Camilla and The Public

[Denville]

If Camilla and Charles were more concerned about their happiness than what the public thinks why would they approve of Penny Junor's biography? It is described as a 'definitive account' .. 'star-crossed love story of the past 50 years', according to Harper Collins.

What's your point? I don't know if they approved of it, but they are public figures and as such of course they are going to want positive coverage. However I don't believe that Camilla or Charles busts a gut to get it, or worries too much about it. THey know that there will be criticism and also "gushy" unrealistic praise..Of course they will be pleased if they get good press, but it isn't going to fundamentaly change what they do...

 

[Tsaritsa]

It has been years since I posted. I can only believe I've felt prompted by the anniversary of Diana's death. I was surprised that all the programmes about her stirred up my feelings at the time it happened..................however, despite that I've been virulently anti Camilla, I can only conclude -although it doesn't sit entirely comfortably- that in my view, she's a far more suitable and appropriate wife for him than Diana. This view takes nothing away from Diana and her many achievements -the greatest of which HAS to be her two wonderful boys who are such a credit to her- but on the day she married Charles, I made the pronouncement "Sadly, there are far more than thirteen chronological years which separate them, but at least she's making the one marriage which can't fail"!!!!
It's impossible to compare their relationships. On the one hand we had a naive 19 year old girl, overwhelmed and deferential to an older man who just happened to be The Prince of Wales, getting married to a man she simply didn't know, to be balanced against a relationship of equals -I feel certain Camilla would only have ever payed lip service to being deferential- which would have made it easier for a friendship -based on all the important things they had in common- to form. That friendship has endured for the best part of 40 years. There was no way Diana -with all her many attributes- was going to break it.

 

[MARG]

I have the exact opposite view of Charles. He was 'in touch' and very much a man of the people before he was with Diana. As his marriage disintegrated he reverted more and more to the typical upper class nobleman, of Diana's standing, and lost touch and became 'dehumanised'. The valet with the toothbrush story was during the Diana years - and after he damaged him shoulder.

He is more in touch with the average person now than he was in the 80s - and that is Camilla - she has brought him back to where he was before Diana.

Most Diana fans don't look beyond her looks (I know Diana fans who claim she 'couldn't lie as she was young and beautiful' as if being young and beautiful meant she couldn't lie) to see the negative impact she had on Charles - making him miserable from almost day 1. He lost his common touch, he lost his ability to laugh at himself, he took himself way too seriously when Diana was around but now he is the fun loving man he was in the 70s again.

Sadly the public don't want that - they want the miserable man in an unhappy marriage so that Diana could be happy.

I have to agree with your observation of Charles in relation to being in touch with the average man. By the time Charles married he had long come to the conclusion that his mother was not going to pass away anytime soon and took advantage of the almost unique opportunity to create a "Prince of Wales job", starting with the Princes Trust and he's still creating.

Like it or not each one in the so-called CDC triangle had their own life and their own history. They were not just a husband or wife, they were their own person. Camilla's permanent appearance in his life has been a very positive one. She gives Charles unconditional love and support and enables him to be the best he can be.

Meanwhile, Camilla has quietly set about supporting causes near and dear to her. Bone disease, animal welfare, reading, were an uncontroversial choice and over time she has progressed to such causes as aid and support to Rape victims, domestic violence victims, etc. and she has received quite good news coverage for those causes she supports. She will see more good coverage once we move on from the anniversary of Diana's death.

 

[M. Payton]

That is just what I would like to know. One thing I do know about Camilla is that she loves animals and has taken rescue dogs into her own home and raised....anyone that loves dogs or any animal and brings them home show to me that there is gold in that heart....for that I am a fan of hers. The past is just that......The Past, done and over with!

One thing I would like to know and it really isn't any of my business, are the dogs allowed in the bedroom? Mine rules my bedroom...he bites if yr not accepted in our home.....

So I want to learn more about what she does and whom she supports in charities. I do know that she has a wonderful marriage and that says a lot in today's society.

 

[Osipi]

One thing I do truly admire about Camilla is that she's the kind of person that is comfortable in her own skin enough to just be herself. I can very much understand why once she is a friend that she is a friend that can be counted on to be a steadfast friend and a keeper of confidences. Everyone that has had occasion to meet her see a warm, down to earth and witty person that truly seems to enjoy being where she is.

As M. Payton mentions, she is an advocate for animals and I remember well when she visited a rescue shelter and went home with Bluebell. Even more, for me, I respect her for her work in literacy and encouraging children to explore the wonderful world of books. As a dedicated armchair traveler myself, it warms my heart to see Camilla promoting the love of reading.

Camilla is actually the kind of person that puts the capital C in consort. She knows her role in the royal family and sometimes I see a lot of the Queen Mother and Philip in Camilla. She knows and understands Charles, his needs, his idiosyncrasies, his passions and his way of doing things and with that knowing, Charles has someone who does truly love him for who he is. Like a pair of comfortable old shoes, this is a couple that don't need to be in each other's back pockets constantly and are able to be individuals. He can have the peace and solitude of nature around him as he quietly sits and paints while she has a rip roaring time with her grandchildren creating an ungodly mess in the kitchen making cookies.

It doesn't happen often but when a marriage encourages individuality with loving support, it brings out the best in each partner and that is what I believe that Charles and Camilla have. Being such a private couple, we rarely get a glimpse into their private lives and that's the way it should be. Unfortunately, without the proverbial fly on the wall, what the general public still sees and forms opinions on is what was long ago. I may be the odd person in the bunch but I do think that without Camilla's support, understanding, comfort and compassion, Charles' experiences in life would have had a more detrimental effect on him. To see him now as a happy, smiling, more comfortable man in his own skin is attesting to the love of a good woman besides him.

 

[AuroraB]

One thing I do truly admire about Camilla is that she's the kind of person that is comfortable in her own skin enough to just be herself. I can very much understand why once she is a friend that she is a friend that can be counted on to be a steadfast friend and a keeper of confidences. Everyone that has had occasion to meet her see a warm, down to earth and witty person that truly seems to enjoy being where she is.

As M. Payton mentions, she is an advocate for animals and I remember well when she visited a rescue shelter and went home with Bluebell. Even more, for me, I respect her for her work in literacy and encouraging children to explore the wonderful world of books. As a dedicated armchair traveler myself, it warms my heart to see Camilla promoting the love of reading.

Camilla is actually the kind of person that puts the capital C in consort. She knows her role in the royal family and sometimes I see a lot of the Queen Mother and Philip in Camilla. She knows and understands Charles, his needs, his idiosyncrasies, his passions and his way of doing things and with that knowing, Charles has someone who does truly love him for who he is. Like a pair of comfortable old shoes, this is a couple that don't need to be in each other's back pockets constantly and are able to be individuals. He can have the peace and solitude of nature around him as he quietly sits and paints while she has a rip roaring time with her grandchildren creating an ungodly mess in the kitchen making cookies.

It doesn't happen often but when a marriage encourages individuality with loving support, it brings out the best in each partner and that is what I believe that Charles and Camilla have. Being such a private couple, we rarely get a glimpse into their private lives and that's the way it should be. Unfortunately, without the proverbial fly on the wall, what the general public still sees and forms opinions on is what was long ago. I may be the odd person in the bunch but I do think that without Camilla's support, understanding, comfort and compassion, Charles' experiences in life would have had a more detrimental effect on him. To see him now as a happy, smiling, more comfortable man in his own skin is attesting to the love of a good woman besides him.

Amen

 

[JessRulz]

A number of posts debating the ever-circular Charles-Diana-Camilla triangle have been removed. Unless you are specifically linking, to the moderating teams' satisfaction, Diana to the 'Camilla and the Public' topic, Diana is off-topic and further posts discussing her will be deleted.

 

[FashionMaven]

I have to disagree with this. Not because I think you are wrong but because I see things perhaps from a different perspective as it relates to my own experiences in life.

When seeing Camilla now that I've come to get to *know* her more by actually following her here on TRF and searching for more information outside of the tabloid headlines that were basically all that formed my opinions on Camilla back during the 80s and 90s, I've come to see a Camilla that perhaps a lot of people don't see.

When things go wrong in life and there's no finding a solution or finding any sense of peace and serenity, especially as in this case with Charles' marriage, it can be quite overwhelming and distressful and it feels like there is no where to turn. The greatest blessing during these times is a best friend. One that believes in you, one that supports you no matter what and one that is always there for you when you need them. A true port in storm that helps you keep your feet on the ground and anchored in reality and gives you the courage to forge ahead. I believe it was because Camilla was this kind of support system for Charles when the marriage had gotten to the point where there was no hope of it ever working out, that Charles was able to maintain and keep going ahead with his life. I think it was Camilla that made it much easier to maintain keeping a public facade on the "irrevocably broken" marriage as long as it did until there was no other option than to divorce.

I know this by experience. I had such a best friend when my first marriage was beyond repair. That's all it was too. Platonic best friends. When I needed support and encouragement or anything at all, it was there for me. It did happen that I lost contact with my best friend for years after the divorce was final but upon meeting again, that friendship was still as strong as ever and this October we'll be celebrating 20 years of marriage. This is why I do believe that Camilla is perhaps the best thing that's ever happened to Charles. It wasn't just an affair. It wasn't just a fling but it was years of building a strong, trusting and intimate relationship as friends outside of a romantic involvement that has made their marriage one that is truly a happy union between two people that sincerely love each other.

I've come to see the strength and resolve in Camilla that tells me that no matter what the public thinks, no matter what title she is "known" by or whether or not she sits in Westminster Abbey being crowned along side her Charles, her top priority now as it has been for a long while is to be the best friend she has always been to Charles and she will support him in any way that she humanly can. She's a person that can gladly put her husband first and foremost in her life simply because she loves him.

I prefer to focus on what Camilla's doing now. Trying to excuse her presence in a marriage from an emotional-friend standpoint still means she was an obstacle for the marriage. Her presence as a best friend helped to doom the marriage and led to the physical affair. Trying to "laud" her for that is weird. That's why the marriage was doomed, lol. Excusing or lauding her for that makes people dig deeper in their dislike for her. If Charles hadn't been married - yes - what she did would have been admirable. Since he was, it isn't. Sorry.

That's why now I like to focus more on what I see Camilla doing today. Camilla seems to have settled into her role nicely and she's kinda killing it. She's really doing the most to make sure she's a good working royal and a good princess. I think she is now a respected royal - even if she will honestly never be liked. I can't stand her but I respect her - or at least her position. She's done good work, which for me is a far better defense of who she is now.

For that reason (and that reason alone because I still hate what she did to Charles' marriage on a visceral level) she should be Queen when Charles becomes King.

I think her relationship with the public will only continue to improve based on her current actions IF folks stop trying to defend the indefensible. That just makes it worse and triggers folks becoming entrenched.

 

[FashionMaven]

If Camilla and Charles were more concerned about their happiness than what the public thinks why would they approve of Penny Junor's biography? It is described as a 'definitive account' .. 'star-crossed love story of the past 50 years', according to Harper Collins.

I agree with this.

It's also why before Charles married Camilla they put out so much press that she "would be Princess Consort" when he became King. It was a bait and switch to get the public to not be so against him marrying her - and then they began a careful plan to elevate Camilla after that through good works.

It's kinda working - but it is still definitely a bait and switch.

 

[Osipi]

I prefer to focus on what Camilla's doing now. Trying to excuse her presence in a marriage from an emotional-friend standpoint still means she was an obstacle for the marriage. Her presence as a best friend helped to doom the marriage and led to the physical affair. Trying to "laud" her for that is weird. That's why the marriage was doomed, lol. Excusing or lauding her for that makes people dig deeper in their dislike for her. If Charles hadn't been married - yes - what she did would have been admirable. Since he was, it isn't. Sorry.

Think about it this way. If Charles' marriage had been a happy and healthy one and secure, no one and their wild horses would have affected it. People usually don't go looking for a repairman until the appliance has broken down.

I agree with you that the Camilla we see today is a strong consort for Charles and has served the "Firm" admirably over the years. It is her role and her support of Charles in the here and now that is most important. People are genuinely warming up to her and those that have met her find her to be a warm hearted, down to earth person with a good outlook on life.

 

[FashionMaven]

Think about it this way. If Charles' marriage had been a happy and healthy one and secure, no one and their wild horses would have affected it. People usually don't go looking for a repairman until the appliance has broken down.

The appliance in this case didn't break down by itself, I don't find this to be an adequate reasoning to excuse Camilla's active part in the breakdown of it. People say this all the time to excuse an adulterer/mistress in marriage - and it doesn't hold well in my opinion.

I agree with you that the Camilla we see today is a strong consort for Charles and has served the "Firm" admirably over the years. It is her role and her support of Charles in the here and now that is most important. People are genuinely warming up to her and those that have met her find her to be a warm hearted, down to earth person with a good outlook on life.

Well then that's what everyone should focus on, imo.

And when people rightfully point out the harm she caused that should simply be accepted and acknowledge without trying to justify it. Justification is actually a defensive maneuver meant to distance Camilla from her wrongdoing. Best to just accept the criticism, acknowledge it but don't feed it and get on with her royal duties. That's what she's doing and I think that's a good way to help her with the public.

 

[Osipi]

The appliance in this case didn't break down by itself, I don't find this to be an adequate reasoning to excuse Camilla's active part in the breakdown of it. People say this all the time to excuse an adulterer/mistress in marriage - and it doesn't hold well in my opinion.

When we set the stage to really look at things objectively, we find that there were many, many more players involved than just three. Out of all of them, what remains today is two people still strongly supporting each other. That is the gist of it all. The rest needs to be filed away in the ancient history folder.

 

[FashionMaven]

When we set the stage to really look at things objectively, we find that there were many, many more players involved than just three. Out of all of them, what remains today is two people still strongly supporting each other. That is the gist of it all. The rest needs to be filed away in the ancient history folder.

Well, generally speaking, I think we do better when we allow people to feel upset about what happened. I think Camilla does better there too. She allows it but doesn't feed into it or even try to defend it. She just focuses on doing her best to be the best royal she can be.

She hasn't won me over per se - but I respect the work she's doing and I can sympathize with her feelings before the marriage when she wasn't allowed into the BRF. That doesn't excuse for me what came later but I can understand and sympathize with her position better.

But like we said - I prefer to focus on what she's doing now. Even thinking of how long they've stuck together still leaves a bad taste because that shouldn't have happened. Can't praise her for it - at best I can just acknowledge that it was very unfortunate and look at her actions today.

I do think she's trying very hard to be the best she can be and that helps her more in my eyes than any defense attempts on her part or others.

 

[Curryong]

There is a 'star-crossed lovers' narrative that seems to have been peddled by certain writers and journalist over the last few years. It seems to consist of Charles and Camilla falling deeply in love but realising that their love could never be, because of tradition and expectations.

In fact, Charles didn't propose to Camilla before she married APB. He apparently whiffle waffled about being too young, and, (it's been surmised), because Camilla had had lovers and was therefore unacceptable to the BRF. There's never been any evidence that he spoke to his parents about his feelings for Camilla during this period, though he clearly was in love.

It's just a shame that Charles didn't make his mind up that Camilla was 'non-negotiable' to him then, before two marriages were wrecked and four children affected.

It's often taken for granted that Camilla was as deeply in love as Charles was. Yes, she was deeply in love, just not with the POW, though she was probably fond of him.

However, every indication is that it was Andrew PB who was in her sights, that she was determined to become his wife, even though he was a prominent womaniser, and she adored him.

Charles went out with Camilla while Andrew was serving in the army in Ireland, so neither of them minded cheating on a man Camilla was obsessed with marrying. It is very very doubtful that even if Charles had mentioned marriage Camilla would have accepted, IMO.

 

[Dman]

Don’t Penny Junor ever get tired of trying to rewrite history? She and so many others have been trying to do this for such a long time.

 

[TLLK]

I do think she's trying very hard to be the best she can be and that helps her more in my eyes than any defense attempts on her part or others.

I agree and at this point in time this is all that she can do.

 

[Queen Claude]

Don’t Penny Junor ever get tired of trying to rewrite history? She and so many others have been trying to do this for such a long time.

I am not a big fan of Junor's but it is not a given that the first version of the story was the true version. IIRC even Andrew Morton said that "her true story" does not equate to "the true story".

I understand the points that are being made above that perhaps it would be wiser to focus on the present and not try to explain or justify what went on in the past but that does not mean that there is not additional information that is valid. Also I do think that there may be people who are captivated by the Charles and Camilla love story, although I agree with the point above that the "star-crossed lovers" version may have actually been more one-sided in the earlier years.

 

[Nico]

Don’t Penny Junor ever get tired of trying to rewrite history? She and so many others have been trying to do this for such a long time.

"Rewriting History" implies that the real story is well known. As far i know it's not the case (and don't talk to me about Morton).
I think Junor was not too far off the mark...

 

[Dman]

"Rewriting History" implies that the real story is well known. As far i know it's not the case (and don't talk to me about Morton).
I think Junor was not too far off the mark...

She and Morton (among others) just don’t get enough. They’ve been rewriting these people’s lives for a long time now.

It’s like enough is enough.

Part of the public has embraced Camilla, so let’s just leave it at that.

 

[XeniaCasaraghi]

You know 90% of people talked about how Camilla looked in the 90's and I was one of them. But though I used to remark back then that she aged fast, she has definitely stopped aging in the last decade; she often looks so radiant.

 

[Jacknch]

Please note that posts speculating on cosmetic surgery and smoking have been deleted. We do not encourage such speculation and with regard to smoking, we have the following thread: http://www.theroyalforums.com/forums/f161/which-royals-smoke-1918.html

 

[Duc_et_Pair]

You know 90% of people talked about how Camilla looked in the 90's and I was one of them. But though I used to remark back then that she aged fast, she has definitely stopped aging in the last decade; she often looks so radiant.

I agree. She can look drop dead glamorous in ceremonial wear Picture.
In long daywear (like in Amsterdam): Picture.
And of course her usual BIG hats and BIG chokers: Picture.|

The last old-style female royal in the core royal family, I would say.

 

[Purrs]

I have warmed to Camilla considerably over the years.

She is hard working and I admire her charitable work including the work she's done on domestic abuse. She's been very supportive to Prince Charles who seems much happier and more relaxed since their marriage than I've ever since him before.

 

[Terri Terri]

Oh I have definitely warmed to Camilla especially since her warm relationship with Meghan. Let me just say that I was a Diana fan and didn't care for Charles or Camilla in particular. But seeing how they have both welcomed and supported Meghan as a woman of colour has changed my mind about them completely!

It has ben almost 21 years since Diana's death! Time to forget the past and look to the future!

 

[MARG]

I think Camilla has more than earned the respect due to her position. She is an extremely hard worker and also seems to be someone who is easy to talk to judging by the videos of her speaking to people during her engagements, I admire the way she supports Prince Charles and also both Harry and Meghan.

 

[jacqui24]

I think both sides on this affair issue are wrong. At the end of the day, Charles and Camilla did have an affair while both are married. Of course people will be upset. I love Charles and Camilla now, but I always thought it was terribly unwise to go on justifying his own action. He says the marriage was irretrievably broken, but guess what? He hasn't left. It was an affair in every sense of the word. Own it and move on.

On the other hand, cheating isn't a good thing, but good people do not so good things sometimes. Cheating isn't the worst thing in this world, and I'm speaking as someone who has been cheated on. You learn and you move on. It's been over 20 years since the Waleses divorced. Time to let it go.

I think Camilla has done great work in literacy and domestic violence. Top it off, she seems like an awesome lady to be around. Just because she had an affair, doesn't change all that.

 

[M. Payton]

And lets not forget her work with animals as she herself has adopted dogs and still to this day they live with her and Charles. She is a big animal lover and that is something huge in my book......I give her tons of credit for all that she has accomplished on her own. She and Charles in my book are highly underestimated by most everyone.?

 

[Osipi]

I think what I have come to know and like about Camilla is that what you see is what you get with her. She's real. She's down to earth and a woman very comfortable in her own skin. Along with tackling some very serious issues, I sometimes catch her "inner child" when she is around animals and reading with children. She has done wonders for Charles and together they make a pretty good team of things.

 

[MARG]

I think both sides on this affair issue are wrong. At the end of the day, Charles and Camilla did have an affair while both are married. Of course people will be upset. I love Charles and Camilla now, but I always thought it was terribly unwise to go on justifying his own action. He says the marriage was irretrievably broken, but guess what? He hasn't left. It was an affair in every sense of the word. Own it and move on.

On the other hand, cheating isn't a good thing, but good people do not so good things sometimes. Cheating isn't the worst thing in this world, and I'm speaking as someone who has been cheated on. You learn and you move on. It's been over 20 years since the Waleses divorced. Time to let it go.

I think Camilla has done great work in literacy and domestic violence. Top it off, she seems like an awesome lady to be around. Just because she had an affair, doesn't change all that.

This is not a thread about events that took place over 21 years ago. It is about Camilla and the public and by its very nature is current. When and where will we ever be able to discuss Camilla without someone dredging up ancient history!

 

[jacqui24]

This is not a thread about events that took place over 21 years ago. It is about Camilla and the public and by its very nature is current. When and where will we ever be able to discuss Camilla without someone dredging up ancient history!

No one can deny what happened decades ago has a HUGE impact on The Duchess of Cornwall and Prince of Wales' standing with the public. There is NO reason why they should continuously poll as low as they do if that didn't happen. Absolutely none.