Charles and Diana


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Look Charles is who he is. Neither bad nor good. He has done some wonderful things and some foolish things, and as you say he is just person. To that I can relate. Also, and I think it is because of his relationship with Diana, he saw a different view towards people. Perhaps, the whole family did. Since, her death, they try to be more inclusive, shall we say. Charles isn't a bad person, he is a product of how he was brought up to be. Diana brought a great deal of openness and caring to the scenario. Those who dislike her, tend to focus on her short comings, which, certainly, did exist, but somehow glaze over her husband's. She was, actually, a kid. He was a man. But to many extents and purposes he was the petulant child.
 
COUNTESS said:
, She was, actually, a kid. He was a man. But to many extents and purposes he was the petulant child.
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I agree with this to an extent. Charles was certainly used to getting his own way and had no idea how to deal with someone who wasn't willing to put his needs ahead of her own all the time. I wouldn't want to be married to someone like that. However, although Diana was young when they first married, she wasn't always young and even young people have to take responsibility for their actions.

No one put a gun to her head when she got married. Charles advised her to think about it seriously. He encouraged her to take a trip and discuss the decision with her mother. It was her decision.
 
Just a little note to someone who may be reading this thread in the future. The moderators have taken some posts from the "Different Facets of Diana" thread and posted them here. That is why there are several posts in a row from my friend Dman. Dman's intelligent posts are actually responses to other posters on another thread.

I think Warren, the moderator, did a good job and people can follow the gist of the discussion. If you want to see the full context in the Different Facets of Diana thread, the original posts are #418 to 487.
 
US Royal Watcher said:
Generally, a marriage fails because the spouses fall into the pattern of one party complaining and criticizing (Diana) and the other party withdrawing emotionally and even physically (Charles). Then it becomes a vicious circle: the more Diana complained and criticized, the more Charles withdrew.
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I agree. I think the Wales' fell into this pattern very early on in their marriage (or even during their engagement) & by 1986 both stopped trying & gave up on their marriage.

IMO, there was no turning back. No matter what Diana might have said publicly about not wanting to end her marriage. By the time she said this their marriage had been dead for 5-6 years, if not longer. (& there was no chance of reviving it.)

If they wanted to save their marriage, they should have sought counsuling during the engagement period when they both noticed their differences. They didn't. In 1982, they should have sought marriage counseling when the 1st major cracks were evident but they didn't.

The books, the media interviews, not a couple who truly thought the marriage was worth savings.

The failure of the Wales' marriage was a joint effort. A 50 - 50 effort.
 
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I could be wrong, but I don't think that Charles ever said that he didn't love Diana. Some of the things that Charles is believed to have said are opinions that Jonathan Dimbleby formed while doing research for his book and documentary about the press.

US Royal Watcher said:
Charles said "I had an affair" and "I wasn't really in love with Diana."
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Mermaid1962 said:
I could be wrong, but I don't think that Charles ever said that he didn't love Diana. Some of the things that Charles is believed to have said are opinions that Jonathan Dimbleby formed while doing research for his book and documentary about the press.
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I don't remember reading a quote from Charles saying he didn't love Diana, and I am sure that if I had read it, I would remember it. And I am equally sure that if he said it, it would have been a hot item and would have appeared in every newspaper and women's magazine many times. That's a gem that wouldn't have escaped our attention. Just think how often we still read his, " ...whatever love (or is it "in love"? He mumbles) means". Perhaps this is the statement that founded the allegation we are now reading that he said he didn't love Diana.
 
Queen Camilla said:
I agree. I think the Wales' fell into this pattern very early on in their marriage (or even during their engagement) & by 1986 both stopped trying & gave up on their marriage.

IMO, there was no turning back. No matter what Diana might have said publicly about not wanting to end her marriage. By the time she said this their marriage had been dead for 5-6 years, if not longer. (& there was no chance of reviving it.)

If they wanted to save their marriage, they should have sought counsuling during the engagement period when they both noticed their differences. They didn't. In 1982, they should have sought marriage counseling when the 1st major cracks were evident but they didn't.

The books, the media interviews, not a couple who truly thought the marriage was worth savings.

The failure of the Wales' marriage was a joint effort. A 50 - 50 effort.
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Sadly, all the counselling in the world will be useless if BOTH parties aren't entirely committed to making the marriage work, which also mean that both parties have to WANT to.
 
Roslyn said:
I don't remember reading a quote from Charles saying he didn't love Diana, and I am sure that if I had read it, I would remember it. And I am equally sure that if he said it, it would have been a hot item and would have appeared in every newspaper and women's magazine many times. That's a gem that wouldn't have escaped our attention. Just think how often we still read his, " ...whatever love (or is it "in love"? He mumbles) means". Perhaps this is the statement that founded the allegation we are now reading that he said he didn't love Diana.
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He may have been between a rock and a hard place when he said those, now infamous words. Who knows what reasons he may have given, shall we say, privately, for marrying Diana. A guess would be her youth, her background, her virginity, her apparent suitability and whilst I'd be willing to bet that he breathed a sigh of relief when she accepted him because it saved him having to go through it all again with another girl, I'm also willing to bet that being in love with her was NOT one of the reasons he gave because, if to him, their union was all about practicalities and logic, his emotions were never truly engaged. He couldn't, therefore, honestly, stand infront of the camara and tell the world that he was IN LOVE.
 
:previous: I never cease to be amazed at how Charles "whatever love is" statement has been dissected and bent into a club to beat him with.

Here was a man, older than his fiancé who, when asked a totally rude and incredibly insensitive question about "Love", upon his engagement, mumbled "whatever . . . ", and has been paying for it for over 30 years! However, I do think all the other young CP's took note and learnt to ooze sugar like something out of a Barbara Cartland novel when their engagements were officially announced.

As an aside, I think you would be hard pressed to find any other common man of that age, or even younger, (outside Hollywood) reduced to gushing about "Love" to their best mates let alone the media at that time or even now. The entire concept is beyond belief.

IMHO Charles was truly captivated by Diana who, while young, was no stranger to the lifestyles of the aristocracy nor even (to a degree) royalty. She did not grow up in a bungalow washing her own dishes, she grew up in an atmosphere of wealth and privilege in one of Britain's stately gems and attended the best of schools with others of the aristocracy and royalty. She mixed with the same set as the royals all her life. Even tea with royalty was something she was used to.

She said she loved him and I am sure she did. I am also sure he was equally besotted with her but their interests were so totally different. For example, he loved Balmoral, polo and Skiing in Europe, she hated Balmoral, polo and preferred the warmth of the beaches and yachts of the Mediterranean. As to unfaithfulness, well Charles admitted infidelity "once the marriage had irretrievably broken down" whilst Diana said much the same in her autobiography (ghosted by Morton). The infamous "3 in the marriage" didn't emerge until the ghastly Panorama interview where I think Diana was desperate to divert attention from her own infidelities.

Weirdly enough, she won and she lost! Charles was deemed to have carried on an affair throughout their marriage, which I am sure was news to his supposed "mistress" Camilla, who had joyfully married a very dashing APB, regardless of whatever Charles was believed to have felt for her all those years ago. Even worse, Diana inadvertently reduced herself to a caricature of a miserably used, abused and neglected wife, thereby negating all of the positive things in her life. People always seem to write about "Poor Diana", a pathetic victim and yet she was a vibrant, happy and fulfilled mother of two adoring sons, a woman known for her many and varied charitable endeavours, a Princess by both marriage and manner. In short, a role model.
 
I've alway been a Charles basher but after going through some of their old pictures I'd like to believe they were in love.

I'm assuming their personalities aren't suited to each other and of course there were other factors like Camilla Parker Bowles, the age difference that came in.
 
When Diana died, I went out and bought every single newspaper, magazine, EVERYTHING I could find. I'm in Los Angeles, so not only did I buy everything local, I had access to all the NY papers, etc. of course the magazines came out later. I'm getting ready to move and I don't think I can bring this box with me. Do you think this is something worth selling - do any of you think a collector would be interested? I'm going to post this in another Diana forum, but in the meantime, I thought I'd ask here first. Any advice or comments would be appreciated. It's a regular file box, filled to the brim, carefully tended, and in excellent condition. The newspapers were all the first news editions of the tragedy. Thanks, Magdalene (P.S. I don't know who else to ask!!! I don't know <<in my "real" life >> anybody who is fascinated by the Royals like me!!!!!
 
-You have everything you want, beautiful children, you can have any man. What more do yo want?
--My husband. Princess Diana & Camila Parker Bowles.

I wonder what would happen if Diana be here?
 
This is a quote by Diana of something she claimed she said to Camilla and Camilla's reply - never confirmed by Camilla as ever having been said.
 
This is one of several version she gave to what she claimed to have said to Camilla when she crashed her sister's 40th Birthday.

Her driver/guard gave several different versions.

No one at the party confirmed anything.
 
Yes. Either in audio tapes recorded for Andrew Morton, or video tapes recorded by Peter Settelen, during the War of the Wales'. She alleges it took place in 1989. If she said it, she might have been having a tiff with James Hewitt at the time and felt the need for a bit of extra attention. :cool:

Diana tapes tell of Camilla clash | Mail Online
 
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Roslyn said:
Yes. Either in audio tapes recorded for Andrew Morton, or video tapes recorded by Peter Settelen, during the War of the Wales'. She alleges it took place in 1989. If she said it, she might have been having a tiff with James Hewitt at the time and felt the need for a bit of extra attention. :cool:

Diana tapes tell of Camilla clash | Mail Online
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Thanks for the link Roslyn, I hadn't read about that particular tape. It just demonstrates Diana's contradictions. She was having an affair in 1989 (and had at least one before that) but in her mind, the only barrier to getting her husband 'back' was Camilla. Confronting your husband's mistress may be satisfying, but the only way to save a marriage is to work on your communication with your husband.

I don't believe for one minute that a medical doctor told Diana that her problem "lies with her husband" and that the doctor could get her completely well within six months.
 
It was a hurtful time for both.

I always found it interesting that Diana talked to Camilla at the party. Where I come from, the ladies wouldn't be talking but one would've been choking the other. For some, it's choke first and talk later.

I've seen women do some interesting stuff. I've learned not to get any of them mad.
 
A lot of it depends on the woman. Some women would yell and scream at the other woman or get into a catfight with them. Others would just ignore the situation. Until you have experienced this, it's very easy to say what you will do and what you actually would do in such a situation.
 
Queen Camilla said:
This is one of several version she gave to what she claimed to have said to Camilla when she crashed her sister's 40th Birthday.

Her driver/guard gave several different versions.

No one at the party confirmed anything.
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She did NOT 'crash' the party. She was invited, but expected to decline. Crashed is is when one appears at a party to which one has not been invited.
 
No, Diana didn't crash the party. Both The Prince & Princess of Wales was invited.
 
She was not invited. What is the source of this fiction?

Why would you think Annabel Elliot would invite Diana to her Birthday party?

One of her version is she saw Charles leaving and decided to follow him to see where he was going. (If she was invited why would need to follow him.)

Another version is she saw him leaving and she jumped into the car and they had a fight while driving to the party.
In both of these versions she was not invited.

Her driver/body guard gave several versions both IIRC stated she was not invited. IIRC, he said when they arrived at Annabel Goldsmith's house, Diana sat in the car trying to get the courage to go inside.

It she was invited why would she arrive as dinner is being served and they would have to add a plate for her?

She crashed the party and them told different versions of what happened.

Versions:
Went downstair to the playroom where C&C where sitting on the couch talking.
Interrupted conversation of Camilla with several men. (MIght be the tapes broadcast on NBC.)

Then there are the multiple versions of Camilla's reaction.
Camilla says nothing but stare/and opened the door for Diana to leave.
Camilla says nothing but stare/laughs.
Camilla makes the 'What more do you want?' comment.

The version I like the best is: Diana asking Camilla why does Charles prefer her. Of course, Camilla doesn't answer in this version.

Another part of this story is Diana became close to Annabel Goldsmith because she after crashed Annabel Elliot's BD party Diana just starting dropping by Annabel Goldsmith's house to ask her questions about Camilla.
 
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If Charles was invited it would off looked very odd not to invite his wife. Diana was bought up in high society if she had off crashed the party it would have made headlines cause people would off loved that. I doubt Camilla would off replied what could she have said?
 
It was a birthday party for Camilla's sister not a formal occasion.

Camilla and Charles were a couple in 1989. Diana was with James Hewitt.

It has been 24 years since it happened and no one who was INVITED to the party has ever said a word.

Only Diana, James Hewitt and Diana driver/body guard have ever spoken about the event. If Diana and her friends had kept their mouths shut no one would have known that she crashed a birthday party.
 
Both Charles & Diana was invited to the party but Charles thought Diana wasn't going to the party. At the last minute, Diana got dressed and was ready to go.

Charles & Diana had a lot of fun attending parties early on although I do remember a story about them attending a party Princess Anne hosted at Gatcombe. Charles & Diana attended but upset Anne by acting like they were at an official engagement and they left rather early. That's just one story though.

There are pictures on the net of the two attending private or public parties and them having a ball.

Queen Camilla said:
It was a birthday party for Camilla's sister not a formal occasion.

Camilla and Charles were a couple in 1989. Diana was with James Hewitt.

It has been 24 years since it happened and no one who was INVITED to the party has ever said a word.

Only Diana, James Hewitt and Diana driver/body guard have ever spoken about the event. If Diana and her friends had kept their mouths shut no one would have known that she crashed a birthday party.
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Well, I'm kinda glad Diana was invited and at least confronted Charles's mistress. She had a right to do so.

If I was in a situation like that, I most likely would've confronted my wife's boyfriend too. Although there wouldn't be any talking.
 
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Queen Camilla said:
It was a birthday party for Camilla's sister not a formal occasion.

Camilla and Charles were a couple in 1989. Diana was with James Hewitt.

It has been 24 years since it happened and no one who was INVITED to the party has ever said a word.

Only Diana, James Hewitt and Diana driver/body guard have ever spoken about the event. If Diana and her friends had kept their mouths shut no one would have known that she crashed a birthday party.
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AGAIN, 'crashed' means not invited. If she was invited, but considered not likely to attend, and decided to come to the party she was invited to, it is NOT crashing a party.

I am not sure how old you are Queen Camilla, but I am old enough to remember when it actually happened, not what I read in Penny Juror's trash.
 
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scooter said:
AGAIN, 'crashed' means not invited. If she was invited, but considered not likely to attend, and decided to come to the party she was invited to, it is NOT crashing a party.

I am not sure how old you are Queen Camilla, but I am old enough to remember when it actually happened, not what I read in Penny Juror's trash.
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Presumably you were not a guest at the party so your version of the truth must be taken from someone elses "trash".
 
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