Diana's Eating Disorders and Health Issues

[anbrida]

You seem to think it is an insult to Diana to believe she had a personality disorder. It is an medical condition. If she suffered from a personality disorder, it was not her fault. She should have taken responsibility for getting help, but it is extremely difficult for people with some mental health problems to understand they need help It's part of the disease.

I don't know why you get this impression. I am also saying Diana had depression, which is also one kind of mental illness, but I don't think I am insulting her. I don't buy the BPD theory is simply because there are not enough substantious evidences out there to make me believe that.

With regard to abandonment issues, it would not be accurate to say that someone with a personality disorder feels abandoned every time she is physically separated from another person. Diana would have feared emotional abandonment, not necessarily physical abandonment. As long as she was confident the other person cared for her, she was probably fine when they physically separated.

If she felt she was at risk of being emotional abandoned by her lovers, wasn't she have every ounce of right to have fear of abandonment? Actually, Abandonment fear to some degree is a normal part of human being, which roots from our baby time. We can not treat each fearness of abandoment as something abnormal. That is why (according to wikipedia), when we diagnose BPD we need to see whether the pattern of abandonment fear (or *extremes* of idealization and devaluation) is "inlfexible, persavsive across a wide range of situations, regular and long-lasting".
Personality disorder - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

We can not say, "Oh, Diana had once or twice showed fear of abandonment when she was with Oliver Hoare, when she was with Hasnar Khan,... so she was likely to have BPD." No, we can not say that, because the pattern of her fear was random, not on a regular basis.

I have read several cases of people who are indeed diagosed with BPD, the pattern of their abandonment fear is really inflexible and persavive across a wide range of situations, in the sense that no matter how their partners were caring, understanding and loyal to them, they are still suspecious of their partners' love. And this kind of suspecion happens even on a daily basis.

Also, she certainly publicly criticized Charles, who was an ex-lover. She didn't really criticize her other lovers because she wasn't necessarily anxious to publicly admit she had other lovers during her marriage.

There are books about Diana written by her lover (Hewitt), by her bulter, by her personal guard, by her secretary, by her astrologists, and by a lengend of biographers (pro-her or anti-her) who had sources from an army of friends or close friends of her. So we really know a lot of her private life. However, none of this book has ever given even one such example of her complaining or bad-mouthing her ex-lovers except for Charles. Even if she publicly criticized Charles, so what, almost every divorced couple play the same blaming game, she is not an exception. If you want to prove she had BPD, not only you have to provide evidences to show that such critization is a manifestation of a pattern of unstable and intense relationships characterized by alternating between *extremes* of idealization and devaluation, but also you have to show that these extremes of idealization and devaluation happened on an inflexible, and regular basis.

 

[anbrida]

About how Prozac is used in UK, the following article can give some insights on it. It said

An Environment Agency report suggests so many people are taking the drug nowadays it is building up in rivers and groundwater.

BBC NEWS | Health | Prozac 'found in drinking water'

And whether Prozac is strong or not, it also depends on the amount of daily of dose.

About Diana's using Prozac, I think I'd better give some references here to back my claim. It was first mentioned in Andrew Morton's book in 1994. It said

Princess Diana now is (in 1994) controlling the bulimia by using the anti-depressant drug Prozac.

Toledo Blade - Google News Archive Search


The second source is actually from herself.

The Princess first visited Clare as she recovered from her surgery at Harefield Heart Hospital in August 1995.
...

"At the time I(Clare) was in a terrible state. I told her(Diana) I was depressed and she said, `We've all been through that'.

"She was talking to me like a friend. I told her I was on Prozac and she said, `Oh, don't worry about that, everyone's on it'. Those words eased me a lot.

From this conversation, first it is sure that Diana knew what is Prozac. Second she seemed to be enough familiar with it that she can assure the girl to not worry. Third, Diana seemed to be still on Prozac at that time (Aug 1995).

However, it is really hard to know exactly how Diana used Prozac. Because unlike those alternative therapists, no professional doctor would come out and tell the world that they've treated and how they treated Diana. Because all of these are confidential information should not be disclosed to the third person. Otherwise it would cause their jobs.

 

[US Royal Watcher]

Anbrida, I appreciate your thoughtful posts. I think we will have to agree to disagree. One of the problems with difficulty of diagnosing psychiatric disorders. I understand why you and Siron11234 do not want to diagnose her after her death, but I don't agree that it isn't possible.

When I look at the timeline of Diana and her relationship with her parents, lovers, friend, other family, staff, etc..., I think there is a pattern of unstable relationships. Obviously she had a few loyal hangers on, but she did not maintain long-term relationships with people who did not put her on a pedestal. For example, shortly after they announced a divorce settlement, a large number of her staff quit.

Regarding feelings of abandonment, she apparently made hundreds of nuisance calls to one lover (Hoare, I think) when he tried to break it off with her. That's pretty extreme.

I also remember Morton talking about Diana's use of anti-depressants. Anti-depressants can help people suffering from bulimia. I hope they gave her some comfort.

 

[olebabs]

I do not doubt that living with a person suffering from a mental illness, is not the easiest thing in the world. I am just wondering why Charles, percieved to be so intelligent and well read in psycho analysis, was not able to see her outburst as a symptom of something much deeper and forced her into treatment. Anyone with the smallest insight into mental health issues knows, that the person suffering, is not able to recognize the need for help themselves. One would assume that a husbond would be the one closest to you and should have your best interest at heart.

To me it seems, that the royal family as well as her own family, buried their collective heads in the sand in order to keep up apperances.
I also wonder, why her sisters, brother and mother just seemed to accept being cut off. That alone, would make me as a relative, deeply concerned.

 

[AuroraB]

In the US a spouse or relative cannot force a person into treatment against their will. You can recommend, provide them with information, but unless they pose a risk to themselves or others your options are limited.

 

[Archduchess Zelia]

I do believe that it is extremely hard to compulsorily detain someone - especially a royal and Charles did try to help Diana. Also, as you said, for an ill person is having a hard time realizing that he or she has a problem and therefore it's even harder for the family to help.

Having been involved with the mental health section myself for a while, I can tell how hard it actually is for friends and family to help - even though they want to.

 

[olebabs]

In the US a spouse or relative cannot force a person into treatment against their will.

It is the same in Denmark, but what I meant was, assuming the stories of her different outbursts are true, she has on at least a few occasions posted a threat to herself. She herself told about the cutting with razor blades. If my husband started to do that, I would be very scared and not dismiss it as attention seeking.

But in any case, if she suffered from BPD, I can only pray that she is now free of her deamons and that she is remembered for the good. We all deserve that.

 

[anbrida]

At the early stage of the marriage, Charles did sent Diana to the therapist. But each time it's Diana alone to see the therapist, Charles had never accompanied her. I guess it is the British Royal Family's style that they don't want to intervene into people's personal life, and its member is supposed to sort themselves out on their own. Of course I am talking about the 80s, maybe they will take a more active role in this issue by learning from Diana's tragic lesson.

 

[olebabs]

I sincerly hope so. I Think a lot of lessons has been learned already and the BRF are better for it.

 

[US Royal Watcher]

Her eating disorder was revealed when one of the reporters posted outside their home traced the car of a frequent visitor to a doctor who specialized in eating disorders. So the doctor actually came to their home--Diana didn't go alone to an appointment. We don't know how involved Charles was in her therapy or whether the doctor or Diana wanted him involved.

Apparently Diana wasn't receptive to therapy at that point, which is very common for people who suffer from mental illnesses. Even when they recognize there is a problem, too many feel that they should just be strong enough to overcome it. No one feels that way about diabetes or cancer, but there is a belief that people should be able to control their emotions and feelings. Tragically, it is not always possible.

One of the most incredible things about Diana was that she did help so many other people while she was suffering from her own demons.

 

[olebabs]

And if you then live in a family of people who tend to keep everything bottled up, it certainly can't have been easy. I don't think any of the two, was emotionally equipped to handle each other, sadly.

Her eating disorder was revealed when one of the reporters posted outside their home traced the car of a frequent visitor to a doctor who specialized in eating disorders. So the doctor actually came to their home--Diana didn't go alone to an appointment. We don't know how involved Charles was in her therapy or whether the doctor or Diana wanted him involved.

Apparently Diana wasn't receptive to therapy at that point, which is very common for people who suffer from mental illnesses. Even when they recognize there is a problem, too many feel that they should just be strong enough to overcome it. No one feels that way about diabetes or cancer, but there is a belief that people should be able to control their emotions and feelings. Tragically, it is not always possible.

One of the most incredible things about Diana was that she did help so many other people while she was suffering from her own demons.

 

[anbrida]

Regarding William and Harry, for many years the media promoted Diana's allegations that Prince Charles was a cold, uncaring father. I remember, though, that in the days following Princess Diana's TV interview, the media proclaimed Diana the "winner" in the public relations war with Prince Charles and the royal family. Then came a startling announcement: both William and Harry had chosen to spend the Christmas holidays with their father. Even Princess Diana's biggest media supporters had to admit that she had not "won" when it came to her sons.

Over the next year, it was widely conceded that both boys were choosing to spend more time with their father--although some of her supporters tried to argue that they simply loved hunting and fishing. I think that most children who have mentally ill parents love and are very protective of their ill parent, but they crave normality and will prefer the "well" parent (if they have one). Then they feel guilty for not being there for the sick parent. It's a sad situation all around.

I really doubt the authenticity of this story. In the following story, William told the girl he met in 1997 that he really wanted to spend the christmas with his mother too. And obviously he blame his father for the reason why he couldn't. If it was the boys who made the decision, William would not put the blame on his father.

And I think William's thought was made known to the adults. From Paul Burrel's book, we know the Queen had allowed the boys to be with their mother for the Christmas of 1997. This is the first time since 1994.

I quite understand William's mind. Children usually hate to show preference. He must be upset that his mother was not treated fairly on the case of Christmas.

She remembers watching television with William. "He told me some stuff about his father and mother - 'my father is not so kind with my mum. It's a pity because I would like to spend Christmas with my mother, too.'"

The Express On Sunday Magazine :* Marion Remembers Her Good Friend Diana* - Princess Diana Remembered

And I understand now why William would have told the girl, Marion such intimate stuffs. Marion was very *safe*. She was only 10 then, non-British, living far away from Britain, and the press would not have known the existence of this girl have not the death of Diana. I guess in Britain, it would be very hard for William to find a person he can trust enough to open his mind.

 

[US Royal Watcher]

I really doubt the authenticity of this story. In the following story, William told the girl he met in 1997 that he really wanted to spend the christmas with his mother too. And obviously he blame his father for the reason why he couldn't. If it was the boys who made the decision, William would not put the blame on his father.

And I think William's thought was made known to the adults. From Paul Burrel's book, we know the Queen had allowed the boys to be with their mother for the Christmas of 1997. This is the first time since 1994.

I quite understand William's mind. Children usually hate to show preference. He must be upset that his mother was not treated fairly on the case of Christmas.

Even if this is accurate, what she is saying is not inconsistent. I'm sure William and Harry wanted to spend Christmas with both their parents. Unfortunately, at that point, Charles and Diana could not stand to be together. As you indicate, the boys were given a choice. Obviously, the Christmas after the interview, they choose to spend Christmas with their father and his family.

Most of Diana's friends confirm that Diana regretted the interview because the boys were upset and angry with her. Unfortunately, people with bulimia, especially if they also suffer from a personality disorder, are not always able to accurately predict how others will respond to their actions. I'm sure she thought she was doing the right thing until she saw how it affected her sons.

 

[sirhon11234]

Even if this is accurate, what she is saying is not inconsistent. I'm sure William and Harry wanted to spend Christmas with both their parents. Unfortunately, at that point, Charles and Diana could not stand to be together.

By 1997 especially by the time of her death Diana and Charles' relationship improved greatly. I remember reading that he sent her a bouquet of flowers for her last birthday.

 

[US Royal Watcher]

Sirhon11234, you are right. By 1997, they were getting along. Anbrida and I were referring to Christmas 1995, which was shortly after Princess Diana's television interview.

 

[anbrida]

Even if this is accurate, what she is saying is not inconsistent. I'm sure William and Harry wanted to spend Christmas with both their parents. Unfortunately, at that point, Charles and Diana could not stand to be together. As you indicate, the boys were given a choice. Obviously, the Christmas after the interview, they choose to spend Christmas with their father and his family.

Most of Diana's friends confirm that Diana regretted the interview because the boys were upset and angry with her. Unfortunately, people with bulimia, especially if they also suffer from a personality disorder, are not always able to accurately predict how others will respond to their actions. I'm sure she thought she was doing the right thing until she saw how it affected her sons.

I don't think Royal kids have a choice on this. Otherwise how to explain the boys spent the 1996 Christmas with his father again. So was it still the boys'sown decision and then they went to moan about being not able to spend the christmas with their mother? Even for the Christmas of 1997, Paul Burrel's words was "the Queen allowed" instead of "the boys choose".

I really don't want to blame everything on mental illness. A lot of parents make poor judgement, but most of them do not have mentally problem at all.

By 1997 especially by the time of her death Diana and Charles' relationship improved greatly. I remember reading that he sent her a bouquet of flowers for her last birthday.

No, Charles didn't sent the bouquet of flowers, it was from another admirer. It was on his way to an official engagement, Charles dropped by the kensington Palace to have a cup of tea with Diana. But Diana was still very excited about his visit.

But I agree by the end of her life, Charles and Diana did try to mend the rifts and get on with each other as friends, *for the sake of their boys*. Every child will be upset if their parent can not get along with each other. Diana even went ahead to assure the boy that their father used to love her. She talked about that with Ingrid Seward weeks before her death.

"Charles did love me when we got married," she said. This. I (Ingrid Seward) suggested, was not the way her marriage to the future King has been represented. The popular legend, I reminded her, is that she was the one who alone did the loving.

She put down her cup, wrung her hands, looked at me and declared: "That's simply not true. He did love me. And if anyone ever saw the love letters we wrote to each other, they would believe that."

On the day of the separation, she told me: "We sat together on this sofa and cried."

Why, I asked her, was she choosing to tell me this now?

"For the sake of my boys," she answered. "It is very upsetting for them to hear that their father didn't love me. "

"I have to consider the children and their feelings. If they thought Charles hadn't loved me, it would not be good for them."

DIANA 1961-1997: HER DREAMS: If my boys read his love letters, they would know Charles used to adore me. - Free Online Library

 

[US Royal Watcher]

But I agree by the end of her life, Charles and Diana did try to mend the rifts and get on with each other as friends, *for the sake of their boys*. Every child will be upset if their parent can not get along with each other. Diana even went ahead to assure the boy that their father used to love her. She talked about that with Ingrid Seward weeks before her death.



DIANA 1961-1997: HER DREAMS: If my boys read his love letters, they would know Charles used to adore me. - Free Online Library

First, I don't consider Paul Burrell a reliable source. Regarding Diana's conversation with Ingrid Stewart, I think that proves my point. Without going into the actual truth of Diana and Charles relationship, how many times did Diana allege that Charles had never been in love with her? More importantly, how many times did Diana claim that things were perfect, especially in the beginning.

We all tend to remember events in the past the way we would prefer them to have happened, but people with personality disorders will often have extreme difficulty accurately remembering the past.

For example, I once had to sort through a major problem at work that involved my colleague who suffered from a personality disorder. I tried to be sympathetic and made it clear that I wasn't attacking her. I repeatedly reassured her that I wanted to help her solve the problem, but in the course of one 30 minute conversation, I got three versions of what had happened. She had additional versions over the next days--including that she hadn't even been present. The common thread was that it could not have been her fault. She wasn't lying, but she could not bear the idea that anyone, including herself, believe that she was anything less than perfect.

Diana obviously had the same problem, and I'm sure it was very confusing and difficult for her family and friends who had to deal with it.

 

[olebabs]

personality disorder

When was it confirmed thet she was diagnosed with a personality disorder???

It is hardly indicative of mental illness, to feel and say things amidst a painful break up, only to see things in a different ligh once you are on the other side.

If she actually had a personality disorder, then I am sure, it was difficult for her surroundings, but has anyone contemplated how Charles was to live with???

 

[US Royal Watcher]

To my knowledge, Diana was not diagnosed with a personality disorder, but I believe that she has many of the symptoms. Of course, everyone has their own opinion. I base my opinion on her admission that she cut herself and threw herself down a flight of stairs, her excessive need for attention and reaffirmation, her difficulties maintaining stable relationships with other adults. Moreover, a high number of people who suffer from bulimia also suffer from a personality disorder

I agree that it can be perfectly normal to perceive things differently at different times, but suddenly claiming that Charles was in love with her after years of complaining that he was not is pretty startling. This is especially startling since, according to the article above, that she didn't acknowledge the change, even after the interviewer prompted her. It is one thing for a divorced person because of personal growth, to see another point of view or acknowledge that the outright lied (which happens). It is another thing to suddenly and completely change your story. If the change is extreme, it can be a symptom of a psychiatric disorder.

I know Charles was not perfect and apparently suffered from severe depression at one point in their marriage, but the current discussion focuses on Diana.

 

[Tyger]

has anyone contemplated how Charles was to live with???

No. I haven't anyway. I'm sure like any man he 'has his ways'. But are you suggesting this would be an excuse/reason for her behavior - for her flip-flopping on what really took place at any given moment? That she lacked a truth-sense is an understatement. At some point Diana needed to be made responsible for what she said. She was either intentionally lying (a lot) or she had some deeper mental problem that made truth and reality a blurred horizon for her. Take your pick - how else to explain all the inconsistencies in the story she told?

We can clearly see that living with Diana had a considerable impact on Charles, too. As a result he likely said and did things he would not have done if not under that stress - which was why living separate lives after 5 years of marriage was wise for them both. They both moved on - found love elsewhere - though it seems Diana never owned up to that. It was always Charles who walked away - never her - yet we know that was very far from the case.

However, Charles seems to do quite well living with his current wife - and in fact, seems to be a man who gathers friends as he goes. He seems to be loyal and generous - he demonstrates care, kindness and tenderness - one can extrapolate from these facts what it might be like to live with Charles - the rest is the background noise of any relationship.

To my knowledge, Diana was not diagnosed with a personality disorder, but I believe that she has many of the symptoms. Of course, everyone has their own opinion. I base my opinion on her admission that she cut herself and threw herself down a flight of stairs, her excessive need for attention and reaffirmation, her difficulties maintaining stable relationships with other adults. Moreover, a high number of people who suffer from bulimia also suffer from a personality disorder

I agree that it can be perfectly normal to perceive things differently at different times, but suddenly claiming that Charles was in love with her after years of complaining that he was not is pretty startling. This is especially startling since, according to the article above, that she didn't acknowledge the change, even after the interviewer prompted her. It is one thing for a divorced person because of personal growth, to see another point of view or acknowledge that they had outright lied (which happens). It is another thing to suddenly and completely change your story. If the change is extreme, it can be a symptom of a psychiatric disorder.

I know Charles was not perfect and apparently suffered from severe depression at one point in their marriage, but the current discussion focuses on Diana.

Well said and well observed - especially the bolded and underlined portion.

 

[Dman]

After all I've read, I tend to believe that there were a lot of adults around in Diana's life that were more than willing to help her. She was headstrong and refused it and went her own way and wanted to deal with things on her own and in her own time.

I just don't buy that there weren't adults there to help her if she wanted it.

Diana needed professional help and many of the adults around her really didn't offer much help. Her relationships with her family were damaged by years of personal issues. Charles was busy with CPB. William is right though..his mother was lonely and isolated. She was in a difficult position with not much good guidance. She would've taken it if there was real authentic help around.

 

[royal rob]

I agree Dman. I try to think it was a different time and no one knew much about mental health but there was a few people I think that treated her very badly. I hope they now know better but I doubt it

 

[Iluvbertie]

Diana had been offered guidance over and over again while in the Royal Family and she refused to take it. Why does anyone think she would take once she was out of the family? She simply believed that she knew best about everything and that no one could tell her anything. She was her own worst enemy.

 

[royal rob]

Offered guidance !!! Very different to love and care

 

[Dman]

Diana had been offered guidance over and over again while in the Royal Family and she refused to take it. Why does anyone think she would take once she was out of the family? She simply believed that she knew best about everything and that no one could tell her anything. She was her own worst enemy.

She was offered guidance, but it wasn't the proper guidance she needed. Guiding her on the art of small conversation and royal waving and protocol is fine, but Diana need professional guidance in that new world that she wasn't fully prepared for. She was young, got married to a man who was interested in another married woman and the royal family were very stiff, starchy and formal in those days. It wasn't the ideal world to join- despite the glamour and glitz.

Offered guidance !!! Very different to love and care

That's right! Also, let's not forget about understanding. lots of love, care and understanding.

 

[MARG]

Diana had been offered guidance over and over again while in the Royal Family and she refused to take it. Why does anyone think she would take once she was out of the family? She simply believed that she knew best about everything and that no one could tell her anything. She was her own worst enemy.

Well, contrary to the prevailing history re-write, Diana was not only offered love and support, she was also offered professional help and she did have some counselling but ended up going off on a tangent with alternative therapies.

But what all these newer posters don't seem to understand is that Diana, an adult who was not disturbed enough to be sectioned, made her own decisions. She decided she didn't need professional help and great heavens above, could you imagine the scandal had she indeed been sectioned! Divorce to her meant freedom to make her own choices and she decided when to risk herself and after the divorce decided she no longer wanted any RPO support except for that which involved the boys. She had no say over that.

 

[royal rob]

Just when you think people are starting to understand mental health you realize there are just so many that still don't get it. Hopefully one day . Well done for trying William and Harry.

 

[Dman]

Her words were pretty much dismissed, but Princess Michael of Kent did mention Diana in an interview a couple of years ago. She mentioned that Diana had no support team around her and had no one around her to understand her situation and position. A lot of people to this day don't fully understand the problems and situation of that time.

 

[Osipi]

As in the old adage "you can lead a horse to water but you cannot make him do the freestyle", the big issue here is that there were people that did try to guide Diana towards getting help for problems but it was her choice or not whether it worked. She did see psychiatrists but never for long and refused to take medication. That was early in the marriage. Over time, she sought help and advice but IMO, in the wrong places.

In order to be helped, one has to want it or it won't work.

 

[Dman]

As in the old adage "you can lead a horse to water but you cannot make him do the freestyle", the big issue here is that there were people that did try to guide Diana towards getting help for problems but it was her choice or not whether it worked. She did see psychiatrists but never for long and refused to take medication. That was early in the marriage. Over time, she sought help and advice but IMO, in the wrong places.

In order to be helped, one has to want it or it won't work.

Right, the issue is that she couldn't do this alone. Also, some of her problems was in her marriage and she needed her husband in the counseling room with her. She needed her family to support her, but they had some past problems they weren't even fixing, so they couldn't be there for her.

Everything was a mess in those days, and the problem was people thought the ol' British stiff upper lip and just caring on with duties would help it all go away. The main problems in the Wales household wasn't being properly addressed in the appropriate and serious manner. Of course the problems with fill the cup and spill over into the public arena. You can't hide the obvious too long. The skeletons will bust out the closet on its own.