General News about Carl Philip, Sofia and Family, Part 1: May 2016 -

[Fijiro]

http://w.cdn-expressen.se/images/fa/79/fa7928ec3ebe4317bc9e242ffc743b80/16x9/680@80.jpg
http://static.eo.nl/fileadmin/bestanden-2016/_processed_/csm_Pr_CarlPhilip_Pr_Sofia_Pr_Alexander_Foto_Kate_Gabor_Kungahuset-1_c557d2a088.jpg

I'm posting this here because Prince Alexander's christening title is closed.

[Catharina]

I don't really know what to think of people calling Sofia "not maternal". I mean, is it criticism or just an expression? Do all women or all mothers need to be maternal? And if so, does this mean that women who don't really feel that maternal to begin with should not have children? If a woman wants to have children, does her best to take care of them and loves them, I don't think it matters whether she is a "natural mother" or not. Not all women are the same.

I know I've criticised her before and I certainly do not know her any more than I can see from photos and tv. I do not like children being taken to each and every place in the name of modern upbringing (especially a rally event where even adults struggle to breathe and hear) but it's not my call.

Alexander looks like a healthy baby and I hope he will have robust health in the future.

[HRHHermione]

Originally Posted by Catharina

I don't really know what to think of people calling Sofia "not maternal". I mean, is it criticism or just an expression? Do all women or all mothers need to be maternal? And if so, does this mean that women who don't really feel that maternal to begin with should not have children? If a woman wants to have children, does her best to take care of them and loves them, I don't think it matters whether she is a "natural mother" or not. Not all women are the same.

I think it's an incredibly sexist criticism and rather nasty. I've never seen anyone imply that a man is "not paternal" or criticize how he holds his baby or where he chooses to take his baby.

It's a criticism that falls almost exclusively on women, and I think it's rooted in some of the sexist criticism that Sofia has already received.

I really wish women would stop doing this nonsense to other women.

[cdm]

I do remember that Albert of Monaco received some critisism in these threads for the way he held one of his children in a photoshoot.

[Pranter]

Everyone needs to just stop with the critique of how other parents do things. None of us are perfect parents. It has nothing to do with being maternal/paternal (more or less so) because another parent handles things in a way you (generic you) don't approve of.



LaRae

[polyesco]

the family out shopping
Prins Carl Philip och Sofia handlade på Bromma blocks | Kungligt | Expressen

[Fijiro]

Originally Posted by Pranter

Everyone needs to just stop with the critique of how other parents do things. None of us are perfect parents. It has nothing to do with being maternal/paternal (more or less so) because another parent handles things in a way you (generic you) don't approve of.



LaRae

Very well said.
People need to stop with all this "not maternal" language.

[Marengo]

I suppose people can and will say whatever they want. However I agree that judging other people's parenting skills and children from the sidelines is far too easy and never fair indeed.

[principessa]

The official section of Prince Alexander at the website of the swedish royal court:

H.K.H. Prins Alexander - Sveriges Kungahus

[betina]

Originally Posted by xenobia

If someone is interested in attacking Sofia as a mother - feel free. I'm sure the moderators here will take care of those posts, just like they try to deal with all there other Sofia-hate on the forums.

My point in this debate is that Sofia is carrying Alexander just like most parents in Sweden are carrying their babies. I've seen pictures of both Madeleine and Victoria with their child in a Babybjörn (the brand that's synonymous with those carrying devices here). They do nothing that's strange or upsetting for us who live here. People also bring their kids everywhere. That includes concerts, find dining restaurants, car races and whatever. So if you want to be critical - don't just go after Sofia. You need to go after a huge majority of swedish parents, and the nurses, midwifes and doctors who take care of them.

And that goes for Denmark as well. We had the same debate about letting children sleep outside in their prams, which is very normal to do in Scandinavia. I have never heard a nurse or health care person advise against those carrying devises.
Childupbringing is different in each country, so let us respect and accept differences please.

[Duc_et_Pair]

I understood that Princess Sofia has been given her own coat-of-arms indeed:

Prinsessan Sofia bar Serafimerordens insignier första gången den 23 oktober 2015 vid Kungl. Ingenjörsvetenskapsakademiens högtidssammankomst. Inom kort kommer en vapenplåt att målas upp för prinsessan med både utnämningsdatum och hennes personliga heraldiska vapen.

My translation: Princess Sofia wore the insigia of the Seraphim for the first time on Octobeer 23rd 2015 at a ceremonial event of the Royal Academy of Engineering Sciences. Soon a coat of arms will be painted for the Princess, with the date of her appointment as well her personal heraldic crest.

Link (last alinea)

This is the proposed personal heraldic crest of Princess Sofia (source pinterest: https://s-media-cache-ak0.pinimg.com...8effc90fd8.jpg ):

I = Kingdom of Sweden
II = House of Vasa
III = Duchy of Värmland
IV = Kingdom of Sweden
Heartshield = ? Solna ?
The oval form shows it are the arms of a lady.

[LadyFinn]

Originally Posted by Duc_et_Pair

I understood that Princess Sofia has been given her own coat-of-arms indeed:

Prinsessan Sofia bar Serafimerordens insignier första gången den 23 oktober 2015 vid Kungl. Ingenjörsvetenskapsakademiens högtidssammankomst. Inom kort kommer en vapenplåt att målas upp för prinsessan med både utnämningsdatum och hennes personliga heraldiska vapen.

My translation: Princess Sofia wore the insigia of the Seraphim for the first time on Octobeer 23rd 2015 at a ceremonial event of the Royal Academy of Engineering Sciences. Soon a coat of arms will be painted for the Princess, with the date of her appointment as well her personal heraldic crest.

Link (last alinea)

This is the proposed personal heraldic crest of Princess Sofia (source pinterest: https://s-media-cache-ak0.pinimg.com...8effc90fd8.jpg ):

I = Kingdom of Sweden
II = House of Vasa
III = Duchy of Värmland
IV = Kingdom of Sweden
Heartshield = ? Solna ?
The oval form shows it are the arms of a lady.

That article quoted is from last October. Henrik Klackenberg, the chief heraldist at the National Archives, told at Svensk Damtidning's article in June that Sofia's coat of arms wasn't ready yet.
http://www.theroyalforums.com/forums...ml#post1895249

The court hasn't published Sofia's coat of arms yet. Daniel's coat of arms was published five days before the wedding.

That "proposal" is taken from here, from June 2015, from the website of Wasling Media:
"Now the royal family has not yet managed to create / publish Sofia's personal coat of arms, but I have received a proposal to me from the heraldic artist Thomas Falk. The proposal of the coat of arms is based on Sofia's tattoo, on her knowledge of and interest in yoga and is also a beautiful counterpart to Queen Silvia's coat of arms from 1976."
Fröken Sofia Hellqvist blir prinsessa _ Heraldik och Vapensköldar

Carl Philip was seen at the Fresco Café last week.
https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?f...type=3&theater

[carlota]

sofia getting off the train that took her to varmland, with little alexander.

http://us.hola.com/imagenes/realeza/...alexswe1-a.jpg

sofia's choices in dressing alexander makes me disappointed. i hate when babies and little children are dressed in 'adult clothes downsized to fit small kids'. kids should be dressed as kids and not as a mini version of an adult. it really makes sofia's middle-class background show. i wish someone would advise her that it is inappropriate for royal babies to dress with booties and hoodies.

[GömdNatt]

Originally Posted by carlota

sofia getting off the train that took her to varmland, with little alexander.

http://us.hola.com/imagenes/realeza/...alexswe1-a.jpg

sofia's choices in dressing alexander makes me disappointed. i hate when babies and little children are dressed in 'adult clothes downsized to fit small kids'. kids should be dressed as kids and not as a mini version of an adult. it really makes sofia's middle-class background show. i wish someone would advise her that it is inappropriate for royal babies to dress with booties and hoodies.

I mean, there's so much here to dissect. But we'll start with the assumption that it's purely Sofia dressing Alexander like this. Second of all, I think 90% of kids clothing is "dressing kids like adults". Half of the coats Estelle has worn are just mini versions of adult coats. But they're clothes! Who cares? He's a baby in a hoodie? Big deal. I don't personally like those shoes he's wearing, but otherwise, he looks cute in the hoodie.

The classism on this site is astounding sometimes.

[carlota]

Originally Posted by GömdNatt

I mean, there's so much here to dissect. But we'll start with the assumption that it's purely Sofia dressing Alexander like this. Second of all, I think 90% of kids clothing is "dressing kids like adults". Half of the coats Estelle has worn are just mini versions of adult coats. But they're clothes! Who cares? He's a baby in a hoodie? Big deal. I don't personally like those shoes he's wearing, but otherwise, he looks cute in the hoodie.

The classism on this site is astounding sometimes.

i knew i would get bashing for my comment - but i maintain my view. it is tacky to dress a kid like this.

the fact that 90% of kids wear whatever alexander is wearing does not make it appropriate, and even less so for a royal child. and whoever dressed alexander does not mater or alter my view in either way: all i care is about the result and the result is vulgar.

[royal rob]

Originally Posted by carlota

i knew i would get bashing for my comment - but i maintain my view. it is tacky to dress a kid like this.



the fact that 90% of kids wear whatever alexander is wearing does not make it appropriate, and even less so for a royal child. and whoever dressed alexander does not mater or alter my view in either way: all i care is about the result and the result is vulgar.

My god how can a baby dressed in a clean warm outfit that every other baby wears be vulgar. A royal baby is just like every other baby when it comes to what it should be wearing. Dressing the baby/child like royals and upper class from a bygone time is vulgar, snobbish and just plain stupid.


Sent from my iPhone using The Royals Community

[GömdNatt]

Originally Posted by carlota

i knew i would get bashing for my comment - but i maintain my view. it is tacky to dress a kid like this.

the fact that 90% of kids wear whatever alexander is wearing does not make it appropriate, and even less so for a royal child. and whoever dressed alexander does not mater or alter my view in either way: all i care is about the result and the result is vulgar.

nobody's bashing you, we're just utterly confused as to how you think a hoodie and boots is "middle class", "tacky", and "vulgar".

so what do you think they should wear? Sweaters? What kind of shirts? Should they always wear button up shirts or polos? what kind of shoes?

I just think no matter what a child wear, it's always going to be a kid version of adult clothes.

[HRHHermione]

Originally Posted by carlota

i knew i would get bashing for my comment - but i maintain my view. it is tacky to dress a kid like this.



the fact that 90% of kids wear whatever alexander is wearing does not make it appropriate, and even less so for a royal child. and whoever dressed alexander does not mater or alter my view in either way: all i care is about the result and the result is vulgar.

If by bashing, you mean a lot of people were going to tell you that your opinion on this topic is incredibly silly...

Well, I guess you were right. Because it's very silly to suggest that a baby wearing baby clothes that are warm and soft is somehow a class marker that's inappropriate.




Sent from my iPhone using The Royals Community mobile app

[carlota]

Originally Posted by GömdNatt

nobody's bashing you, we're just utterly confused as to how you think a hoodie and boots is "middle class", "tacky", and "vulgar".

so what do you think they should wear? Sweaters? What kind of shirts? Should they always wear button up shirts or polos? what kind of shoes?

I just think no matter what a child wear, it's always going to be a kid version of adult clothes.

check out how victoria and madeleine's kids dress: soft colours, unpretentious, age-appropriate, generic clothing. no black sneakers. no hoodie with a hood the size of 3 times alexander's head. no beanie hats that look like they belong in a rapper's wardrobe.

it is not the hoodie that is an issue. in fact, there are many hoodies out there that are completely kid appropriate. it is just the little details.

Originally Posted by HRHHermione

Well, I guess you were right. Because it's very silly to suggest that a baby wearing baby clothes that are warm and soft is somehow a class marker that's inappropriate.

well, i hate to tell you, but it IS a class marker.


anyway... i guess we can move on from this conversation. i accept that others view this differently but i will maintain my view, and would like not to be judged as 'silly' for doing so. thanks very much!

[GömdNatt]

Originally Posted by carlota

check out how victoria and madeleine's kids dress: soft colours, unpretentious, age-appropriate, generic clothing. no black sneakers. no hoodie with a hood the size of 3 times alexander's head. no beanie hats that look like they belong in a rapper's wardrobe.

it is not the hoodie that is an issue. in fact, there are many hoodies out there that are completely kid appropriate. it is just the little details.


anyway... i guess we can move on from this conversation. i accept that others view this differently but i will maintain my view, and would like not to be judged as 'silly' for doing so. thanks very much!

You and I clearly have a different definition of unpretentious because I find some of the things that Estelle, Leonor, Nicolas, and Oscar have worn to be pretentious, but that tends to come with money. In fact, I find a lot of the adults clothing to be pretentious.

I accept that it's your view, but it's not only incredibly silly, but incredibly insulting. You're welcome to your opinion, but you can't be surprised when people don't agree and find fault and insult with the way you phrase things. It's very classist and just generally insulting and borderline...well, it's troubling the phrases you use sometimes.