Titles and Styles of Harry, his Future Wife and Children - Page 58

Pranter · #**1141** 09-22-2015, 09:08 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ish

Henry FitzRoy was Duke of Richmond and Somerset and Earl of Nottingham.

The title Duke of Richmond is presently held by Charles Henry Gordon-Lennox, the 10th Duke in its 4th creation.

The title Duke of Somerset is presently held by John Michael Edward Seymour, the 19th Duke in its 4th creation.

The title Earl of Nottingham is presently held by Daniel James Hatfield Finch-Hatton, the 12th Earl in its 7th creation. He is also the 17th Earl of Winchilsea.

Well I guess those aren't just laying around unused then....

LaRae

cepe · #**1142** 09-22-2015, 10:07 AM

I have always like the idea of Mercia (old kingdom, as is Wessex).

Duke of Mercia sounds good to me.

Marty91charmed · #**1143** 09-22-2015, 10:26 AM

Duke of Clarence. The sounds is pure elegance!

eya · #**1144** 09-22-2015, 11:30 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by cepe

I have always like the idea of Mercia (old kingdom, as is Wessex).

Duke of Mercia sounds good to me.

I'm with you cepe. Duke of Mercia is so much sounding beautiful.

hernameispekka · #**1145** 09-22-2015, 03:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by eya

I'm with you cepe. Duke of Mercia is so much sounding beautiful.

I think they need to use it a bit "politically" as well. I've noticed a tendency in Sweden when they give out Dukedoms to the royals it's usually the northern counties or the island counties. I think that might be because those are more scaresly populated and often forgotten in a general Swedish life, so I think it might be a concious move of the royal family to include them a bit extra. I wonder if the UK have such places?

Curryong · #**1146** 09-22-2015, 09:22 PM

Well, Mercia was a 'border province'. The trouble is, IMO, if the monarch continues to appoint Dukes (or Earls) with 'Ye olde English' names instead of the names of existing English counties then the whole thing starts to become quite Ruritanian. Just as Kate and Will have paid visits to their namesake city so could Harry and his wife to Sussex. There'd be no visits to Mercia, obviously.

Sunnystar · #**1147** 09-22-2015, 09:38 PM

So, if Harry and Chelsy do get back together, perhaps he'd become the Duke of Leeds. ;-)

cepe · #**1148** 09-22-2015, 10:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Curryong

Well, Mercia was a 'border province'. The trouble is, IMO, if the monarch continues to appoint Dukes (or Earls) with 'Ye olde English' names instead of the names of existing English counties then the whole thing starts to become quite Ruritanian. Just as Kate and Will have paid visits to their namesake city so could Harry and his wife to Sussex. There'd be no visits to Mercia, obviously.

Mercia does exist. there is a Mercian police region for example. there is also the Mercian Regiment, with PoW as Colonel.

what I like about it is that it covers part of the country which does not have royal representation at present.

so it's my idea and I like it

Clarence doesn't have any geographical base at all and has a bad history going back centuries.

Sussex is ok but try saying Duchess of Sussex in a hurry!

Curryong · #**1149** 09-22-2015, 10:24 PM

That would be good and Chelsy could pop in to her old alma mater if she felt like it, lol.

Seriously though, Leeds has no royal connection to it, though it is an extinct dukedom. With Sussex (and Cambridge) there are links with King George III's sons and grandson, Queen Mary's mother, etc. With the exception of the Wessex earldom all the titles borne by Royal dukes that are currently in use have an historic connection to the throne.

Yes, the Duke of Clarence has an awful history.

Pranter · #**1150** 09-22-2015, 10:39 PM

Has 'Duke' of Clarence even been used since the time of the Plantagenets?

I think it was used as part of an Earldom in the 1800's, one of Queen Victoria's sons.

LaRae

Curryong · #**1151** 09-22-2015, 10:43 PM

Prince Eddy, Edward VII's son, who died young in 1892 was Duke of Clarence and Avondale.

King William IV, known as 'Silly Billy' was also Duke of Clarence and St Andrews before coming to the throne.

Pranter · #**1152** 09-22-2015, 10:45 PM

Ah ...not a happy history there for sure.

LaRae

Rudolph · #**1153** 09-22-2015, 10:45 PM

A dukedom was a given for Harry up until Edward's earldom. Prince Edward is the only son of a sovereign in this dynasty going back to King George I not to be created a duke. He broke the mould. Although it may still happen.

No doubt Harry's wishes will be taken into account. He may well want to follow in Edward's shoes and take a lesser title and maybe even have any future children styled non-royal.

Also depending on when he marries he may well be raised to the peerage as a bachelor. Who knows he may never get married.

We have no real idea how Charles will grant titles. He may not follow the Queen's examples.

Pranter · #**1154** 09-22-2015, 10:49 PM

Was that by Edwards choice then to be an Earl as opposed to a Duke?

LaRae

Curryong · #**1155** 09-22-2015, 10:54 PM

Edward was only given an earldom however, because he is to inherit his father's title of Duke of Edinburgh after the Queen dies. So he will be a royal duke eventually. Harry will do what he wishes but even if he remains a bachelor (don't think he will) he'll be given a dukedom, IMO. Other bachelor princes were.

Rudolph · #**1156** 09-22-2015, 11:12 PM

Of course Harry will be raised to the peerage one way or the other. Bachelor or married.

Edward won't receive his father's dukedom. If and when it merges with the crown he will receive a new creation of Edinburgh. At least this is the 'agreement'. Its not binding and Charles for a variety of reasons could change his mind. Or after all these years Edward may simply not want change in title.

In all likelihood Harry will be made a duke and not an earl but I can see him not wanting any children styled as royal highnesses. It gives them more chance of a normal upbringing.

Skippyboo · #**1157** 09-22-2015, 11:23 PM

The Edinburgh dukedom will almost for certain merge with the crown. The only way it wouldn't is for Charles, William and George to die before Philip and Queen. Then Charlotte would become Queen and Harry would inherit the Edinburgh dukedom.

Sent from my iPhone using The Royals Community

Curryong · #**1158** 09-22-2015, 11:34 PM

Why would Harry inherit the Edinburgh dukedom though? He could well have a dukedom of his own. Edward wouldn't be dead, hopefully. He would just receive the promised title from a new monarch (or her regent) after the Queen and Prince Philip's deaths.

Rudolph · #**1159** 09-22-2015, 11:55 PM

The dukedom of Edinburgh is hereditary. The Letters Patent specify the standard remainder of 'heirs male of body lawfully begotten'

If Charles, William and George die after Philip but before the Queen. The Crown passes to Charlotte and her descendants, the dukedom passes to Harry and his descendants.

Curryong · #**1160** 09-23-2015, 12:17 AM

After the death of the Queen and Prince Philip however, the title merges with the Crown, especially if Charlotte would ascend the throne as a young single woman. Harry would undoubtedly have a dukedom of his own by then and would likely be regent until Charlotte was 18.

Therefore if there is a new creation then the title could be given to Edward by the new monarch as per the family agreement. I don't believe that whoever is on the throne in this hypothetical scenario, that Edward would be subjected by the sovereign to being leapfrogged over. He obviously accepted the terms of the agreement at the time the Earldom of Wessex was created.