Discussion about Sofia Hellqvist's Past & Future Role in the Royal Family

[Archduchess Zelia]

Some of the comments in this thread just ooze 'internalized sexism' from afar. How absolutely sad – nothing makes me cringe more than when women feel the need to condescend and patronise other women – shouldn't we leave that to the men who do it so well already? It's the most disgusting of things. Whatever happened to solidarity? Well, it's certainly long gone in most of these comments.

And yes, everyone are entitled to their own opinions – opinions that have been spewed all over this thread to the point where no one are uncertain that the general opinion of certain posters is that Sofia is an immoral wench – a sort of modern Jezebel – who will be the certain death of the entire nation of Sweden

I hope Sofia will prove all of her critics wrong. I hope she ends up as one of the most hard-working, well-loved and iconic members that the Swedish royal family has ever seen. I truly hope that more than anything – just to get a good laugh out of all these people who have declared her the doom of Sweden not even a week after her engagement to CP.

 

[jjkg]

This discussion reminds me a lot when in 2008 US elections Sarah Palin's candidacy as VP was announced.

Immediately, there was huge erruption and push back from many women, especially young. People have become so used to the empty celebrities and reality TV, that there was seen nothing wrong with her candidacy, lack of skills set, knowledge etc, left or right politics notwithstanding. The overwhelming feeling was "She is just like us", "you are a snob, a judgmental know-it-all" if you are raising objections to her.

In short, she appealed to that innate desire "if she can make it, so can I".


Now, one cannot compare the position of VP of US with bring Princess of Sweden. But I see similar sentiment in works here.

CP and Sofia will not be the crown couple. But this engagement does leave the head shaking. If CP did really, really want to marry her, then he can renounce his rights.

CP and Sofia will be representing Sweden as "spares", unless they live abroad and are totally removed from royal life like King's elder sister(s).

It does not engender respect when an individual has used sex to make money.

IMHO there is a difference between public sex business and private. What MM of Norway did was wild, but it was her personal life, not professional. Similarly, Sofie of Wessex posed topless with her friends. But that private. Same with Letizia (she may or may not have posed).

But Sofia used her sexuality in public as a profession - strange photoshoot, OTT sexuality in her "Paradise Hotel" reality show, being Miss Porn magazine etc.....using her sexuality overtly in almost a pron like fashion to make money and/or gain publicity.

When it is public and for money, then forgive me, it is for everyone's consumption and everyone becomes a consumer, with attendant rights to judge.

So, Sofia, has asked for it.


IMHO, and I hope I am wrong, future will be like that of Sarah Palin. Once the newness wears off, it will be one gaff after another, and her inadequacies & her detriments will be for all to see.


I truly hope I am wrong for the sake of the crown couple and the Queen

 

[jjkg]

would also like to add:

Royalty does not mean that royals lead a puritan life. Heck, King of Sweden's own private sexual life has been less than exemplary, to say nothing about former King of Spain etc.

But what Sofia did was in another category all together. And it is completely different from women who are forced to enter into this business.

And, I would also like to add, it is not about owning one's sexuality. Owning one's sexuality does not mean one get's one's buttocks massaged by another male for TV cameras for the express purpose of public broadcast. Or some of the other *orn like pictures floating around.


She has been dating CP for many years now. She could have truly shown she has turned her life around by going to college/university etc to show she is educating herself so that she can be gainfully employed in professions where she can count on her other skills than her body.

Sorry, working for her own charity is not cutting it because I do-not see much there except photo-ops some of which did not leave a pleasant taste in one's mouth.


These are my 2 cents. Feel free to ignore.

 

[SLV]

People want S to show her worth by going to university. But I think that they are forgetting that university is not for everone.

 

[jjkg]

People want S to show her worth by going to university. But I think that they are forgetting that university is not for everone.

University is just an example....something to show she was trying to prepare herself to earn her living from something other than her sexuality.

Running her own small charity does not cut it, especially when there has been nothing in her past to show she can manage projects, money, or people. Otherwise it is just a scam, a ladder to use to get into public's good eyes.

ETA:
If she was so much into charities, she could have worked for a pre-established one. Actually that would have been wonderful opportunity to learn the ropes.

 

[SElizabeth]

WOW, you just said a mouthful and every word is right on. What has she done during this time to better herself? She has spent lots of money on clothes, hair, make-up, vacations, whatever took her fancy all from PCP who gets his money from the taxpayer. From seeing her and learning about her, all she has done is sell herself to make money on the fact that she is a pretty woman with a good figure, and yet those are just a dime a dozen in this world. I put her on the par with Kim K who has done nothing but make a sex tape and the young foolish kids of today think she is a *star* and she could not act her way out of a wet paper bag. Sex sells period in today's day and age, only 2 things most people care about in this world is 1)sex, 2) money and whatever comes first. What I don't understand is that some here think that a woman should support another woman just because she is a woman..........how can you support a person be they man or woman who does these type of things and then expects people to forgive and forget and then still live off the taxpayers? She might have earned some money doing this posing, if so did she invest it, spend it wisely or use it to further her modeling career? She seems uneducated, lacks grace and dignity, acts like a school girl at times showing off the ring and giggling. Sure she is excited and somehow in viewing all the pictures and video, I really don't think this was a surprise to her at all. I think this was a planned engagement trying to fool everyone into thinking it was a last minute thing........body language says a lot.

 

[Duc_et_Pair]

Prince Carl Philip chose to get engaged and marry the woman he love and find very suitable for royal life in the Swedish Monarchy and his family agree with him because they know Sofia and have spent a great time with her publically and privately.

Those who are busying themselves by judging Sofia harshly and posting inappropriate things online and Madeleine's Facebook page, are most likely those who the royals don't like and will disapprove of.

A monarchy only has a meaning and can only survive when it is 'borne by the people'. These were the words of Queen Beatrix. With choosing controversial partners (also the said Queen's own sons b.t.w.) they ask quite a lot from the people who are supposed to 'borne' the monarchy they live in, which represents their nation and for which they pay their upkeep and maintenance. It is a two-way traffic but it looks like many of present-day royals consider it as a one-way: "I choose my partner and you have to accept it".

 

[LadyFinn]

She's been kind and has held her head up high and with a smile. She's working hard on with Project Playground and promoting the charity and have traveled on it's behalf. She has been very graceful when attending events with the royal family and Prince Carl Philip. I'm not understanding what else people want from this young lady?

Sofia hasn't been graceful in any of the events she has attended organized by the royal family. She poses a lot longer than any royal person and waves and talks with the press like she was the most important guest at the event. She talks in every possible event with the press about Carl Philip and other members of the royal family. Obviously the king doesn't demand the same discretion from her than he demanded from Daniel, Emma and Jonas. But that isn't an excuse for Sofia to babble with the press. She collects money for Project Playground by using the relationships and contacts she has got via Carl Philip and the royal family. She goes down to South Africa perhaps two-three times a year and stays there for a couple of weeks. Frida Vesterberg lives in Langa and deals with the problems they meet every day, Sofia knows hardly anything about that. The royal court has told nothing about how Sofia has earned her living during the first years when she has been with Carl Philip. Now that PP has got donations thanks to Sofia's royal connection, they afford to pay salary for her, I guess.

 

[xenobia]

I'm one of the Swedish taxpayers mentioned in this thread, so I think that my two cents should matter.

Like I said before, I have my reservations about Sofia. But I'm more than willing to give her a chance. Why? Simply because everyone deserves second (and sometimes third and more) chances. We haven't seen her in this new role yet. Best case scenario, IMO, is that she can carve out a role for herself which includes bringing popularity for the monarchy among those who don't approve of it today. She isn't camera shy, and that could prove to be useful further down the line.

I have doubts, yes. But I'm not bitter, and I accept that Carl Philip loves this woman and wants to marry her. I've actually never seen him so happy and outgoing as on the press conference last friday. I hope that trend continues.

And for all of you who doesn't approve: What exactly do you want? Is there anything that can happen, besides from Carl Philip dumping her, that could possibly please you? Will a decade of hard and faultless work from Sofias side be enough? Or is there nothing this couple can do that will ever allow her to - in your eyes - move on and get a new start and a new life together with Carl Philip?

 

[Marengo]

If she was so much into charities, she could have worked for a pre-established one. Actually that would have been wonderful opportunity to learn the ropes.

It is unlikely that an establised NGO -or a company for that matter- would have hired her for a PR/ambassador job (before her royal connection that is). She didn't have any experience, no resumé to speak of, no degrees (high school drop out AFAIK) and since companies usually check social networks etc., I assume that her career in erotic modelling and reality shows also made her an unlikely candidate for a public job, as these companies and NGO's are usually quite strict on protecting their image. Quite frankly, it is likely that any HR person would glance over the application and put it away after a few seconds. She probably would never passed the first round of any hiring process in that line of business. Shallow, unfair, 'she deserves an xth chance', judgemental etc. perhaps, but that is the way how HR usually works. And NGO's are esp. hard to get into in the nice positions, as many very qualified people do apply. A friend of mine works for the NGO Oxfam Novib, she has 2 cum laude master degrees in relevant areas and still had troubles getting a job there (in the end she did).
So in that respect, joining a small new charity created by a friend seems an easier step. And for PP it was also an effective step, her royal fame has worked out very well for their charity since big donors were interested in supporting PP (for example: Elisabeth Tarras-Wahlberg, former marshall of the court, is now in the board of the Postal Code lottery. The lottery became the most important donor for PP).

It is curious that many companies/ NGO's have stricter policies about these things than the Swedish RF/state, since she will be representing Sweden. Of course it is more difficult in this case as the personal is mixed with the job.

 

[Tilia C.]

She might have worked for an NGO, it is not so hard to join them as a volunteer. But there is neither payment nor fame to be expected from that. You might be working away sorting donated clothing or packing food boxes for crisis region. Maybe years of good hard work might get you into the way of a proper position there. But there is no fame in that kind of work, it does not throw you into the way of charity galas with all camera lenses focused on your evening dress and red-lipped smile.

 

[LadyFinn]

I'm one of the Swedish taxpayers mentioned in this thread, so I think that my two cents should matter.

Like I said before, I have my reservations about Sofia. But I'm more than willing to give her a chance. Why? Simply because everyone deserves second (and sometimes third and more) chances. We haven't seen her in this new role yet. Best case scenario, IMO, is that she can carve out a role for herself which includes bringing popularity for the monarchy among those who don't approve of it today. She isn't camera shy, and that could prove to be useful further down the line.

I have doubts, yes. But I'm not bitter, and I accept that Carl Philip loves this woman and wants to marry her. I've actually never seen him so happy and outgoing as on the press conference last friday. I hope that trend continues.

And for all of you who doesn't approve: What exactly do you want? Is there anything that can happen, besides from Carl Philip dumping her, that could possibly please you? Will a decade of hard and faultless work from Sofias side be enough? Or is there nothing this couple can do that will ever allow her to - in your eyes - move on and get a new start and a new life together with Carl Philip?

They can start a life together - as Mr and Mrs Bernadotte somewhere in the country, like Stenhammar. And not attend in any official royal duties. Just the family events.

 

[Pranter]

Does CP do a lot of royal duties now? I didn't think he did....


LaRae

 

[Baron Brockdorf]

Does CP do a lot of royal duties now? I didn't think he did....


LaRae

he does about 40-60 engagements a year on behalf of the crown...its not a big number but its quite frequent when you think of it about 3-5 a month

 

[Icea]

The royal court has posted Sofia's CV online and it does mention that she's taken several courses at Stockholm University and a course at the Institute of English and Business in New York, so I don't understand why everyone is saying she doesn't have any education and hasn't tried to become more "princess-like" since meeting Carl Philip?

Sure, the CV is whitewashed in that it doesn't mention her modeling or time in Paradise Hotel, but to say that she's completely uneducated is harsh.

http://www.kungahuset.se/download/18.44b9de9714527ae8f1d29dc3/1403879674678/CV+SH+eng.pdf

 

[LadyFinn]

Curriculum Vitae with Gaps! Are they ashamed of something in Sofia's past?
Sofia Hellqvist Lebenslauf mit Lücken! BUNTE.de
Translation

 

[Marty91charmed]

Tha curriculum is a farce IMO... anyway no words from Victoria?

 

[xenobia]

They can start a life together - as Mr and Mrs Bernadotte somewhere in the country, like Stenhammar. And not attend in any official royal duties. Just the family events.

So no matter what she does (or doesn't do) from today and in the future, she doesn't deserve a chance to start over again?

 

[LadyFinn]

So no matter what she does (or doesn't do) from today and in the future, she doesn't deserve a chance to start over again?

She has got a new start already. She is seen as some kind of a charity professional and saviour of the poor children in South Africa. She doesn't need a third chance. If she would live a normal life as mrs Bernadotte, stop the eternal flirting and babbling with the press and continue work with her Project Playground, I would give her some respect.

 

[xenobia]

She has got a new start already. She is seen as some kind of a charity professional and saviour of the poor children in South Africa. She doesn't need a third chance. If she would live a normal life as mrs Bernadotte, stop the eternal flirting and babbling with the press and continue work with her Project Playground, I would give her some respect.

Yes, her nearest surroundings - aka the Royal Court including her fiancé - has given her the chance of a new start. But I guess you are not going to give her one. You don't have to either. I was just curious.

 

[Icea]

Yes the CV has gaps, but my point was that you can't claim that she doesn't have any education at all. It would be really easy to check and see if she has attended the courses and so she must have taken them. I'm sure that it would probably quite easy to find otu what grades she got as well, at least for the courses she took in Stockholm.

 

[Dman]

Some of the comments in this thread just ooze 'internalized sexism' from afar. How absolutely sad – nothing makes me cringe more than when women feel the need to condescend and patronise other women – shouldn't we leave that to the men who do it so well already? It's the most disgusting of things. Whatever happened to solidarity? Well, it's certainly long gone in most of these comments.

And yes, everyone are entitled to their own opinions – opinions that have been spewed all over this thread to the point where no one are uncertain that the general opinion of certain posters is that Sofia is an immoral wench – a sort of modern Jezebel – who will be the certain death of the entire nation of Sweden

I hope Sofia will prove all of her critics wrong. I hope she ends up as one of the most hard-working, well-loved and iconic members that the Swedish royal family has ever seen. I truly hope that more than anything – just to get a good laugh out of all these people who have declared her the doom of Sweden not even a week after her engagement to CP.

Due to the sad reality of our society today.

 

[LadyFinn]

Some of the comments in this thread just ooze 'internalized sexism' from afar. How absolutely sad – nothing makes me cringe more than when women feel the need to condescend and patronise other women – shouldn't we leave that to the men who do it so well already? It's the most disgusting of things. Whatever happened to solidarity? Well, it's certainly long gone in most of these comments.

I hope that you would have felt that same way also if Chris O’Neill had been a "glamour model" instead of an investment banker. If he would have been a well known fame seeker with a odd CV (TV-reality show, posing in nude photos, chosen as Mr. Slitz, not working fulltime, going from a party to another party).
For me that would have been even more difficult to accept than this Sofia case. Somehow it is easier to accept that a woman does nude or bikini photos than a man, at least for me. And men are often allowed more easily to marry "lower than themselves" than women.

I also believe, that King Carl Gustaf wouldn't have allowed Madeleine marry Chris, if he had had Sofia's background.

 

[Hans-Rickard]

Hahaha nothing surprises me these days. Like someone already said, the swedish royals have probably learned the lesson the hard way (P Bertil and P Lilian, P Margareta and Robin Douglas) about what happens when young love are kept apart with cold brutality from the elder generations.

This engagement hasn't got as much attention at all in Sweden like the Crown princess engagement or the first engagement of P Madeleine.
It's funny Every time when people who don't live in Sweden belive that they know what every swedish
Citizen are thinking.
I think we should let Charles and Diana be the very last exemple of how things turns out when you are not allowed to marry your love and forced to marry someone you do not love !


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[Lee-Z]

I'm one of the Swedish taxpayers mentioned in this thread, so I think that my two cents should matter.

Like I said before, I have my reservations about Sofia. But I'm more than willing to give her a chance. Why? Simply because everyone deserves second (and sometimes third and more) chances. We haven't seen her in this new role yet. Best case scenario, IMO, is that she can carve out a role for herself which includes bringing popularity for the monarchy among those who don't approve of it today. She isn't camera shy, and that could prove to be useful further down the line.

I have doubts, yes. But I'm not bitter, and I accept that Carl Philip loves this woman and wants to marry her. I've actually never seen him so happy and outgoing as on the press conference last friday. I hope that trend continues.

And for all of you who doesn't approve: What exactly do you want? Is there anything that can happen, besides from Carl Philip dumping her, that could possibly please you? Will a decade of hard and faultless work from Sofias side be enough? Or is there nothing this couple can do that will ever allow her to - in your eyes - move on and get a new start and a new life together with Carl Philip?

Thank you for posting, as a non-Swede there is nothing more i can add to this discussion than you have said above

 

[Cris M]

Now, we know Sofia has received some kind university education. People can't claim she has no education at all, so they came with the "brilliant" argument: "The CV has gaps". What a nonsense.

Oh, and she uses her royal connections to promote charity! What a crime! Wait, royals all over the world uses their royal status and their connections to promote charity. I suppose the Sofia Haters will say that all charity should be stopped. That's their logic.

 

[Duc_et_Pair]

It has nothing to do with Sofia haters or whatever. People who believe in a monarchy tend to believe that this institution represents the best of their society, that its members try to embody the respect and dignity of their country and its institutions, at home and abroad.

This is no different from an ordinary family. When a son comes home with a Harvard or Yale graduate from a "good family" the family will jump up and be happy with the excellent new alliance. When a son comes home with a lady who has made a 'career' as an underwear and nude model, has little prospects on the career market because of a poor curriculum, then also there the family will frown and think twice. And then we are talking about a "normal" family and not about the first family of a country.

With a fitness instructor and an underwear model the message is: anyone can become a royal Prince. If standards are so low that descent, background or prestige does have no any meaning, then people begin to wonder what they are actually cheering and applauding to. A royal family? This dilemma threats all royal families who have thrown all standards out of the palace windows.

 

[COUNTESS]

Look, specifically, this royal family, The Bernadottes, are not royal to begin with. Their founding father was a Marshall in the French Army and was born in a small town of Pau. His wife, Desiree Clary, was the daughter of a silk merchant. They did fine. It really doesn't matter. Many who graduate from prestigious schools go on to do very mundane things and many who went to ordinary schools succeed beyond imagination. Bill Gates never went to college. Steve Jobs started his projects in his garage. President Truman never went to college and he was a bright man. George W. went to Harvard and Yale and is a fool. Camilla never worked, except a short time and lived fine and became a famous mistress and will be Queen. They are young and happy and in love. That is the best thing. They will do well.

 

[Elenath]

Look, specifically, this royal family, The Bernadottes, are not royal to begin with. Their founding father was a Marshall in the French Army and was born in a small town of Pau. His wife, Desiree Clary, was the daughter of a silk merchant. They did fine. It really doesn't matter. Many who graduate from prestigious schools go on to do very mundane things and many who went to ordinary schools succeed beyond imagination. Bill Gates never went to college. Steve Jobs started his projects in his garage. President Truman never went to college and he was a bright man. George W. went to Harvard and Yale and is a fool. Camilla never worked, except a short time and lived fine and became a famous mistress and will be Queen. They are young and happy and in love. That is the best thing. They will do well.

No one was "royal to begin with". Every royal family started with one person not being royal but declaring himself as such. Usually after winning some big battle/war.


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[COUNTESS]

No one was "royal to begin with". Every royal family started with one person not being royal but declaring himself as such. Usually after winning some big battle/war.


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Of course, you are right. Royal is a made up appellation, when some guy had a big sword and took the town.