Wealth of the Luxembourg Grand Ducal Family

[Odette]

Originally Posted by auntie

How come they wanted to auction off the late GD's jewels?

They cancelled that auction as fast as one could say "stop" since there was an outcry.
I do not know if they have too many jewels already or it was the same like the inheritance of the Orleans. According to them (Orleans) they could not equitably divide the property so they auctioned it off. Who knows?
It could be not for the money though.

[firelight]

Thanks for the helpful replies. I hope I didn't offend anyone with the question, it's just that I read this article years ago when I didn't know anything about Luxembourg but now I know Lux is a pretty rich country so I was curious. Also, I read that the Lux family sold off some of their properties to the Lux government after WW2 due to financial reasons. It seems to me they would not have done so unless circumstances were fairly desperate.

Of course they could have rebuilt themselves since then - if they're really worth $4.3b they've certainly done very well for themselves! The question is, how did they do it? In some ways, I feel this is harder for a royal family than for regular families because as a royal you have to be careful not to appear to be exploiting your position for financial gain. It looks bad and tends to bring out the pitchforks in the more republican-minded among your subjects.

I didn't know about the auctioning of the GD's jewels though. When was this supposed to happen?

[lucien]

Originally Posted by kelly9480

The Windsors' personal wealth is around L350m if you only take into account their private property (the rest belongs to the crown and is held in trust for the nation/taxpayers), and even a large portion of that money is held in stuff like art, houses, furniture, jewels -- not in cash. In terms of cash, the PoW gets the most in the family (The Queen gets about L6m less and has to spend a lot of her money on relatives and maintaining Sandringham and Balmoral).

Liechtenstein has the greatest private wealth, while Belgium and Denmark both claim less than $20m, and Sweden was around $20m before the stock market slumps. Norway refuses to comment, Spain has amassed an estimated E30m (from where, no one knows because they were destitute before the restoration). Luxembourg isn't poor, but there's no way we can assume that the family is obscenely rich. Their main assets would be what Adolphe had, since no one who has married in since then came with a fortune (Felix was a younger son, Josephine-Charlotte was a Belgian, and Maria Teresa's family lost their great wealth in the revolution). I wouldn't be surprised if Sibylla alone has more money than her in-laws combined.

Wrong Kelly.Lux is very wealthy,it is second to the Liechtenstein's,and Adolf had nothing,absolutely nothing,to do with it.Charlotte and Jean,had all to do with it.

[lucien]

Originally Posted by auntie

How come they wanted to auction off the late GD's jewels?

As Odette already said,the auction was called off after a public outcry.

The late GD Josephine-Charlotte had not enclosed in her will where each and every piece would go,and moreover,some of the children,
let alone the d-i-l's,didn't have all that great memories of her,so no-one actually wanted the pieces,at all.She may have come across
as a lady with humour and wit,but she had her streaks and fits.

You still see 'm very rarely if at all.
They're stuck with 'm,allthough I'm sure many here would know what to do with them,the Lux Family prefers
to let that part of the collection collect dust in the vault.I can not entirely disagree with them,the connotation
has too many negative elements.

[firelight]

Thanks for your interesting explanation about the jewels, lucien. I was wondering the same thing as auntie.

Originally Posted by lucien

some of the children,
let alone the d-i-l's,didn't have all that great memories of her,so no-one actually wanted the pieces,at all.

Oh my.

Originally Posted by lucien

You still see 'm very rarely if at all.
They're stuck with 'm,allthough I'm sure many here would know what to do with them,the Lux Family prefers
to let that part of the collection collect dust in the vault.I can not entirely disagree with them,the connotation
has too many negative elements.

Hmmm...why not loan them to a museum so the public can view them as an exhibit (like british crown jewels, Diana's gowns)? Don't have to worry about dividing them / selling them / guarding them / having them lying around the house giving off bad vibes to the d-i-ls! OK, i'm being flippant but one of the reasons I was inclined to think them 'poor' was because I don't see MT wearing a lot of different jewellery or tiaras (correct me if I'm wrong), unlike e.g. the British RF. So I thought the GD family did not have much by way of sparkly stuff.

BTW, lucien, could you please explain your last comment about how Charlotte and Jean are responsible for the family's wealth? Thanks in advance.

[lucien]

Originally Posted by firelight

Thanks for your interesting explanation about the jewels, lucien. I was wondering the same thing as auntie.



Oh my.



Hmmm...why not loan them to a museum so the public can view them as an exhibit (like british crown jewels, Diana's gowns)? Don't have to worry about dividing them / selling them / guarding them / having them lying around the house giving off bad vibes to the d-i-ls! OK, i'm being flippant but one of the reasons I was inclined to think them 'poor' was because I don't see MT wearing a lot of different jewellery or tiaras (correct me if I'm wrong), unlike e.g. the British RF. So I thought the GD family did not have much by way of sparkly stuff.

BTW, lucien, could you please explain your last comment about how Charlotte and Jean are responsible for the family's wealth? Thanks in advance.

Charlotte,and her son,had a good/shrewed mind investmentwise.Till the mid 1950's Lux economy was mainly thriving on agriculture and steel industry,but as changes/reforms in these fields were under way within the BeNeLux treaty,under Charlotte's Reign that changed from then on into the country being an almost financial institution on itself,a tax-free safe-haven for any money anyone wished to stash,the billions poored in and with the GD Family having majority stakes in some of the financial institutions,they sky-rocketed financially coppled to wise investment policies by the Family,et voila.

[lizie86]

Liechtenstein monarchy tops list of richest royals | UK news | The Guardian

[Shikha Pal]

The article is 10 years old !

[tommy1716]

according to teh article below the Luxembourg royal family is one of the cheapest in Europe (though the Spanish RF may take a budget cut taking them lower).

Spain's Royal family cut budget for first time in history - Telegraph

COMPARATIVE ANNUAL BUDGETS:
Britain €48.6m (£40.6m)
Netherlands €39.6m (£33.1m)
Norway €28m (£23.4m)
Belgium €13.7m euros (£11.5m)
Denmark €12.6m euros (£10.5m)
Sweden €12.2m euros (£10.2m)
Spain €8.9m euros (£7.43m)
Luxembourg €8.7m euros (£7.2m)


I wonder how much, if any, of this goes to the family themseleves in teh way the Dutch Queen gets a personal allowance or is it all for "official business" only?

[maria-olivia]

Lucien,
Do you know how much the Grand ducal family had to pay for the cancellation of the Auction. This Auction was organized by Prince Jean Junior and prince Philip of Wurtenberg
Short time later Prince Jean Jr married a second time with Diane de Guerre. No show up at their wedding from Grand Duke Henri and his wife.

On the other hand it was known that Grand-Duchess Charlotte's husband Prince Consort Felix was a casino-player and she had to pay her husband's debts.

Thanks for answering the 2 questions
Thanks for answer

[Lalla Meriem]

The 8.7 million Euro only reflects the cost of the monarchy. It is not a reflection of the personal wealth of the family.

Some time after the auction was cancelled it was estimated by royal watchers with connections to the auction business that the fee for cancellation would have been around 200,000 Euro. The cancellation fee is a certain percentage of the estimated sale of the items. Some of the items may have been sold privately by the family members that acquired them. Henri said in an interview that each of JC's children had gotten their favorite pieces of the jewelry and the rest of the jewels are stored. I don't see why they don't place the jewels into The Nassau Family Foundation.

Prince Jean is on good terms with his family. Their absence at his second wedding isn't a sign of family discord. Maybe they just didn't approve of Jean's marriage to a woman that he was allegedly involved with prior to his divorce. In any case, they remain a close family.

[tommy100]

Luxarazzi : Court Marshall Talks Grand Ducal Finances

Luxarazzi has an article about the Court Marshal giving an interview to Wort about the Grand Ducal finances. Apparently the money from the State for the grand ducal court is not enough to meet all the costs and the Grand Duke pat the extra himself.
The Court marshal also says the family's private wealth is not as big as some in the media say.

[Mbruno]

Originally Posted by tommy1716

according to teh article below the Luxembourg royal family is one of the cheapest in Europe (though the Spanish RF may take a budget cut taking them lower).

Spain's Royal family cut budget for first time in history - Telegraph

COMPARATIVE ANNUAL BUDGETS:
Britain €48.6m (£40.6m)
Netherlands €39.6m (£33.1m)
Norway €28m (£23.4m)
Belgium €13.7m euros (£11.5m)
Denmark €12.6m euros (£10.5m)
Sweden €12.2m euros (£10.2m)
Spain €8.9m euros (£7.43m)
Luxembourg €8.7m euros (£7.2m)


I wonder how much, if any, of this goes to the family themseleves in teh way the Dutch Queen gets a personal allowance or is it all for "official business" only?

In fact, on a per capita basis, the Luxembourg grand ducal family is one of the most expensive, if not the most expensive royal family in Europe. And, of course, according to Forbes, the grand ducal family is privately much wealthier than their counterparts from bigger European countries.

[Duc_et_Pair]

Originally Posted by Mbruno

In fact, on a per capita basis, the Luxembourg grand ducal family is one of the most expensive, if not the most expensive royal family in Europe. And, of course, according to Forbes, the grand ducal family is privately much wealthier than their counterparts from bigger European countries.

Forbes is hardly a reliable source. They are simply guessing someone's wealth and because it has the stamp "Forbes" on it, that estimation gets some authority and voilà, another myth is born. Note that after the death of Grand-Duchess Joséphine-Charlotte her children wanted to auction off major items, to overcome taxes and to distribute her estate. The grand-ducal family also wanted to sell a popular forest in Luxembourg, which also sparked protests. If they were so dazzling rich, they really were not enforced to sell personal items or possessions. It seems the Grand Duke pays for 90 staff out of his private assets. Compare it with the related House Orange-Nassau (Netherlands): there only a handful are working privately for the King and even these are paid out of the "B-component" of the King's dotation (the allowance for the functional costs), the rest is directly paid by the State... So the Grand Duke probably is "eating" his own capital to maintain a court.

[tommy100]

^^^ yes it definitely seems to be that the family are having to use a lot of money to pay for staff for the Court. Though I am a little dubious that out of the 100 staff only 10 are paid for by the Court budget, especially given the vast majority of the 8million euro or so budget goes on staffing. I doubt the Grand Duke pays 90 staff their full wage from his own pocket, if he does that would mean the 10 staff paid by the State get almost 800,000euro each?!
I wonder if the State pays for 10 staff (from a central budget of sorts) and the Court budget pays for the rest with some contribution from the family.

[Lee-Z]

You guys do realize that the post above with the figures was from 2010?
Maybe it would be interesting to see an update?

[tommy100]

Working on the figures of 8.1million euros staffing costs for next year which the Court Marshall says is 86% of the total court budget I make the total Court budget 9,234,000 Euro which would put them above Spain based on the 2010 figures.

[Duc_et_Pair]

Originally Posted by tommy100

^^^ yes it definitely seems to be that the family are having to use a lot of money to pay for staff for the Court. Though I am a little dubious that out of the 100 staff only 10 are paid for by the Court budget, especially given the vast majority of the 8million euro or so budget goes on staffing. I doubt the Grand Duke pays 90 staff their full wage from his own pocket, if he does that would mean the 10 staff paid by the State get almost 800,000euro each?!
I wonder if the State pays for 10 staff (from a central budget of sorts) and the Court budget pays for the rest with some contribution from the family.

It is very difficult to say what is included and what not. The maintenance of the palaces? The pensions of the retired staff? The transportation? The security? The Archives of the Grand-Ducal House? The maintenance of the parks and the domains?

The figure of the Netherlands is high but they are the most transparent in being honest and say which costs are attributed to proper workings of the monarchy. In many monarchies there are "hidden costs" which needs some puzzling. In Spain the palaces are part of the Patrimonio Nacional but in usufruct by the royal family. In Belgium the palaces come from Leopold II's gift (Donation Royale) but this is a semi-autonomous institution of State. These costs should be included. Etc. Anyone who has seen the grand residences and grand military ceremonials in Spain will understand that labelling this as "cheapest monarchy" is nonsense. In the one monarchy these costs are included, in the other monarchy you have to look into the hidden costs of the Department of Defense or the Department of the Interior, to name some examples.

That Luxembourg is -per capita- the most expensive, lies at hand.

[Lee-Z]

Not sure how reliable the Almanach de Gotha website is on the case but they have the Grand-duke listed for 2014 as more wealthy than P.Albert of Monaco, that kinda surprised me
Richest Monarchs and Royals of the World - 2014

[Duc_et_Pair]

Originally Posted by Lee-Z

Not sure how reliable the Almanach de Gotha website is on the case but they have the Grand-duke listed for 2014 as more wealthy than P.Albert of Monaco, that kinda surprised me
Richest Monarchs and Royals of the World - 2014

The Almanach de Gotha is a genealogical database. How do they assess the wealth of a family? We may safely assume that the Prince of Monaco is amongst the wealthiest royals in Europe. The palais princier looks absolutely fabulous, the ceremonies (Fête Nationale, the mariage princier, the birth of the Marquis des Baux and the Comtesse des Carladès), it is all done with grandeur. All this with a very small number of taxpayers, so the Prince must have enough resources for the upkeep of the palais princier, the great domain and Château de Marchais in Northern France, the staffing, the transportation, the own private jet, the yacht.... Yes, he is dazzling rich.

The Grand Duke of Luxembourg is not poor either but I fail to see where the grand fortune came from. They got the Grand Duchy in 1890, after the death of King Willem III of the Netherlands. The Nassaus had to pay the Orange-Nassaus for the purchase of some of their Luxembourg estates, the palace inventories, the artworks, etc. which remained in the Grand Duchy. Before that they were no Sovereign family anymore (the Duchy of Nassau became part of the German Empire). The marriage partners were not that dazzling rich ánd the familles grand-ducale were blessed with many children. So it is a mystery to me why the Grand Duke is seen as one of Europe's most wealthy royals.