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  #1601  
Old 01-12-2020, 03:35 AM
Muhler's Avatar
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tarlita View Post
I do not see a complete resolution to the current problem after Monday's meeting with the Queen. But I hope they can all agree to a blue print going forward with the finer details to be worked out along the way.

And while Harry is in the UK I hope he can take the time to visit with his Grandfather Prince Philip.
Prince Phillip would rip his ears off!

But perhaps a no holes barred talk with grandpa can help resolve things?
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  #1602  
Old 01-12-2020, 03:43 AM
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Well yes I was thinking similarly to you. But its still the right thing to do if he is game enough.
Philip may be able to talk some sense into him.
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  #1603  
Old 01-12-2020, 03:47 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Iluvbertie View Post
Harry didn't get the grades at school to go to university. He basically 'failed' - a 'D' grade in one subject and a 'B' in the other is hardly the sign of someone who has the brains to go to school. He did have the marks to get into Sandhurst as they do additional tests.

The other five of HM's adult grandchildren all have degrees. William changed from History of Art to Geography while Eugenie did her degree in History of Art and Literature. She has worked at an art gallery since leaving university.

Beatrice has a degree in History and History of Ideas. There are jobs that could use those subjects but she seemed to want to go into business but she didn't study the relevant subjects to go into a degree in that area. So when making her subject selections at school she didn't think about job prospects it seems.

Charles and Edward didn't get into Cambridge on merit so there are questions about their degrees.

Neither Anne nor Andrew had the marks to get into university either.

What would you suggest - insist that the universities take in these royals who don't have the grades required?
No! if course not, but why did they fail with all this privileges in gheir background, nobody cared that's the point. As a royal why make efforts? seems to have been the idea behind their upbringing and this is a fault. About Beatrice and Eugenie' careers, well, we have not seen much if this but them partying and vacations somewhere to be honest I doubt they ever really worked by the means anybody else would have to. Zara was sponsored and had enough talent to win something sportive, Peter ?, William has his future and then there is Harry just another Andrew if things go on, being controlled from a weird wife/exwife.....
  #1604  
Old 01-12-2020, 04:10 AM
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Hopefully, going forward, the BRF will instill in their children, the importance of education and being able to make their own way in life. This is probably what Edward and Sophie had in mind when they asked that their children not be known as prince/princess.
  #1605  
Old 01-12-2020, 04:17 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by King of the Jungle View Post
The shock and uncertainty coupled with the media frenzy and the usual no, or minimal, comment from the BRF is getting out of hand.. It is a newspaper's picnic.

This will calm down.
No titles or names will be lost.
Harry and Meghan will continue to carry out much of their previous work but spend some months in Canada and some days in the US.
If Harry and Meghan do work on behalf of the Queen then they will have expenses met, as is the custom.
Of course, less work = less reimbursement.

No important decisions should be made while either Harry or Meghan feels at crisis point. Mental stability and security of thought and awareness is necessary.
ladongas, above, I agree with your opinion.

Other royals own houses in other countries.
...Prince Andrew, David Armstrong Jones.

To work out a structure under which Harry and Meghan can ethically earn their own money and also a structure under which they can earn money for charities is critical.
There is obviously a way that works for Princess Anne's family and Prince Michael of Kent etc..

It is just as important to also come to an agreement on acceptable media communications. The BRF and Harry and Meghan need to trust each other and make no shock disclosures. (unlike the past few days)

The change could end up being an improvement on the present situation.
This is probably what will happen. And if there is so much lack of trust within the different offices of the BRF, they should ask themselves why. If courtiers leak information (on their own or on behest of a royal) then I can understand why Harry didn't want to put anything down on paper.
  #1606  
Old 01-12-2020, 04:27 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Queen Claude View Post
Moment Prince Harry appears to tout Meghan Markle for a Disney voiceover job



Thanks for posting a direct link, I didn’t want to click on the DM.

That is truly outstanding, this has been in the wheelhouse for a long time.
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  #1607  
Old 01-12-2020, 04:37 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lee-Z View Post
And he is to be commended for that, that he wants the best for his family, and I have a feeling most people feel the same..

A thought occured to me though: I wonder if P.Charles (or someone else) ever really explained to his sons that the way Diana and him each tried to use "the media" in their divorce was a big mistake and they should never have done that...
To me it seems a bit as if Harry makes the same mistake in his attempt to control the media as Diana and Charles did at the time...
That' s obviously the same fault, isn't it?
William has lost his mother, too and suffered from media attention and he was their main focus always as he will be the heir. But he managed to cope with it and protects his family, too.
It is really funny if only it did not turn out a tragedy how everybody thinks Harry the only one who lost,suffered and now protects his family
but others have done before and much better.
Since his relationship with Meghan Harry has choosen to do things differently, instead of learning from others who have more experience and suceeded.
As Harry ain't the brightest bunny and only proofed to can be funny, maybe a somehow good soldier but with not more! this is either a lack if intelligence or most probably a combination if both a lack of intelligence and arrogance or stupidity.
Plus Meghan who does not seem to adapt anything, have no experience in Britain, being royal or being much in the focus if the media though she was a d-list actress before.
What can one expect from this couple? Maybe they see themselves as rebels or just doing things differently but they are nit learning, one desaster after another since they started.
I wonder if nobody gave Meghan the time to adjust slowly or if she did not want to. She has now proofed she just can't manage it.
I think it would be wise to rake them out, because there will always be a next surprise with them.
Monarchy is not about yourself but about serving!
And this is nit all easy but possible!
  #1608  
Old 01-12-2020, 04:46 AM
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Quote:
if they want to walk away, then fine. no titles,
Not a simple matter, AT ALL :

HMQ cant rescind the HRH or their titles, since the first is automatic thanks to the 1917 Letters Patent of George V and the second became legally 'incorporeal hereditaments' when they were granted by Letters Patent under the Great Seal.

The Sussexes would have to become subject to a Bill of Attainder in order to revoke them.

A bill of attainder was last passed in Britain in 1798, against Lord Edward FitzGerald.

Attainders by confession, verdict and process were abolished in the United Kingdom by the Forfeiture Act 1870
  #1609  
Old 01-12-2020, 04:48 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Queen Claude View Post
Moment Prince Harry appears to tout Meghan Markle for a Disney voiceover job

honestly, as long as the revenue of this goes to charity, as it seems to be implied it will, i see no issue in a meghan voiceover for disney. now, if it is to be used for them to become 'financially independent' as they get to retain their titles, their house in windsor, their security... then that is a problem. Bob Iger seems stunned/surprised, as in 'is he really asking me this?'.

watching that video is also quite embarrasing as well. harry sounds like a salesman trying to plug her wife for a role. awkward.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mbruno View Post
The fact that the talks are even taking place (involving the four households, the British government and the Canadian government) and that the Queen, according to the DM (take it with a grain of salt !), instructed that they be wrapped up in 72 hours is evidence that Harry and Meghan's temper tantrum has already worked (at least partially) for them. I find that sad.



I understand Charles' strategic thinking on the matter and the need to keep H&M in the fold, but I hope it is not another case of parents not knowing how to handle their spoiled kids.
i hope you are wrong, but fear you may be right. the queen cannot give in to their whims when it is clear the whole country opposes what they've done. not that they want to 'step back' but the fact that they expect everything else to remain the same. it is clear from the polls that the public don't have an issue with them leaving, but not whilst keeping titles/security/house renovated by the taxpayers. so i hope the queen understands and makes the right decisions here. i trust that charles and william will act as the voice of reason, although they may fear themselves that they need harry to perform as a monarchy. oh, it is now that i wish charles and diana would have had a 3rd child as this would have been less of an issue.
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  #1610  
Old 01-12-2020, 04:57 AM
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...

Quote:
Originally Posted by Betsypaige View Post
Wow...this is a no-holds barred look at Meghan from a former friend and business advisor. I believe her - I’m sure others won’t, but that’s fine. This rings true to me, from her wanting to “bag a prince” to her not understanding or caring about the Royal sense of duty to not getting the Royals as human beings...

This is terribly sad...




https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...ULE-world.html
....................
  #1611  
Old 01-12-2020, 05:11 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by poppy7 View Post
P

Tom Bradby has well and truly stuffed himself. What is he doing? William won't touch him now and Harry is out of it. Same with Omid. I have noticed a distinct pulling back from his love in for the Sussexes. Now he probably realises they are not going to be paying the bills anymore. A lot has changed since Wednesday.
There is a programme on ITV this evening (Sunday) at 10.15 all about them. I am interested to see how balanced it is because I have a feeling he will have a hand in it as he works for ITV>
  #1612  
Old 01-12-2020, 05:13 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JessRulz View Post
I feel like people overestimate how much money $30-35million actually is, especially when it would be needed to fund the lifestyle Harry has grown up with/is accustomed to, and Meghan has entered after her engagement.

Should they need to pay for their own security, purchase a new home/furniture, pay taxes, etc - $30-35 million wouldn't last more than a decade without the need to have a source of income.
if they were really goig to have a quiet life away from the public gaze, It would be OK but they clearly DONT intend to have such a life.. (which I hink is more Meghan than Harry's desire to make money and be public figures...) so they will need to find some way of making more money or getting more from the Royal family
  #1613  
Old 01-12-2020, 05:18 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Helen.CH View Post
No! if course not, but why did they fail with all this privileges in gheir background, nobody cared that's the point. ..



I agree in part. Prince Richard, who was originally supposed to work for a living and not be a full-time royal (as his older brother would be the next Duke of Gloucester), studied Architecture at Cambridge (which is supposed to be a hard degree) and then went on to earn a professional Master's degree (also from Cambridge) that would allow him to be a practicing (US spelling) architect.



On the question of military careers, the UK has a proud military tradition and I think it is OK if a junior prince sees the military as a life career option. The current Duke of Kent went all the way to a service rank of Lieutenant-Colonel in the Arny, I think, and was in active service for 20 years, which is a typical military career for many people. Prince Andrew also had a 20-year active service career (1981-2001, I think), but never made to Captain (equivalent to colonel in the Army). He retired, I suppose, as a commander, which would be comparable to lieutenant-colonel like the Duke of Kent. Both did, in my opinion, what was expected of them although they didn't have any exceptional career in the service.


The problem with Harry is that, not only did he not have the grades (or marks as you say in the UK or Australia ?) to go to university, but he also left the Army prematurely afer less than 10 years of active service and at a lower-than-expected rank. In hindsight, that was probably a mistake. Objectively he was obviously not needed as a working royal (there are already too many people doing that job in the UK) and it would have been nice to see Meghan living with him for a while as a quiet military wife (assuming they would have met and got married under such scenario, which we don't know).
  #1614  
Old 01-12-2020, 05:22 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Helen.CH View Post
No! if course not, but why did they fail with all this privileges in gheir background, nobody cared that's the point. As a royal why make efforts? seems to have been the idea behind their upbringing and this is a fault. About Beatrice and Eugenie' careers, well, we have not seen much if this but them partying and vacations somewhere to be honest I doubt they ever really worked by the means anybody else would have to. Zara was sponsored and had enough talent to win something sportive, Peter ?, William has his future and then there is Harry just another Andrew if things go on, being controlled from a weird wife/exwife.....
Phillip, Zara, William, Beatrice and Eugenie all went to University. If you want to who is the 'brightest' Eugenie got the best grades. Beatrice is dyslexic but did well for herself. Both of those girls essentially cannot do whatever career they want and really do posh girls jobs. But what does it matter. They did well for themselves. Peter and Zara both went to University and Zara is actually a trained physiotherapist along with her career. William and Harry were never really as academically bright as their cousins especially Harry. William did alright and went to St Andrews, which he didn't get the grades for but that is unimportant and Harry well didn't do well at school but went into the army. I have known fellow students of theirs and a teacher at Eton and William is always praised as being a really lovel guy you who you can chat too but they were all very quiet on Harry.

All six of the grandchildren had the best education money could get for them. And William could have gone to Oxford or Cambridge if he wanted but he didn't want to go without the grades so decided on St Andrews. Now Kate Middleton was a straight A student who again had an excellent education. She is far more academically capable than her husband.
  #1615  
Old 01-12-2020, 05:25 AM
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Quote:
more Meghan than Harry's desire to make money and be public figures.
Which is why I think this won't be the end of Harry's mental health issues, but the beginning of a FAR more serious phase..

It occurs to me that having your wife fly off, leaving you to deal with a multitude of critical issues ALONE.. [when your head is in an already fragile state] hardly speaks of 'Marital support' ?

Would ANY married person here desert their spouse under such circumstances, when your child is safely ensconced elsewhere with Nanny [and quite possibly Grandma] ?
  #1616  
Old 01-12-2020, 05:32 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JessRulz View Post
I feel like people overestimate how much money $30-35million actually is, especially when it would be needed to fund the lifestyle Harry has grown up with/is accustomed to, and Meghan has entered after her engagement.

Should they need to pay for their own security, purchase a new home/furniture, pay taxes, etc - $30-35 million wouldn't last more than a decade without the need to have a source of income.
I am sure many of us could live the quiet private life they claim to want on that kind of money. I am prepared to give it a try.
  #1617  
Old 01-12-2020, 05:33 AM
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Originally Posted by Mbruno View Post
I agree in part. Prince Richard, who was originally supposed to work for a living and not be a full-time royal (as his older brother would be the next Duke of Gloucester), studied Architecture at Cambridge (which is supposed to be a hard degree) and then went on to earn a professional Master's degree (also from Cambridge) that would allow him to be a practicing (US spelling) architect.



On the question of military careers, the UK has a proud military tradition and I think it is OK if a junior prince sees the military as a life career option. The current Duke of Kent went all the way to a service rank of Lieutenant-Colonel in the Arny, I think, and was in active service for 20 years, which is a typical military career for many people. Prince Andrew also had a 20-year active service career (1981-2001, I think), but never made to Captain (equivalent to colonel in the Army). He retired, I suppose, as a commander, which would be comparable to lieutenant-colonel like the Duke of Kent. Both did, in my opinion, what was expected of them although they didn't have any exceptional career in the service.


The problem with Harry is that, not only did he not have the grades (or marks as you say in the UK or Australia ?) to go to the university, but he also left the Army prematurely afer less than 10 years of active service and at a lower-than-expected rank. In hindsight, that was probably a mistake. Objectively he was obviously not needed as a working royal (there are already too many people doing that job in th UK) and it would have been nice to see Meghan living with him as a quiet military wife (assuming they would have met and got married under such scenario, which we don't know).
He was needed. He is needed. The Royal family couldn't operate with 4 working members. As would be the case when the Queens cousins and her other,son and daughter retire and they wait for Charlotte, George and Louis to grow up. I mean William was in his thirties when he started being a full time royal. Will George be afforded the same. When he gets to that age his father will most likely be King.
  #1618  
Old 01-12-2020, 05:41 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lee-Z View Post
And he is to be commended for that, that he wants the best for his family, and I have a feeling most people feel the same..

A thought occured to me though: I wonder if P.Charles (or someone else) ever really explained to his sons that the way Diana and him each tried to use "the media" in their divorce was a big mistake and they should never have done that...
To me it seems a bit as if Harry makes the same mistake in his attempt to control the media as Diana and Charles did at the time...

William knows, there was a documentary on some time ago and William spoke about the media. The part that stuck in my mind was about finding a balance of access for the media but also an element of privacy. He spoke about it being a 2 way thing , but there was a line that shouldn't be crossed by either party because that is when it went wrong. He emphasised the ' either party' So to me it that was an acknowledgment of the past.
  #1619  
Old 01-12-2020, 05:42 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mbruno View Post
I agree in part. Prince Richard, who was originally supposed to work for a living and not be a full-time royal (as his older brother would be the next Duke of Gloucester), studied Architecture at Cambridge (which is supposed to be a hard degree) and then went on to earn a professional Master's degree (also from Cambridge) that would allow him to be a practicing (US spelling) architect.



O

The problem with Harry is that, not only did he not have the grades (or marks as you say in the UK or Australia ?) to go to the university, but he also left the Army prematurely afer less than 10 years of active service and at a lower-than-expected rank. In hindsight, that was probably a mistake. Objectively he was obviously not needed as a working royal (there are already too many people doing that job in th UK) and it would have been nice to see Meghan living with him as a quiet military wife (assuming they would have met and got married under such scenario, which we don't know).
I think Harry left because he was coming to the point where they wanted to train him for full time royal work. He was always intended, with his future wife to be a working royal.. and with Philip getting older and the other support role royals like the Kents and Charles' siblings also getting older, it was time to bring him in, even if he wasn't strictly needed right then. Now, he ahs taken on full time royal work and he and his wife are saying they can't/wont do it.
  #1620  
Old 01-12-2020, 05:45 AM
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Originally Posted by poppy7 View Post
He was needed. He is needed. The Royal family couldn't operate with 4 working members. As would be the case when the Queens cousins and her other,son and daughter retire and they wait for Charlotte, George and Louis to grow up. I mean William was in his thirties when he started being a full time royal. Will George be afforded the same. When he gets to that age his father will most likely be King.



My point was that he could easily have stayed another 10-11 years in the military as Prince Andrew and the Duke of Kent did before he would be needed for full-time royal work (we are talking a time horizon here around 2026 only).
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