign of the times.
 
The portraits are apparently shown in the Kunsthalle in Munich., where there is an exposition of the work of Erwin Olaf going on, named: Erwin Olaf. Unheimlich schön.

The portraits are located in the Adels-Kabinett of the museum. The Erwin Olaf portraits of the Dutch king and queen are also shown.

The Duke, his partner and the photographer attended the opening together:

https://gpdhome.typepad.com/nieuwsberichten/2021/06/erwin-olaf-begint-project-blue-blood.html
 
I think he is even the first head of a European real to assume a relationship with a person of the same sex.
Best wishes to them!
 
principessa said:
Is it known where the portraits were taken?
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They are taken at Nymphenburg Palace outside of Munich where Franz, if my memory serves me right, has the use of an apartment.
 
Blog Real said:
I think he is even the first head of a European real to assume a relationship with a person of the same sex.
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If King Ludwig II of Bavaria had done this, would he have not been condemned?
 
CyrilVladisla said:
If King Ludwig II of Bavaria had done this, would he have not been condemned?
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Homosexuality was illegal in Germany from atleast 1871 and it was considered a sin by most people so it would have been impossible. King Ludwig would most likely have lost his throne even earlier than he did if he chose to live openly as a homosexual.
 
I don't know if anyone already mentioned it here but Sophie Württenberg (which mother is Marie Caroline von Bayern) is aspecting a baby from her husband Maximilien D'Andigné.
The baby will be delivered in late autumn and will be the first grandchild for Marie Caroline von Bayern and her husband Philip Württenberg and the first great-grandchild for Elizabeth and Max von Bayern.
The couple got married two years ago in Tegernsee and currently live in Paris
 
Magnolia471 said:
I don't know if anyone already mentioned it here but Sophie Württenberg (which mother is Marie Caroline von Bayern) is aspecting a baby from her husband Maximilien D'Andigné.
The baby will be delivered in late autumn and will be the first grandchild for Marie Caroline von Bayern and her husband Philip Württenberg and the first great-grandchild for Elizabeth and Max von Bayern.
The couple got married two years ago in Tegernsee and currently live in Paris
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It was posted in the House of Württemberg Thread into which it actually belongs as Sophie is a member of that RF and not the bavarian RF. Btw. the child will also be the first great-grandchild of Duke Carl and Duchess Diane of Württemberg and the first great great-grandchild of the late Count and Countess of Paris.
 
JR76 said:
The 87-years old Duke Franz of Bayern has posed in an official photograph with his longtime partner Dr Thomas Greinwald. This is to my knowledge the first time that the head of a European royal house presents their same-sex partner to the public and that it's done during pride month can't be a coincidence.
The photographer is Erwin Olaf who's earlier taken photos of the Dutch Royal family.

Welcome out of the closet Franz [emoji2380]

https://1.bp.blogspot.com/-ufZGkKvQ...1024/d7e56016-ab3a-4178-8b80-d7762a53f0c3.JPG

https://eurohistoryjournal.blogspot.com/2021/06/new-pictures-of-duke-franz-of-bavaria.html?m=1
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That's lovely! Congrats! :flowers:

And I really like the portrait ?
 
Franz, Duke of Bavaria, and his partner Dr. Thomas Greinwald attended the premiere of "Tristan und Isolde" as part of the Munich Opera Festival 2021 at the Nationaltheater in Munich yesterday, June 29:


** Pic 1 ** Pic 2 **
 
Max, Duke of Bavaria, attended the Opera For All concert "Tristan und Isolde" as part of the Munich Opera Festival 2021 yesterday, July 31:


** Pic **
 
Franz, Duke of Bavaria, with his partner Dr. Thomas Greinwald, Ursula, Princess of Bavaria and Leopold, Prince of Bavaria attended the premiere of "Tosca" during the Salzburg Opera Festival 2021 on August 21:


** Pic 1 ** Pic 2 ** Pic 3 **
 
iceflower said:
Franz, Duke of Bavaria, with his partner Dr. Thomas Greinwald, Ursula, Princess of Bavaria and Leopold, Prince of Bavaria attended the premiere of "Tosca" during the Salzburg Opera Festival 2021 on August 21:


** Pic 1 ** Pic 2 ** Pic 3 **
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:bavariaflag:

The boys age with grace!The Duke and Dr.Greinwald that is.
 
Elisabeth, Princess in Bayern, attended the fashion contractor Katag's Cheftagung 2021 in Bielefeld on August 26:


** Pic **
 
JR76 said:
The 87-years old Duke Franz of Bayern has posed in an official photograph with his longtime partner Dr Thomas Greinwald. This is to my knowledge the first time that the head of a European royal house presents their same-sex partner to the public and that it's done during pride month can't be a coincidence.
The photographer is Erwin Olaf who's earlier taken photos of the Dutch Royal family.

Welcome out of the closet Franz [emoji2380]

https://1.bp.blogspot.com/-ufZGkKvQ...1024/d7e56016-ab3a-4178-8b80-d7762a53f0c3.JPG

https://eurohistoryjournal.blogspot.com/2021/06/new-pictures-of-duke-franz-of-bavaria.html?m=1
Click to expand...

Is it certain that this represented a departure from the status quo? While I do not follow the German former reigning families, I saw royal watchers mention Thomas Greinwald on many occasions and had gotten the sense that their relationship was publicly recognized even if Thomas apparently refrained from accompanying Franz at official events of the House of Bavaria.

That being said, I take your point about the timing during Pride Month.
 
I don't really think that the timing of these pictures has anything to to with the pride month. In fact, the pictures were taken by the really famous photographer Erwin Olaf. And they were not published by the Royal House as official portraits, they were part of an high profile exhibition by said photographer. So the timing is about the opening of the exhibition.
 
Luitpold, Prince of Bavaria, attended the Autumn Festival of the Eisenbarth innkeeper family in Munich on September 14:


** Pic 1 ** Pic 2 ** Pic 3 **
 
Is Prince Manuel of Bavaria (born in 1972) in the succession to the Bavarian throne?

Is Prince Manuel of Bavaria (born in 1972) in the line of succession to the Bavarian throne? I'm asking about this because he was born illegitimate and as far as I know, children who were born illegitimate were generally included from acquiring various European countries' thrones even if they were subsequently legitimized, as with French King Louis XIV's various illegitimate sons. I would presume that this principle would have likewise applied in Bavaria, and I haven't actually heard or read anything about the Bavarian laws of succession being changed in order to allow royal children who were born illegitimate to be in line of succession to the defunct Bavarian throne, but maybe I'm missing something here.

Anyway, what exactly are your own thoughts on this? Manuel's father, Prince Leopold of Bavaria, is presumably in the Bavarian line of succession (albeit located rather distantly in it, to my knowledge), but after Leopold, does the succession to the non-existent Bavarian throne go to Manuel or directly to Manuel's younger legitimate brother, Prince Konstantin of Bavaria (born in 1986)--thus completely bypassing Manuel himself due to his illegitimate birth? :

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Prince_Leopold_of_Bavaria_(born_1943)#Marriage

Thoughts?
 
Tatiana Maria said:
Is it certain that this represented a departure from the status quo? While I do not follow the German former reigning families, I saw royal watchers mention Thomas Greinwald on many occasions and had gotten the sense that their relationship was publicly recognized even if Thomas apparently refrained from accompanying Franz at official events of the House of Bavaria.

That being said, I take your point about the timing during Pride Month.
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FWIW, I suspected that he might be gay but didn't actually know for sure. Now I do.

Congratulations to him on coming out! :)
 
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