Diana's Styles and Titles

[BeatrixFan]

I'm not ruling it out on the basis of personal opinion. I'm ruling it out on the basis of common sense and decency. It won't happen.

 

[sirhon11234]

BeatrixFan how do you know that it won't happen. We didn't know that after charles and Diana got divorced that she would die a year later or how do we know that Charles will predecease the Queen anything can happen.

 

[BeatrixFan]

No, anything cannot happen. This is an institution built on 1,000 years of history. Let's get this into perspective. Diana wasn't a member of the Royal Family for very long. When she departed, she embarrassed them. She voluntarily gave up her HRH. There is absolutely no reason why she should get the HRH back.

 

[ClassicRoyal]

I believe that by being the mother of the future King of England, Princess Diana will always be a part of the royal family. What a nice touch it would be if William did make the decision to restore his mother's HRH style. What would it hurt anyway - it would warm hearts and allow her memory some peaceful closure.

 

[Madame Royale]

Diana wasn't a member of the Royal Family for very long. When she departed.

Yes she was BeatrixFan.

Even after the divorce, Diana remained a member of the royal family, something Queen went to lengths to ensure.

It is even mentioned in Gyles Brandreth's Philip & Elizabeth - Portrait of a Marriage.

she embarrassed them

As did her hsband if you really feel it necessary to play the blame game.

 

[Elspeth]

Before this gets sidetracked into a discussion of Charles versus Diana, is this really a useful line of discussion? Since we're talking about something that may or may not be an issue in the future, and since we don't know what the future necessarily holds, it doesn't seem as though there's very much productive discussion to be had on the subject of what William may or may not do about his mother's title or anything else about her.

 

[BeatrixFan]

I just find it quite amazing that people are so desperate to see three letters given to a woman who a) didn't deserve them and b) didn't want them. Quite bizarre.

 

[Madame Royale]

Before this gets sidetracked into a discussion of Charles versus Diana, is this really a useful line of discussion? Since we're talking about something that may or may not be an issue in the future, and since we don't know what the future necessarily holds, it doesn't seem as though there's very much productive discussion to be had on the subject of what William may or may not do about his mother's title or anything else about her.

I agree Elspeth,

My intention is not to start a Wales's debate (I'm so over that) but I think it only right to note that blame is not something that should be directed at any one person. That's the only point I wished to make and I of course shall leave it there.

How anyone else wishes to respond is up to them but I won't be taking part in such a debate.

 

[BeatrixFan]

For the record, I didn't bring up Charles. I simply said that she embarrassed the Royal Family and there's no denying that. Even Diana's fondest admirers admit that. The fact is, Diana had refused that HRH several times before her death. To re-instate it (which is impossible) would be truly silly. I sometimes wonder if people actually want the monarchy the survive at all.

 

[sirhon11234]

But what does having Diana's HRH restored to her has to do with the monarchy not surving.

 

[BeatrixFan]

Because the moment you start giving dead people honours, debate begins to surface. There'll be questions about the honours system, titles and before you know it - the very question of monarchy itself. The Queen is lucky - she can do no wrong and nobody will question the role of monarch whilst she's alive because she's served us for over 50 years and she's an old lady now. Charles is lucky - questions won't be asked because he's waiting for it and he's been waiting for it for a very long time. But William has no excuses. The political climate is not in his favour, there are big changes coming and if he's going to sod about giving dead people honours, people who didn't even want them when they were alive, he'll open up a can of worms that the monarchy WILL NOT survive.

 

[sirhon11234]

people who didn't even want them when they were alive

Well that was some people not all.

 

[BeatrixFan]

That was Diana. She made it explicitly clear that she didnt want it.

 

[sirhon11234]

But what if the queen gave Diana her HRH back(and we all know she won't) but what if she did would it cause such a problem.

 

[BeatrixFan]

Well, the Queen wouldn't give it back because Diana said she didn't want it. So why would she give it back in the first place?

 

[Madame Royale]

But what if the queen gave Diana her HRH back(and we all know she won't) but what if she did would it cause such a problem.

No, not really. Speaking in hypotheticals, it would have been consented too by the monarch and her government so I see very little reason as to why there would, infact, be a problem.

I personally, dont see any 'need' for the reinstating of a HRH styling, but if it did ever occur I would not object to it, nor would I dismiss it. If William does (none of us know) decide to one day accord his mother a royal style then I would view it as a tribute to his late mother, a public show of admiration and pride to the mummy he and Harry never grew to have by their sides. Some will disagree with this view and that is perfectly fine, but I know a great many people who would welcome such a move and I know some less inclined to do so aswell.

It would of course annoy some, but they would have to learn to either like it or lump it (respectively).

 

[BeatrixFan]

I find it interesting that those who want to see the HRH restored can't answer a simple question. Why would it be restored when Diana herself rejected it?

It would of course annoy some, but they would have to learn to either like it or lump it

No we wouldn't. We'd sit night and day outside Buckingham Palace protesting. And then we'd become republicans.

 

[Madame Royale]

BeatrixFan, you seem to be insinuating that I have said I wish for the Royal distinction to be reinstated to Diana and after having made my point clear, I would have thought that it is blatantly obvious I have stated otherwise (my reasons are much different to yours I may add, but none the less..)

No we wouldn't. We'd sit night and day outside Buckingham Palace protesting. And then we'd become republicans

I'm sure they could corner off a 5 by 5 metre square for you all, infront of the Victoria monument

 

[BeatrixFan]

No no, I didn't mean you. I was referring to those who are desperate that the HRH be restored and was just posing the question, why can't they give reasons for their opinions. They say they want to see the HRH re-instated but they don't seem to recognise that the woman they idolize had refused the HRH several times when she was alive. Talk about going against someone's wishes.

I don't know quite what's so hilarious. You think I'm a minority? From the people I speak to, most of them are convinced that King William will be the last King. He'll cock it up and Britain will become a Republic. And as soon as that boy takes the throne, I'll be a republican myself. If I'm still here which I very much doubt.

 

[sirhon11234]

Well hopefully Britain will still be a monarchy during william's reign and after.

 

[BeatrixFan]

I can assure you that if he pursue's the avenues he looks set to pursue then Britain will have a President. Sirhon, why do you think Diana should get the HRH back when she rejected it several times during the divorce settlement and after?

 

[sirhon11234]

Oh, I don't think Diana should get her HRH back. Diana is gone she has no use of it. But I'am just curious why some people want her to get it back and some don't want her to get it back.

 

[BeatrixFan]

I find it all very very bizarre. In the New Years Honours List 1980, Joyce Grenfell was going to be made a Dame. She died a few months before the list came out so her name was dropped and she died as Joyce Grenfell OBE. They didn't give her a posthumous Damehood. I was asked to sign a petition at a charity event held in Joyce's memory to get her the Damehood and as far as I know, a letter was sent back saying that the British Honours System did not reward people posthumously. I can only assume it'd be the same for an HRH, otherwise, Wallis would have got hers yonks ago.

 

[Madame Royale]

I don't know quite what's so hilarious. You think I'm a minority?

Yes, on the issue of reinstating a HRH style to the late Diana, Princess of Wales (which would be largely viewed as a tribute of sorts) I do believe you (myself included) are part of a public minority. That however, is just my opinion

I can only assume it'd be the same for an HRH, otherwise, Wallis would have got hers yonks ago.

You are aware though that there were more 'influentia'l powers at play regarding Wallis. Primarily an influence that loved her Dubonnet.lol.

 

[BeatrixFan]

Well I'd beg to differ but if I'm being honest, those who would go spare at the HRH being re-instated would probably become republicans right out in William V's reign and not bother protesting about just that - they'd scrap the lot.

You are aware though that there were more 'influentia'l powers at play regarding Wallis. Primarily an influence that loved her Dubonnet.lol.

Oh yes but then why wasn't it re-instated in 2003? You see the sort of trouble it would cause? Once you start honouring the dead, where does it end?

 

[Madame Royale]

Oh yes but then why wasn't it re-instated in 2003? You see the sort of trouble it would cause? Once you start honouring the dead, where does it end?

Why wasn't it re-instated in 2003? How can you re-instate something that was never given?

Her Grace the Duchess of Windsor was never a Her Royal Highness to begin with, quite different to Diana - Princes of Wales who was afforded the style and titles befitting her husbands position. Wallis was denied the styling of a royal consort as I know you are aware.

With Diana, they would be re-instating something that was once 'hers', that is the difference between their respective situations.

 

[BeatrixFan]

My error. With Diana they would be re-instating something that WAS hers and that she gave up voluntarily. So what would be the point?

 

[Elspeth]

I find it all very very bizarre. In the New Years Honours List 1980, Joyce Grenfell was going to be made a Dame. She died a few months before the list came out so her name was dropped and she died as Joyce Grenfell OBE. They didn't give her a posthumous Damehood. I was asked to sign a petition at a charity event held in Joyce's memory to get her the Damehood and as far as I know, a letter was sent back saying that the British Honours System did not reward people posthumously. I can only assume it'd be the same for an HRH, otherwise, Wallis would have got hers yonks ago.

Wallis wasn't going to get anything during the Queen Mother's lifetime. That lady knew how to hold a grudge.

 

[BeatrixFan]

Well, the staff at David and Wallis's home always called her "Your Royal Highness" etc which pleased him so I guess she had what needed without it being confirmed by the relatives across the Channel.

 

[Madame Royale]

My error. With Diana they would be re-instating something that WAS hers and that she gave up voluntarily. So what would be the point?

I 'see' where your coming from BeatrixFan, I really do but it's no longer about what Diana relinquished by choice, rather what her son may or may not wish to do in memory of his mother. And their is a possibility (however slight it may seem) that William may, one day, re-instate the HRH style to his mother's name. Do I think it will happen? Probably not but I'm in no position to rule it out and neither is any other member of this forum.

For me, I don't feel it necessary to her memory, for I shall always remember her for the humanitarian she was and a Princess I thought very highly of. No royal style is needed for that, imo.