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  #1661  
Old 10-05-2007, 05:12 PM
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Originally Posted by ysbel View Post
Ladies, help me please.

I'm having a hard time understanding how Diana's mental illness or lack of mental illness is going to affect whether Charles ascends the throne.

One could say that part of Charles and Camilla's lack of popularity and acceptance is because of the publicity campaign that Diana waged against them and because of her mental instability, Diana's truthfulness during the campaign can rightfully be questioned.

But I'm not getting that understanding from your comments. What impact exactly do you find that state of Diana's mental health (good or bad) had on Charles' ability to ascend the throne?
I would say that Diana's mental illness played a part in whether or not Charles would ascend the throne because I think it was a major factor in the divorce itself and most especially how it affected her behavior that led up to the divorce both in Charles's eyes and most especially in HM eventually agreeing to the divorce and urging Diana to proceed with it in a timely fashion. The divorce and remarriage of Prince Charles to Camilla certainly had a potential impact and had not the government and major opposition of the day decided not to make an issue of it, could have potentially resulted in Prince Charles not ascending to the throne?
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  #1662  
Old 10-05-2007, 05:33 PM
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Originally Posted by diamondBrg View Post
I would say that Diana's mental illness played a part in whether or not Charles would ascend the throne because I think it was a major factor in the divorce itself and most especially how it affected her behavior that led up to the divorce both in Charles's eyes and most especially in HM eventually agreeing to the divorce and urging Diana to proceed with it in a timely fashion. The divorce and remarriage of Prince Charles to Camilla certainly had a potential impact and had not the government and major opposition of the day decided not to make an issue of it, could have potentially resulted in Prince Charles not ascending to the throne?
Thanks for answering DiamondBrg. Well a divorce can have an impact on opinions about Charles ascending the throne but do you think the divorce in and of itself would have caused public opinion to turn against Charles?

I am thinking of the divorce of Prince Joachim and Princess Alexandra and while Joachim was not heir to the throne, there are hints that either one or the other person was unfaithful in the marriage and the public reception to Joachim and his new wife seems to be much better than that experienced by Charles and Camilla.

I realize that Joachim is not heir to the throne; however, I don't believe that is the only reason that Joachim got a different reception upon his divorce and remarriage than Charles did.
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  #1663  
Old 10-05-2007, 05:59 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ysbel View Post
Thanks for answering DiamondBrg. Well a divorce can have an impact on opinions about Charles ascending the throne but do you think the divorce in and of itself would have caused public opinion to turn against Charles?

I am thinking of the divorce of Prince Joachim and Princess Alexandra and while Joachim was not heir to the throne, there are hints that either one or the other person was unfaithful in the marriage and the public reception to Joachim and his new wife seems to be much better than that experienced by Charles and Camilla.

I realize that Joachim is not heir to the throne; however, I don't believe that is the only reason that Joachim got a different reception upon his divorce and remarriage than Charles did.
Had Diana conducted herself properly, not have engaged in multiple intimate liaisons while still married to Prince Charles, not have engaged in a public relations war with both Prince Charles and the monoarchy as a whole, not have made obvious attempts to "upstage" and embarass him and Prince Charles had simply divorced her because he wanted his mistress?

I think that could have possibly cost him the throne?
  #1664  
Old 10-05-2007, 06:05 PM
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Originally Posted by diamondBrg View Post
No, she was severely mentally ill and traumatized from a very neglected childhood and expected Prince Charles to make right everything that had gone wrong in her life. Had she not been blond, blue eyed and beautiful and titled, she most likely would have ended up in an Institution for the Mentally Ill. Instead her family and Prince Charles Grandmother manipulated him into a marriage with her.
The idea Diana was "mentally ill" or manipulated into her marriage has been debunked over and over again. It's true she suffered from an eating disorder, as did her sister, Lady Sarah, and bulimia certainly contributes to depression. She sought treatment and eventually was able to overcome her problem.

Diana and Charles both have stated they got married because they loved each other and for no other reason. While they both may have had doubts about the other, they did have a relatively happy marriage in the early years and enjoyed each other's company. The boys were a joy in their lives and both worked hard in carrying out their public duties.

Diana knew all about Camilla from the start and she did have bouts of jealousy over their friendship. Only when she herself turned outside her marriage for comfort did Charles do the same by resuming his relationship with Camilla. That was the beginning of the end and they both contributed to the eventual failure of the marriage.

Diana became paranoid and angry with the idea Charles fought comfort and friendship with Camilla. The more she focused on it, the more her negative side came out. She became convinced there was a plan to ease her out in favor of eventual remarriage. She refused The Queen and Prince Philip's assurances and offers of help. Eventually, she took her case to the media and tabloids, which was the final nail in the coffin.

Despite all of this, Diana was treated with the highest level of respect and dignity by The Queen, even when she didn't always deserve it. She was the mother of a future king and the weight of her position was always given full support by The Queen.

Once the divorce was over, Diana and Charles became friends again and were rebuilding their relationship for the sake of the boys. She had a good relationship with The Queen and was on her way to regaining a worthwhile public role. Sadly, her time had come and she passed away in a tragic accident.

It's time to let The Princess rest in peace. Charles has remarried and Camilla is now his wife. When the time comes, they will be King and Queen and that's how life goes.
  #1665  
Old 10-05-2007, 06:09 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by diamondBrg
Had Diana conducted herself properly, not have engaged in multiple intimate liaisons while still married to Prince Charles, not have engaged in a public relations war with both Prince Charles and the monoarchy as a whole, not have made obvious attempts to "upstage" and embarass him and Prince Charles had simply divorced her because he wanted his mistress?

I think that could have possibly cost him the throne?

.
Well I agree that playing all the troubles in the marriage on a public stage had to have affected both Diana's and Charles reputation in the long run and with Charles' reputation goes the reputation of the monarchy as an institution to some extent because he is the heir.

I also agree that Diana preferred more than Charles to play her pain on a public stage.

But I don't necessarily think that mental illness caused Diana to do this; one doesn't need to be mentally ill to want to show the world how horrible another person is. If someone is mentally ill though, one would question that person's judgment though of how horrible the other person really was.

The effects though would be the same whether one is mentally ill or not , don't you think?

Do you think that the aftereffects of playing the marriage troubles on a public stage will still have an impact on whether Charles will be King?

.
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  #1666  
Old 10-05-2007, 06:13 PM
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Originally Posted by branchg View Post
It's time to let The Princess rest in peace. Charles has remarried and Camilla is now his wife. When the time comes, they will be King and Queen and that's how life goes.
Well it appears that what DiamondBrg is saying is that it will affect Charles' ability to be King which is why I am asking the question of why she thinks this way.
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  #1667  
Old 10-05-2007, 06:19 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ysbel View Post
Well I agree that playing all the troubles in the marriage on a public stage had to have affected both Diana's and Charles reputation in the long run and with Charles' reputation goes the reputation of the monarchy as an institution to some extent because he is the heir.

I also agree that Diana preferred more than Charles to play her pain on a public stage.

But I don't necessarily think that mental illness caused Diana to do this; one doesn't need to be mentally ill to want to show the world how horrible another person is. If someone is mentally ill though, one would question that person's judgment though of how horrible the other person really was.

The effects though would be the same whether one is mentally ill or not , don't you think?

Do you think that the aftereffects of playing the marriage troubles on a public stage will still have an impact on whether Charles will be King?

.
Perhaps you are right. I do agree that if even a few more years pass before HM deceases, there really is no doubt that Prince Charles will become King.
  #1668  
Old 10-05-2007, 06:19 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by diamondBrg View Post
I would say that Diana's mental illness played a part in whether or not Charles would ascend the throne because I think it was a major factor in the divorce itself and most especially how it affected her behavior that led up to the divorce both in Charles's eyes and most especially in HM eventually agreeing to the divorce and urging Diana to proceed with it in a timely fashion. The divorce and remarriage of Prince Charles to Camilla certainly had a potential impact and had not the government and major opposition of the day decided not to make an issue of it, could have potentially resulted in Prince Charles not ascending to the throne?
Diana's "illness" had nothing to do with whether Charles could or would ascend the throne. The Act of Settlement governs the succession and Charles is next in-line after the death of The Queen as the lineal descendant of The Electress Sophia. Unless Parliament acts otherwise, he will automatically be King.

The divorce did raise questions as to whether The Church would accept a divorced King on the throne. While these were important issues, there is nothing in the law stopping The King from being a divorcee or marrying a divorcee. Technically, the Church is subordinate to the King as Supreme Governor.

The comparisons to Edward VIII and his proposed marriage to Wallis Simpson do not apply whatsoever. For one thing, Charles is already married to Camilla and she shares his titles and rank. For another, The Church accepted his remarriage and there is no longer a prohibition on divorce or remarriage in the faith.
  #1669  
Old 10-05-2007, 06:21 PM
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Branchg wrote:

"The idea Diana was "mentally ill" or manipulated into her marriage has been debunked over and over again."

-------------------------------------------------------------------------

Do you consider someone who literally pushes an older lady down a flight of stairs on purpose mentally stable?
  #1670  
Old 10-05-2007, 06:26 PM
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Diana pushed Raine out of anger and rage, Raine had forgiven Diana and by the time of her death Diana and Raine were very good friends.
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  #1671  
Old 10-05-2007, 06:31 PM
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Guys, let's keep the thread on topic to whether Charles will ever reign.

Now if any of you think that Diana pushing Raine down the stairs has anything to do with whether Charles will ascend the throne, that would be amazing but I confess not really believable.
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  #1672  
Old 10-05-2007, 06:32 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ysbel View Post
Guys, let's keep the thread on topic to whether Charles will ever reign.

Now if any of you think that Diana pushing Raine down the stairs has anything to do with whether Charles will ascend the throne, that would be amazing but I confess not really believable.
OK, sorry!
  #1673  
Old 10-05-2007, 06:39 PM
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Originally Posted by ysbel View Post
Guys, let's keep the thread on topic to whether Charles will ever reign.

Now if any of you think that Diana pushing Raine down the stairs has anything to do with whether Charles will ascend the throne, that would be amazing but I confess not really believable.
Sorry I just read your comment.
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  #1674  
Old 10-05-2007, 06:41 PM
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That's quite alright, diamondBrg and sirhon. I understand that on a hot topic a lot of members cross post without seeing the last message.

Now that this is settled maybe we can go back to our regularly scheduled program.

Cheers.
ysbel.
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  #1675  
Old 10-05-2007, 07:08 PM
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Which Government people will be involved What about the Lord Chaberlain (sp) Bishop of London ect ect
  #1676  
Old 10-05-2007, 07:12 PM
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Hopefully not...
  #1677  
Old 10-05-2007, 09:50 PM
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They'll both definitely be there. I don't think either of them take an active role though.
  #1678  
Old 10-06-2007, 01:16 PM
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Which ones take an active role
  #1679  
Old 10-06-2007, 01:55 PM
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According to the order of service... ( The Coronation of Queen Elizabeth II )

The Archbishops, Garter King of Arms, Lord Great Chamberlain (not the Lord Chamberlain), Lord High Constable, the Dean of Westminster, Moderator of the General Assembly of the Church of Scotland, whatever Royal Dukes there are living at the time, the senior peer of each degree, and unnamed people who bear things such as the swords.
  #1680  
Old 12-13-2007, 03:23 PM
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So, I'm sitting on the bus and wondering why the man who's just got on has a plastic dog in a wicker basket under his arm and it strikes me. Why is it that people feel it sensible to say, "The Queen has good genes, she'll last to 100". Well, doesn't Charles have the same genes? Surely he's guaranteed to make 80?
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