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  #81  
Old 12-01-2021, 04:31 PM
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Originally Posted by Muhler View Post
Yes, that's about Frederik and Joachim's nanny, Else Pedersen. Who was their nanny and indeed very much a substitute mother for most of their childhood - up until they left for the French boarding school.
And also when they returned and went to high school.
25 years in total.

She was about ten years older than QMII.

It was Else Pedersen who looked after the boys. Woke them up, fed them, send them to school. It happened that the boys went down to their parents but mostly they didn't see QMII until the late afternoon, where she would usually rest a little.
PH and QMII dined late, around 20.00. While the boys dined around 18.00. And it was after dinner they usually went down to their mother. (Presumably before bedtime around 19.00 or so.)

QMII describes her as a "delightful lady."

QMII appreciate Else Pedersen looking after the boys, something that wasn't always possible (or desired...) for QMII, explaining: "It was a great delight to have these two little boys, but I probably also have to acknowledge that I wasn't a particularly efficient toddler-mother. I was - and is - not particularly good at little children and perhaps children in general. I don't know quite why. Some can, others less so."

--------------

Their relationship is well described in the two portraits books elsewhere here on TRF. And also how Frederik and Joachim IMO outgrew their nanny.
It is an indication of the previous royal and aristocratic way of raising children that you as a parent really didn't see your own children much. And basically only saw them when they were "presentable." It is a very archaic way of bringing up your children to our modern eyes - and something I don't think we need reintroduced from "the good old days."

There was of course also an amount of street-gossip about Else Pedersen. My mother for instance firmly believed that Else Pedersen was dismissed because the Regent Couple were jealous of J&F's warm and close relationship with her.
That of course contradicts the fact that she was employed for 25 years! If they had been jealous they would probably have gotten rid of her sooner.
But yes, Else Pedersen would have been there to comfort them, to tuck them in at night and been worried when they were sick. And of course children being children they attach themselves to those who feed and look after them.

QMII has often said that she isn't good with children. Well, perhaps she should have tried harder?
I don't think QMII is interested in children and she has often admitted that she isn't particularly patient. And that's something you need with children!
And, good grief, sometimes you want to put them in a box and return them to the maternity ward with no return address.
But the rewards are there as well and there must have been a lot of little things QMII missed.

PH was the strict father - and that is probably necessary with royal children - and even though they no doubt feared him I'm sure they also knew he loved them. And that explains the close ties it is my impression J&F had with their father.
I'm sure they were fond of their mother, but I think it was more a "nice-aunt" relationship, if you get my meaning.
The relationship especially between Frederik and QMII seem to me to have been developed when Frederik was fully grown up, say around 30 or so - and crucially after the death of Queen Ingrid. Because it was very much Queen Ingrid J&F went to, when there was a problem.
Thank you!! I also wonder how much influence Mary had in Frederik becoming closer to his mother (and vice versa) given the loss of her own mother.

QMII never looks comfortable around children, especially when they are being, well, kids and being rambunctious, loud, etc. IMO, PH always looked more affectionate with the grandkids. QMII seem to still like the "seen and not heard" scenario.

No wonder Frederik has mentioned many times how he would be different with his children and be there for them and participate in their lives, be a present parent...and also not banish them to a corridor of the palace. Obviously Mary had a very happy childhood where she had a close relationship with her parents and siblings, which she has obviously brought into the raising of their kids. They are very tactile with the kids and the kids with each other showing that in private it is the same and there is no reservation of giving a hug or kiss or showing affection amongst each other.

But reading how distant their mother was is sad to me. At least Else provided them with all the motherly love and attention their own mother did not.
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  #82  
Old 12-01-2021, 05:16 PM
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First of all, it's not exactly easy to admit you are a bad parent, or even not good with (your own) children, in public, for everyone, for posterity, no less.

In addition QM is one of very few women in a modernized society who has had absolutely no choice about not having kids. She had to. Sure, I guess she could have passed the throne to Bene's kids in theory, but in practice it caused far less fuss to just have a couple. Whether she really wanted to or felt she could parent them well or not.

And in addition to not having that choice, she had no choice about having to suddenly take an extremely busy job that she was forced to occupy herself with while they were young. And I believe she's spoken about how stressful and essentially traumatic that was, too. Margrethe is very fortunate she always had access to wonderful childcare, but that doesn't make up for everything.

Finally, QM isn't always the best judge of herself. While her relationship with J&F hasn't always been perfect or easy, she may say she's a bad parent/not good with children because she feels like she's not or like she failed, but it doesn't mean she is. Truly bad parents don't read to their kids or try at all. Or say they're bad parents to everyone, for that matter. Or care.
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  #83  
Old 12-01-2021, 05:35 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Izzie View Post
Thank you!! I also wonder how much influence Mary had in Frederik becoming closer to his mother (and vice versa) given the loss of her own mother.

QMII never looks comfortable around children, especially when they are being, well, kids and being rambunctious, loud, etc. IMO, PH always looked more affectionate with the grandkids. QMII seem to still like the "seen and not heard" scenario.

No wonder Frederik has mentioned many times how he would be different with his children and be there for them and participate in their lives, be a present parent...and also not banish them to a corridor of the palace. Obviously Mary had a very happy childhood where she had a close relationship with her parents and siblings, which she has obviously brought into the raising of their kids. They are very tactile with the kids and the kids with each other showing that in private it is the same and there is no reservation of giving a hug or kiss or showing affection amongst each other.

But reading how distant their mother was is sad to me. At least Else provided them with all the motherly love and attention their own mother did not.
Yes, she was there for them, but she was not their mother.
Frederik has talked about how Else Pedersen made that very clear to them.

No doubt she loved them. She wouldn't have stayed for so long if she didn't. And no doubt the boys could tell, even if Else Pedersen tried to be professional.

I think that mix of a fairly distant but kind mother, and a loving mother-figure who tired not to be an open mother for him, must have made it's mark on Frederik who is a very sensible person. (Or is it sensitive?)
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  #84  
Old 12-01-2021, 06:03 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Muhler View Post
Yes, she was there for them, but she was not their mother.
Frederik has talked about how Else Pedersen made that very clear to them.

No doubt she loved them. She wouldn't have stayed for so long if she didn't. And no doubt the boys could tell, even if Else Pedersen tried to be professional.

I think that mix of a fairly distant but kind mother, and a loving mother-figure who tired not to be an open mother for him, must have made it's mark on Frederik who is a very sensible person. (Or is it sensitive?)

I think I may have read somewhere that sometimes it was hard for Else to not show too much affection as she was not their mother, but that the boys knew that she loved them. She was their day-to-day caregiver.

I think Frederik is both sensible and sensitive. It has also fully affected the type of father he aims to be to ensure that his kids grow up differently. He has said this on more than one occasion. Yes, Mary and Frederik have help/nannies (that is inevitable), but the raising of the kids is theirs. And IMO that is the more modern thought process of the younger generation.
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  #85  
Old 12-01-2021, 06:06 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Muhler View Post
on Frederik who is a very sensible person. (Or is it sensitive?)
Unless you're talking Jane Austen, I think you mean "sensitive".

But I think both of them are, it just shows in different ways. Fred is affected by things but tries to deal by appearing happy and sociable and busy.

Joachim is affected by things and seems to be the "think about it more/talk about it less/brood endlessly" type.

Frederik is willing to be exposed, and Joachim is pretty guarded, it seems. Or at least they yin-yang with this much in common.

(I'm sorry, mods, if you want to move this to a more sensible thread, please feel free!)
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  #86  
Old 12-28-2021, 11:23 AM
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The book "Mary H.R.H." honouring Crown Princess Mary's 50th birthday will be published on January 31:


** Book cover ** politikensforlag.dk ** translation **
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  #87  
Old 12-28-2021, 12:07 PM
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Now, that's gonna be an interesting book.
A bit like the photo-book Mary made with Frederik when he turned 50. I.e. pretty much edited and commented by Mary.

If this book is anything like the photo book about Frederik, then the many photos and the relatively few and simple captions would mean it appeals to non-Danish speakers as well.

But

At 329 DKK it ain't cheap though!

---------------

On another note. I got the book about QMII, I have been talking about, for Christmas. I have only had time to flip through, but I'm impressed!
Seriously impressed!

I'll go into more details later.
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  #88  
Old 12-28-2021, 12:48 PM
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So exciting that Mary is getting a book like this for her 50th! Very well deserved! And that cover is absolutely stunning!! Cannot wait to see all the photographs! Appears to be 272 pages.

If my conversion is correct 329 DKK is about $51.00 USD. Not bad tbh, especially for a photo book of that type.
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  #89  
Old 12-28-2021, 04:14 PM
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New book
The book marks the Crown Princess's 50th birthday in 2022 with a portrait of a woman who has found the right balance between her role in a royal family with strong historical roots and being royal in our time as a committed patron of Danish and international
affairs.
MARY – H.K.H. The Crown Princess is a modern picture adventure with the best photos from official events, but the book also takes readers on the Crown Princess's travels to lesser-known surroundings and to the Crown Princess's meeting*with the people who are most vulnerable.


https://www.billedbladet.dk/kongelig...t-mest-private
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  #90  
Old 12-28-2021, 04:21 PM
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I am very excited (not to mention pleasantly surprised)! Cannot wait to see the photographs chosen for the book! And WOW...what a stunning photo on the cover! She looks gorgeous!! So glad to see Mary getting all these accolades for her 50th...very much deserved!!

From the description in part: The book contains both new and not before seen photos and is accompanied by the Crown Princess's own stories about the moments that have had a special meaning......One of the book's highlights is the exclusive look-in-the-scenes photos from the wedding day in 2004.....when the Crown Princess is preparing to start a new chapter......The Crown Princess also opens the door to family life and never shares previously shown pictures.
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  #91  
Old 12-28-2021, 04:57 PM
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That cover is sensational. My goodness.
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  #92  
Old 12-28-2021, 09:07 PM
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I have a photobook of Crown Princess Mary of Denmark (bought a few years ago ) when Mary Donaldson met Crown Prince Frederik of Denmark during the Sydney (Australia) Olympic Games, a beautiful photobook from the introduction to the Danish Royal Court, the wedding & as wife of C/P Frederik of Denmark & in later years until today, a lot s of formal photographs with other princesses of Europe. Absolute A MUST. The name of the book is " MARY, Princess of style" by Jan Korner, Jim Lyngvild & Vibeke Sybrandt & the other 2 books about C/P Mary is " Mary, Crown Princess of Denmark" by Karin Palshoj & Gitte Redder & 3 " Something about Mary, from girl about town to princess" by Emma Tom.
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  #93  
Old 01-01-2022, 04:26 PM
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As I wished I got this book for Christmas. Happy little me.

https://www.saxo.com/dk/undervejs-dr...xoCa_YQAvD_BwE

Undervejs = Under Way, by Tom Buk-Swienty.

Who is a brilliant historical author, and who I'm in no doubt whatsoever has QMII among his readers.

The book must be considered a must-read by anyone who is remotely interested in QMII, but also the DRF family relations from around 1910-1950.

It is basically one long quote by QMII.

The author has asked the appropriate questions and simply allowed QMII to tell her story in her own words.
There are no words by the author himself apart from captions to various photos, many of which have never been shown before - don't worry, you'll find them in this thread eventually.
I actually like this approach, because it's not a biography per se. It's QMII talking and it's up to us, the readers, to interpret her words and draw what conclusions we get to.
It's a very frank book. QMII does not hide who among her family she liked or perhaps didn't like that much and who among the family who wasn't well liked or who was very well liked, even those she did not know personally. So this is the impressions and opinions that family members told her.

The book starts very simple by QMII introducing herself briefly, and making it clear that she is Daisy to her family only. And that she during her childhood was Princess Margrethe - it was a double-name to her, rather than title and name. Never only Margrethe.

Then she proceeds to talk about her very first memory escaping from her pram around the age of two.
She talked early on, and she believe that the fact that she was able to put words to things, enabled her to have such a clear and early memory.

It's an extremely easy book to read, divided into very short segments around one particular topic or memory. Be that her family members or the kindergarten at Amalienborg.

It's too good a reference-book not to share here. I'm still trying to work out how though.
Because translating more than 400 pages is out of the question.
So I think it will be a mix of a summary of minor segments.
A few translated quotes.
And tidbits and hard facts, which you can ask into, if you feel you need to know more.

- I think it will predominantly be the latter option.
Right now I need to finish the book. To my surprise I have been even more preoccupied during the Christmas holiday than anticipated - and hoped...

But I intend to start with the many photos, which divide the book into overall chapters.
They will be uploaded here at some point.

- Considering the price and the content the book is a gem!
And those of you who would like to read for yourselves really should consider pestering the publisher for an English version.
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  #94  
Old 01-02-2022, 08:27 PM
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After long and careful deliberations I have decided to go against my ethnicity (Jutlander) and part with some of my money.
I will buy the photo-book about Mary, scan and share it here.

- Unless the reviews are bad, mind you.
In which case we can get it cheaper, in a few months.
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  #95  
Old 01-02-2022, 09:44 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Muhler View Post
After long and careful deliberations I have decided to go against my ethnicity (Jutlander) and part with some of my money.
I will buy the photo-book about Mary, scan and share it here.

- Unless the reviews are bad, mind you.
In which case we can get it cheaper, in a few months.
our RF will have a very happy new year indeed! Mange tak Muhler
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  #96  
Old 01-19-2022, 04:46 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Muhler View Post
As I wished I got this book for Christmas. Happy little me.

https://www.saxo.com/dk/undervejs-dr...xoCa_YQAvD_BwE

Undervejs = Under Way, by Tom Buk-Swienty.

Who is a brilliant historical author, and who I'm in no doubt whatsoever has QMII among his readers.

The book must be considered a must-read by anyone who is remotely interested in QMII, but also the DRF family relations from around 1910-1950.

It is basically one long quote by QMII.

The author has asked the appropriate questions and simply allowed QMII to tell her story in her own words.
There are no words by the author himself apart from captions to various photos, many of which have never been shown before - don't worry, you'll find them in this thread eventually.
I actually like this approach, because it's not a biography per se. It's QMII talking and it's up to us, the readers, to interpret her words and draw what conclusions we get to.
It's a very frank book. QMII does not hide who among her family she liked or perhaps didn't like that much and who among the family who wasn't well liked or who was very well liked, even those she did not know personally. So this is the impressions and opinions that family members told her.

The book starts very simple by QMII introducing herself briefly, and making it clear that she is Daisy to her family only. And that she during her childhood was Princess Margrethe - it was a double-name to her, rather than title and name. Never only Margrethe.

Then she proceeds to talk about her very first memory escaping from her pram around the age of two.
She talked early on, and she believe that the fact that she was able to put words to things, enabled her to have such a clear and early memory.

It's an extremely easy book to read, divided into very short segments around one particular topic or memory. Be that her family members or the kindergarten at Amalienborg.

It's too good a reference-book not to share here. I'm still trying to work out how though.
Because translating more than 400 pages is out of the question.
So I think it will be a mix of a summary of minor segments.
A few translated quotes.
And tidbits and hard facts, which you can ask into, if you feel you need to know more.

- I think it will predominantly be the latter option.
Right now I need to finish the book. To my surprise I have been even more preoccupied during the Christmas holiday than anticipated - and hoped...

But I intend to start with the many photos, which divide the book into overall chapters.
They will be uploaded here at some point.

- Considering the price and the content the book is a gem!
And those of you who would like to read for yourselves really should consider pestering the publisher for an English version.
I'm curious about your overall impression of the book, Muhler, assuming you've gotten to finish.

Of course the details, too. But that's one impression versus many.
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  #97  
Old 01-19-2022, 05:33 PM
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Originally Posted by Prinsara View Post
I'm curious about your overall impression of the book, Muhler, assuming you've gotten to finish.

Of course the details, too. But that's one impression versus many.
Almost finished. - Been busy.

It's a very good book!
What makes it so interesting is that it is very personal. It's QMII's views, impressions, opinions and values we get, about all sorts of events and persons, family and otherwise.
What is also interesting is what she doesn't elaborate on. Sometimes the nuances of what she doesn't say about a person or event is very palatable.
It is certainly my impression that the relationship between Prince Knud's family and QMII branch of the family was pretty strained in connection with the change in the Law of Succession of 1953. But of course she doesn't say that outright. It's just hanging there in the air...

I will get to that because my - initial - approach will be to scan the photos. Than add very brief trivia to the photos and a few quotes, in order for you to get the gist of what QMII says about that person or event.
It will be a kind of super-condensed summary to the various parts of the book, because there are no chapters as such. It's QMII talking about her life from a chronological order, but with the odd detours.
And then you can ask into the details.

It will be a much more interactive thread than usual when I have written about books, because the whole book, every single word, ought to be translated.

When the condensed summary has been written, I will then scan the text. And then more can join in - or people may painstakingly try a Google translate.

I'm not even sure if this approach will work, but I think it's worth a try.
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  #98  
Old 01-25-2022, 01:12 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Muhler View Post
Yes, she was there for them, but she was not their mother.
Frederik has talked about how Else Pedersen made that very clear to them.

No doubt she loved them. She wouldn't have stayed for so long if she didn't. And no doubt the boys could tell, even if Else Pedersen tried to be professional.

I think that mix of a fairly distant but kind mother, and a loving mother-figure who tired not to be an open mother for him, must have made it's mark on Frederik who is a very sensible person. (Or is it sensitive?)
CP Frederik was very emotional when he met Else at Prince Christianís christening. His thoughts must have been how she cared for him and yet could not give him the love she thought he should have had!
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