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  #681  
Old 07-27-2020, 07:52 PM
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I just don't understand where all this is coming from.

We've always known that Harry was the more sensitive of the two brothers. That he would have walked away if given the opportunity but I always thought he would stick it out for William. But this Harry? What the heck?

He has always known that he was the spare and that attention would go to Wililam as they got older. That's why Diana spent more time with him. He has seen it happen to Andrew and the York Princesses. Why would he not think it would happen to him? The excerpts from this book border on ridiculous....Upset that he had to pay second fiddle to the others. No picture of him during the Christmas speech? He couldn't be bothered to see his Grandparents for Christmas!


How dare they slam their staff who believed in them, who worked for them?

Thinking the others are jealous of the Sussexes? HE seems to have forgotten how the Cambridge's were treated after they got married. All the excitement! The adulation! Thinking that they are more important the William ,Charles and the Queen?! Who the heck do they think they are?

The only star is the Queen!

This book has done them no favors. It does not make them look good AT ALL. And I agree with the general consensus...they will never be welcomed back in the royal fold as it relates to being working royals.
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  #682  
Old 07-27-2020, 07:57 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Betsypaige View Post
I'm sure at some point along the way, even before Meghan came along, this was made clear to Harry......but, you can't make someone listen, you can't make someone believe.
I also wonder if it's a perspective thing.

To us regular people out in the normal world, being the second son of a monarch seems like a fantastic, privileged thing.

Maybe, when you're in the system, and everything is about where you come in the line of succession, from what seat you have in the Abbey to what room you're given at Sandringham to when you're allowed to announce the new charity project you're launching, it becomes something you fixate on, not always with a good outcome.
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  #683  
Old 07-27-2020, 08:11 PM
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I can’t imagine Charles turning his back on his son!

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.mir...s-22426142.amp

'Naive' Meghan Markle and Prince Harry's time in Royal Family is 'done and dusted'
  #684  
Old 07-27-2020, 08:11 PM
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I think this book is going to hurt Harry and Meghan much more than the royal family. The excerpts I have read do not present them in a flattering light at all. They sound like a couple of petulant children who don't realize that the monarchy is about the Queen, not them.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Denville View Post
well all this stuff about what the queen said to Harry as they tucked into roast beef, or how Meghan felt about Harry when they went on a date. How on earth can the authors know about those details and feelings, unless they are told by H and Meg or by their friends? Just as everyone knew that Di's friends would not have talked to Morton about her private life without her OK...
It is interesting, too, that Harry and Meghan have not sued over this book. They have sued over breaches of privacy before. Their mild statement about this book was not endorsed by them, compared to how they have reacted in the past to similar press reports, says to me they helped with this book in some way. I just hate that the Queen and Prince Philip are having to go through this all again at their age.
  #685  
Old 07-27-2020, 08:16 PM
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Originally Posted by Sionevar View Post
I also wonder if it's a perspective thing.

To us regular people out in the normal world, being the second son of a monarch seems like a fantastic, privileged thing.

Maybe, when you're in the system, and everything is about where you come in the line of succession, from what seat you have in the Abbey to what room you're given at Sandringham to when you're allowed to announce the new charity project you're launching, it becomes something you fixate on, not always with a good outcome.
It is beyond baffling. I often wonder if (pre Meghan) his every whim was granted and catered to growing up and he just expects... I get he was indulged but something is just not right with him IMO
  #686  
Old 07-27-2020, 09:08 PM
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It's funny for people to think the BRF are 100% blameless in this matter. The Windsors did rapid response to this book as opposed to the previous ones are showing the hit dogs are hollering. And no one from the BRF is threatening to sue. The public attacks only increase interest. And the US press is not calling the Sussexes the bad guys as opposed to the British press, which is probably what's upsetting the royals and the Rota. They have no influence with media beyond its borders.
  #687  
Old 07-27-2020, 09:16 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sionevar View Post
I also wonder if it's a perspective thing.

To us regular people out in the normal world, being the second son of a monarch seems like a fantastic, privileged thing.

Maybe, when you're in the system, and everything is about where you come in the line of succession, from what seat you have in the Abbey to what room you're given at Sandringham to when you're allowed to announce the new charity project you're launching, it becomes something you fixate on, not always with a good outcome.
The thing is, as disappointed as everyone was that Harry wanted to leave, they tried their best to make it work for he and Meghan...His frustration at the system is no excuse (not that you are saying it is) for treating his family so terribly
  #688  
Old 07-27-2020, 09:22 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Madame Verseau View Post
It's funny for people to think the BRF are 100% blameless in this matter. The Windsors did rapid response to this book as opposed to the previous ones are showing the hit dogs are hollering. And no one from the BRF is threatening to sue. The public attacks only increase interest. And the US press is not calling the Sussexes the bad guys as opposed to the British press, which is probably what's upsetting the royals and the Rota. They have no influence with media beyond its borders.
I can tell you that the average American doesn’t care about the Sussex’s. The majority of us didn’t know who she was before she started dating Harry! I know many Americans who have been turned off by the behavior of the Sussex’s! To be honest, I think it was the Royal family that found their freedom!
  #689  
Old 07-27-2020, 09:23 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nightsky View Post

'Naive' Meghan Markle and Prince Harry's time in Royal Family is 'done and dusted'

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.mir...s-22426142.amp
I agree with all of this....there’s no way, even in the highly unlikely event that Harry wanted to return as a working Royal that it could ever work. Everyone now knows how H and M loathe the idea of a monarchy, how disdainful they are of the intuition and the people who represent it. They could never, ever be trusted ....They’ve burned professional and personal bridges, and it is far worse for Harry. Maybe he does continue to talk to his father, but imagine how Charles must feel now? What about his brother, his grandparents ? They have feelings, too, which Harry doesn’t seem to realize or care about...If he returns to the U.K., say for Christmas, he’s got an awful lot of mending to do.

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Originally Posted by nightsky View Post
I can tell you that the average American doesn’t care about the Sussex’s. The majority of us didn’t know who she was before she started dating Harry!
Exactly. Even under the best of circumstances, most Americans don’t care about any of the Royals. Given the toll the devastating pandemic has taken, the racial issues this country still faces, etc..., the media has far, far bigger fish to fry than to cover a D list celeb and her spoiled prince. The media are people, too...they’ve been sick, they’ve had loved ones die from Covid. H and M don’t rate a mention on any list of important things for our media to cover.
  #690  
Old 07-27-2020, 09:25 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Madame Verseau View Post
It's funny for people to think the BRF are 100% blameless in this matter. The Windsors did rapid response to this book as opposed to the previous ones are showing the hit dogs are hollering. And no one from the BRF is threatening to sue. The public attacks only increase interest. And the US press is not calling the Sussexes the bad guys as opposed to the British press, which is probably what's upsetting the royals and the Rota. They have no influence with media beyond its borders.
The BRF members and courtiers are absolutely correct IMO in responding to Finding Freedom. Diana getting her side out via the Morton book put out a narrative that defined her husband and his family, and took years, if not decades, for many to realized that there were other sides to the story.
  #691  
Old 07-27-2020, 09:33 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Muhler View Post
Interesting questions.

I don't think the rift between Harry and his family will be so big, they won't welcome him back. There will be some wounds to heal, but that I think will not be a big hindrance.
After all Harry wasn't a potential national security risk, not does he harbor questionable political views.
Harry will especially be welcomed back by the family should he divorce. Naturally.
Should he and Meghan decide to return, she will as his wife also be welcomed or at least accepted back. (Because it's impossible to gauge the BRF members feelings for Meghan at present. We simply don't know.)

But will Harry again have a public role? Or will he be put on grass?
I think he will, at least initially, be given some obscure charity he can focus on, without too much attention. (A half-Andrew so to speak.) It all depends under what circumstances he returns, when and under whose reign. As well as the public view on Harry.
He sure can forget all about having the same prominent role he had beforehand! Too much damage has been done.

Also, being welcomed back to the family, doesn't mean he will be physically together with the family. He may very well be de facto exiled, only to appear with the family a prominent events.

Meghan has a supporting role here, unless the family clearly believe she had no responsibility for this mess. I.e. they blame Harry for it all. She is her husband's wife, and that will be it! IMO. There will be no platform for her either.

Now for a hypothetical, but IMO far from unlikely, scenario. H&M divorce.
Statistically it is very much a possibility.
IMO it is a probability in regards to H&M.
Infatuations have a tendency to burn out, like a nova. I.e. dramatic but short-lived.
It is my impression that Harry was not happy before marrying Meghan.
I doubt very much he is happy in his present life and the future prospects...? Well...
He may one day look around in the mansion, they have borrowed. In a foreign country. In a different culture - in every definition of the word! I.e. a Hollywoodsk culture.
Looking at the calendar it's another day of doing... what?
He is no longer in contact with his family. He has AFAIK left most of his old friends behind. He is shunned by the public in his own country. The public in his new country don't care. That's a big culture shock for someone who has never known anything else.
He has no charities anymore. No purpose. Little contact with ordinary people, for whom he genuinely means something and for whom he can do something.

That will put a strain on even the happiest marriage and might very well plunge Harry into a genuine depression.
And Meghan. She is looking at a disillusioned shell of a husband who very likely will have lost his drive. Where is the dynamic Harry who wanted to change the world? You can't live on mirages in the long run.
So unless they find a purpose with their lives, in particular Harry, their marriage will face a serious crisis. - It's brutal psychology.

There is a very good chance I'll be wrong with this thought pattern, but there is also a good chance I'll be right.
Yes I agree with your scenario but also, who really cares so much about this couple now. They appeared so self absorbed before, now they are irrelevant
  #692  
Old 07-27-2020, 10:09 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Missjersey View Post
It is beyond baffling. I often wonder if (pre Meghan) his every whim was granted and catered to growing up and he just expects... I get he was indulged but something is just not right with him IMO
I believe that was the case.
To me, more and more he seems like another Andrew- entitled, petulant, and resentful of the heir.
  #693  
Old 07-27-2020, 10:17 PM
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Originally Posted by Mirabel View Post
I believe that was the case.
To me, more and more he seems like another Andrew- entitled, petulant, and resentful of the heir.
Yes, I call it “andrewitis”
  #694  
Old 07-27-2020, 10:22 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Madame Verseau View Post
It's funny for people to think the BRF are 100% blameless in this matter. The Windsors did rapid response to this book as opposed to the previous ones are showing the hit dogs are hollering. And no one from the BRF is threatening to sue. The public attacks only increase interest. And the US press is not calling the Sussexes the bad guys as opposed to the British press, which is probably what's upsetting the royals and the Rota. They have no influence with media beyond its borders.
I understand that you feel there are things that the royal family could have handled better. But the reality is that Harry and Meghan also could have handled this better. I think what most people here are saying is that even if the royal family was in the wrong in each of these instances, this is a major overreaction.

It seems that Harry and Meghan are deeply hurt because they are not William and Kate's best friends. I understand their hurt but I don't understand lashing out in public. Frankly, this just vindicates any reservations William and Kate had about Meghan.

Maybe William was insensitive when he talked to Harry about slowing down, but does that justify such a high profile public attack? Do you really think that Harry has never done anything that has hurt William's feelings? So far, the worst complaints about Kate are that she didn't call enough. Maybe Kate should she have asked Meghan to go shopping but everyone feels excluded at some time or another. Not being invited to something you want to do can sting, but it happens to everyone. Can you honestly say that you you never excluded someone?

Perhaps Kate and William should have tried harder to protect Harry and Meghan's feelings during the Commonwealth services. But at the same time, it doesn't appear that Harry and Meghan cared about William and Kate's feelings when they were pressured to give up their role in the official procession for Harry and Meghan.

I hope Harry and Meghan can resolve their differences with the family but they are going to have to start putting things in perspective or they will n ever be happy.
  #695  
Old 07-27-2020, 10:40 PM
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I'm not so sure if the Sussexes are so irrelevant

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/femail/a...estseller.html

No. 1 on Amazon UK, no. 14 in the US two weeks before release. The media hit pieces and palace pushback generated sales. The numbers may not have been so high if it weren't for the slamfest. People apparently want to read the whole book and make their own judgment.

Meghan's dad finally weighed in



https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...biography.html

Dad took a couple of hits in the book but DM brought him out to slam the Sussexes for complaining and that they allegedly did not help him. DM's star witness in Meghan's lawsuit just got damaged and the rag is doing clean up.
  #696  
Old 07-27-2020, 10:45 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Madame Verseau View Post
It's funny for people to think the BRF are 100% blameless in this matter. The Windsors did rapid response to this book as opposed to the previous ones are showing the hit dogs are hollering. And no one from the BRF is threatening to sue. The public attacks only increase interest. And the US press is not calling the Sussexes the bad guys as opposed to the British press, which is probably what's upsetting the royals and the Rota. They have no influence with media beyond its borders.

I agree that the BRF are not 100% blameless in how things have turned out, Madame Verseau.

The background checks on the Duchess of Sussex, when she first came into Prince Harry’s life, raised a lot of red flags, a lot of concern.

People within the Royal system knew a middle-aged, free-living, divorced women - from a lifestyle where it was considered “cool” to give wedding guest drugs - would not fit in.

However ...

The Duchess being bi-racial - a good fit for the Commonwealth.

Her and Harry’s obvious happiness with each other.

The Prince’s wish to be married rather than just have a long term live-in arrangement.

Meghan’s vivacity - a draw personally for the Queen, remember Sarah Ferguson.

Meghan expressing her willingness to do what would be required - shades of Diana loving country-life until she didn’t.

The Duchess being experienced, and being comfortable in the public eye.

The threat of being seen as racist if Meghan was rejected.

The “suck it up” remark to Her Majesty from her grandson, showing how off the deep end he may go if thwarted and his wishes/demands denied.


I think they crossed their fingers, hoped for the best, gave every assistance they could, covered a lot of awful behaviour up, and so on.

They took the lesser of two evils - having the couple “within”, rather than having them go rogue and running riot outside of the system.

Even though of course, that is where it has all ended up.

So yes, the BRF have had a hand in this, but I don’t think it could have gone any other way.


From the slights and insults being reported in the “Finding Freedom” book, I really believe everyone, family/staff etc, must have been put through the mill by them when they were in the UK.

No-one was able to soothe/settle the deep, deep rage we have been seeing spill everywhere from the Sussexes.

When people try to control things around them - and the Sussexes want to sort out the whole world - it can be a way of avoiding dealing with what’s within.

And we’re all getting to witness it.
  #697  
Old 07-27-2020, 11:14 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Madame Verseau View Post
I'm not so sure if the Sussexes are so irrelevant

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/femail/a...estseller.html

No. 1 on Amazon UK, no. 14 in the US two weeks before release. The media hit pieces and palace pushback generated sales. The numbers may not have been so high if it weren't for the slamfest. People apparently want to read the whole book.
What’s your point even Lady Colin Campbell’s book is on the bestseller list! People love drama and want to read about the crap show that is the Sussex story!
  #698  
Old 07-28-2020, 12:05 AM
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Originally Posted by nightsky View Post
What’s your point even Lady Colin Campbell’s book is on the bestseller list! People love drama and want to read about the crap show that is the Sussex story!
On the us best sellers list right now is Mary trump and John Bolton’s book. Trump speeches are great for cnn ratings but it doesn’t mean popular not by a long shot. It’s like trying to watch nascar for crashes. Entertaining but not substance
  #699  
Old 07-28-2020, 01:40 AM
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Originally Posted by nightsky View Post
What’s your point even Lady Colin Campbell’s book is on the bestseller list! People love drama and want to read about the crap show that is the Sussex story!
I guess with the pandemic, they're not going to be filming episodes of soap operas any time soon so this turns out to be the "social distancing" relief. Stay tuned for more episodes of "As The Stomach Churns".

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  #700  
Old 07-28-2020, 03:28 AM
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My question for Harry and Meghan, are they any happier now than when they were living in the UK. It seemed at least from the outside they both had enjoyed their work and were very involved with their charities and other activities related to being a working royal. It seemed a pretty prestigious life. Now what are they actually doing? I realize covid has put a damper on most peoples lives currently but what do they do every day, are they doing any meaningful work? After reading through this thread I've decided to preorder the book perhaps to glean some insight on what went wrong. They appeared so happy and hopeful on their wedding day. To go from all that to being holed up in someone else's home in the foothills of LA. They seem very whiny and immature now.
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