Finding Freedom: Harry and Meghan and the Making of A Modern Royal Family

[ACO]

It really is just different sides of the same coin...

 

[Pranter]

But you are so gleeful to rebuke them, so i guess it's well balanced

I am willing to call a spade a spade yes.


LaRae

 

[Denville]

The answer is target markets.

The book is intended for the American audience, because that is where H&M want to build their “brand”. They come across as spoiled and petulant in the articles about the book in the UK media- I’m not sure it will play out that way in the US. They might come off as victims of the BRF and establishment, which will garner them the sympathy and help brand building— the whole point in broadcasting their side of the story.

I think its possible that the idea that they "didn't want to be old fashioned and stuffy royals, doing the bidding of the Palace and the older royals" might gain them some points in the US, when they also have the glamour of BEING part of a royal family.. But I dont know if its enough for people to pay large sums of money to them.

 

[Denville]

This is all true...Like you said, who ever was criticizing her ? She was pretty much unknown...a mediocre actress on a not popular show. I can’t imagine she was talked or written about then, so I doubt she was paranoid about that sort of thing...although I do believe she craved that kind of attention.

I don’t know why Harry cares so much...maybe because Meghan does. In any case, if they didn’t care, if they just did their thing, they wouldn’t have such silly and unrealistic expectations of the BRF feuding with the media. How does he not understand this?

I think Harry craves attention too.. I've said this before, so wont repeat it but I think it wasn't such a big thing with him previously but it seemed to come out when he gradually started being a full time royal. Perhaps he's not aware of it.. but it may spring from his being a younger son.. or maybe from the trauma of his Mum's death? I don't know. I think that for many years he was mixed up by his mother's death but he suppressed it and according to himself was angry and unhappy. He probably buried himself in army life and having fun. Then he had therapy, tried to confront it but maybe he is actually more unhappy now that he's facing it and hasn't got the army to keep him so busy any more...
And I think the younger son factor has only begun to bite now in the past few years. HE can see that his grandmother is now very old, his father wil be king in due course. And William is now a mature man with a family and on the way to being POW. And he's realizing that he's not quite the young popular Harry any more.. but he wotn have the compensation of being King later...
..
Perhaps that's why he rushed itnto marriage with Meghan. She seemed to love him, she seemed happy with him and would make up for the loss of his mother and his "only being a second son"...and they'd have a family and be a still popular couple. But it didn't work out so well. She didn't get good press, he was still liked but I think it wasn't enough for him.. and when Meg was also unhappy, he got more wound up and miserable and angry.

 

[Denville]

I disagree, especially with Meghan. From even when she was a little girl, she was acutely aware of inequality and actually persuaded a retail giant to change their commercials. That is not a bad thing in and of itself, but it IS when she chooses to get involved with the son of the future King. I do stand by my previous comments, although I will admit that in this regard, I think Harry likely just follows his wife.

Yeah most people are socialists when they are young.. but most people get less radical as they get older. I think that yes Harry (while he's not a card carrying Tory) just didn't think much about politics and didn't know much about them.. but Meghan has the "standard set of Democrat attitudes" and she's passed them on to hm. And maybe he reckons that now he's out of the RF, he can talk a bit more freely on these issues.
however with regard to Meghan, I think that (whatever she was like as a kid) nowadays, she may have some sincere desire to do some good, but - a lot of it is a bout the red carpet and ego gratifying nature of charity work. If they had really had a strong dislike of the inegalitarian nature of royalty, and had felt "we want to get out of here with all the grey men and rules and curtsies and so on... and do some real good for people in need".. they would have left, bought a house somewhere and lived on the income they had..and had a GREAT opportunity to do hands on good for the poor and needy...

 

[Denville]

There did appear to be genuine affection on the part of both Charles and Meghan, although obviously a picture doesn't tell the whole story. Supporting her when her father was causing chaos was lovely. And the Queen also took her on a joint engagement early on and gave them both important jobs with an international outlook and there's been nothing particularly concrete in this book about why it crumbled beyond the petty and trivial even from people who say they've read the whole thing. That's partly what's confusing to me. Lightweight has many royal "tell alls" are I expected a bit more. Especially about the sudden announcement of it all.

Eugenie liked all the official "Happy Birthday" posts on Instagram but did not post anything publicly herself.

Is.

No i don't think they'll sue whatever the truth is. I think they are realising now with the other case that suing doesn't end well a lot of the time and they might drop that case.
I think yes that Meg in the bath and Harry and the queen must have some basis in Omid being told by SOMONE some kind of a story about what happened. Its possible that Omid had ot use his imagination on the "how they felt about each other".. but not the Meg in the bath story! (I Think that in books about royals there's usually a bit of exercising imagination about "how the couple felt and how much they loved each other)
Re Charles etc. I think that he was prepared to like Meg, and may have started off liking her.. and hoping that she was a woman who could make Harry happy.. But I think that due to her family's having been so awful, and her father not turning up, the RF and Charles particularly HAD To be seen making a big effort to welcome her. She was in a new country, she wasnt used to royal life, and had not had time to make friends or a support system, so they had to be seen as welcoming her...)

I Don't know.. I sort of feel that Charles was friendly, hoped that this would be a good thing, for H and for the RF and was willing to welcome and befriend her and was glad that she seemed confident and outgoing.. but I can't imagine that the liking persisted very long.....
It does seem that within a short time, Meghan was (perhaps innocently) showing that she didn't understand how things were done and wasn't all that tactful in showing it and probably Harry got shirty, they withdrew and the RF also retreated from being very friendly...

 

[Denville]

We saw it on the screen - not only did Charles walk her down the aisle, but he was very warm towards Doria...

I think they expected the BRF to go to war with the media over their treatment of Meghan.....expectations that were always unfair and unrealistic. The problem is that both H and M care way too much what people think; they read articles about themselves as well as comments on social media. For anyone in the public spotlight, that’s a bad idea.

It is a bit like Diana. Although it was more understandable that she should care what the press and public thought. But aides said that they told her not to read the papers but she did. And then started to try and manipulate her press image...

 

[Betsypaige]

The answer is target markets.

The book is intended for the American audience, because that is where H&M want to build their “brand”. They come across as spoiled and petulant in the articles about the book in the UK media- I’m not sure it will play out that way in the US. They might come off as victims of the BRF and establishment, which will garner them the sympathy and help brand building— the whole point in broadcasting their side of the story.

As far as I can tell, no one in the States gives a bleep about Harry, Meghan or the book. Of course they have their fans, but they’re just segments on Entertainment Tonight; even in better days, they were never making the evening news or headlines. H and M are completely irrelevant, not that they were ever relevant even in the best of circumstances. Their fans will buy the book, but why would anyone else want to read a book that is essentially a list of complaints by rich, entitled people who live off of their celebrity “friends”?

 

[Betsypaige]

Yeah most people are socialists when they are young.. but most people get less radical as they get older. I think that yes Harry (while he's not a card carrying Tory) just didn't think much about politics and didn't know much about them.. but Meghan has the "standard set of Democrat attitudes" and she's passed them on to hm. And maybe he reckons that now he's out of the RF, he can talk a bit more freely on these issues.
however with regard to Meghan, I think that (whatever she was like as a kid) nowadays, she may have some sincere desire to do some good, but - a lot of it is a bout the red carpet and ego gratifying nature of charity work. If they had really had a strong dislike of the inegalitarian nature of royalty, and had felt "we want to get out of here with all the grey men and rules and curtsies and so on... and do some real good for people in need".. they would have left, bought a house somewhere and lived on the income they had..and had a GREAT opportunity to do hands on good for the poor and needy...

I’m a Democrat, so I’m sure I probably agree with her on most things, but yes, I’m sure that’s true about Harry feeling like he’s been freed to some degree. Though, personally I can’t take him seriously anymore as I find him self-righteous and hypocritical...not to mention annoying.

I agree with your last point. I’ve said it before, they’re so desperate for privacy that they left the quiet of Canada for the paparazzi capital of LA, specifically Beverly Hills? For those saying that Doria is there, they could have moved anywhere in the area, not BH. I think Harry and Meghan also wanted to be around their celebrity friends.....for many reasons.

 

[Lee-Z]

For some reason i keep seeing a Hollywood mini-series in the making...
"The Crown: Finding Freedom"

 

[Helen.CH]

The answer is target markets.

The book is intended for the American audience, because that is where H&M want to build their “brand”. They come across as spoiled and petulant in the articles about the book in the UK media- I’m not sure it will play out that way in the US. They might come off as victims of the BRF and establishment, which will garner them the sympathy and help brand building— the whole point in broadcasting their side of the story.

Know what- I am beginning to wonder what will happen next, another book, interviews, talkshows, homestories with H&M? if the book is what it looks like at the moment and turns out to damage their image, how will those two immature personalities react. If they really thought the book would help them or their pov was shown and widely accepted by the audience what are they going to do once they realize it goes the wrong way.
Things got worse since they left, time will if they follow this path of leaking more and more especially as they have little more to offer than stories about the RF.

 

[ACO]

Meghan nor Harry are Canadian citizens. They couldn’t just stay there. Meghan and Archie are Americans though. Also they can stay where they like. Honestly we haven’t seen that much of them... COVID or not.

As for people not caring? I would agree. Overall I don’t think really care about celebrity or royalty in general until something interesting happens. So I don’t know if people would show up to see her speak at event until that actually happens. The same way I have zero idea how the U.K. public would react if either returned until we see it.

People claimed no one would care and the reaction would hostile when they did their final engagements and that was far from true. We just have zero idea.

Time will tell though.

 

[Denville]

Meghan nor Harry are Canadian citizens. They couldn’t just stay there. Meghan and Archie are Americans though. Also they can stay where they like. Honestly we haven’t seen that much of them... COVID or not.

As for people not caring? I would agree. Overall I don’t think really care about celebrity or royalty in general until something interesting happens. So I don’t know if people would show up to see her speak at event until that actually happens. The same way I have zero idea how the U.K. public would react if either returned until we see it.

People claimed no one would care and the reaction would hostile when they did their final engagements and that was far from true. We just have zero idea.

Time will tell though.

so why did they go there if they are not Canadians?

As far as I can tell, no one in the States gives a bleep about Harry, Meghan or the book. Of course they have their fans, but they’re just segments on Entertainment Tonight; even in better days, they were never making the evening news or headlines. H and M are completely irrelevant, not that they were ever relevant even in the best of circumstances. Their fans will buy the book, but why would anyone else want to read a book that is essentially a list of complaints by rich, entitled people who live off of their celebrity “friends”?

All the more reason for them to need to build up a base. If they are going to work there they will need people to buy what they have on offer...

 

[ACO]

so why did they go there if they are not Canadians?

Why not? They went for vacation and extended their trip. People are allowed to visit places. You can even temporarily stay. You can’t stay long term without getting a visa. Canada limit is 6 months. Neither being citizens made it complicated. But maybe they initially intended to stay longer. Covid changed a lot of plans.

 

[Denville]

I’m a Democrat, so I’m sure I probably agree with her on most things, but yes, I’m sure that’s true about Harry feeling like he’s been freed to some degree. Though, personally I can’t take him seriously anymore as I find him self-righteous and hypocritical...not to mention annoying.

I agree with your last point. I’ve said it before, they’re so desperate for privacy that they left the quiet of Canada for the paparazzi capital of LA, specifically Beverly Hills? For those saying that Doria is there, they could have moved anywhere in the area, not BH. I think Harry and Meghan also wanted to be around their celebrity friends.....for many reasons.

Yes but if you are left of centre, sincerely so, you usually want to get rid of institutions like the RF.. or reform them radically. I Can't see any sign that Meg wanted that. She was quite happy to have the expensive dresses, to take the title and to borrow the tiara etc etc. I don't think it bothered her to be part of the RF in itself, she was happy enough to curtsy away to senior royals and so on.. as long as she was getting the comfortable lifestyle from it. But I think she misread things, and thought that the being part of the RF would mean that she got public adulation and never got criticized and didn't realise that the Press is always ready to bash the rich and the royals...
so she was rich and famous, she had the comfortable and luxurious lifestyle... but she wanted more. She was finding she was not immune from criticism. Perhaps she was a little bit irritated that she would have been warned that she would have to keep her political views to herself, and stick to non controversial viewpoints in public. but again I don't know if it mattered all that much to her in itself.

Perhaps she just saw the whole RF as quaint but its oddities didn't bother her because she felt that she could essentially do as she liked all the same. She didn't maybe take the strictures too seriously. But she found that she could not just do things as she chose, that the Press was not that nice to her, that the RF were maybe a bit snooty at times in private, she began to get angry and feel that if she got out of the RF as a fulltime thing, and went off to the US she had the best of both worlds.
They'd still have tax payer funded security, they'd come back for a few weeks to do engagements, and in the meantime they could make money, do glitzy charity stuff, say controversial things if they wanted to...
I suspect that maybe she saw it like a hiatus from a steady TV show.. where she could go and star in a movie during the off time...

Why not? They went for vacation and extended their trip. People are allowed to visit places. You can even temporarily stay. You can’t stay long term without getting a visa. Canada limit is 6 months. Neither being citizens made it complicated. But maybe they initially intended to stay longer. Covid changed a lot of plans.

But they could have stayed there if they wanted. Just they'd have to abide by the normal rules of getting work permits and permission to live there... But unfortunatley the Canadian govt withdrew the free secuirty....

 

[ACO]

They paying security now so would that had really mattered? They could have payed it there too. In fact we know they left before Canada even pulled their security, so clearly that was not the issue.

Yes they could have stayed there. Maybe they would have but let’s not pretend a lot of things happened including a global pandemic. It’s clear they wanted to be near family — so it was either his or hers. They picked hers.

 

[Denville]

They paying security now so would that had really mattered? They could have payed it there too. In fact we know they left before Canada even pulled their security, so clearly that was not the issue.

Yes they could have stayed there. Maybe they would have but let’s not pretend a lot of things happened including a global pandemic. It’s clear they wanted to be near family — so it was either his or hers. They picked hers.

I think it did matter. They chose Canada probably because it was a cheaper place to settle initially but near enough to the US to work there. And Trudeau gave them free security for a time.. as a courtesy. When the COvid struck and they had no doubt been warned that the free security would stop, and that travel would be forbidden soon...they headed for LA where they had probably wanted to be all along

 

[Betsypaige]

Yes but if you are left of centre, sincerely so, you usually want to get rid of institutions like the RF.. or reform them radically. I Can't see any sign that Meg wanted that. She was quite happy to have the expensive dresses, to take the title and to borrow the tiara etc etc. I don't think it bothered her to be part of the RF in itself, she was happy enough to curtsy away to senior royals and so on.. as long as she was getting the comfortable lifestyle from it. But I think she misread things, and thought that the being part of the RF would mean that she got public adulation and never got criticized and didn't realise that the Press is always ready to bash the rich and the royals...
so she was rich and famous, she had the comfortable and luxurious lifestyle... but she wanted more. She was finding she was not immune from criticism. Perhaps she was a little bit irritated that she would have been warned that she would have to keep her political views to herself, and stick to non controversial viewpoints in public. but again I don't know if it mattered all that much to her in itself.

Perhaps she just saw the whole RF as quaint but its oddities didn't bother her because she felt that she could essentially do as she liked all the same. She didn't maybe take the strictures too seriously. But she found that she could not just do things as she chose, that the Press was not that nice to her, that the RF were maybe a bit snooty at times in private, she began to get angry and feel that if she got out of the RF as a fulltime thing, and went off to the US she had the best of both worlds.
They'd still have tax payer funded security, they'd come back for a few weeks to do engagements, and in the meantime they could make money, do glitzy charity stuff, say controversial things if they wanted to...
I suspect that maybe she saw it like a hiatus from a steady TV show.. where she could go and star in a movie during the off time...

With all due respect, that is your opinion that being “left of center” equates to being Republican. I don’t want to take this off-topic, so I’ll just end it by saying that I disagree about Meghan; from what I’ve read, she did want create a revolution from within. I DO agree that she and Harry both wanted the easy part of Royalty, the lavish lifestyle and privileges, without the hard part.

 

[Denville]

I never said any such thing if you mean it in the American sense of Republican Party... If you mean preferring a republic to a monarchy, yes Id say most left of centre people would prefer a republic...

 

[Alison H]

Who knows what Meghan did or didn't expect? But surely Harry, after being a member of the Royal Family all his life, should, by his mid-30s, have known exactly how things worked.

 

[HighGoalHighDreams]

Although the lawsuits are being discussed elsewhere, it is worth noting in this discussion that the latest ruling in what we refer to as the “Daily Mail” suit calls out Meghan for leaking confidential information directly to Omid Scobie.

Again, there is another thread that discusses why this was done, the legal implications, etc. I am sure there will be those who say that just because Meghan leaked information to him about her ongoing high-stakes lawsuit, that is no reason to think she would leak information for a book. Think what you will.

 

[ACO]

Her attorney 100% did give info about the suit to friendly reporters for coverage but it wasn't just Omid. I remember other reporters posting the same info. Victoria Murphy being one of them. Jack from Newsweek being another but I am not surprised MOS focused on Omid -- if I were them I would too as his name is in the media currently.

The 20 page document also highlighted how the MOS purposely mislead their information. They even went to print with info before it was even officially available in court notes... all for clicks. Both sides playing too much out in the media.

It was wise for the judge to put an end to that (for now). And funny enough the coverage of this ruling was pretty straightforward. But that was to be expected.

Also her attorney was Johnny Depp's. He did the same in his case too. Media games.

 

[HighGoalHighDreams]

I’m not sure whether or not the MOS focused on Omid. I don’t/ can’t open the DM website because it doesn’t allow ad blockers. I read the document myself and haven’t actually read any coverage.

There is a wonderful discussion to be had about what both sides did and the judge putting a stop to it, [...] What’s relevant here, for this book discussion, is that yes: Meghan does in fact give information directly to Scobie in order for it to be published to paint her in a favorable light.

 

[poppy7]

Her attorney 100% did give info about the suit to friendly reporters for coverage but it wasn't just Omid. I remember other reporters posting the same info. Victoria Murphy being one of them. Jack from Newsweek being another but I am not surprised MOS focused on Omid -- if I were them I would too as his name is in the media currently.

The 20 page document also highlighted how the MOS purposely mislead their information. They even went to print with info before it was even officially available in court notes... all for clicks. Both sides playing too much out in the media.

It was wise for the judge to put an end to that (for now). And funny enough the coverage of this ruling was pretty straightforward. But that was to be expected.

Also her attorney was Johnny Depp's. He did the same in his case too. Media games.

Mmm this is not the place for it but that isn't quite true. Meghan's solicitors would be leaking. Sherborne is the barrister and has actually been hired by the solicitors.

Sherborne is a savvy media barrister but he isn't really known for his games with the press. Seeing as he is the one who took them to court in Levenson.

That Meghan has leaked to the press in the past is an own goal. Games of court. Something happens once more likely to happen again.

 

[Heavs]

Having just quickly looked the DM site they don't mention anything about Omid Scobie at all. Just a brief article saying that the friends will remain anonymous for now.

It mostly seems to be social media and forum users that quickly picked up that Omid Scobie was explicitly named as someone who was given direct inside scoop by Megan and her solicitors within minutes of the hearings and therefore adds a lot more impartial weight to the idea that they gave information directly to him for this book in the same way, even if it wasn't face to face.

 

[Jacknch]

A reminder that we can discuss the book, Finding Freedom, and issues relating to the content of the book in this thread.

Discussion concerning the current Court case and issues relating to, or emanating from, that may be discussed in the https://www.theroyalforums.com/forums/showthread.php?t=46799&goto=newpost.html thread.

What we wish to avoid is discussing the same things in two different threads.

If in doubt, please contact a moderator or administrator by PM for clarification. Thank you.

 

[Betsypaige]

I never said any such thing if you mean it in the American sense of Republican Party... If you mean preferring a republic to a monarchy, yes Id say most left of centre people would prefer a republic...

Yes you did, and it’s pretty obvious I meant Republican in the UK sense. We’ll just have to agree to disagree.

 

[Duchess_Watcher]

"Meghan never considered giving birth at St. Mary's Hospital in London, where Kate delivered all three of her children," reads a report from People about the book's contents. Meghan wanted to deliver somewhere "more discreet," the book claims.

I low how it's "More Discreet". Kate likely had no choice because Prince William is the future King, so is George, and all his kids are direct heirs of William.

 

[Duchess_Watcher]

I agree with the Louis and Charlotte will be treated very differently. They will be far more active imo in their roles.

 

[ACO]

People thought the same of Harry too. Hard to speak of what will happen 20 years into the future but hopefully they have all leaned from that is happening now.