"1015 København K" by Trine Villemann (2007)

[Gaia]

Warren did in this post Paty And if any non-Australian member wishes to view the segment, here is a video of the Mary segment of ACA last night.

And an article talking about the segment (there is also the same ACA video at the top of the article)

Thank you for the video link...the story of "chicken little" comes to mind. I don't agree that wives have to step up and make their husbands into leaders. I also don't see that Fred is having anymore of a problem than some other future Kings who seem to speak and ruffle feathers.

 

[LauraMCS]

OK, very short synopsis of what was broadcast:
Frederik doesn't want to be King and it's Mary's job to turn him into kingly material. So far she hasn't done so (apparently it's all up to her) and therefore "the future of the Monarchy is at stake". However, the Danes have high hopes that Mary can achieve this task and she needs to "connect" with the people by remembering she's Australian.

The Danes high hopes for the monarchy rely on Mary connecting with the people by remembering she's Australian? This doesn't make any sense to me at all.

 

[Duke of Marmalade]

I am sure Frederik will be a good King. OK he does not have a larger than life personality but there were others before him who hadn't and became much loved and respected monarchs (just to mention QE II's father George VI or Carl Gustaf of Sweden). Mary can make a difference but who knows if Frederik has to rely on that asset. Before he acutally becomes King which is a huge step we simply don't know if he will grow or fail. Being the best-prepared CP around as at least two of Frederiks peers are being hailed all the time is no guarantee for a successfull reign. Only time will tell.

 

[Villemann]

I am a royalist

I watched half of the interview and shut it off. It sounds to me as though this woman is almost hoping that the monarchy fails. What a very pessimistic attitude toward the future of her country. Fred is shy, big deal, it doesn't mean that he won't carry out the role of King very admirably. He doesn't have to be the life and soul of the party (such as are other European Royals no names mentioned) as long as he is true to his country and it's future. He may not want to be King but it really isn't something he has much control over. He is going to have to make the best of it.

Just to clarify: "This woman" is a a royalist. I want the Danish monarchy to survive for another millenium, bit it won't unless they reform.

 

[Villemann]

Turn down the Barbie-style

The Danes high hopes for the monarchy rely on Mary connecting with the people by remembering she's Australian? This doesn't make any sense to me at all.

Because a monarchy of today cannot survive - in my opinion - if it's all about style. As i said, it is no longer enough just to show up and look good. There has to be some substance to the work, you are doing, otherwise you are just another Paris Hilton. If CP Mary can tone down her Barbie-style and turn up her Aussie personality by trusting herself and all the experience, she brought into this marriage, then I think she can do a lot for my monarchy. Mary needs to find her true self, because that is the woman, CP Frederik fell in love with and he needs that woman to help him in his future job.

 

[Villemann]

Frederik needs help

I am sure Frederik will be a good King. OK he does not have a larger than life personality but there were others before him who hadn't and became much loved and respected monarchs (just to mention QE II's father George VI or Carl Gustaf of Sweden). Mary can make a difference but who knows if Frederik has to rely on that asset. Before he acutally becomes King which is a huge step we simply don't know if he will grow or fail. Being the best-prepared CP around as at least two of Frederiks peers are being hailed all the time is no guarantee for a successfull reign. Only time will tell.

I don't agree with you on this one. I think Frederik will be a very average king unless he gets help. Ok, we have had lots of average monarchs in the past, but average will not do in a modern, globalized society. The Danes of Frederik's generation are watching their future king stumble through interviews - and life in general. He has hooked up to this IOC-candidacy despite the fact, that almost half of the nation - according to most polls - believe it is not a good idea. These polls I posted in a thread somewhere some time ago, by the way! Frederik's futue subjects are not seeing a Crown Prince getting on with the job of serving his country. All they are seeing is a lost Crown Prince. Why is this is such a sore issue? Why do people get so upset, when I mention these facts? Is it not better that we deal with these problems? Is it not better that Frederik gets some help ? Mary is his nearest and dearest. Surely, she can do something!

 

[Empress]

I hardly think that it is fair for you to pass judgement on another person, especially someone that you either don't know or barely know personally by calling it a "barbie" style.

It's a bit much for anyone to make determinations on anothers personality simply by hearsay.

 

[Jo of Palatine]

After reading through this thread I don't think I want to read that book. I like books about royalty to be rather neutral accounts based on in-depth research but in this case it seems to me that the author has rather fixed opinions (and negative ones) which does normally not make for a trustworthy or good read. It's a bit like reading a biography of the Prince of Wales written by a Diana-fan. IMHO, of course.

 

[Villemann]

After reading through this thread I don't think I want to read that book. I like books about royalty to be rather neutral accounts based on in-depth research but in this case it seems to me that the author has rather fixed opinions (and negative ones) which does normally not make for a trustworthy or good read. It's a bit like reading a biography of the Prince of Wales written by a Diana-fan. IMHO, of course.

Now, how can one pass judgment on a book, one has not read? Beats me!

 

[Jo of Palatine]

Now, how can one pass judgment on a book, one has not read? Beats me!

I read your postings here and interviews on the net which have shown IMHO rather fixed and negative opinions. That's enough for me to decide that I don't wish to spend my money on this book - it's not a judgment on the book but on what I've seen from its author, unfortunately. There are quite some people here on these forums from whom I wouldn't want to read a book either.

 

[Villemann]

Barbie-monarchy

I hardly think that it is fair for you to pass judgement on another person, especially someone that you either don't know or barely know personally by calling it a "barbie" style.

It's a bit much for anyone to make determinations on anothers personality simply by hearsay.

Well, it is my personal opinion, which I think I am allowed to express on this thread. I am not passing judgment om CP Mary's personality, merely commenting on the way she performs her job. Basically I don't care at all about CP Mary's personality, but only about how she is managing the monarchy that came with her prince. In my personal opinion, she could do a much better job if she toned down, what I think is her Barbie-style apporach to her duties. She should put more substance in to what she is doing. I would love the focus to be on Mary's work and not her clothes. I would love if we discussed her latest speech to a charity organization instead of whether or not prince Joachim is in love with her. I don't want a Barbie-monarchy, here I go again. I want a monarchy which is meaningful and relevant to my life and the times we are living in!
I do not know if you have read my book, but let me assure you, it is not based on hearsay.

 

[Empress]

Well, one might not be able to pass judgement on the book itself, I grant you that. However, one might very well take a good reading of the author and how she would slant her book by reading the posts on this forum. Generally speaking authors find it difficult to seperate their personal feelings from their writings. So if the authors posts on this board are anything to go by, then that might give good insight into how the book is written.

Unfortunately Mary can not do anything about what the media or other people decided to talk about. She would make just as much news for her clothing if she wore a potato sack. I think that she is taking on quite a few important issues, and it's unfortunate that the focus is often on what she is wearing, but you can not blame her for that. What do you think she does, deliberately chooses her clothing to outshine the event?

I think not. I think that she instead dresses as any professional woman would do with her resources. She shows respect for the causes by taking the time to look her best rather than rolling out of bed and dragging a comb through her hair. I don's see any possible way that can be construed as a negative aspect of her personality.

 

[Villemann]

Fair enough

I read your postings here and interviews on the net which have shown IMHO rather fixed and negative opinions. That's enough for me to decide that I don't wish to spend my money on this book - it's not a judgment on the book but on what I've seen from its author, unfortunately. There are quite some people here on these forums from whom I wouldn't want to read a book either.

Fair enough, but you should read it! It is a honest and truthful picture of the DRF. Let me give you an example: Today ,the Danish papers are reporting that Prince Joachim has filled in for Queen Margrethe on more than 30 occasions this past year. In comparison, CP Frederik has only filed in on 7 occasions. Now where was it, the Danes for the first time read that Prince Joachim is a disciplined and industrious member of the DRF and never afraid to pull his weight? Yep, in my book.

 

[grevinnan]

If CP Mary can tone down her Barbie-style and turn up her Aussie personality by trusting herself and all the experience, she brought into this marriage, then I think she can do a lot for my monarchy. Mary needs to find her true self, because that is the woman, CP Frederik fell in love with and he needs that woman to help him in his future job.

I absolutely agree with you. Mary may have the potential of having the biggest impact on the Danish royal house - second only after the Queen. But she must become alive again. I have mentioned many times on these boards about the re-birth the royal house gave her. Let's re-surrect the Mary with a personality and spunk we saw before the engagement. Grooming and royal training is necessary - but don't kill the personality in the process.

 

[Jo of Palatine]

I would love the focus to be on Mary's work and not her clothes. I would love if we discussed her latest speech to a charity organization instead of whether or not prince Joachim is in love with her.

Moment - are we talking Mary or Marie here?

 

[Jo of Palatine]

Let's re-surrect the Mary with a personality and spunk we saw before the engagement. Grooming and royal training is necessary - but don't kill the personality in the process.

I'm as well one who thinks Mary should loosen up a bit. But after reading what Villemann has to say about her in public I wonder if she simply doesn't want to do the Di on her husband - meaning that she doesn't want to become the star of the show but is content to be the future king's consort?

 

[grevinnan]

I'm as well one who thinks Mary should loosen up a bit. But after reading what Villemann has to say about her in public I wonder if she simply doesn't want to do the Di on her husband - meaning that she doesn't want to become the star of the show but is content to be the future king's consort?

It is not a matter or being the star of the show - just a more believable person behind the designer clothes. Mary has the potential - the danish royal house has for a long time had women with their own personalities, Q Ingrid, Q Margerethe and her sister and Princess Alexandra. I don't understand why Mary was made into this image that is neither appealing nor beneficial for her.

 

[Jo of Palatine]

It is not a matter or being the star of the show - just a more believable person behind the designer clothes. Mary has the potential - the danish royal house has for a long time had women with their own personalities, Q Ingrid, Q Margerethe and her sister and Princess Alexandra. I don't understand why Mary was made into this image that is neither appealing nor beneficial for her.

But who is giving her this image? Besides these forums I read the DanishRoyalwatchers blog regularily including their translations of articles and I don't think the "clothes-horse"-claim is something I read often. I have a lot of respect for Mary and her achievements as a Crown Princess and have the impression that most Danes agree with me. She is liked in Denmark, isn't she?

 

[Al_bina]

Moment - are we talking Mary or Marie here?

There was a gossip with a photo that Prince Joachim is in love his sister-in-law. You may check the thread "Relationships between the members of the Danish Royal family" for more information.

 

[Jo of Palatine]

There was a gossip with a photo that Prince Joachim is in love his sister-in-law. You may check the thread "Relationships between the members of the Danish Royal family" for more information.

Thank you for the info. My, my, I love these forums for their variety of topics and the way all potential scenarios can be talked through but this is a bit too much. Frederick and Joachim are not the first brothers to like the same type of women and to marry them. there are a lot of twin sisters marrying brothers around, so this is quite laughable considering how much in love Joachim is with Marie. But it makes for a nice, juicy, scandalous speculation to sell papers, books etc.

 

[Villemann]

Well, one might not be able to pass judgement on the book itself, I grant you that. However, one might very well take a good reading of the author and how she would slant her book by reading the posts on this forum. Generally speaking authors find it difficult to seperate their personal feelings from their writings. So if the authors posts on this board are anything to go by, then that might give good insight into how the book is written.

Unfortunately Mary can not do anything about what the media or other people decided to talk about. She would make just as much news for her clothing if she wore a potato sack. I think that she is taking on quite a few important issues, and it's unfortunate that the focus is often on what she is wearing, but you can not blame her for that. What do you think she does, deliberately chooses her clothing to outshine the event?

I think not. I think that she instead dresses as any professional woman would do with her resources. She shows respect for the causes by taking the time to look her best rather than rolling out of bed and dragging a comb through her hair. I don's see any possible way that can be construed as a negative aspect of her personality.

I am not even trying to separate my feelings from my book, because I care passionately about my subject., the Danish monarchy. I am, however, gobsmacked by how upset people get, when I air my opinions. Why is it not ok to discuss the DRF? Why can we only discuss their hair and clothes and not the way they do their jobs? And please, lets not "waste" our time discussing why Mary dresses the way she does.

Moment - are we talking Mary or Marie here?

We are talking about Mary. There is a silly rumour doing the rounds saying that Prince Joachim is in love with his sister in-law. It is so not true!

 

[Madame Royale]

She is liked in Denmark, isn't she?

She certainly is. My travels to Denmark have shown me that Mary is very well liked, if not thought of with much affection by a great many Danes. Not all, but then again, not all Swedes think favourably of Crown Princess Victoria either, nor the Ducth for Maxima, or Spaniards for Letizia.


Moving along...

She (Mary) has an honesty about her I think. A wholesome, kind and gentle nature. Dedicated and continuing to learn what it is to be the Crown Princess of Europes oldest monarchy. And that's not for anyone to tell her, it's something she has to recognise and establish for herself and I believe she's doing a fine job as is. It's something she will continue to do for the rest of her life.

As for what she wears getting more attention, that's hardly her problem. Perhaps journalists should start focussing on the real issues instead of providing the lowdown on what it is HRH is wearing if it's such a national concern. Which clearly it isn't...

As for her maintaing that 'Aussie spark'? Newsflash, she isn't Australian! You strip someone of their citizenship and so accuse her of loosing the charm which reflected her life as an Australian? I'm sure she maintains many attributes which reflect her values and so stem from the way of life here, and how she was raised. But you cannot ask the Danish Crown Princess to be, or act, more Australian. That's entirely unreasonable.

 

[Warren]

And please, lets not "waste" our time discussing why Mary dresses the way she does.

While I agree it becomes frustrating at times with the intense interest on Mary's (and most other princesses') dress and style, by heading a post "Barbie-monarchy" you have placed a focus on Mary's style which members will naturally question.

 

[Villemann]

But who is giving her this image? Besides these forums I read the DanishRoyalwatchers blog regularily including their translations of articles and I don't think the "clothes-horse"-claim is something I read often. I have a lot of respect for Mary and her achievements as a Crown Princess and have the impression that most Danes agree with me. She is liked in Denmark, isn't she?

Of course Mary is liked in Denmark!In MY opinion we mostly like her, because CP Frederik chose her as his bride and she har born him - and us - two lovely children. The question is: Do we respect her? I think the jury is still out on that one. Regarding her image, I think it's a two-way street. How can you not talk about her designer-dresses, if there is nothing else to talk - and write? - about. On the other hand, maybe we should listen more carefully, if and when CP Mary actually tries to leave her comfort zone and do something with substance.

I'm as well one who thinks Mary should loosen up a bit. But after reading what Villemann has to say about her in public I wonder if she simply doesn't want to do the Di on her husband - meaning that she doesn't want to become the star of the show but is content to be the future king's consort?

She IS the star of the show. We are all discussing her! Everything is about Mary. She needs to gather up all of that golddust and spread it somewhere sensible - starting with her husband!

While I agree it becomes frustrating at times with the intense interest on Mary's (and most other princesses') dress and style, by heading a post "Barbie-monarchy" you have placed a focus on Mary's style which members will naturally question.

My mistake! I was referring to Barbies placid personality not her dress-sense!

 

[Empress]

I suppose that in your research you've looked at Mary's charities and patronages. I hardly call the work that she does with the Danish Cultural Society, Danish Refugee Council, Youth association of Science, Childrens Aid Foundation, Danish Association for Mental Health, Rare Disorders, Brain injury, heart, kidney and stroke asscociations without substance. To name a few.

http://www.theroyalforums.com/forums/f32/crown-prince-couple-patronages-14372.html

As far as I know Barbie is an inanimate object and has no personality at all.

 

[Villemann]

I suppose that in your research you've looked at Mary's charities and patronages. I hardly call the work that she does with the Danish Cultural Society, Danish Refugee Council, Youth association of Science, Childrens Aid Foundation, Danish Association for Mental Health, Rare Disorders, Brain injury, heart, kidney and stroke asscociations without substance. To name a few.

http://www.theroyalforums.com/forums/f32/crown-prince-couple-patronages-14372.html

As far as I know Barbie is an inanimate object and has no personality at all.

But do you know what she actually does apart from showing up and looking good? She is lending her name and her position to her charities. Great, but that is hardly work, is it? What is it then, I want from CP Mary? To step away from her illusions of what a princess is like and put some content into what she does. Bring the monarchy forward - and her husband too, for that matter - by creating initiatives and stretching her tentacles into areas that are worthwhile, but perhaps not politically correct or "nice." It is all talk and no real action, if you ask me - and you did
I a way Mary is the royal Obama. He is talking about change, making all the right noises, but what has he actually achieved so far? Nothing!

 

[Warren]

My mistake! I was referring to Barbies placid personality not her dress-sense!

I understand what you mean now. I guess Mary faces that conflict between maintaining "control" and allowing her natural personality to shine. It's a balancing act, although I would imagine that as she has grown into the position of Crown Princess she has loosened up somewhat. Are you saying that you think she hasn't loosened up enough in public and retains too much reserve?

 

[Madame Royale]

and put some content into what she does

Then by all means, prove that she doesn't.

 

[Empress]

But do you know what she actually does apart from showing up and looking good? She is lending her name and her position to her charities. Great, but that is hardly work, is it? What is it then, I want from CP Mary? To step away from her illusions of what a princess is like and put some content into what she does. Bring the monarchy forward - and her husband too, for that matter - by creating initiatives and stretching her tentacles into areas that are worthwhile, but perhaps not politically correct or "nice." It is all talk and no real action, if you ask me - and you did
I a way Mary is the royal Obama. He is talking about change, making all the right noises, but what has he actually achieved so far? Nothing!

And do you know for a fact that she does not do anything more than just show up? If as you say it's all about the clothing, and that's the media doing the portraying, how are we to know that she doesn't do anything more? I rather suspect that she does. She certainly did with the Mary Foundation, and the Alana and Madeleine foundation.

What's more, more background effort goes into these events than you might imagine. It takes effort and time to learn about the different problems facing each patronage. It takes time to prepare a speech, and research what needs to be said, and it takes time to interact with the various people and listen to their needs.

So unless you know for a FACT that she does nothing more than just show up, then I think that you are making assumptions that can not be supported by a scratch of the surface.

 

[Viv]

I a way Mary is the royal Obama. He is talking about change, making all the right noises, but what has he actually achieved so far? Nothing!

Of course Obama hasn't changed anything! He isn't president of the United States .... yet!

Viv