Finding Freedom: Harry and Meghan and the Making of A Modern Royal Family

[Alison H]

What have they been "personal and passionate" about, though? If they were working with children in underprivileged countries, like Princess Anne does, or supporting marginalised groups, like Diana did with AIDS patients, or even talking about carbuncles, like Prince Charles did, then I'd get it But all I'm hearing is a lot of soundbites. I accept that the coronavirus situation limits what people can actually do at the moment, but I'm not hearing anything of any substance from them.


As for what people have been doing over the last 7 months, a lot of us have been working from home with little or no support from our employers, whilst medical staff have been working extremely hard and in difficult and sometimes dangerous conditions, and other people - supermarket staff, binmen, Amazon delivery drivers, postal staff, and many others - have been working very hard too.


William and Kate's visit to a seaside resort in South Wales might not seem very glamorous, but the tourist industry's been hit incredibly hard by lockdown and the absence of overseas visitors, and a royal visit gives people a boost and provides some publicity.

 

[Osipi]

How long woudl they have stuck it? They were given an important adn responsible job with the Commonwealth, whihc is very dear to the queen's heart and they preferred to leg it to LA and hole up in a stranger's mansiion...

Like every other member of the royal family, Harry and Meghan had their own areas of interest and ideas of what they wanted to do. Since its been mentioned just recently, I can see how it was with Charles. He wanted to establish his own personal Prince's Trust to put energy into something he's passionate about. So this is a good example. For starters.

What happened is that Charles' bright idea fit very well into the parameters of the "Firm" and its even hard for some people to have the idea and notion that Charles' work for the "Firm" and the monarchy and his work with the Prince's Trust are two entirely different things.

The Sussex plan on how to move forward in their own personal aims and goals (substitute Sussex Royal for Prince's Trust) clashed horribly with the "Firm" and how it operates and was deemed a "no go". It became an either/or situation. If Harry and Meghan's schemes and dreams were to mesh with how the "Firm" operates, we'd see them today happy as a pair of lovebirds smiling and waving the UK flag and doing wondrous things. They just made the decision that the way they want to go about doing things into the future were more of a priority than being a part of "Team Windsor" and the "Firm" and sailed off into the sunset not so very quietly but with a huge sonic *boom*.

 

[Denville]

What have they been "personal and passionate" about, though? If they were working with children in underprivileged countries, like Princess Anne does, or supporting marginalised groups, like Diana did with AIDS patients, or even talking about carbuncles, like Prince Charles did, then I'd get it But all I'm hearing is a lot of soundbites. I accept that the coronavirus situation limits what people can actually do at the moment, but I'm not hearing anything of any substance from them.

The only thing they are passionate about is "doing their own thing" and "finding freedom..."
If they were so into charity work, they had a great opportunity on leaving the RF to get out there, roll up their sleeves and work at something practical, They have enough money to live on, they have free time.. they could have dedicated themselves to hands on charity work.. but that's nt what they want to do..> its to pop up and say something vaguely controversial, so that their names will still be in the media, when they do get a chance to
make money...

 

[Osipi]

The only thing they are passionate about is "doing their own thing" and "finding freedom..."
If they were so into charity work, they had a great opportunity on leaving the RF to get out there, roll up their sleeves and work at something practical, They have enough money to live on, they have free time.. they could have dedicated themselves to hands on charity work.. but that's nt what they want to do..> its to pop up and say something vaguely controversial, so that their names will still be in the media, when they do get a chance to
make money...

When doctors are turning to having consultations over the phone rather than personal visits and a lot of business still haven't been able to open up to "make money" and people are still being advised to lay low, social distance, wear masks everywhere out in public and rely on hand sanitizer more than that wonderful new and improved lotion to eliminate cellulite, just how in tarnation do people get "out there" and "do good".

How do they go out there spreading good cheer and unicorns and rainbows like they're Santa's elves incarnate let alone draw hordes of people to a "making money" proposition when no matter *who* you are from the owner of an airlines to a laid off worker from Hobby Lobby whose unemployment benefits have expired are draining their own wallets to the point that even buying groceries next week is a hugh *if* and threatening their jobs and their businesses to the point they may have to never reopen again or recover?

The obvious answer is a pandemic called Covid-19. One little microscopic "bug" has brought the world to its knees and it is a nasty little varmint that doesn't care who you are or how much money and chutzpah and "influence" anyone has. it affects anything and everything in its path. And you wonder why H&M haven't done anything??? Look around you.

 

[Denville]

When doctors are turning to having consultations over the phone rather than personal visits and a lot of business still haven't been able to open up to "make money" and people are still being advised to lay low, social distance, wear masks everywhere out in public and rely on hand sanitizer more than that wonderful new and improved lotion to eliminate cellulite, just how in tarnation do people get "out there" and "do good".

How do they go out there spreading good cheer and unicorns and rainbows like they're Santa's elves incarnate let alone draw hordes of people to a "making money" proposition when no matter *who* you are from the owner of an airlines to a laid off worker from Hobby Lobby whose unemployment benefits have expired are draining their own wallets to the point that even buying groceries next week is a hugh *if* and threatening their jobs and their businesses to the point they may have to never reopen again or recover?

The obvious answer is a pandemic called Covid-19. One little microscopic "bug" has brought the world to its knees and it is a nasty little varmint that doesn't care who you are or how much money and chutzpah and "influence" anyone has. it affects anything and everything in its path. And you wonder why H&M haven't done anything??? Look around you.

Ohter people are working, and "doing good".. A lot of people are working in very diffuclt circumstnaces, trying to go ot work, take care of and homeschool children.... Harry and Meg think the RF isn't doing enough charity work, it seems. so I think this is a great chance for them to show waht they are made of.

 

[Osipi]

Ohter people are working, and "doing good".. A lot of people are working in very diffuclt circumstnaces, trying to go ot work, take care of and homeschool children.... Harry and Meg think the RF isn't doing enough charity work, it seems. so I think this is a great chance for them to show waht they are made of.

OK. I'll bite again. Just what do you propose they do? How? Whatever can they jump into doing on a day to day basis physically and in the flesh to be seen doing all this good stuffs? How do we know that all they're doing is sitting basking in the comfort of their new home and twiddling their thumbs and playing Candy Land with Archie? Last I heard, they weren't wearing body cams.

Where too has it ever been recorded that Harry and Meghan don't believe that the RF is doing enough charity work?? That's a totally new one for me that I've never heard before.

 

[Denville]

OK. I'll bite again. Just what do you propose they do? How? Whatever can they jump into doing on a day to day basis physically and in the flesh to be seen doing all this good stuffs? How do we know that all they're doing is sitting basking in the comfort of their new home and twiddling their thumbs and playing Candy Land with Archie? Last I heard, they weren't wearing body cams.

Where too has it ever been recorded that Harry and Meghan don't believe that the RF is doing enough charity work?? That's a totally new one for me that I've never heard before.

I thought that was the whole idea of Finding Freedom. They thought that the RF were annoyed that they were so popular and that the RF were snobs who didn't notice what wonderful things that Meg an Harry were doing (or planned to do).

They didn't want to work within the framework of the RF, so presumably that meant that they didn't like the charity work that the RF were doing.. or they would have been happy enough to stay within the job that the family had allocated them.
And there are lots of things they can do.. if they want to... they spent a day or 2 delivering food, they could have found some charity where they could pack meals for people.. they could phone up lonely old people who are isolated by the Virus... There are things they could do, if they wanted to...

 

[Osipi]

I thought that was the whole idea of Finding Freedom. They thought that the RF were annoyed that they were so popular and that the RF were snobs who didn't notice what wonderful things that Meg an Harry were doing (or planned to do).

From where I sit, it wasn't the work that they would be doing within the "Firm's" parameters that was the problem. It was also being able to do things their way and in their own interests that didn't mesh with the "Firm" that created the either/or problem. I would imagine that if back in the 70s, Charles decided he wanted to open a factory making a product that was totally staffed by single, unwed mothers, the "Firm" would have put a kibosh on that right quick. It was a matter of what they wanted to do separate from the "Firm: that proved to be a conflict of interest.

They didn't want to work within the framework of the RF, so presumably that meant that they didn't like the charity work that the RF were doing.. or they would have been happy enough to stay within the job that the family had allocated them.
And there are lots of things they can do.. if they want to... they spent a day or 2 delivering food, they could have found some charity where they could pack meals for people.. they could phone up lonely old people who are isolated by the Virus... There are things they could do, if they wanted to...

How do we know they're not doing this? If its not in the Daily Mail, it never happened?

 

[Eskimo]

coverage of this book's contents has been really quiet in the UK's serious news channels. i wonder if they were asked to keep quiet given that it would be the final nail in the coffin for the sussexes.

I’m not seeing much coverage in the US media as well.

 

[US Royal Watcher]

I would imagine that if back in the 70s, Charles decided he wanted to open a factory making a product that was totally staffed by single, unwed mothers, the "Firm" would have put a kibosh on that right quick. It was a matter of what they wanted to do separate from the "Firm: that proved to be a conflict of interest.

that doesn't ring true to me. The Prince's Trust was established to help criminal offenders, which would be equivalent of helping unwed mothers. The "men in gray suits" weren't thrilled when Diana wanted to help those with AIDS, which was controversial at the time.

It's hard to really know what they wanted because "Finding Freedom" doesn't explain it. I can't imagine that they were shut down for wanting to do charity work. It's possible that they wanted to get more involved in political issues, which would have been problematic.

However, I think the issue was overshadowing Charles and William. I suspect that the Queen and Charles didn't want them to have their own court because they didn't want more incidents like the media release that took the headlines from Charles's very important trip to the Middle East.

As for what they could be doing right now, I agree that personal appearances are out, but they could be making virtual appearances, like the royal family is.

 

[Osipi]

Whooops. You're right with Charles' aim of the Prince's Trust. I didn't think that example through thoroughly enough it seems.

So basically what we're stuck with now is Harry and Meghan wanting to "find freedom" and everything and anything coming out in books that point to a possible reason for "finding freedom" but so far, there's no concrete explanation as to what their personal "freedom" includes.

Makes for interesting discussion though eh?

 

[evolvingdoors]

Yes, there are quotes from that letter, in chapter 16 "Mum's the Word".

Are these the same as the parts published by the MoS? Or brand new quotes?

 

[Betsypaige]

Of course not alienate him. I think he could rein in the money a bit. I know, I know, it’s his money to do as he wants. I wonder, at times, if he’s ever put his foot down. It appears H and M require a certain lifestyle and that Charles is their favorite banker.

Harry seems to do whatever he wants without regard of another’s feelings or ever having any consequences... Does he really have ambition (or is it newly found) with his holier than thou sermons on how people should live. Reminds me of Mel Brooks’ line, “it’s good to be king”.

I understand where you’re coming from Bestypaige about losing something with regards to Charles. Who I see emerging publicly is a spoiled, immature, over indulged man child that Charles has probably always known. I believe Charles has bent over backwards for this son.

No matter how you try to protect something or someone, sadly, there are times you find it was never yours to lose. Yes, different opinion, I think Harry is Charles’ Achilles heel. The only thing I see Charles having any give with is the money...

Maybe Harry thinks he can be a King of sorts in America, lol, because people will ooh and ah a real, honest to goodness Prince living in America, lol. I certainly believe that’s why they have so many celebrity friends!

If Charles was soft with the boys, it’s because they lost their mother... but, that’s for another thread. I feel sorry for him because I’m sure he’s hurt from the things said in the book.

 

[ACO]

Meghan has some celebrity friends because she was in that business. Heck the royals have plenty of celebrity friends themselves. Not sure why is it apparently only a sin for the Sussxes, but especially Meghan who had some of them pre royal life.

 

[Betsypaige]

It is fascinating that Meghan was on this earth for 35 years before she entered the royal bubble. It was only then that suddenly she was apparently this evil, manipulative, ruthless diva despite plenty of people who personally knew and worked with her didn’t have the same view of her. She comes to the UK fold and her entire life has been rewritten.

It’s really stuff like that that has many people not really taking a lot of stuff said by the press seriously. Also why people have interesting opinions of the media in relation to her. She was hardly a blank slate. Do I think she is perfect? Nope. Do I think she can be a bitch? Of course. Do I also believe a lot of the coverage has an agenda? Yep.

If you already don’t like someone it doesn’t take much for you to believe anything negative about them whether true or not. And the same on the other end. People are biased whether we want to admit it or not. So plenty times the truth doesn’t even matter to people once their minds are made up.

So at the end of the day no one truly knows what’s accurate besides those who were there. And how people interact with all in the future likely won’t be revealing either. People who work with them speak highly of the members of the royal family, including Harry and Meghan. I don’t see that changing much.

Sure she had friends and people who liked her, but that doesn’t mean there weren’t people who didn’t like her. Leopards don’t change their spots. Of course Meghan has good qualities, but she’s also shown some of her very worst since the Africa interview.

I liked M a lot and defended her - my posts showing such are all over this board. Post-Africa, I changed my mind...people do that, so I disagree that they mostly make up their minds and dig in their heels, never listening to other POVs and considering they may be wrong.

This is what happens when you have two people who are never told NO.

Actually, this all happened because they WERE told NO... they ditched the restrictive life of Royalty for freedom in America, lol

I’m not seeing much coverage in the US media as well.

There hasn’t been....the media here has much more to focus in than self-exiled Royals...

Meghan has some celebrity friends because she was in that business. Heck the royals have plenty of celebrity friends themselves. Not sure why is it apparently only a sin for the Sussxes, but especially Meghan who had some of them pre royal life.

That’s fair...

 

[poppy7]

Megjan appears.to have had an amazing capacity to make well connected,.rich friends.

Book is progressing for me
Everyone loves Meghan..Eugenie loved Meghan. No word on what Meghan thought of her but the relationship leak did come from Andrew and Eugenie's office and Eugenie was one of the first to know. I don't know what that is supposed to insinuate.

Harry has a dreadful temper but Meghan is calm and tempered about things.

How can there be so much about how everyone loves Meghan but to be honest there isn't much of what she thinks of people.

Also I just hear her voice. Not Harry. I do wonder whether this is really just her book after all.

Loads of more ridiculousness about money, consumerism and private planes while discussing their environmental interests.

Kate...well Kate. Uninterested in meeting Meghan. And very guarded when they met. It is all in what is said to be honest.

Pippa and Carole were worried Meghan would upstage Pippa. But to be honest I wouldn't have gone to the wedding ceremony knowing the press just wanted pics of me. Anyway she eventually went to reception but they couldn't even sit together because Pippa mixed people and couples up.on the tables. Boo hiss mean Pippa.

 

[Fem]

I find the portrayal of Catherine really interesting in this book. It seems to me (at least the book leaves that impression) that Meghan wanted to connect, be BFFs and get the lay of the land from Catherine, but when it didn't happen, instead of just asking for help she got offended and that was it for this relationship.

Also we finally get confirmation that they really did announce the pregnancy at Eugenie and Jack's wedding. The authors tried to put it in a more favorable light, but there's really no world in which this would look good. It was Eugenie's day, the one day when the whole thing was about her and her husband and the Sussexes made it all about them. I hope she at least got an apology


What is missing from the book? I'd love the authors' perspective on "What Meghan wants, Meghan gets" quote. And I noticed how they didn't even touch the issue of the messed up birth announcement and a few other gaffs that happened.

 

[Betsypaige]

I find the portrayal of Catherine really interesting in this book. It seems to me (at least the book leaves that impression) that Meghan wanted to connect, be BFFs and get the lay of the land from Catherine, but when it didn't happen, instead of just asking for help she got offended and that was it for this relationship.

Also we finally get confirmation that they really did announce the pregnancy at Eugenie and Jack's wedding. The authors tried to put it in a more favorable light, but there's really no world in which this would look good. It was Eugenie's day, the one day when the whole thing was about her and her husband and the Sussexes made it all about them. I hope she at least got an apology


What is missing from the book? I'd love the authors' perspective on "What Meghan wants, Meghan gets" quote. And I noticed how they didn't even touch the issue of the messed up birth announcement and a few other gaffs that happened.

Americans are generally considered to be more out-going and open than the British or even other Europeans, so maybe Meghan was expecting Kate to be like her. That said, even in America it’s considered rude and pushy to try and force a friendship...and of course PLENTY of Americans are introverted and shy (like me). Meghan wanting to connect with Kate isn’t a bad thing, but judging her and taking offense because Kate couldn’t be what M wanted is unfair and nasty.

Announcing the pregnancy at Eugenie’s wedding is the height of arrogance, obnoxiousness and rudeness. H and M didn’t make a mistake, they made a choice. Even if they apologized, I would have a hard time forgiving them.

 

[Alison H]

It's no secret that Prince Philip found things difficult at first. In some ways, it was even harder for him, because he had to pack in his naval career after 4 years, when he'd expected another 20 years. But he carved his own niche, especially with the D of E award scheme.


There was so much Harry and Meghan could have done. Take the Grenfell Tower community cookbooks - working with mainly black, mainly female survivors of the Grenfell Tower fire. Meghan did a great job with that. It raised a lot of money - and, without Meghan's patronage, I doubt it would have raised nearly as much, because it just wouldn't have got the publicity. But she and Harry opted out.

 

[Heavs]

Kate has always been said to be fairly shy and reserved with people she doesn't know.

I think they are two very different women from very different backgrounds, and different perspectives. Which is the case for many in laws in general and we all discussed at the time.

When they met Kate had small children and her duties and her own family issues and was wary of Meghan. Or any very new girlfriend, especially one in a long distance relationship. Which is understandable (and if she had started to become chummy the contents of those conversations would probably now be in this book, interpreted in the worst way possible as well). Also understandable is Meghan wanted to get the lay of the land/need to know gossip from Kate and being disappointed when it didn't happen.

When they got engaged and married Kate was pregnant and dealing with her usual HG, which certainly can't have helped. I don't think there was anything mentioned in the book that should have caused longterm offense, not even the shopping trip.

The wedding vs pregnancy announcement issue is one of those incidents that Scobie could have used to balance the whole thing out a bit, but no. It's "their mini oopsie but they had to, there was no other time to do it" which is BS. And if Eugenie had done it she would have been torn to shreds in this book.

 

[Sun Lion]

Thanks to the posters who have the book who are sharing their insights.

Very much appreciated.

 

[Fem]

Thanks to the posters who have the book who are sharing their insights.

Very much appreciated.

If you have any questions about the book shoot, I'll try to answer!

 

[caethi]

The Devil's Advocate:

They tried. They tried hard.
But you cannot change what will not be changed, however yesteryear it is.

H&M had a choice: To either remain in a system that was suffocating for visionaries and that didn't utilize their full potential. A deeply conservative and ever more globally irrelevant system.

Or to provide and work within an alternative. I.e. not focus on national issues within the narrow confines of the BRF, but set up their own, global and globally relevant, alternative, that could easily co-operate with the BRF, in particular W&K - without "overshadowing them."

Meghan and Harry are not "visionaries" in my view. They may have altruistic aims, they may genuinely want to make a better, more socially just world, but that does not make them visionaries. As a couple they had 18 months in a system and then gave up on it. If they were true visionaries, they would have found a way to stay and inspire change from the inside. In my view, their quest for "Freedom" had little to do with their life goals and everything to do with their personalities.

 

[caethi]

Americans are generally considered to be more out-going and open than the British or even other Europeans, so maybe Meghan was expecting Kate to be like her. That said, even in America it’s considered rude and pushy to try and force a friendship...and of course PLENTY of Americans are introverted and shy (like me). Meghan wanting to connect with Kate isn’t a bad thing, but judging her and taking offense because Kate couldn’t be what M wanted is unfair and nasty.

Announcing the pregnancy at Eugenie’s wedding is the height of arrogance, obnoxiousness and rudeness. H and M didn’t make a mistake, they made a choice. Even if they apologized, I would have a hard time forgiving them.

Agree and agree.

 

[caethi]

Megjan appears.to have had an amazing capacity to make well connected,.rich friends.

Book is progressing for me
Everyone loves Meghan..Eugenie loved Meghan. No word on what Meghan thought of her but the relationship leak did come from Andrew and Eugenie's office and Eugenie was one of the first to know. I don't know what that is supposed to insinuate.

Also I just hear her voice. Not Harry. I do wonder whether this is really just her book after all.

.

From another source, I read that Eugenie and Harry are said to have been very close. If she was "in the know" it might have been a natural consequence of a close friendship with her cousin.



The only voice I hear when either of them speaks is Meghan's voice. I find that sad.

 

[QueenMathilde]

OK. I'll bite on this one. Just *how* are they drawing money from the "Firm" still? Last I checked, no one ever gets a paycheck from the "Firm" to start with.

Credible sources to back your answer up too please. ?

Their money comes from Charles. Charles gets his money one way or another from the taxpayer. It's either money they skimmed through the centuries or money from the Duchy which would revert back to the taxpayer if there wasn't a royal family. None of them work with the exception of an Andrew who gets a Military pension or one of the married ons who came into the marriage with their own money. The civil list is a shell game.


If Charles weren't POW he wouldn't have much money.

Thanks to the posters who have the book who are sharing their insights.

Very much appreciated.

I agree. I don't want to spend the money on any of the books. Besides Mail Online is putting out enough excerpts I don't have to read it.

 

[Sun Lion]

If you have any questions about the book shoot, I'll try to answer!

Fantastic Fem, much appreciated.

Does your version have the photos .... are there any new/unique photos included, or are they what we’ve seen before?

Can you share some information about The Queen’s jewel cabinet, that I believe is in the book.

And I’ve seen it reported that the Cambridge’s home is described in some detail - I’m assuming it’s Anmer Hall - and something about William and Kate’s photos.

Any details will be great, thanks again.

 

[duchessrachel]

The more I read the more I'm struck by how H&M vigorously claim they are entitled to privacy for themselves but have breached a lot of people's privacy in this book by including a lot of detail of private conversations, locations etc. Whether that has been given directly to the authors or the authors have picked it up from friends and other "sources" what is clear is that H&M are happy to tell private details about themselves and others to an impossibly wide circle of people whilst at the same time acting upset and hurt when those details make their way into the media.

Its rather like I said before in regards to them feeling they have their right to happiness yet causing untold upset and sadness to their families by allowing this book to go ahead - very much "we deserve this but others don't" and "do as we say not as we do" seems to permeate through the book.

I.e:
why shouldn't we be allowed to overshadow W&K, C&C and even HM vs its okay for us to overshadow Eugenie on her big day

The men in grey suits are so mean and horrible vs HM who employs them and trusts them to represent her is so lovely and understanding

We had no support at all vs HM gave Meghan a master class in being Royal, Meghan talked to so many people about protocol and etiquette and William fought for them to have their own court and independence

Personally I believe the high level of personal detail is meant as a sig that H&M have - in whatever way - gone along with the book.

I agree. At the very least Harry should be raising sand about his brother and sister-in-law's privacy being compromised by this book. But he remains silent. They may say they did not participate in this book, but their actions tell a different story. I would be incensed if I were William and Catherine.

 

[duchessrachel]

True Kate is taking most of the incoming. But again everyone is taking a hit one way or another. With complaints of Harry and Meghan not suing I don't see any member of the BRF unleashing the lawyers and some members have sued before. Either they have to prove Harry and Meghan talked to Scobie and Durand or the Sussexes gave permission for the friends to talk. Or the BRF continue to use their press contacts to put out their side.

But we're getting bits and pieces. I would like to read the book entirely to put it all together.

I think the RF won't sue because it will just exacerbate the tension already between them and H&M.

I don't plan to read it either.
Though in a sense, I feel I have read it, since so much has been reported about it.
Sounds like a combination of a hatchet job and a puff piece, so I'll pass.

I'm looking forward to the Lacey book; hopefully it will give a more balanced view.

What book is this?

IF (big IF for some) H&M have been involved with the book then they have been quite clever as there is really no way for the RF to hit back - any direct reaction from the RF or those around them would get H&M to point to his being the RF being unkind, trashing them in the media etc, on the other hand they get their side of the story out to the public whilst being able to claim they had nothing to do with it. Whichever may it plays they "win" (as I believe they'd see it)

That is in part why I think the RF are basically ignoring the book - don't let it seem like you are bothered and just keep going on ignoring it rather than giving more fuel for the fire.

Exactly, never complain never explain.

 

[Betsypaige]

Agree and agree.

Thanks, and speaking of agreeing,

Meghan and Harry are not "visionaries" in my view. They may have altruistic aims, they may genuinely want to make a better, more socially just world, but that does not make them visionaries. As a couple they had 18 months in a system and then gave up on it. If they were true visionaries, they would have found a way to stay and inspire change from the inside. In my view, their quest for "Freedom" had little to do with their life goals and everything to do with their personalities.

This!

You know who’s a visionary? Charles - he’s been ahead of the curve on several issues, and he was mocked for his views at the time. Harry and Meghan jump on the bandwagon of the issue du jour...they don’t bring anything new or interesting to the mix.