Finding Freedom: Harry and Meghan and the Making of A Modern Royal Family

[Pranter]

Archie is their child. It doesn’t matter why someone was let go in regard of caring for him. As his parents that is their job to PROTECT their child. So frankly it doesn’t matter your opinion of any of them. You were not there. You have no idea that happened and frankly it seems no one really cares. It’s just the fact this person was no longer employed that has you fixated. If a parent doesn’t want you near their child. You won’t be near their child. The end.

Exactly. None of us were there. We don't know what happened. To then take this approach of The Sussexes were somehow in the wrong to fire a nanny (or two or six) makes no sense to me. Why assume they are somehow at fault? We see this over and over no matter what the topic is...the Sussexes are portrayed in a negative manner.



LaRae

 

[Helen.CH]

Exactly. None of us were there. We don't know what happened. To then take this approach of The Sussexes were somehow in the wrong to fire a nanny (or two or six) makes no sense to me. Why assume they are somehow at fault? We see this over and over no matter what the topic is...the Sussexes are portrayed in a negative manner.



LaRae

Well this is a forum to discuss the Royals, most of us have not been with them,
so what?

 

[Sandy345]

This is something I struggle with massively, they say the RF are unsupportive (though they try an hide that behind meaning royal aides sometimes) but from the book:

The Queen was so supportive, praising Meghan, taking her with her on a trip quicker than any other royal and popping in to see them regularly at Windsor. She invited her to the big BP christmas lunch and the more private family Christmas at Sandirngham while they were still 'only' engaged which, I believe for HM , is a big step/sign.

Charles loves Meghan and her can do attitude and was like a second father to her. He and Camilla attended her private baptism and hosted a private dinner for Meghan after it with all her friends invited, he walked her down the aisle when her father couldn't and they spent some time at the Castle of Mey together. Charles was and still is continuing to still fund them and their lifestlye

Eugenie was wonderful, popping in all the time, double dates with H&M and Jack.

Zara is mentioned as being told about the birth of Archie via whatsapp

Even William is praised for fighting for them to have their own staff rather than just sharing with the rest of the RF and said to have pushed Charles to ensure their office was properly funded. At the start the book specifically says: But she needn’t have worried. As soon as William opened the black double doors to welcome Meghan into his home, he said, “I was looking forward to meeting the girl who has put that silly grin on my brother’s face.”

He and Kate host Meghan and Harry for Christmas in their own private home
At the start (before the book suddenly changes its view and Kate is cold and unkind) she is said to be supportive. Here is the entire quote about their first meeting which took place after William first met Meghan because Kate was still at Anmer at the time with the children (completely fair IMO surely and if anything shows how eager William was to meet Meghan not to wait until Kate was free):
Despite the fact that Harry was a regular guest in her household, Kate had seemingly not shown much interest in finding out who this woman was who had made her brother-in-law so happy. But that indifference wasn’t necessarily directed toward Meghan. “The Duchess is an extremely guarded person,” a friend explained. After she married William, she was careful about letting others in to her social circle. Her friends today—including Lady Laura Meade and Emilia Jardine-Paterson, both of whom married friends of William’s—are for the most part the same ones she had on her wedding day. Like her husband, Kate ran in a tight group.
Meghan brought a present for the duchess, who had celebrated her birthday just a day earlier. The soft leather Smythson notebook helped to break the ice, as did Meghan’s cooing over then twenty-month-old Charlotte. The meeting ended with Kate letting Meghan know that she was always welcome to contact her if she needed anything. Having been through the experience of being a royal girlfriend herself, Kate knew how trying it could be to suddenly have one’s personal life laid bare.

Kate may be cold, a bit distant but other than instantly becoming BFFs like some cheesy teen film I don't know what else she was expected to do. She told Meghan she could contact her with anything so IMO that in a way puts the ball back in Meghans court.


But all of this isn't supportive enough? Especially when you compare it to Meghan's family? I find that quite remarkable to be honest.

Charles did not follow up on his kindnesses. What I found particularly egregious was no comment from Charles of protest when Archie was likened to a chimp by someone in the media. Charles also as the father should have not let the feud between his sons continue to deteriorate and called regular meetings to resolve their differences. I think that some intervention may have helped matters.

I would have hoped Charles would have been seen on appearances with Meghan, Harry, and Camilla. There was that one appearance early on at a Garden Party but nothing else.

I think there should have been more than funding, Charles should have been more proactive. IMO.

 

[Pranter]

Well this is a forum to discuss the Royals, most of us have not been with them,
so what?

Yes however even the rules of the forum are largely ignored and folks just post whatever rumor/speculation and treat it as fact.



LaRae

 

[Helen.CH]

Yes however even the rules of the forum are largely ignored and folks just post whatever rumor/speculation and treat it as fact.



LaRae

I can't see this largely happening rules being ognored... and if I am capable to ignore, ask for sources and most important make up my own mind about things.
And the fact that here many opinions about the Sussexes seem negative,
must not show the majority is against them but maybe this is a result of their actions&behaviour or those members of the forum who think the Sussex couple has acted all right do not speak out here, both is possible.
I am totally relaxed about any royal topic here as I do not live in a reigning house, but think it is nice to have a view outside and see what others think, how the public opinion develops aso.

 

[tommy100]

Charles did not follow up on his kindnesses. What I found particularly egregious was no comment from Charles of protest when Archie was likened to a chimp by someone in the media. Charles also as the father should have not let the feud between his sons continue to deteriorate and called regular meetings to resolve their differences. I think that some intervention may have helped matters.

I would have hoped Charles would have been seen on appearances with Meghan, Harry, and Camilla. There was that one appearance early on at a Garden Party but nothing else.

I think there should have been more than funding, Charles should have been more proactive. IMO.

The Royal Family have learnt the hard way that giving these disgusting comments, that go mainly on social media, airtime only gives those behind them power. I don't really know what people expect him to do, jump in his car and track the people down himself? Did anyone ask him what he thought of such comments? Not that I'm aware of, I'm sure if they did he would have condemned it in the way it deserved to be.

We don't know what engagements may have been planned in the future together, royal diaries are booked up years in advance so they well have planned more in over time. Its also worth noting that the RF seeks to do as many duties for as many people as possible, having 4 senior royals turn up at the same event is simply not an appropriate use of their time or funds. Should the RF have looked beyond that, maybe? But then again that would have been putting H&M in a different, special position above the other royals.

At the end of the day, rightly or wrongly, Charles devoted the majority of his time to his duties. You may think that unfair but his sons are well into their 30s so I think most parents wouldn't expect to have to take time out their work to mediate between their grown up children.

 

[Pranter]

I can't see this largely happening rules being ognored... and if I am capable to ignore, ask for sources and most important make up my own mind about things.
And the fact that here many opinions about the Sussexes seem negative,
must not show the majority is against them but maybe this is a result of their actions&behaviour or those members of the forum who think the Sussex couple has acted all right do not speak out here, both is possible.
I am totally relaxed about any royal topic here as I do not live in a reigning house, but think it is nice to have a view outside and see what others think, how the public opinion develops aso.

Likely because a lot of posts are deleted before you see them. You can go thru the threads and see the warnings and notice of posts being deleted.

It's one thing to comment negatively about something they have actually said or done. It's another to build up a whole narrative about something that is based on rumor/speculation.

LaRae

 

[Winnie]

tommy100, post 3109 = excellent post and last paragraph hit nail on the head. JMO

 

[Lee-Z]

At the end of the day, rightly or wrongly, Charles devoted the majority of his time to his duties. You may think that unfair but his sons are well into their 30s so I think most parents wouldn't expect to have to take time out their work to mediate between their grown up children.

That's it isn't it: royals, especially royals in a country that's still a monarchy, are there for duty, service to their country, and all the people in that country.
There are many priviliges that come with it, but the main thing is this.

If H&M weren't comfortable with the idea of that being their future, it was a good plan to step out of it.
In the end it seems that it is better for both parties they did.

 

[Hallo girl]

Charles did not follow up on his kindnesses. What I found particularly egregious was no comment from Charles of protest when Archie was likened to a chimp by someone in the media. Charles also as the father should have not let the feud between his sons continue to deteriorate and called regular meetings to resolve their differences. I think that some intervention may have helped matters.

I would have hoped Charles would have been seen on appearances with Meghan, Harry, and Camilla. There was that one appearance early on at a Garden Party but nothing else.

I think there should have been more than funding, Charles should have been more proactive. IMO.

We cannot possibly know what went on behind the scenes, do you know for a fact that Charles did not meet up with his sons for meetings, do you know for a fact that they did not have phone calls to discuss, no you dont. Neither do I or anybody else on this forum. Just because Charles does not post on social media what he has done in support of his sons and their families it does not mean that nothing has been done. WE just don't know.
As for supporting them at events maybe that was a compliment to Meghan that they had complete confidence in her abilities. I do not know.

 

[Hallo girl]

Likely because a lot of posts are deleted before you see them. You can go thru the threads and see the warnings and notice of posts being deleted.

It's one thing to comment negatively about something they have actually said or done. It's another to build up a whole narrative about something that is based on rumor/speculation.

LaRae

That is correct just like there is a whole scenario on this thread with regards the nanny that was asked to leave. We do not know the reason but it has not stopped speculation, all based on the nanny being in the wrong.

 

[Betsypaige]

The Royal Family have learnt the hard way that giving these disgusting comments, that go mainly on social media, airtime only gives those behind them power. I don't really know what people expect him to do, jump in his car and track the people down himself? Did anyone ask him what he thought of such comments? Not that I'm aware of, I'm sure if they did he would have condemned it in the way it deserved to be.

We don't know what engagements may have been planned in the future together, royal diaries are booked up years in advance so they well have planned more in over time. Its also worth noting that the RF seeks to do as many duties for as many people as possible, having 4 senior royals turn up at the same event is simply not an appropriate use of their time or funds. Should the RF have looked beyond that, maybe? But then again that would have been putting H&M in a different, special position above the other royals.

At the end of the day, rightly or wrongly, Charles devoted the majority of his time to his duties. You may think that unfair but his sons are well into their 30s so I think most parents wouldn't expect to have to take time out their work to mediate between their grown up children.

I couldn’t agree more. You can’t win by getting into a war with the media, and besides, it was ONE person, who was promptly fired. That one man didn’t represent all the media, just himself and his racist views.

No parent can force their children to get along, especially when they are adults - you’re exactly right. It’s ridiculous to blame Charles for not trying to be a referee....William and Harry have to work this out for themselves. All their father can do is encourage them to do so.

Meghan apparently still loves Charles and has a strong relationship with him, so anyone who is upset on her behalf should take it up with her.

On another note, I have to laugh at the people taking umbrage at those of us “speculating”, simply because we disapprove of how H and M are behaving, but because they love H and M, they are in full possession of the facts.

 

[Eskimo]

I couldn’t agree more. You can’t win by getting into a war with the media, and besides, it was ONE person, who was promptly fired. That one man didn’t represent all the media, just himself and his racist views.

No parent can force their children to get along, especially when they are adults - you’re exactly right. It’s ridiculous to blame Charles for not trying to be a referee....William and Harry have to work this out for themselves. All their father can do is encourage them to do so.

Meghan apparently still loves Charles and has a strong relationship with him, so anyone who is upset on her behalf should take it up with her.

On another note, I have to laugh at the people taking umbrage at those of us “speculating”, simply because we disapprove of how H and M are behaving, but because they love H and M, they are in full possession of the facts.

This times a 1000

 

[Lori138]

(On another note, I have to laugh at the people taking umbrage at those of us “speculating”, simply because we disapprove of how H and M are behaving, but because they love H and M, they are in full possession of the facts.)

Thank you, that is exactly how I felt when reading thru these threads.

 

[Osipi]

lifestlye


He and Kate host Meghan and Harry for Christmas in their own private home
At the start (before the book suddenly changes its view and Kate is cold and unkind) she is said to be supportive. Here is the entire quote about their first meeting which took place after William first met Meghan because Kate was still at Anmer at the time with the children (completely fair IMO surely and if anything shows how eager William was to meet Meghan not to wait until Kate was free):
Despite the fact that Harry was a regular guest in her household, Kate had seemingly not shown much interest in finding out who this woman was who had made her brother-in-law so happy. But that indifference wasn’t necessarily directed toward Meghan. “The Duchess is an extremely guarded person,” a friend explained. After she married William, she was careful about letting others in to her social circle. Her friends today—including Lady Laura Meade and Emilia Jardine-Paterson, both of whom married friends of William’s—are for the most part the same ones she had on her wedding day. Like her husband, Kate ran in a tight group.
Meghan brought a present for the duchess, who had celebrated her birthday just a day earlier. The soft leather Smythson notebook helped to break the ice, as did Meghan’s cooing over then twenty-month-old Charlotte. The meeting ended with Kate letting Meghan know that she was always welcome to contact her if she needed anything. Having been through the experience of being a royal girlfriend herself, Kate knew how trying it could be to suddenly have one’s personal life laid bare.

I keep seeing references to this first Christmas and then other times where Meghan got the blues because this member of the family seemed to ignore her or that member seemed to be cold and unfeeling and unfriendly towards her. To be honest, I think most of us, attending a Sandringham Christmas with the British Royal Family to be a huge dose of culture shock.

Meghan, at the time, basically came from a society where at parties with people you really don't know, its kiss-kiss, smooch-smooch, hugs all around and "let me get you a drink from the bar and we'll talk". Open (sometimes too open and friendly) shallow small talk and seeing and being seen is the name of the game. What a comparison to a Sandringham Christmas. Sitting down to Christmas Eve dinner dressed to the nines and even the process of arriving and departing the dinner table is protocol filled. Anne has to arrive at the dinner ahead of Charles . Charles has to enter before the Queen. Its a very, very structured time with a lot of "on the dot" timing and correct clothing changes for each and every event from going to church, sitting down for lunch, going on an afternoon shoot. You get the picture. Total and complete formality. Even the Christmas gifts are all arranged on tables according to the person's name and are opened at a precise time. Its even possible that during the Christmas Eve dinner the strict protocol of talking to the person on your left during the salad course changes to talking to the person on your right during the main course kind of thing.

Not strange to Harry who grew up with this strictness of a Christmas at Sandringham but Meghan probably felt like Alice falling through the looking glass finding herself in the middle of all this. Its not being cold. Its not ignoring her or failing to make her feel welcome. It was how the family does Christmas and have been doing it this way since any of them can remember. The Queen would have been aghast had Sophie ran up to Meghan when she entered with Harry and did the "smooch smooch kiss kiss" routine. Its just not done.

Anyone that has an inkling of what a Sandringham Christmas is like will see Meghan's feelings being "hurt" as Meghan not understanding how things are done and playing the "victim" as if the BRF should have changed how *they* do things normally to coddle someone new.

 

[Moonmaiden23]

What kind of baggage (in the sense the word was used in the book) did Diana have (other than her parents having had an unhappy marriage)?



Diana was an 18-year virgin who, to use her own words, "grew up in a big house" and was an earl's daughter from an old family of courtiers and aristocrats. I don't think her "baggage" compares to anything that was alleged against Meghan when she started dating Harry.

I disagree. Being caught in the middle of two beloved parents who hate one another and have decided to wage war using their children is quite literal HELL. That was Diana's childhood reality despite her big ancestral pile and her inherited title.

When she spoke of lying awake at night listening to her little brother cry because he missed their mother...who had lost custody of them ...my heart broke.

Any competent psychologist will verify that kind of emotional upheaval in early childhood is more damaging and lasting than bruises and broken bones.

As Diana would size herself up later in a very rare moment of introspective self awareness....." I was so MESSED UP.".

Diana: Her True Story, author Andrew Morton.

 

[Madame Verseau]

I was wondering how Trevor Engelson was going to response to his treatment in the book. Actually his uncle did

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/ushome/index.html

I'm not sure if Meghan's first husband is asking his uncle to speak on his behalf. If it's wrong, Trevor sues and be able to prove it in a US Court. The same standard would apply to the Markles (Samantha has not screeched back - yet) and the royals.

On one of his interviews Scobie said there is a lot more but couldn't print for legal reasons or "appropriateness". Laying the groundwork for another book once the obstacles no longer exist?

 

[poppy7]

I disagree. Being caught in the middle of two beloved parents who hate one another and have decided to wage war using their children is quite literal HELL. That was Diana's childhood reality despite her big ancestral pile and her inherited title.

When she spoke of lying awake at night listening to her little brother cry because he missed their mother...who had lost custody of them ...my heart broke.

Any competent psychologist will verify that kind of emotional upheaval in early childhood is more damaging and lasting than bruises and broken bones.

As Diana would size herself up later in a very rare moment of introspective self awareness....." I was so MESSED UP.".

Diana: Her True Story, author Andrew Morton.

Diana's childhood was a disaster. Her father was quite the man..Refusing to allow Diana a d her brother to return to their mother and the ensuing drama was horrendous. And both Charles and Diana have had troubled personal lives
In contrast to the other two. And then the subsequent treatment of nannies and the stepmother. It was like a children's novel about those wild, emotionally neglected children who thrive against the odds. Except they didn't thrive.

 

[poppy7]

I was wondering how Trevor Engelson was going to response to his treatment in the book. Actually his uncle did

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/ushome/index.html

I'm not sure if Meghan's first husband is asking his uncle to speak on his behalf. If it's wrong, Trevor sues and be able to prove it in a US Court. The same standard would apply to the Markles (Samantha has not screeched back - yet) and the royals.

On one of his interviews Scobie said there is a lot more but couldn't print for legal reasons or "appropriateness". Laying the groundwork for another book once the obstacles no longer exist?

Trevor will ignore it either way.

 

[Osipi]

Having not read the book and now reading about people maybe getting upset and suing and Scobie quipping "legal reasons", I'm wondering if anywhere in this book a certain person named Piers Morgan is brought up. If anyone jumped on the bandwagon to make Meghan feel the "victim", this is the guy.

This is also the guy that would have no qualms taking them to court most likely. Just wondering.

 

[evolvingdoors]

Diana's childhood was a disaster. Her father was quite the man..Refusing to allow Diana a d her brother to return to their mother and the ensuing drama was horrendous. And both Charles and Diana have had troubled personal lives
In contrast to the other two. And then the subsequent treatment of nannies and the stepmother. It was like a children's novel about those wild, emotionally neglected children who thrive against the odds. Except they didn't thrive.

YesC and Diana and Charles went and did the same thing to their sons via war of the Waleses.

Given Harry childhood, and his adult behavior, given Meghan own behavior regarding family, any family, i hazard that the Sussex divorce - when it arrives- will be just as bad.

 

[nightsky]

I was wondering how Trevor Engelson was going to response to his treatment in the book. Actually his uncle did

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/ushome/index.html

I'm not sure if Meghan's first husband is asking his uncle to speak on his behalf. If it's wrong, Trevor sues and be able to prove it in a US Court. The same standard would apply to the Markles (Samantha has not screeched back - yet) and the royals.

On one of his interviews Scobie said there is a lot more but couldn't print for legal reasons or "appropriateness". Laying the groundwork for another book once the obstacles no longer exist?

One book by Omid is enough. He hasn’t done the Sussex’s any favors!

 

[Sandy345]

I don't claim to know. But I think that this feud just kept getting worse and it should have been nipped in the bud. I think the royals do get access to media or the courtiers do. And I think it would not have hurt to try to refute criticism of Meghan by showing more support. Just my thoughts.

 

[Helen.CH]

One book by Omid is enough. He hasn’t done the Sussex’s any favors!

well, he makes money with the book , it's not been the goal to do anybody else a favour ;-)

 

[lirienn]

I believe that during the writing of this book which says almost nothing about Harry's life which is more interesting everyone believe the book will be a bigger deal. Instead it's like a b-class movie. Just like her actions and zoom meetings. She thought other celebrities and agencies will fight for her instead she's one of so many with bad reputation. She dreamt of winning of Oscar but will probably be B-list celebrity. She trashed her husband yet he never spoke about her and they surely offered him money. How unnecessary.
In the book I found 0 ideas, just idea of idea. Also her blog Tiggy was pretty irrelevant yet she makes it sound profound.
She hoped for a jet-setting lifestyle and upper society but being associated with her seems like the wrong move for everyone now.

 

[Osipi]

I don't claim to know. But I think that this feud just kept getting worse and it should have been nipped in the bud. I think the royals do get access to media or the courtiers do. And I think it would not have hurt to try to refute criticism of Meghan by showing more support. Just my thoughts.

Adults have differences and parting of the ways and resolve it by just walking away and getting on with life. Children take it to the school yard, form sides, push and pull and bully and it turns into a game of war of survival of the fittest and the meanest and the nastiest.

Finding Freedom seems to me to belong on a schoolyard playground scale. Don't let things go. Keep things alive and prod the masses into taking sides in things that actually don't concern them in the first place.

 

[Denville]

Weren't there articles about Harry and Meghan not wanting a Norland nanny for Archie?

I dont kow but I think they'd be well advised to get one. they are from a highly repubable organisation and I can't imagine that tehy wuodl have anyone who wasnt well triained and good at the job.

 

[Denville]

Ia
Anyone that has an inkling of what a Sandringham Christmas is like will see Meghan's feelings being "hurt" as Meghan not understanding how things are done and playing the "victim" as if the BRF should have changed how *they* do things normally to coddle someone new.

So if this was teh case how come Harry claimed that Meghan had had a great time at her pre marriage meetings with the family and that they had been the family she had never had? It seems an odd swing around from "Oh they were lovely and they love her and she loves them" to " they're too formal and cold and Meg felt unhappy with them." Does not add up.

 

[Denville]

We cannot possibly know what went on behind the scenes, do you know for a fact that Charles did not meet up with his sons for meetings, do you know for a fact that they did not have phone calls to discuss, no you dont. Neither do I or anybody else on this forum. Just because Charles does not post on social media what he has done in support of his sons and their families it does not mean that nothing has been done. WE just don't know.
As for supporting them at events maybe that was a compliment to Meghan that they had complete confidence in her abilities. I do not know.

Royals dont do that many engagements with other royals. Apart from married couples. Generally Charles and Cam don't do engagements wiht WIll and Kate, the queen doesn't do engagements with her children or grandchildren. They spread out so that they can get more done.

 

[Osipi]

So if this was teh case how come Harry claimed that Meghan had had a great time at her pre marriage meetings with the family and that they had been the family she had never had? It seems an odd swing around from "Oh they were lovely and they love her and she loves them" to " they're too formal and cold and Meg felt unhappy with them." Does not add up.

Exactly. There's a lot of things that just don't add up for me. How it was then is portrayed as totally something different now? Changing the narrative to suit a purpose never is a good tactic if you want to actually be taken seriously.

Is it perhaps the audience they're trying to reach with this book is presumed to be totally in the dark and uninformed about all the events in the book and how things went down and they're just now coming to light. I think this is what is confusing those of us who have followed Harry's relationship since the news first broke that they were a couple. A lot of "I don't remember it being *that* way at all". ?