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  #1541  
Old 08-12-2020, 11:12 AM
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Originally Posted by Muhler View Post
Restrictions and limitations are to be stretched and tested. Especially if they are out of date and way too cautious.
It was, it is, time for something new.
Team H&M would have led by example and given half the chance they would have showed the BRF and indeed the world, what they could accomplish.




The BRF has indeed become dusty. It's high time to refresh the whole institution.
With all possible respect for QEII, she won't be around forever, nor will Prince Charles. And a good deal of the popularity of the BRF is personified in QEII.
When she is no more, the growing and vocal republican minority, will gain strength.
You cannot be relevant to an ever more global population and remain in the past at the same time. Going slowly is going nowhere. Serious change must happen already now. Teams H&M and W&K must be positioned already now! Not tomorrow. Now!
Waiting will indeed endanger the BRF.
Unfortunately the senior BRF was too confined, too narrow-minded, too mired in the past to dare realize that and move forward! To follow the lead, the path, H&M had laid out.

Was talking about this earlier (and have before on other formats) ..the class system is on it's way out. Society is becoming less a less tolerating of this type of system as voices for equality (overall not just gender) grow.

I really think some of the push (from the start) against Meghan has more to do about classism than racism.

If the current system of The Firm continues they will be out of operation within 25 years (or less). Other monarchies in Europe have figured out how to balance things to remain relevant even if to a lesser degree.


LaRae
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  #1542  
Old 08-12-2020, 11:12 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Muhler View Post
Restrictions and limitations are to be stretched and tested. Especially if they are out of date and way too cautious.
It was, it is, time for something new.
Team H&M would have led by example and given half the chance they would have showed the BRF and indeed the world, what they could accomplish
The BRF has indeed become dusty. It's high time to refresh the whole institution.
With all possible respect for QEII, she won't be around forever, nor will Prince Charles. And a good deal of the popularity of the BRF is personified in QEII.
When she is no more, the growing and vocal republican minority, will gain strength.
You cannot be relevant to an ever more global population and remain in the past at the same time. Going slowly is going nowhere. Serious change must happen already now. Teams H&M and W&K must be positioned already now! Not tomorrow. Now!
Waiting will indeed endanger the BRF.
Unfortunately the senior BRF was too confined, too narrow-minded, too mired in the past to dare realize that and move forward! To follow the lead, the path, H&M had laid out.
The Cambridge Team is indeed ready and willing. They have formed a nice family and are shouldering (it took a while) their fair share of the Royal burden without complaint and ensuring the Monarchy is relevant, visible and active. They project by far a more relatable image to the public at large and are preparing the way well for their eventual succession. They, and the British public have no need for the couple currently residing in Santa Barbara.

And with regards to republicanism I do not believe it is growing in the UK however, its two greatest assets are without doubt the Sussexes!
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  #1543  
Old 08-12-2020, 11:13 AM
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Originally Posted by Darius1 View Post
I wonder if somebody like Skippy Inskip who is shown in an unfavourable light were to sue where the trail of collaboration with the authors would lead back to?
The book mentions something about the already repairing relations with Skippy and Harry etc.


LaRae
  #1544  
Old 08-12-2020, 11:27 AM
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I wonder if the book will undo that repairing relationship and a few others along the way. Especially if those mentioned feel either H&M have been speaking out or that they have been gossiping about them to others.
  #1545  
Old 08-12-2020, 11:43 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Darius1 View Post
The Cambridge Team is indeed ready and willing. They have formed a nice family and are shouldering (it took a while) their fair share of the Royal burden without complaint and ensuring the Monarchy is relevant, visible and active. They project by far a more relatable image to the public at large and are preparing the way well for their eventual succession. They, and the British public have no need for the couple currently residing in Santa Barbara.

And with regards to republicanism I do not believe it is growing in the UK however, its two greatest assets are without doubt the Sussexes!
That may be. But there ain't much new happening on the W&K front!
It's pretty much: Let's do like our grandparents. It's so 1962!
Where is the drive of team W&K? Where are their visions? Where is the passion for genuine issues that concerns the modern British globalist?
W&K appeals to the traditionalists, the "let everything remain as it always was, when the sun always shined on green England." Their supporters will go extinct and the republicans will multiply.
Forgive me, but team W&K are so dusty and dull. Especially when compared to the passionate and colorful team H&M. Who dares wins, as Meghan would have been reminded off when she went to the SAS course.

H&M dare, where W&K hesitate. H&M dared lead by example. That's the modern way. That's the way to attract would-be republicans. Visions, relevance, drive.

I can well understand that H&M, being visionaries, in their frustration opted out rather than remain in a institutionalized straight-jacket.

- It's dinner time. If anyone wish to take over as the Devil's Advocate I can recommend it. It's fun and actually a little enlightening.
  #1546  
Old 08-12-2020, 11:49 AM
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Originally Posted by tommy100 View Post
IF (big IF for some) H&M have been involved with the book then they have been quite clever as there is really no way for the RF to hit back - any direct reaction from the RF or those around them would get H&M to point to his being the RF being unkind, trashing them in the media etc, on the other hand they get their side of the story out to the public whilst being able to claim they had nothing to do with it. Whichever may it plays they "win" (as I believe they'd see it)

That is in part why I think the RF are basically ignoring the book - don't let it seem like you are bothered and just keep going on ignoring it rather than giving more fuel for the fire.
Ignoring it is the right thing to do anyway. By not taking the bait, they are going to allow this to die as natural a death as possible. If itís going to be kept alive, it will be by Harry, Meghan and/or the authors...and that would just make H and M look worse than they already do.
  #1547  
Old 08-12-2020, 11:52 AM
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Originally Posted by janet14 View Post
My thoughts:-

1. It's really badly written and edited. Does no one proof read at publishers any more? Missing words and ungrammatical sentences that don't make sense + the "fall" for autumn and "gotten" for "got" that make it clear what market it's aimed at.

2. It takes until p306 of a 347p book to get to the "half in , half out" and subsequent exit chapter, which, frankly, is what most people, I think, are interested in. And there's nothing revelatory there - or, really, anywhere in the book.

3. Except (for me) information on the the Queen's jewel vault (about Meghan selecting her wedding tiara from 5 offered). Just a few lines, but I don't remember reading about it before (and am not sure it should have been included).

4. Of course they're not going to sue. There are hundreds of unauthorised books about royals cf Lady Colin Campbell's (which has a blatant lie on the very first page) and , unless they contain material which is so damaging that it's criminally actionable. the RF don't sue.

5. I found it a sad book in many ways, with such potential wasted for what seems small and "get-over-able" reasons..
As to #1, this is the kind of book where no one cares very much about the quality of the writing or grammer. It was rushed through the process to get to the point where it could have been published months ago if not for the pandemic.
  #1548  
Old 08-12-2020, 11:56 AM
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Originally Posted by Heavs View Post
But even if people do pick up this book out of curiosity, interest in gossip or what have you, it doesn't follow that they'll agree with it or that they'll support any future serious money making venture of Harry and Meghan's which is what they'll need if they want to stop living off "The Bank of Dad" and financially independent.
Right. Letís say the book sells incredibly well and the authors make tons of money and Harry and M get lots publicity (and possibly money if the authors promised them)....all that gets them is attention in the very short term and money. It doesnít help them in any way that really counts. I donít think Harry and Meghan won at all.
  #1549  
Old 08-12-2020, 11:57 AM
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Originally Posted by Somebody View Post
I read (but haven't seen it confirmed - so asked those who read whether they could confirm (or deny)) that the book contains parts of her letter to her father. She already sued others over publishing it, so for consistency sake, she should sue these authors as well.

Other than that, I don't think there is a reason to sue if your reporter-friend puts out the story that you apparently want out in the world.
Yes, there are quotes from that letter, in chapter 16 "Mum's the Word".
  #1550  
Old 08-12-2020, 11:59 AM
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Originally Posted by Missjersey View Post
Itís absurd the constant need for attention...

They want to be front and center...

Tempers...I bet they both have. Always thought Harry was catered to growing up (which he still hasnít achieved). Want, want, want, now ďgo fetchĒ. She seems cut from the same cloth...

Who knows what Charles feels. Of course he will say ďdoor is openĒ. I wish he would put his foot down, itís embarrassing to watch him go through this so publicly... you reap what you sow applies to father and son. I like Charles but it seems Harry is his Achilles heel...

With all the toilet talk, a better title perhaps would be ďPissing on my familyĒ...
I donít think thatís fair about Charles...Harry is his son, of course he doesnít want to alienate him. Of everyone involved, he has the most at stake in trying to strike some sort of balance, or at least to understand Hís POV. If he puts his foot down too hard, if he doesnít exhibit empathy or sympathy, if he turns his back completely, he could lose his beloved son..nothing is with that.
  #1551  
Old 08-12-2020, 12:14 PM
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Originally Posted by Muhler View Post
That may be. But there ain't much new happening on the W&K front!
It's pretty much: Let's do like our grandparents. It's so 1962!
Where is the drive of team W&K? Where are their visions? Where is the passion for genuine issues that concerns the modern British globalist?
W&K appeals to the traditionalists, the "let everything remain as it always was, when the sun always shined on green England." Their supporters will go extinct and the republicans will multiply.
Forgive me, but team W&K are so dusty and dull. Especially when compared to the passionate and colorful team H&M. Who dares wins, as Meghan would have been reminded off when she went to the SAS course.

H&M dare, where W&K hesitate. H&M dared lead by example. That's the modern way. That's the way to attract would-be republicans. Visions, relevance, drive.

I can well understand that H&M, being visionaries, in their frustration opted out rather than remain in a institutionalized straight-jacket.

- It's dinner time. If anyone wish to take over as the Devil's Advocate I can recommend it. It's fun and actually a little enlightening.
Personally I felt both ďvisionsĒ were valid and needed. The Cambridges and Sussexes appeal to different types of people. Nothing wrong with that and it was a plus for the BRF. I donít think anyone denies that Meghan made the monarchy appeal to people who usually wouldnít care because representation matters. But thatís done now.

No one has any idea what the future holds for any of them but they will all do whatís best for them and thatís all anyone can do.
  #1552  
Old 08-12-2020, 12:33 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Queen Claude View Post
Camilla Tominey reported that there is a note in the book that does state that the authors "when appropriate" spoke to the Sussexes. Have you come across that blurb yet?
For myself the statement that " when appropriate " they spoke to their HRH's does not confirm that information in the book came directly from their HRH's ,rather that they spoke directly to them at official events . What gives me concern about how "close " the contact was is the statement that the Duchess "gave Mr Scobie a " hug " at the end of such an event .
Have I misses a Tom Bradby comment on the book ?
  #1553  
Old 08-12-2020, 12:57 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Betsypaige View Post
As an American, I feel comfortable saying that this bookís impact is being overrated. Itís not getting any press coverage that I can see - and for good reason: we have rather pressing problems. Plus, Joe Biden announced his Vice President. People all across his country are still without jobs (including me), COVID is still destroying lives, and we have a Presidential election coming up. Even in the best of circumstances, most Americans wouldnít give a fig about Meghan and Harry....their fans would, but no one else. Will people buy it to read and pass the time? Maybe, but if they do, Iím positive that they will not walk away feeling good about H and M.
I am very sorry to hear about your job situation. This entire time has been so difficult. I hope it resolves itself for you soon.

I wouldn't think anyone would care and it is written, when dealing with her, like an aspirational lifestyle blog. But it is obviously aimed at the US market. Even down to Fahrenheit being used. High school. Fall.
  #1554  
Old 08-12-2020, 01:10 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Muhler View Post
That may be. But there ain't much new happening on the W&K front!
It's pretty much: Let's do like our grandparents. It's so 1962!
Where is the drive of team W&K? Where are their visions? Where is the passion for genuine issues that concerns the modern British globalist?
W&K appeals to the traditionalists, the "let everything remain as it always was, when the sun always shined on green England." Their supporters will go extinct and the republicans will multiply.
Forgive me, but team W&K are so dusty and dull. Especially when compared to the passionate and colorful team H&M. Who dares wins, as Meghan would have been reminded off when she went to the SAS course.

H&M dare, where W&K hesitate. H&M dared lead by example. That's the modern way. That's the way to attract would-be republicans. Visions, relevance, drive.

I can well understand that H&M, being visionaries, in their frustration opted out rather than remain in a institutionalized straight-jacket.

- It's dinner time. If anyone wish to take over as the Devil's Advocate I can recommend it. It's fun and actually a little enlightening.
This is interesting and perhaps it would help if I understood exactly what changes Harry and Meghan wanted to make - other than to have their own court and the ability to address the tabloids (apparently by filing more lawsuits). What exactly do they want to do?

Do they want to be more political, them speaking out may be unifying to people who agree with them, but people who disagree would be alienated from the monarchy. Do they want less classism and more economic equality? I would find that a little hard to take from people who are that wealthy, unless they planned to give it up and live a more middle-class lifestyle.

In fact, I don't think Harry and Meghan lead by example. I truly like both but was quite thrown by the African journey interview in which they complained lack of emotional support while visiting some of the poorest, most disadvantaged people of the world. Moreover, as has been discussed, I am offended when I am lectured about reducing my carbon footprint by someone who lives in a mansion, drives around in large gas-guzzlers, and travels extensively on vacations.
  #1555  
Old 08-12-2020, 01:18 PM
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I'm afraid I can't see how Harry and Meghan are leading by either vision or example, other than with the Invictus Games and the Sentebale charity.
  #1556  
Old 08-12-2020, 01:22 PM
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Originally Posted by Betsypaige View Post
Right. Letís say the book sells incredibly well and the authors make tons of money and Harry and M get lots publicity (and possibly money if the authors promised them)....all that gets them is attention in the very short term and money. It doesnít help them in any way that really counts. I donít think Harry and Meghan won at all.
I am following discussions on this book on several boards and one consensus comment about the book stood out to me.

Roughly summarized: This book serves as a warning to anyone who wishes to befriend or collaborate with them in the future-- you will be thrown under the bus when you are no longer useful

If this is true, H&M are losers in the long run because they won't get any people of consequence to work with them or hire them for speeches etc.
  #1557  
Old 08-12-2020, 01:49 PM
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If Meghan says she wants nothing to do with anything Royal ever again; then I think their life now lies in Santa Barbara; does a house in a compound really cost 8 million, with neighbours all around you?

Christmas - they need not return to the UK.
Future weddings - not obligatory.
Funerals - it would look bad if they didn't return to the UK.
Future Coronation/s not necessarily required to return to the UK.

Her father - can't see a way forward with this?

So they might as well make a life for themselves as best they can.
  #1558  
Old 08-12-2020, 01:57 PM
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Originally Posted by US Royal Watcher View Post
This is interesting and perhaps it would help if I understood exactly what changes Harry and Meghan wanted to make - other than to have their own court and the ability to address the tabloids (apparently by filing more lawsuits). What exactly do they want to do?

Do they want to be more political, them speaking out may be unifying to people who agree with them, but people who disagree would be alienated from the monarchy. Do they want less classism and more economic equality? I would find that a little hard to take from people who are that wealthy, unless they planned to give it up and live a more middle-class lifestyle.

In fact, I don't think Harry and Meghan lead by example. I truly like both but was quite thrown by the African journey interview in which they complained lack of emotional support while visiting some of the poorest, most disadvantaged people of the world. Moreover, as has been discussed, I am offended when I am lectured about reducing my carbon footprint by someone who lives in a mansion, drives around in large gas-guzzlers, and travels extensively on vacations.
Quote:
Originally Posted by ACO View Post
Personally I felt both “visions” were valid and needed. The Cambridges and Sussexes appeal to different types of people. Nothing wrong with that and it was a plus for the BRF. I don’t think anyone denies that Meghan made the monarchy appeal to people who usually wouldn’t care because representation matters. But that’s done now.

No one has any idea what the future holds for any of them but they will all do what’s best for them and that’s all anyone can do.
The Devil:

Indeed, indeed!

They hinted at their visions, but they were curbed by an antiquated system and thinking. H&M were never allowed to fly, they were never even allowed to flap their wings.
Had they been allowed to try, just try, explaining and promoting their visions of a better world, because that's in essence all H&M ever wanted, ever desired, to do for the BRF, what would we have seen?
They tried within the confines of a timid system to outline their visions regarding rights for women, combating racism and putting focus on the climate issues. All being both national and global issues.
But they were crucified by a biased press corps who only wanted to see flaws and minor mistakes and blow them completely out of proportions.

Despite offering the BRF a perfectly reasonable alternative to try out their new approach, H&M were reined in - hard. Is it any wonder their only option, that de facto was imposed on them, was to leave?

H&M did not leave, rather they were exiled by narrow-mindedness.

- As for flying and driving. That was a regrettable necessity. H&M were appealing to a global audience and the best way to that is by appearance. Surely they weren't supposed to walk and row around the world?
  #1559  
Old 08-12-2020, 02:10 PM
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Honestly the BRF has now incorporated a more relaxed way since Meghan arrived. Stuff the press berated the Sussexes for they now praise the other members for doing. One big thing being a more chilled social media approach. Now they are all *relatable* but I remember how people reacted to
SussexRoyal initially.

I do think they had some good ideas but about projects but also understood why they might have wanted them to slow down or thought other members (like William) would be better suited for certain projects.

We will never know what the four of them could have achieved together but will will see what the two couples will do on their own. It’s a new era in many ways.
  #1560  
Old 08-12-2020, 02:19 PM
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Originally Posted by poppy7 View Post
I am very sorry to hear about your job situation. This entire time has been so difficult. I hope it resolves itself for you soon.

I wouldn't think anyone would care and it is written, when dealing with her, like an aspirational lifestyle blog. But it is obviously aimed at the US market. Even down to Fahrenheit being used. High school. Fall.
Aww, thank you! I appreciate your concern! Itís going to be difficult because Iím a paralegal - bankruptcy/foreclosure specialty. With all thatís gone on, thereís no way any Courts are going to proceed with Foreclosures; as a result, clients have placed files on hold...and so law firms donít need as many employees.

Oh, they used Fahrenheit? I didnít know that. Well, they may do well financially, but I donít think that Americans are going to read the book and think well of them; just the opposite, actually.
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