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  #4161  
Old 01-21-2020, 05:47 PM
Heir Apparent
 
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They stripped Harry, who actually served, of his military titles. I wouldn’t blame him for not attending.
Someone 'upthread' [I forget whom] eloquently explained why a Canadian Commodore friend saw this move as essential - it wasn't done out bitterness or anger, but for far more important reasons - the smooth-running of our armed forces, and their morale .

They believe Sussex has betrayed his 'C-in-C' and so feel he can no longer represent them is any capacity.

That is their opinion, one far more important than that of a petulant and stroppy [ex] Prince.
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  #4162  
Old 01-21-2020, 05:51 PM
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I think itís unfortunate Meghan and Harry couldnít have met maybe five years sooner because, to me, the stage of life Meghan was at when Harry came into her life dictated the pace of a lot of things surrounding their relationship. She was an actress in her mid 30s when she met Harry. Even very talented and well known actresses have spoken about how difficult it is for women in show business to find work after 40. Meghanís acting wasnít earthshaking and she didnít have major connections in the business, so Suits was likely going to be the high point of her career. Equally as important, she was a woman in her mid 30s who, (Iím guessing based on the existence of Archie), wanted children.

So, thatís where sheís at when, out of the blue, Harry comes into her life offering solutions to her two most immediate problems - career and children. Iím not surprised she didnít want to spend too much time digging deeper into what her life was going to look like as a royal given how appealing the superficial package must have looked. She didnít have the luxury of time, and, as Iíve said before, Harry didnít do the responsible thing and insist on a pre-marriage period of exposure to life in the UK and to the BRF and everything that goes with them.

So, in short order - fast marriage, baby ASAP, lots of big ideas about what kind of work she was going to do, and then a quick smash into the wall of reality in the form of the restrictions of British royal life and the ruthless British press.

I totally agree with those who think the couple could have given royal life more of a chance. I mean, two years is nothing given all the major life changes they went through. But I think for things to have really worked they would have had to agree to change their strategy to fit with the broader goals of the royal family. If they werenít willing to do that then I think getting out fairly quickly was best for Harry and Meghan, as well as the institution itself.
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  #4163  
Old 01-21-2020, 05:59 PM
ACO ACO is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wyevale View Post
Someone 'upthread' [I forget whom] eloquently explained why a Canadian Commodore friend saw this move as essential - it wasn't done out bitterness or anger, but for far more important reasons - the smooth-running of our armed forces, and their morale .

They believe Sussex has betrayed his 'C-in-C' and so feel he can no longer represent them is any capacity.

That is their opinion, one far more important than that of a petulant and stroppy [ex] Prince.
And yet Iíve read many veterans come to his defense. Those who served with him and those who have benefited from his support, ie Invictus Games or otherwise . Itís all opinion but the deed was done for whatever reason. Personally I think they used it to really test if he would leave. Hitting him there really meant he wanted out cause if anything they know how important military was to Harry.
  #4164  
Old 01-21-2020, 06:00 PM
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Originally Posted by ACO View Post
They stripped Harry, who actually served, of his military titles. I wouldnít blame him for not attending. But we shall see how it all plays out.

I can see them at Beatriceís wedding.
They stripped if of the honoury titles he had as a member of the RF not those he worked himself for. I don't see an issue with that. He agreed (for whatever reasons) to no longer serve the country officially thus the official roles went with that.
  #4165  
Old 01-21-2020, 06:09 PM
Heir Apparent
 
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Quote:
He agreed (for whatever reasons) to no longer serve the country officially thus the official roles went with that.
Indeed- 'actions have consequences' and this was/is the logical consequence of HIS actions..
  #4166  
Old 01-21-2020, 06:21 PM
Aristocracy
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by O-H Anglophile View Post
It does seem the BRF were welcoming to Meghan, at least at first. But perhaps feelings cooled as Meghan (and Harry) wanted to do some things their way-"the modern way"-- but were told no and it "stifled Meghan's spirit."

Because things sure seemed to have changed from about a year after the engagement interview.
I remember how long it took for William to be confirmed as Harry's best man . Maybe there was already some discontent .
  #4167  
Old 01-21-2020, 06:26 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ACO View Post
They stripped Harry, who actually served, of his military titles. I wouldnít blame him for not attending. But we shall see how it all plays out.

I can see them at Beatriceís wedding.
Harry renounced, so he was not stripped of his military honors, he chose this path. There are no military officers "Part time". He is an adult and he should stop reading his thoughts to gain public sympathy. "Ad nauseam". If they want a private life why do they continue speaking in public? Keep your thoughts to yourself. You are and adult and so is Meghan.
They acted cowardly and disrespectfully towards the BRF.
  #4168  
Old 01-21-2020, 06:27 PM
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Originally Posted by acdc1 View Post
I do think it was very hasty, itís been what, 18 or 20 months? I wonder if they had given it 5 years if things would have changed. I know that Kate and Sophie both got off to slow or rockier starts to being royals,, and now both of them are thought of as being two of the harder working, reliable family members. They toughed it out and things have gotten better. Then again, both women are from Britain and didnít have such a stark transition period. I also wonder if things would have turned out differently if they had waited a year or two, and perhaps if Meghan had moved to London and lived there for a bit beforehand to make friends, get used to the culture, see firsthand what royal life would be like.
SOme people did believe that this was a possibility, that she hadn't spent any real time in the UK and didn't know quite what to expect in Royal British life.. and I think those fears were well grounded. But if she had at least given it 5 years before giving up, I think people might think better of her, than her apparnetnt disappearance after less than 2 years.

Quote:
Originally Posted by julia garcia roch View Post
Harry renounced, so he was not stripped of his military honors, he chose this path. There are no military officers "Part time". He is an adult and he should stop reading his thoughts to gain public sympathy. "Ad nauseam". If they want a private life why do they continue speaking in public? Keep your thoughts to yourself. You are and adult and so is Meghan.
They acted cowardly and disrespectfully towards the BRF.
I dotn believe he renounced his honorary titles.. I don't think many people expected that to happen and it was almost certainly the queen's idea and he had to go along with it...
  #4169  
Old 01-21-2020, 06:31 PM
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There's no way of knowing how the other royals feel about it, but some of Harry's remarks over the past year haven't exactly endeared him to people. Meghan may have ruffled a few feathers, but Harry has as well.
  #4170  
Old 01-21-2020, 06:35 PM
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Originally Posted by Alison H View Post
There's no way of knowing how the other royals feel about it, but some of Harry's remarks over the past year haven't exactly endeared him to people. Meghan may have ruffled a few feathers, but Harry has as well.
Harry has always been somewhat silly but with Meghan, he seems to have become even more volatile and prone to shoot his mouth off.. The 2 of them have made a terrible hash of wanting to get out... Its up to them now if they make something good of their freedom.
  #4171  
Old 01-21-2020, 06:41 PM
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Originally Posted by tommy100 View Post
They stripped if of the honoury titles he had as a member of the RF not those he worked himself for. I don't see an issue with that. He agreed (for whatever reasons) to no longer serve the country officially thus the official roles went with that.
I see. Just the honorary ones. I also have no issue with that. He made his choice.
  #4172  
Old 01-21-2020, 06:42 PM
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Originally Posted by ACO View Post
I see. Just the honorary ones. I also have no issue with that. He made his choice.
He was probably made to do it. Harry does care for his military work and Im sure it was painful to him to have to give up the titles. But he has chosen to be out of the RF and the queen clearly felt it was best to remove them from him...
  #4173  
Old 01-21-2020, 06:58 PM
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A number of comments have been deleted. Let’s get back to discussing Harry and Meghan’s decision to leave royal life.
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  #4174  
Old 01-21-2020, 07:11 PM
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Originally Posted by HighGoalHighDreams View Post
For me, the saddest part of this ordeal was seeing Philip being driven away from Sandringham minutes before Harry's arrival. If you want an image that sums up the human factor in all this, that is it in a nutshell.



Given the very close eye that was being kept on the comings and goings at Sandringham, and on the movements of every member of the family, there is next to no chance Harry and Philip met at another time without it being commented on.



I hope I'm wrong, but I don't see any other probable explanation than that Philip would rather take the very real risk of never seeing his grandson again than see him under these circumstances. With all the statements being released, to me this one is the most loud and clear.


I hadnít thought about it quite that way, but that is quite sad if he never saw Philip at all.
  #4175  
Old 01-21-2020, 07:44 PM
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After Philip had served loyally as Captain General Royal Marines for 64 years I imagine he could have felt that he, himself, had made a poor decision in trusting Harry with the role..
Harry asked to back away from royal responsibilities. It left no option to continue one of the most senior royal appointments with the Marines.

It is sad that faith in family members might have been eroded along with day to day interactions and communications.

Love won't be lost but there is a loss never-the-less.
  #4176  
Old 01-21-2020, 07:44 PM
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Originally Posted by Erin9 View Post
I hadnít thought about it quite that way, but that is quite sad if he never saw Philip at all.
Even though Harry and Meghan are happy, there's a deep sadness that lingers, and I don't think it will ever go away......
  #4177  
Old 01-21-2020, 09:15 PM
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Originally Posted by poppy7 View Post
I wouldn't blame Beatrice, after what her own father must have put her through, if she didn't want them there. I mean it is her day, not a day to be overshadowed.
I agree. But, however she may feel personally, I see her as a people pleaser who will want to keep everyone happy so I expect they'll be invited. However, just because they're invited doesn't mean they'll show up and frankly, I don't think they will. And if they do, I expect there'll be all sorts of headlines about their drama overshadowing Beatrice and her day, especially after all of this appears to have had some bearing on when her wedding date could be announced. Then you factor in the drama and stir that resulted from the "announcing her pregnancy at Eugenie's wedding" and "stealing Eugenie's thunder" as well as the "Beatrice announced her engagement during their tour to get back at them for stealing Eugenie's thunder" and it's all just a perfect storm. To be perfectly honest I think they'll be invited but I think it would be better for everyone concerned if they didn't show.
  #4178  
Old 01-21-2020, 09:41 PM
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Originally Posted by Osipi View Post
Thought pulled out of left field in a galaxy far, far, away. How much of this "new path to forge" as far as their foundation was formed by listening to their PR manager they hired last March who is a) An American, b) a former senior adviser to Hilary Clinton and c) adviser to Hilary Clinton in her 2016 run for the presidency of the US? Is the Clinton Foundation a working model they used for the Sussex Royal Foundation?

Perhaps things may have turned out completely different if they had hired someone to advise them that knew and understood just how the monarchy and the "Firm" in the UK works? And also how the UK media works? And who also knew and could advise Harry and Meghan towards workable solutions to their problems without going all out "American capitalism"?

Just points I'm pondering here. Keeps the grey matter active.
This make me think that truly no one sat Meghan down and explained to her exactly how the Monarchy works. It should have been made clear to her, by Harry, what could and could not be done. Then again, he (or someone else) may have told her and she just really did not believe it until she started to live it. I found a transcript of their engagement interview and there is very telling statement in it below:

Interviewer: But do you have that sense of responsibility Prince Harry, for what you thought you were asking Meghan to do?
Prince Harry: Of course. That sense of responsibility was was essentially from day one or maybe a couple of months in, when I sort of realized actually, this is you know, I feel I know that I'm in love with this girl. And I hope that she is in love with me. We still have to sit down and I still, you know, I still have to have some pretty frank conversations with her to say you know what you're letting yourself in for it is it is it's a big it's a big deal and it's you know it's not it's not it's not easy for anybody. But I know that at the end of the day, she chooses me and I choose her. And therefore you know whatever whatever we have to tackle together or individually, will always be us together as a team. So I think, I think she's capable.

I bolded a statement in Prince Harry's response to the Interviewer saying they still needed to have some pretty frank conversations to let her know what she was getting herself into . I am wondering if they ever had them.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Princess View Post
Well, this could just go the other way round.
Any "warnings" from their Royal Highnesses will probabely be noted with a little smile.
the "Royal Highnesses" will be noted with a little smile too.
  #4179  
Old 01-21-2020, 09:53 PM
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Originally Posted by camelot23ca View Post
I think itís unfortunate Meghan and Harry couldnít have met maybe five years sooner because, to me, the stage of life Meghan was at when Harry came into her life dictated the pace of a lot of things surrounding their relationship. She was an actress in her mid 30s when she met Harry. Even very talented and well known actresses have spoken about how difficult it is for women in show business to find work after 40. Meghanís acting wasnít earthshaking and she didnít have major connections in the business, so Suits was likely going to be the high point of her career. Equally as important, she was a woman in her mid 30s who, (Iím guessing based on the existence of Archie), wanted children.

So, thatís where sheís at when, out of the blue, Harry comes into her life offering solutions to her two most immediate problems - career and children. Iím not surprised she didnít want to spend too much time digging deeper into what her life was going to look like as a royal given how appealing the superficial package must have looked. She didnít have the luxury of time, and, as Iíve said before, Harry didnít do the responsible thing and insist on a pre-marriage period of exposure to life in the UK and to the BRF and everything that goes with them.

So, in short order - fast marriage, baby ASAP, lots of big ideas about what kind of work she was going to do, and then a quick smash into the wall of reality in the form of the restrictions of British royal life and the ruthless British press.

I totally agree with those who think the couple could have given royal life more of a chance. I mean, two years is nothing given all the major life changes they went through. But I think for things to have really worked they would have had to agree to change their strategy to fit with the broader goals of the royal family. If they werenít willing to do that then I think getting out fairly quickly was best for Harry and Meghan, as well as the institution itself.
A very thoughtful assessment.

I am interested to see how Harry is going to "flourish" now that he has severed so many ties to The Crown. In practical terms, is he going to rent office space in the closest metropolitan area and head there a few days a week and sit at a desk to weigh showbiz offers? A "Miss Baxter, hold my calls." type of situation?

I suppose his biggest worry is money and will be for the rest of his life, just like King Edward VIII.
  #4180  
Old 01-21-2020, 09:56 PM
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The Duke of Windsor (formerly King Edward VIII) did not have to worry about money the rest of his life...he had plenty of it.


LaRae
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