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  #3681  
Old 01-19-2020, 11:08 AM
Majesty
 
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Originally Posted by Helen.CH View Post
I agree with thinking why on earth did HM choose them for such an important thing( I suppose it to be compared to other wirk) like the CW? Did nobody realize what was going on, their immaturity......
I wonder too.. I feel that she didn't seem to realise how volatile he is.. or perhaps she didn't realise how volatile he is when paired with Meghan. However I assumed that she felt he was a grown man, doing full time royal work, with a mature woman for wife and that they could take on this role. and that if they took it on, they would stick with it.
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  #3682  
Old 01-19-2020, 11:14 AM
Courtier
 
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Originally Posted by Helen.CH View Post
I hope that the next generation will be prepared better to their roles.
If Charlotte and Louis would study and then have a normal job being employed somewhere
and take part in their parents work, this could be a schedule working like other monarchies have shown aswell.
Though maybe W&K might not want their second and third child to be working for the firm and the UK goes ahead with upcoming changes to a future mode of a slimmed RF with only the heir being fulltime working with his parents to make sure the others can live a happy rather independant life.
I do not think a harsh split like this must be always, if H had not forced this and not wanted to gain financial plus, things had gone normal. So H& M 's idea mentioned on their website, carving a new role... is only about them and not a giod idea for future generations.
I hope the best for Charlotte& Louis.��

And ask myself why the british RF make such a drama far too often compared to others��
I have to admit that idea causes me unease.
I try to place myself in the shoes of an heir, forced to take on this role he or she may not want while their siblings are off doing whatever the hell they want.
I know this system exists in other royals houses, but I can not imagine that such a thought did not cross the heirs mind. I am sure it has crossed William’s these past days. knowing the crisis would have been tenfold if it was him instead.

I feel a method where the siblings support the heir is the smartest option, a sort of one for all, all for one mentality.
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  #3683  
Old 01-19-2020, 11:22 AM
Majesty
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by evolvingdoors View Post
I have to admit that idea causes me unease.
I try to place myself in the shoes of an heir, forced to take on this role he or she may not want while their siblings are off doing whatever the hell they want.
I know this system exists in other royals houses, but I can not imagine that such a thought did not cross the heirs mind. I am sure it has crossed William’s these past days. knowing the crisis would have been tenfold if it was him instead.

I feel a method where the siblings support the heir is the smartest option, a sort of one for all, all for one mentality.
Tthe long suffering public do not want to pay any more for a bunch of younger royals. And Charles does not want to undertake expenses for younger royals if he can avoid it because then He will be stuck with paying them for the rest of his life.
He wanted the 2 sons to work, WIlliam as future King, Harry to take on a commonwealth role and any other stuff that cropped up. Bbut in the next generation I think the public will be saying " we don't want ot pay for Charlotte to cut ribbons for the rest of her life.. or do some made up job to keep her on the payroll... " They will remember how Andrew messed up and used his job to make dubious money, and they will remember how Harry walked out on the job of second royal supporter. So the public will be very hostile IMO to the idea of more than the heir working..
  #3684  
Old 01-19-2020, 11:26 AM
Courtier
 
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There was plenty for both Harry and Meghan to do within the RF for many years to come.
These stories about them being sidelined I find difficult to understand.
IMHO they wanted to be centre of attention and do high flying events, they are not interested in service and duty. There have been criticisms on some of the threads on here that K & W are boring and do low key boring events and charity work. Well that is what service and duty is, it relates to ordinary people not the celebrity circuit.
If they wish to go out on their own and earn money well good luck to them.
There is more to life than money, I hope they will be very happy, and by the way they really are naive if they think the press will leave them alone.
There is a total contradiction in what they do , they ask for privacy but then manage to make the headlines with their actions or messaging.
  #3685  
Old 01-19-2020, 11:40 AM
O-H Anglophile's Avatar
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Denville View Post
Tthe long suffering public do not want to pay any more for a bunch of younger royals. And Charles does not want to undertake expenses for younger royals if he can avoid it because then He will be stuck with paying them for the rest of his life.
He wanted the 2 sons to work, WIlliam as future King, Harry to take on a commonwealth role and any other stuff that cropped up. Bbut in the next generation I think the public will be saying " we don't want ot pay for Charlotte to cut ribbons for the rest of her life.. or do some made up job to keep her on the payroll... " They will remember how Andrew messed up and used his job to make dubious money, and they will remember how Harry walked out on the job of second royal supporter. So the public will be very hostile IMO to the idea of more than the heir working..
On the other hand there is Princess Anne and the Wessexes. Shining examples of lowkey service and duty.
Yes, the Wessexes had some rough patches-mostly from trying to have careers in the beginning of their marriage. But ever since they have been an enormous help and support to the Queen and the DofE.
  #3686  
Old 01-19-2020, 11:56 AM
csw csw is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sionevar View Post
The Court Circular website is the best place to find this info:

https://www.royal.uk/court-circular
I wonder if the listings for H&M will disappear from the archive after the transition is complete. It says it goes back to 1997 which is the year we lost Diana but she is not included in the list.
  #3687  
Old 01-19-2020, 12:01 PM
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They may just keep them there for archive reasons and for the possibility (as slim as it is) that they are asked to do anything for HM in the future.
  #3688  
Old 01-19-2020, 12:01 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by csw View Post
I wonder if the listings for H&M will disappear from the archive after the transition is complete. It says it goes back to 1997 which is the year we lost Diana but she is not included in the list.
Diana wasn’t doing Royal engagements in 1997. She was divorced. The archive would need to go back further for Diana to be included.
  #3689  
Old 01-19-2020, 12:09 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Denville View Post
I do feel a bit sorry for her but I think she should have been better aware of the country... before electing to marry into the RF
I think they married too fast , they barely knew each other in a day to day setting . They had a long distance relationship and one result of such a relationship is that people are often on their best behaviour when they are together to make those days count . Maybe an approach like in Denmark would have worked . Have Meghan move to the UK and live there for a while , with Harry or without him , just to get a feel for the place beyond being a tourist .


Quote:
Originally Posted by Hallo girl View Post
There was plenty for both Harry and Meghan to do within the RF for many years to come.
These stories about them being sidelined I find difficult to understand.
I see that a direct result of the Diana's boys narrative . After Diana's death the press attached them to each other and treated them like they were the same and equal to each other . And I believe, with the Queen getting older and everybody now being in smooth transition mode , it hit Harry like a brick , that he's not really equal and that he isn't even the "spare" anymore ,
  #3690  
Old 01-19-2020, 12:16 PM
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Quote:
it hit Harry like a brick , that he's not really equal and that he isn't even the "spare" anymore ,
Then he's 'a bear of little Brain'.. this has been YEARS 'in the offing'.. none of it is remotely new...
  #3691  
Old 01-19-2020, 12:21 PM
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Originally Posted by wyevale View Post
Then he's 'a bear of little Brain'.. this has been YEARS 'in the offing'.. none of it is remotely new...
I think that's more Meghan. I thnk she thought that royal life would be more glamourous and didn't realise that even for the queen and Charles and William, the direct line.. it is not that exciting.. and for a second string one like Harry, its not that grandiose.

Quote:
Originally Posted by O-H Anglophile View Post
On the other hand there is Princess Anne and the Wessexes. Shining examples of lowkey service and duty.
Yes, the Wessexes had some rough patches-mostly from trying to have careers in the beginning of their marriage. But ever since they have been an enormous help and support to the Queen and the DofE.
Yes Anne and the Wessexes have done an OK job.. but that was then.. in the future, as they get older, the royal worker bees are going to be just a very few..The public doesn't want to pay for tehm any more.. Charles does not want to have half a dozen royals that he has to help support.. THe RF DID have a large role in supporting chartiies, which was Ok for its time but now things have changed and it is not going to be such a major part of the Royal role. It will change but gradually. So for the time being Harry was required and Anne and the ohers were required.. but they wont be all htat much longer. They will retire and not be replaced.
  #3692  
Old 01-19-2020, 12:24 PM
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I keep seeing Harry's past interviews expressing his unease with his royal role as "evidence" against Meghan driving this decision. Frankly, however you see it-- that this was driven by Meghan, by Harry, or by a combination of the two-- I would think that Harry's comments from before he met Meghan would actually weigh in the other direction. For years, Harry was honest about how uneasy he was in his role, yet made no moves to step away from it. In fact, he spoke about how he could not step away from it because it was his duty to support his grandmother, then his father, then his brother. In other words, his own past words and actions show that he had every intention of overcoming his unease and sticking it out.
  #3693  
Old 01-19-2020, 12:24 PM
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I don't think anyone has suggested that Meghan hates the UK. She doesn't seem to want to be part of the Royal Family with all that that entails, and it would be very hard to get away from that by moving to one of the London suburbs, or even moving to the Scottish Highlands. If they want out, they need to get well away.


If she'd married a footballer or a film star, she'd probably be quite happy living here.


There's also the Duke of Windsor issue - if Harry and Meghan had stayed in the UK, being celebs instead of royals, there'd have been a danger of them overshadowing William and Kate, and that wouldn't really have been an option.


I've only been to Canada three times, for a couple of weeks at a time, so I can't really comment on how different the lifestyle there is, but I didn't find it that different ... but the difference between a royal lifestyle and a non-royal lifestyle is certainly different. Vancouver Island is lovely, although Harry the former "party prince" may find it very quiet compared to London.
  #3694  
Old 01-19-2020, 12:30 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lumutqueen View Post
You would be correct, Henry is not honorary colonel of any regiment. He was Commodore-in-Chief, Hon Air Commandant and Captain General.

However I do believe that there is some air of truth to what is being said about why Henry's military appointments have been removed. It's not something I ever contemplated.
There has to be a lot of truth to this... His military appointments were not in even in public discussion and the statement basically bought about a discussion of it. I don't believe the BRF would have seemingly gone out of their way to bring this into the public limelight unless they were forced to.
  #3695  
Old 01-19-2020, 12:37 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Denville View Post
The drama was made by Meg and Harry. They undertook a full time royal role. Perhaps in Willaims day there will be only the heir working.. and the younger children wll be completely free to work outside. But for the moment, in 2018/19 Will and harry were both considiered to be required for full time service and they undertook the job.
With drama was meant a lot of things happening in the past, if it was Margret, Diana Fergie or Andrew they lack to be capable to control inside, maybe the Queen was to weak, the upbringing was bad, not enough education given....
many reasons and wrong decisions were made.
  #3696  
Old 01-19-2020, 12:42 PM
Majesty
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HighGoalHighDreams View Post
I keep seeing Harry's past interviews expressing his unease with his royal role as "evidence" against Meghan driving this decision. Frankly, however you see it-- that this was driven by Meghan, by Harry, or by a combination of the two-- I would think that Harry's comments from before he met Meghan would actually weigh in the other direction. For years, Harry was honest about how uneasy he was in his role, yet made no moves to step away from it. In fact, he spoke about how he could not step away from it because it was his duty to support his grandmother, then his father, then his brother. In other words, his own past words and actions show that he had every intention of overcoming his unease and sticking it out.
I think he would have stayed but been rather unhappy a lot of the time.. if he had stayed single or married someone else. He had the loyalty to his Grandmother and father and brother.. He also had no real expeirence of life outside the RF.. so I think he would not have taken steps to go.. He might have complained a lot and taken long holidays in Africa to escape.. but he would have stuck out the job. But he has married someone who is from totally outside the RF and upper class life.. or even middle class Englsh life. She has givene him a new perspective that it might be possible to do the unthinkable and go. And Im sure that she was the one who said "We don't have to rely on your father etc for money.. we can go to America and make our own.. "!
  #3697  
Old 01-19-2020, 12:47 PM
csw csw is offline
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Originally Posted by O-H Anglophile View Post
Diana wasn’t doing Royal engagements in 1997. She was divorced. The archive would need to go back further for Diana to be included.
Thanks! I didn't think of that.
  #3698  
Old 01-19-2020, 12:50 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Betsypaige View Post
This blog post was written on Thursday, but it’s still worth reading ...I couldn’t agree more.

https://fromberkshiretobuckingham.bl...am-summit.html
So do I! I agree with the author so much I've even bookmarked her blog.
  #3699  
Old 01-19-2020, 12:50 PM
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There was a mildly interesting opinion piece in the Telegraph today by Martin Townsend, who used to be the editor of OK! in the 1990's. It's a piece for subscribers but in it he points out some of the potential pitfalls of the Sussexes monetizing their celebrity, and also makes some suggestions as to how to avoid some of those pitfalls. Here's an excerpt:

--"In the world of celebrity media in particular, the word ‘exclusive’ comes at a high price - both to buyer and seller.

For the buyer it means being able to obtain something that no other magazine, newspaper, television company or website have had access to before.

For the seller - Harry and Meghan - it requires them having such stories to sell, but here is the rub: each time they deliver an exclusive a little bit of their mystique ebbs away, the bank of material they can draw on diminishes and the future market value of any exclusive falls. How many times could Harry and Meghan lift the lid on their relationship with William and Kate, even assuming they wanted to ? If Meghan ‘told all’ about how she might have been tormented by her father or pushed around by Royal lackeys, how often could she repeat those allegations without sounding bitter and washed-up ?"--

--"When I was Editor of OK! Magazine in the late 90s, the highest prices we paid were for stars photographed in their own homes and for exclusive access to their weddings and the birth of their children.

The prices for these exclusives ranged anywhere from between £20,000 to over a million, depending on the star’s celebrity status.

Will Harry and Meghan willingly let a magazine into any home they might share, particularly if photographs of Archie are part of the deal ?

Most of these exclusives are brokered on the basis of Worldwide rights, meaning that the buyer can ‘sell on’ the interview and pictures, globally. On this basis, and at current market rates, it might be possible for Harry and Meghan to secure at least £10 million for a single at-home and exclusive interview. But they’d have to be prepared to include the child they have been at great pains to protect, divulge some juicy Royal secrets, and not mind if the whole thing turned up in the Chinese equivalent of Take A Break next to an advert for incontinence pants."--

He also points out that such interviews would inevitably serve notice to paparazzi that it would be no holds barred from then out, and suggests that they might be wiser to forgo that kind of quick and easy money to establish a quieter and more selective lifestyle that might not reap such quick cash payouts, but have longer benefits.

As I said, an interesting read from someone whose bread and butter this stuff used to be.
  #3700  
Old 01-19-2020, 01:00 PM
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Originally Posted by Mirabel View Post
I don't find them immature as much as self-absorbed. They seem to have a sense of entitlement that is hard to dismiss.

But perhaps I see it that way because I simply can't imagine anyone hating the UK! It's one of my favorite places in the world- I visit every year, sometimes twice a year- and I just can't fathom someone not liking it as much as I do. So, I am struggling with attempting to be fair to M & H.
Self-absorbed? Absolutely. I call them immature because of the way they threw a proverbial temper tantrum and posted on their website, deliberately defying the Queen and Charles. I call them immature because Harry can't figure out if he hates the Royal life or wants to be part of it - OR if he's just jealous of William. Mercurial is definitely the right description for him - and I've seen that several times in the media.

I want to be fair to them also - I supported Meghan up until now as my posts here will attest to, and of course I loved Harry. It's hard for me to be kind to them when I feel they've been unfair to Charles (not just now), especially, but also of course the Queen and William. I also adore the UK - I've been several times, including last year and the year before, and I'll be visiting again in June.

Quote:
I feel like there's some mixed messages here - in the engagement interview we got confident Meghan, ready to hit the ground running Meghan, we got Harry saying that she will be great in the job part. Yet now we get "I didn't know the press won't be fair" Meghan? What? When was the press fair to BRF? Did the treatment of Diana or Catherine seemed fair? Was Meghan's treatment in the press fair during their engagement? I don't believe she was unprepared to this extreme and I honestly feel like the "bad press" is being used as a scapegoat here, a convienient excuse for this decision.

The ground rules that BRF has are pretty clear - keep quiet, keep working, don't complain. They might offer support and reassurance in person, but they KNOW any public statement will cause more scrutiny than the lack of it. When they have that option, they take legal measures, but it requires having solid ground for the case.
Quote:

A perfect example of how manipulative they are - and probably how dumb they think people are that they wouldn't remember this. I'm not surprised - Harry is annoyed that he's being pushed out, upset that his father agreed with the Queen about not allowing them a separate "court", but then we find out that for months he's been working on an exit strategy. It's like he has no idea what he wants, like he changes his mind with the wind.

I'm furious with Meghan at how ungrateful she is to the BRF, specifically Charles and the Queen, who DID welcome her warmly into their family.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Halley View Post
So Harry will be based in Canada, with trips to the US and UK. He will have left his friends and his way of life. Let us hope that his relationship with Meghan and Archie is enough to make him happy. No. Harry has not won.
You're right, Harry didn't win. But his wife might have.
His wife definitely won.......and Harry thinks he's won, though he's lost. Archie has lost.
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