Aristocracy of France

[Tatiana Maria]

Originally Posted by Duc_et_Pair

The French Republic does not recognize titles but still employs a Garde des Sceaux de France (more or less comparable with the Lord Privy Seal in the UK). One of the duties of the Garde des Sceaux de France is to examine and verify -on request- if a person has a legal and valid claim to a title.

It comes down to a conflict about Nicolas de Broglie, son of the late 8e duc de Broglie, 7e prince de Broglie who was born out of wedlock. Nevertheless Nicolas inherited all from his father: from the enormous family fortune to the ancestral estates et al, but not the title Duc de Broglie.

Nicolas went to the Conseil d'État to complain about the decision of the Garde des Sceaux de France that he was no heir to his father's titles. The Letters Patent of Louis XV de France from June 1752 to the first Duke spoke about pour lui et l'aîné de ses mâles nés et à naître de lui en légitime mariage (for him and for the eldest of males born to him in a legitimate marriage).

Because Nicolas was not born inside a marriage, the title went to his father's younger brother Philippe-Maurice, now the 10th Duke. However, this 60 years old uncle of Nicolas is unmarried. His younger brother Louis-Albert has no sons either. This means the title risks to go to a remote relative somewhere.

Nicolas de Broglie argued that since 2005 the Code Civil no longer distincts between chidren born inside or outside a marriage. Therefore the Letters Patent of Louis XV was an infringement to law.

The Conseil d'État ruled: "The acts conferring, confirming or maintaining titles of nobility prior to the establishment of the Republic constitute acts of the sovereign authority in the execution of its administrative power, including the establishment, where appropriate, of rules of transmission for these titles. Consequently, the Letters Patent of King Louis XV of June 1742 are not among the legislative provisions liable to be referred to the Constitutional Council in application of article 61-1 of the Constitution."

(With other words: The King can do no wrong. The French Republic does not recognize titles. It is willing to attest to the practice (in which titles are still used) but in this case without importing the law of the Republic into the practice of nobility. Louis XV can rest in peace. His royal Letters Patent remain patent under the law of the Republic.


https://www.conseil-etat.fr/fr/arian...1-02-12/440401

Nicolas de Broglie owns the Château de Broglie, 500 hectare of forest and two maisons in Paris.
https://mecenatmh.fr/wp-content/uplo...que-france.jpg

His eldest uncle Philippe-Maurice de Broglie, the current Duke, owns the monumental Grand-Hôtel de Tours.
https://cf.bstatic.com/images/hotel/.../260032524.jpg

His youngest uncle Louis-Albert de Broglie owns the Château de la Bourdaisière.
https://montjoye.net/images/Centre-V...urdaisiere.JPG

Thank you for your informative posts!

In my opinion, these practices can be accurately described as a form of legal recognition. Heraldica describes it in terms of titles having legal existence as part of the holder's family name.

Titles, to the degree that they exist in French law (that is, represent enforceable rights and obligations), exist as part of the family name or patronym, and get the same protection in civil courts as the latter.

Titles are not a full part of the family name, however, for a variety of reasons: they are not inherited by all children equally, but rather follow the rules of inheritance determined by the original grant or act of creation. Also, no one can be forced to use his title. Titles are, however, accessories of the family name, complements which help to distinguish among members of a family. As such, they are entitled to the same legal protection from usurpation as the family name.

Although some pre-1789 titles could be inherited in female line, the courts have decided that this cannot take place anymore.

The only way to acquire a title is to inherit it according to its original rules of transmission. In particular, it cannot be acquired prescriptively by usage.

https://www.heraldica.org/topics/fra...lesse.htm#Name

[Mbruno]

Originally Posted by Tatiana Maria

Thank you for your informative posts!

In my opinion, these practices can be accurately described as a form of legal recognition. Heraldica describes it in terms of titles having legal existence as part of the holder's family name.



https://www.heraldica.org/topics/fra...lesse.htm#Name

How is the title incorporated into the legal name in practice though? I mean, would the name in a passport or other national I.D. document appear as Nicolas de Broglie, Duc de Broglie or as Nicolas Duc de Broglie ?

[eya]

From the Royal House of Murat:

"Their Royal Highnesses the Prince and Princess Murat, have the joy of announce the civil marriage of Prince Joachim Charles Napoléon Murat, Prince of Pontecorvo with Miss Yasmine Lorraine Briki ”.


GD Georgi with his fiance Rebecca attend at the wedding in Paris


https://www.pointdevue.fr/mariages/j...rial_4710.html

[Biri]

Congratulations to the couple!

[iceflower]

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[iceflower]

Adélaïde de Clermont Tonnerre, author and Editorial Director of French magazine Point de Vue has released a new book entitled „Happy Days“:


** pointdevue article with interview: Adélaïde de Clermont-Tonnerre présente son nouveau roman **

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Adélaïde de Clermont Tonnerre signed her book "Les Jours heureux - Happy Days" at Librairie Galignani in Paris on June 5:


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[iceflower]

Adélaïde de Clermont Tonnerre attended the Haute-Joaillerie dinner at La Vigie Restaurant in Monaco yesterday, July 1:


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Adélaïde de Clermont Tonnerre attended the third edition of the "Les Ecrivains chez Gonzague Saint-Bris" ("Writers at Gonzague Saint-Bris") literary event in Chanceaux-pres-Loches on August 29:


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[iceflower]

Marie-Louise de Clermont Tonnerre attended Doris Brynner’s 90th Birthday at "Le Cheval Blanc Paris" Restaurant on September 16:


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Adélaïde de Clermont Tonnerre attended the Chanel Womenswear Spring/Summer 2022 show as part of Paris Fashion Week on October 5:


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Adélaïde de Clermont Tonnerre attended the traditional dinner of the Friends of the Museum of Modern Art of the City of Paris:


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Princess Caroline Murat attended the American Friends Of Blérancourt 2021 Annual Gala Dinner in New York City on November 8:


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[iceflower]

Adélaïde de Clermont Tonnerre attended the "Cocktail des Ecrivains" at Salons du Fouquets in Paris today:


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[iceflower]

Princess Minnie de Beauvau-Craon and daughter Victoria Botana de Beauvau-Craon have written a book together: „The Palace of Haroué“ about one of the family‘s estates in Lothringen. A book signing event recently took place in Paris:


** pdv article with gallery: La princesse Minnie de Beauvau-Craon et Victoria Botana de Beauvau-Craon, séance de dédicaces **

[iceflower]

Princess Diane de Beauvau-Craon attended the "Karl with Friend" exhibition at Sotheby's in Paris today, December 11:


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[eya]

Countess Eléonore de La Rochefoucauld attends at the opening night of the Ritz Bar

https://www.pointdevue.fr/storage/im...ps1jH6AZ1k.jpg

[iceflower]

Marie-Louise de Clermont Tonnerre attended the inauguration of the Charles Ray retrospective at the Bourse de Commerce in Paris:


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[iceflower]

Marie-Louise de Clermont Tonnerre attended the premiere of "Toute La Memoire Du Monde" at La Cinematheque in Paris on March 30:


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