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  #2061  
Old 09-28-2016, 12:24 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AdmirerUS View Post
Well, I think by some of what we write, WE have not gotten over the Camilla situation - and we were not even in the relationship.
Blessed if I know why? Certianly there are people who do seem to continue "holding a grudge" against her, but well lets face it, she's been married to Charles for a decade, she's been a fairly good Duchess, and Charles seems happy.. what is the point

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Originally Posted by Mbruno View Post
I doubt Charles would have married Camilla if Diana were still alive. It would have been considered too risky for the future of the monarchy and the Queen would not have allowed it unless Charles renounced his succession rights, which in turn would have required an act of parliament and all the complicated ratification process in the other Commonwealth realms that we saw with the recent Succession to the Crown Act 2013.
No, the 2 reasons for allowing the divorce were (1) to end the marriage becuase it was clear that as long as they were still married, Diana was a problem.. whereas with her divorced they could "cut her loose" to an extent, and also ensure her silence in public, by confidentiailtiy agreements in the divorce.
The other was to allow Charles the freedom to remarry. He had admitted to an affair with Camilla, and by old fashioned protocol that really meant that he should marry her..
I think that the queen (and some of the public) woudl have preferred if he gave Cam up and ruled alone.. but clearly Charles loved Cam, was going to go on seeing her and because of that, it was clear that he had to marry her.
The queen didn't want him to give up his succession rights, becuase she is very conservative. Nor did he because he has been trained for being king all his life and I think he felt that why should he give up his job because of a bad marriage?
So he waited for soem time, till the QM had passed on, till his sons were older, and til the public had accepted Camilla as his partner and not a monster in human form but just a normal woman who had made some mistakes.. and by 2005, they were generally ready to accpet her as his wife.
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  #2062  
Old 09-28-2016, 01:09 AM
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If I may add just pure speculation on my part. It had to be tough on Diana during the marriage and after the divorce because Charles had Camilla throughout the marriage problems, but after the divorce and he, if you will, stayed true to Camilla until they were married. Diana, by contrast, had relationships with several men and was unable to find the ONE. In addition, some the men kissed and told on her about their relationships, so a betrayal so to speak. Here's the most popular and beautiful Royal in the world and she can't find love after losing the man she loved and thought would stay with her forever. It had to gnaw at her.
I once read that Diana supposedly advised Charles after the divorce to marry Camilla and make a decent woman of her. I can't believe that ever happened. There was too much animosity Diana held for Camilla.
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  #2063  
Old 09-28-2016, 01:19 AM
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One thing for sure that came out of a nasty marriage for Charles was that he came to realize he did have a backbone. Once the marriage had ended, he came to the realization that "Camilla is non-negotiable" and that was that.

As far as being married to Camilla and having a living ex-wife, it really is no different of a situation than Camilla having a living ex-husband. As the views on divorce within the Church of England and by society as a rule since the time of Edward VIII has changed, I think the marriage would have gone ahead exactly as it did in 2005.

How Diana would have handled and accepted it all had she lived is something that is pure speculation and we have no way of actually knowing. Too many different variables.
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  #2064  
Old 09-28-2016, 02:19 AM
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Originally Posted by Katrianna View Post
Ifrles after the divorce to marry Camilla and make a decent woman of her. I can't believe that ever happened. There was too much animosity Diana held for Camilla.
I quite agree. Im sure that Diana knew he was going to marry Camilla, and that she'd have to accepet it, but she wasn't hapy about it.

I agree that it DID upset her, that Charles was with Camilla, whereas she was still looking for a happy love affair and a marriage and that beautfiul and charming as she was, she was not having much luck in finding one and that at least ONE boyfriend sold their story.
but then, in one sense, it wasn't that odd.. in that she was still really like a girl of 18 or so, meeting men and finding her way through the dating world.. Whereas Charles was settled with Camilla becauase he had done his years of sowing wild oats, having fun and working his way through several women till he found one to marry.
Diana hadn't really done that, and I think that well it is very rare that one finds "the One", on one's first canter out of thte paddock...
It takes time, experience and seeing a lot of people. that's why I can't understand people going on like Diana was a slut because "she had lots of affairs while Charles only had one".
He had only one because he had played the field in his 20s.. Diana was married at 20..
And she did have a lot of baggage. She was a prize, as the ex wife of a Prince.. and rich and beautiful so she was bound to attract a lot of the wrong sort of attention, as well as men who were decent and loved her.
But because she was older than the usual "dating years" age, she was more panicky about finding someone.
She wanted I think to be able to say to Charles and the RF,
"look I've found a nice husband, that Im happy with.. " and then perhaps she would care less that Charles hadn't loved her and that he was settled wth Camilla.
It is understandable, esp if she wanted another child, but her panickiness probalby didn't help in her affairs, when added to her natural intensity, it probaby scared some men off.
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  #2065  
Old 09-28-2016, 02:36 AM
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Originally Posted by Denville View Post
It is understandable, esp if she wanted another child, but her panickiness probalby didn't help in her affairs, when added to her natural intensity, it probaby scared some men off.
This, right here, is probably one of the most detrimental effects to come out of the very public War of the Wales epic saga against Diana. Any man would have had to be living under a rock or in a cave to not know at least some of the sordid events and problems that Diana faced during the marriage and have the intelligence of a village idiot to believe it was all to be pinned on Charles.

By the time Diana was seriously looking elsewhere for a loving, solid relationship, too much was already known beforehand what any possible suitor would be facing with a relationship with Diana. At the most, men at least figured that perhaps Diana was good "arm candy" and it gave them their moment in the limelight with one of the most prominent women of that time period.

I am apt though to exclude Hasnat Khan from this as the man definitely had higher priorities elsewhere with his dedication to his profession and has never talked about his time with Diana.
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  #2066  
Old 09-28-2016, 02:46 AM
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Originally Posted by Osipi View Post
This, right here, is probably one of the most detrimental effects to come out of the very public War of the Wales epic saga against Diana. Any man would have had to be living under a rock or in a cave to not know at least some of the sordid events and problems that Diana faced during the marriage and have the intelligence of a village idiot to believe it was all to be pinned on Charles.

By
I am apt though to exclude Hasnat Khan from this as the man definitely had higher priorities elsewhere with his dedication to his profession and has never talked about his time with Diana.
If you are saying that people woudl figure that Diana had some blame in the unhappy marriage, yes of course that is true.
I think at first people did tend to blame C more but gradually began to realise that it was both of them.

Im not sure what you mean by "sordid events".. Charles had an affair, they both did, and they rowed and bitched about each other to their friends and because they had access to the meida, they did it more publicly as well. but that's normal IMO, with a bad marriage.
but lots of people have a bad marriage and then later a better one. People often behave badly in an unhappy marriage because they are very miserable..
and While Hewitt talked, He was the only one. Her other lovers were discreet, Oliver Hoare didn't talk to the media, Will C denied any affair, so did Gilbey. Hasnat Khan only did so when really forced to do so.

Diana did attract admirers who were interested in her largely becuase of her status, but I think she tended to give them very litlte time..
I think the bad thing was that nicer men, who might have been good for her, were frightened off by the media craziness, and the fact that they would be chased and commented on by the Press if they were once seen on a date with her. Teddy Forstman, the american Businessman was I think a bit put off by this.. he was well known in his own right, and was a bit put out to be then seen as Diana's beau -
(not that I think he was a very serous admirer, I think he was fond of her and they had a friendship.). -But it highlights the difficulties that Di faced in finding a nice man. The wrong sort would enjoy the meida attention for their own purposes, the right sort, woudl shy away from it.
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  #2067  
Old 10-01-2016, 02:21 PM
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I suppose we'll never know how Charles felt about her taking up with the Fayeds during that last summer, but I don't imagine that he was pleased. Mr. al Fayed had a terrible reputation, and Dodi seemed to be a dabbler rather than a career man. I agree that Diana seemed a bit lost after the divorce, although her public work with the landmine issue must have given her great satisfaction.
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  #2068  
Old 10-02-2016, 03:30 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AdmirerUS View Post
Well, I think by some of what we write, WE have not gotten over the Camilla situation - and we were not even in the relationship.
Funny! But very true!

Although not so much for the people involved.

Only me, but I believe Diana was in love with Charles and stayed in that mindset through out the whole marriage and aftermath, so no, graciously conceeding to Camilla would never have happened.

Charles and Camilla marrying, Charles a divorcee rather than a widower?

I think the theory on that is a whole new thread!
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  #2069  
Old 10-09-2016, 03:02 PM
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Top secret medical records belonging to Charles and Diana found stuffed in cabinet on an industrial estate-
https://www.thesun.co.uk/news/193893...strial-estate/

They were delivered back to Clarence House.
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  #2070  
Old 10-09-2016, 04:51 PM
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There be whales here! Ok.. its a Star Trek quote and in no way referencing the Wales' medical records but that quote is sometimes used such as "Eureka!"

It is most refreshing to know that there are decent people out there and also among the staff of the Sun. They ran with the story and very well could have made whatever was contained in the medical files public knowledge but they had enough respect for personal privacy not to.
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  #2071  
Old 10-09-2016, 05:42 PM
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Yes, good on the Sun! Of course, the Palace and Clarence House may have made a official complaint to the Press Council and have come down on the Sun like a ton of bricks if they had gone ahead. Isn't it illegal anyway to publish an individual's medical details anyway?
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  #2072  
Old 10-15-2016, 02:38 PM
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Please note that posts concerning Diana's charity work after her divorce have been moved to the following thread:

http://www.theroyalforums.com/forums...ges-11254.html
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  #2073  
Old 10-15-2016, 03:19 PM
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I would think that it would be illegal to publish anyone's medical history or details in England. The people who returned the medical records were decent honest individuals. Had this gotten into the hands of someone who was dishonest or someone who wanted to make money off of the information which they probably would have, it would have been a different story.

A lot of people these days don't care or don't think about the consequences of their actions and wouldn't think twice about releasing the information on the royal family or anyone else.
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  #2074  
Old 10-15-2016, 05:32 PM
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Yes, but in general, people who are no longer alive lose "rights" as we know them in most political systems (not all, I know).
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  #2075  
Old 10-16-2016, 04:41 AM
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Posts discussing the relationship between Diana and her mother, have been moved to http://www.theroyalforums.com/forums...r-7139-12.html. Let's keep the thread about Diana and Charles.
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  #2076  
Old 10-22-2016, 10:39 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Roslyn View Post
Here's an interesting little contemporary article by Washington Post staff writer Roxanne Roberts, that suggests Hewitt may have celebrated Diana's birthday with her: washingtonpost.com: International Special Report: Princess Diana, 1961-1997
Great article, Roslyn.

Loved this quote, for its humor, but it is also deeply revealing about what Charles had come to feel about why Diana married him, not for love but for status and perks: "An Arranged Marriage: 'Diana only married me so that she could go through red traffic lights,' the prince once joked to reporters."

But also this, among a lot that is interesting, please note the bolded: at a time when any other wife would have (should have?) been at her partner's side, helping him get through what was clearly a tough time, she was elsewhere, leaving him to be visited and consoled by his circle of friends:

"Persisting Whispers From Day One, there have been whispers of a mismatch.

"The honeymoon was over. [...]

"The royal couple had separate appearances, separate vacations and separate beds, according to a former security guard at Highgrove who yakked to the tabs. The press began counting the days or weeks that Charles and Diana spent apart. Speculation reached fever pitch in 1987, when Charles spent 39 days at Balmoral, the queen's retreat in Scotland, while Diana stayed in London with the two little princes.

"In 1988, a skiing accident killed his friend, Maj. Hugh Lindsay, and almost killed the prince, who is said to have plunged into a deep depression. He became increasingly withdrawn. After a polo accident last summer - which kept him off his beloved polo ponies for months - Charles canceled most public appearances and was reportedly suffering from a whopping case of midlife crisis. Former girlfriends, especially Parker Bowles, kept showing up at Highgrove while Diana was in London."
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  #2077  
Old 10-23-2016, 12:15 AM
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Diana certainly didn't marry Charles for perks and status. She was in love with him. He with her, probably not so much!
I don't think you can regard one joke by Charles about Diana's driving as proof that he felt she didn't love him or had married him for the wrong reasons. He apparently speaks even now on occasion of Diana, with a "We were terribly in love with each other once, you know!'

Incidentally, what about the long holidays Charles took to Scotland, to various places in Europe and elsewhere alone during the marriage, neglecting his husbandly duties when Diana wanted his company, wanted him around? Or is that different because it happens to be Charles?

Diana tried to offer Charles comfort when he returned to the chalet after the terrible accident to Major Lindsay but Charles wanted to be alone. She took pride in organising the logistics of the journey home to England for the stricken Charles and herself, and the transportation of Major Lindsay's body. However, according to the biographies I've read Charles made it clear he didn't want her around afterwards. As soon as she left Highgrove, Camilla appeared.

As for all the visits by Mrs Parker Bowles and others to Highgrove, I think it's pretty clear why Camilla went there after Charles's polo accident, incidentally leaving her own husband and children in the summer holidays, or don't they matter either, against this great romance?

Diana never felt comfortable at Highgrove after Harry was a toddler, and it's no wonder! Charles and Diana were by the mid to late 1980's leading virtually separate lives, and Charles didn't want Diana at Highgrove, after accidents or otherwise, as it interfered with his affair with his (equally married) lover, Mrs PB!
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  #2078  
Old 10-23-2016, 09:58 PM
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I don't think that Diana married Charles for "status and perks". She hardly needed status, because she was the daughter of the Earl Spencer. Not only did she have the courtesy title of "Lady Diana", but she had family that was closely connected to the Royal Family on both her father's and mother's sides. She was a wealthy young woman in her own right, from the money that she inherited from her ancestress Frances Ellen Work. If she hadn't married Charles, I'm sure that there were other titled and/or wealthy young men she could have married.

I do believe that she either was in love with Charles or was fond enough of him to be convinced that she was in love with him. The belief that he could never divorce her was, I believe, part of the reason she married him. She wanted to marry for love, and she didn't want to be divorced.
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  #2079  
Old 10-24-2016, 09:50 AM
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Originally Posted by Mermaid1962 View Post
...I do believe that she either was in love with Charles or was fond enough of him to be convinced that she was in love with him. The belief that he could never divorce her was, I believe, part of the reason she married him. She wanted to marry for love, and she didn't want to be divorced.
I had never thought of that! Thanks and it rings true.
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Old 10-24-2016, 10:00 AM
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Originally Posted by Mermaid1962 View Post
I don't think that Diana married Charles for "status and perks". She hardly needed status, because she was the daughter of the Earl Spencer. Not only did she have the courtesy title of "Lady Diana", but she had family that was closely connected to the Royal Family on both her father's and mother's sides. She was a wealthy young woman in her own right, from the money that she inherited from her ancestress Frances Ellen Work. If she hadn't married Charles, I'm sure that there were other titled and/or wealthy young men she could have married.

I do believe that she either was in love with Charles or was fond enough of him to be convinced that she was in love with him. The belief that he could never divorce her was, I believe, part of the reason she married him. She wanted to marry for love, and she didn't want to be divorced.
Excellent post.

Diana was very, very proud of her Spencer heritage. As a descendant of the dukes of Marlborough she had quite enough status and perks of her own.
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