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  #341  
Old 01-08-2020, 09:21 PM
ACO ACO is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tatiana Maria View Post
I think they would be wise to strike a conciliatory tone, but a palace spokeswoman has surprisingly given another short statement to the BBC.

https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-51041950

Can you provide a link to this?
I don't have a link but I am sure you can find the SUN retraction somewhere. It was his story they had to backtrack on. It wasn't that long ago. Maybe others remember? I know it was posted here.
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  #342  
Old 01-08-2020, 09:22 PM
Heir Presumptive
 
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Who is the Money Man/Woman?

An endeavor like this will require large sums of money in pretty short order. They must have a mega-rich sponsor to help them get this thing off the ground. It will be interesting to see who’s signing the checks.
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  #343  
Old 01-08-2020, 09:23 PM
Commoner
 
Join Date: Dec 2018
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Very, very disappointing. They were my favorite royals, but I started to sour on them with the Africa documentary. The personal revelations they chose to include were unfortunate. Then to take the long break over Christmas, with Harry not even flying back when his 95 year old father was hospitalized. It just smacked of entitlement. Their lives are not that hard compared to most of The Queen's subjects. A beautiful home, all the money you could want, prestige, a worldwide platform, not to mention a beautiful son and each other. Even their work is nothing compared to the slog most of us have to go through to keep a roof over our heads. The tabloid press is poison, but others have had to run that gamut. It is best ignored. Instead, they tried to be secretive about even unimportant things, and that just got the reporters riled up even more. So many of their decisions have been poor; they have terrible PR instincts.

I sound like a hater, but I've been a big fan and have defended them time and time again. But now, with this move, I can't feel the same about them. From the disrespectful way they sprang this on the RF, to the horrid PR jargon of their announcement, to their apparent desire to have their cake and eat it, too, I feel so let down. If I were British, I think I'd feel angry.

Harry strikes me as a follower, and I get a sense that this is led by Meghan. The announcement is 100% her. She has always talked about her initiatives and interests in global terms, not UK terms. It stands to reason Britain and the BRF have little meaning for her. But they do have meaning for Harry. And that phrase about financial independence is scary. Do they plan to commercialize their titles? If so, their brand is going to be tarnished sooner than they would like. Being royal is what makes them.

(I love how Meghan plans to "collaborate" with the Queen? Big of her!)

I can't help thinking that Harry is going to have big regrets about allowing himself to be estranged from his family. I can't imagine it having happened without Meghan. On the other hand, Harry does seem pretty impulsive, so maybe he was the prime mover after all. Either way, I think he will regret it.

They are in for a shock if they think they can control their press now, or that it will be better. It's going to be worse, the scrutiny will be greater, probably the criticism too. Everyone who ever accused Meghan of merching is going to have a beady eye on their every move with Sussex Royal. And they've put themselves in an uncomfortable position in the UK.

Poor little Archie! All of this is swirling around over his innocent head. To think how cheered I was to see that cute photo of him and Harry, thinking they would soon be back, and all would be back to normal. And meanwhile this was being cooked up in the background. Well, perhaps I'm being overly cynical and it is all in his best interests in the end. I hope so.
  #344  
Old 01-08-2020, 09:23 PM
Countessmeout's Avatar
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I am sorry most of that exclusive seems made up in fairy land. Harry is not going to quit over a generational photo. They have done them for years. He is not an idiot, he understands the symbolism.

It seems like someone grasping at straws. No one who actually has the inside ear to the queen, Charles or William would leak this crap.

I have my doubts that charles at the very least had no idea. If Harry plans to continue some royal duties he needs funding and they comes from dad. Think buckingham simply got blinded by When it was announced, not by the announcement. The leak made Harry jump the gun and announce sooner. Buckingham didn't have their announcement drafted yet and simply made a short release to deal with the talk.

As for not being able to keep up with commonwealth roles, why not? The commonwealth trust and ACU are not based in the UK. Meghan and Harry could both be involved heavily in commonwealth activities from a Canadian base. Both in Canada and abroad. Beyond the commonwealth nations, more important are the Queehs realms. And beyond Canada, many of them are in the Western Hemisphere.

Canadians will be happy to have them here. As we aren't footing their living expenses. Canada has a non existent republican movement outside Quebec, unlike Australia. If they were to take up some patronages here and be a face for the royals in canada may do good.
  #345  
Old 01-08-2020, 09:25 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by _Heather_ View Post
If that's true then this truly is nothing more than a temper tantrum of epic proportions thrown by two spoiled brats who saw themselves as far more central and important than they really are. Those were portraits of the Queen and her heirs. Period. They are the future and the continuity of the monarchy. Harry, Meghan, and Archie were never going to be that. They were never the heirs. If the historic portraits showing the Queen with three future generations of monarchs really set them off then they need to be sat down immediately and have it driven home in no uncertain terms that they are not nearly as central to the monarchy as they apparently believe themselves to be.
Besides, how could Harry be in the portrait if he was out of the country? (It appears to have been taken at the same time as the baking photos, over Christmas.)
  #346  
Old 01-08-2020, 09:33 PM
Nobility
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by _Heather_ View Post
If that's true then this truly is nothing more than a temper tantrum of epic proportions thrown by two spoiled brats who saw themselves as far more central and important than they really are. Those were portraits of the Queen and her heirs. Period. They are the future and the continuity of the monarchy. Harry, Meghan, and Archie were never going to be that. They were never the heirs. If the historic portraits showing the Queen with three future generations of monarchs really set them off then they need to be sat down immediately and have it driven home in no uncertain terms that they are not nearly as central to the monarchy as they apparently believe themselves to be.
I don't think that portrait had anything to do with this...some are just reaching for excuses to blame Meghan/Harry. It was clear back in September (long before the portrait or photos) that things weren't going well. The constant attacks by the media, lack of support from the family (while they can manage support for those accused of much worse or more trivial things), leaks to the media were far more likely to be factors than random pictures.
  #347  
Old 01-08-2020, 09:35 PM
Majesty
 
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So, in the UK they will be keeping their Uk-funded security. But, when they are living in Canada for half of the year , will the Canadian government be responsible for their security ?

I am srill trying to understand what their legal status in Canada would be. Woulld Harry be an accredited UK diplomat with UK-funded security ? How would that square with not being a senior royal and being outside the RF’s chain of command ?
  #348  
Old 01-08-2020, 09:36 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by O-H Anglophile View Post
I have serious reservations about using their royal status for profit. When Andrew’s profit making side-line came to light in the recent fiasco, his whole charity was ended. I am appalled.

And if Meghan and Harry were really upset that much by a photo of the Queen and her three direct heirs, then they are delusional.
I just read that article - and I’m almost incandescent with rage at what seems to be Harry throwing a fit and wanting to stick it to the Queen - his grandma, his father, brother and the rest of the BRF. Add on the fact that they are whoring themselves out for profit and I’m just done with them. Good riddance.
  #349  
Old 01-08-2020, 09:38 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ladongas View Post
An endeavor like this will require large sums of money in pretty short order. They must have a mega-rich sponsor to help them get this thing off the ground. It will be interesting to see who’s signing the checks.
Meghan knows how to make money by writing blog posts (and having sponsors). Speaking engagements could be another potential way of earning lots of money. Not sure whether Harry might profit from his Travalyst role if he would want to. Merchandize of their Sussex brand could turn out to be rather popular (at least for a short while).

The fact that they are quite open about how they want to be able to professionally earn money but other than that only talk about spending time in the UK and North America and launching their charitable entity, suggests that they are not looking for 'normal day jobs' but more likely to big bucks sponsoring them, writing books, doing speaking engagements etc (like other celebrities combining both getting/staying rich and doing charitable work). So far, this is meant to be in addition to the 95% of their current funding they expect to keep receiving from Charles; but I do see them becoming 'financially independent' in time. But we'll have to see how all plays out, because that's the part that remains rather 'unspecific' even though they prepared a long page on 'funding' for their website.
  #350  
Old 01-08-2020, 09:40 PM
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To be honest, I really don't know what to think. I'm reading that they can't have titles and make money, like going on QVC. So I just don't know how this will play itself out. I wish them the best, but I don't think this will stop the press, especially the British. As for the Firm not supporting them. Who knows? It sounds to me like both Harry and Meghan don't really know what they need or want!
  #351  
Old 01-08-2020, 09:44 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BaiSoSo View Post
I don't think that portrait had anything to do with this...some are just reaching for excuses to blame Meghan/Harry. It was clear back in September (long before the portrait or photos) that things weren't going well. The constant attacks by the media, lack of support from the family (while they can manage support for those accused of much worse or more trivial things), leaks to the media were far more likely to be factors than random pictures.
Well some things never change. I'm so incredibly sick of this screaming about "a lack of support from the family" and blaming of everyone and everything but Harry and Meghan for their missteps. There's plenty of blame to go around but I'm so tired of this line that there's no blame to be placed on these two. Why in the world would the family or the Firm go out of their way to throw "support" behind a couple who have done nothing but turn their noses up at every aspect of the Firm and family right from the beginning? In their desire to be progressive and edgy and modern they managed to make themselves seem ungrateful and disrespectful and came across like they viewed the Queen and the family as a lot of dotty old relatives that you occasionally humor but don't set much store by. That's horribly offensive and not exactly the kind of attitude and behavior that wins you a lot of "support" and defense and goodwill. Much of this can be laid squarely at Harry and Meghan's doorstep and if they had stepped back and looked outside of themselves for even a few minutes they might have realized long ago that they were shooting themselves in the foot.
  #352  
Old 01-08-2020, 09:50 PM
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This is so left of field that I wonder whether there is another major issue.

I can't see any benefit for them.
I can't see Harry and Meghan being happy to be as supportively polite and as diplomatic as other royals who do their own thing.
Prince and Princess Michael, The Duchess of Kent, The Snowdons, Chattos, Phillips and Tindalls all voice positve and show positive regard to the Queen and the Monarchy but they are relativley quiet and very low key about promoting their own agenda.
Perhaps Harry and Meghan intend to only promote good causes - not themselves.
I worry about their safety and personal earning ability if that is the case.
I do predict that the BRF will react with calm and respect.
  #353  
Old 01-08-2020, 09:52 PM
Majesty
 
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On “ lack of support from the family” , one of the Palace “ sources” quoted by the press said that they were given the wedding they wanted, the home they wanted, the office they wanted, the money they wanted , and got to pick the tours and patronages they wanted. He concluded then by asking what else they wanted !

It may be. a one-sided account, but it is true nonetheless.
  #354  
Old 01-08-2020, 09:52 PM
Majesty
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JessRulz View Post
From Dan Wootton, who had the exclusive on the move: ... [snipped]
"I’m told Harry and Meghan decided to rush out a statement after learning yesterday that The Sun was about to break the story. In doing so, courtiers say they have “exiled themselves from the royal family”."

One wonders who sold the story to The Sun. On a different note, The Duke of Sussex and his spouse can do whatever they wish to do.
  #355  
Old 01-08-2020, 09:53 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Countessmeout View Post
I have my doubts that charles at the very least had no idea. If Harry plans to continue some royal duties he needs funding and they comes from dad. Think buckingham simply got blinded by When it was announced, not by the announcement. The leak made Harry jump the gun and announce sooner. Buckingham didn't have their announcement drafted yet and simply made a short release to deal with the talk.
Yep. They weren’t blinded about Harry and Meghan wanting to leave - they knew that, they were blindsided about Harry and Meghan announcing it now when a decision hadn’t even been made yet.

This was still in the early stages, so I wouldn’t expect BP to have a draft ready. Hard to draft a statement when they are still trying to work through and figure this all out.

It seems the BRF was “disappointed” in the Sussexes decision to release a statement (from the BBC link posted in a previous post).

Quote:
The BBC understands no other royal, including neither the Queen nor the Prince of Wales, was consulted before the unexpected statement was released on Wednesday evening.

A palace spokeswoman told the BBC the Royal Family was "disappointed”. She said discussions with the couple were at an early stage. "We understand their desire to take a different approach, but these are complicated issues that will take time to work through," she added.
I’m shocked that the Sussexes released a statement before informing the Queen and Prince Charles and before anything had even been decided.
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  #356  
Old 01-08-2020, 09:55 PM
Nobility
 
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I wonder if this decision might have more to do with Harry’s mental health than anything. In all honesty we have almost no proof of Meghan doing all the things she is accused of so we should really only consider the facts that we do know. Harry has shared the troubles he has had and said how difficult it was for him when Diana died. Perhaps he is struggling with the media vitriol towards Meghan and is terrified. As for the financial independence I think that would be a good thing and then no one can complain about what ever designer Meghan is wearing. I remember the media and how they went after Diana but times have changed and they are far nastier now than they were then. My guess is that they will still live primarily in the uk but have a holiday place perhaps in Canada. Archie will one day go to school and that will mean a more permanent home in one of the two places they spend time in. I’m sad that it has come to this as I don’t think either of them deserves the treatment they have received. I’m also sad for the Queen as this is a sadness for the family.
  #357  
Old 01-08-2020, 10:00 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BaiSoSo View Post
I don't think that portrait had anything to do with this...some are just reaching for excuses to blame Meghan/Harry. It was clear back in September (long before the portrait or photos) that things weren't going well. The constant attacks by the media, lack of support from the family (while they can manage support for those accused of much worse or more trivial things), leaks to the media were far more likely to be factors than random pictures.
I agree that Harry and Meghan seem to believe the royal family has not been supportive, but I am not sure it is fair to accept that it is all the family's fault. Harry and Meghan are both in their thirties. They have each other and they have a staff. Yes, there are some pressures unique to the royal family, but they also don't have the stress of many things other people face, such as not being able to pay their bills or serious illnesses.

The other family members have their own lives and pressures. Familial support should be a two way street. The family shouldn't revolve around them. His grandparents are in their 90s and probably should be receiving support from them, rather than the other way around. William has his own family. I find it difficult to believe that Charles, who was so supportive of Harry and Meghan during their engagement and the first few months of marriage (and I'm not talking about just walking her down the aisle), has simply abandoned them.

My guess is that, if there is a problem, Harry and Meghan have been unable to clearly communicate their needs. As adults, Harry and Meghan have to be part of the solution.
  #358  
Old 01-08-2020, 10:01 PM
ACO ACO is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mbruno View Post
On “ lack of support from the family” , one of the Palace “ sources” quoted by the press said that they were given the wedding they wanted, the home they wanted, the office they wanted, the money they wanted , and got to pick the tours and patronages they wanted. He concluded then by asking what else they wanted !

It may be. a one-sided account, but it is true nonetheless.
And Meghan says no one even bothered to ask if she was okay. Maybe it lies somewhere in the middle. No one is all right or wrong. I mean heck in this mess some could just trying to save face. We have zero idea because we have no clue what the REAL dynamics of these people are. We just know what they want us to know and most of the time that is rarely the truth... unless forced out.

All we know based on what was issued is that Harry and Meghan want out of royal duties. My guess is that the Queen and Charles were trying to get them to wait a bit but the Sussexes have made up their mind. Maybe this statement was to force their hand. Maybe that website was to provoke. I don't know.

But what I can guess is that Harry and Meghan are not naive and know they can't be half a royal. They either will be all in or leave. If they are given that ultimatum I suspect we will be getting another statement saying they are no longer HRH or a member of the royal family.

These next few days will be very very interesting.
  #359  
Old 01-08-2020, 10:04 PM
Majesty
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LadyGlendower View Post
If the Sussexes wanted the element of surprise as a sort of leverage, they have it. For about 48 hours is my guess.

Then they lose whatever advantage they might have had because I find it hard to believe that no one at BP has long since gamed out what might happen if they took this tack.

Interesting days ahead at BP, BBC, DM, etc.

And that means interesting days at The Royal Forums as well. God bless the mods!
my bolding
Right you are!
  #360  
Old 01-08-2020, 10:17 PM
Majesty
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by marlene View Post
I wonder if this decision might have more to do with Harry’s mental health than anything. In all honesty we have almost no proof of Meghan doing all the things she is accused of so we should really only consider the facts that we do know. Harry has shared the troubles he has had and said how difficult it was for him when Diana died. Perhaps he is struggling with the media vitriol towards Meghan and is terrified. As for the financial independence I think that would be a good thing and then no one can complain about what ever designer Meghan is wearing. I remember the media and how they went after Diana but times have changed and they are far nastier now than they were then. My guess is that they will still live primarily in the uk but have a holiday place perhaps in Canada. Archie will one day go to school and that will mean a more permanent home in one of the two places they spend time in. I’m sad that it has come to this as I don’t think either of them deserves the treatment they have received. I’m also sad for the Queen as this is a sadness for the family.

I don’t see any major issue about Harry and Meghan living in Canada as private citizens provided they can sort out their immigration status, which should not be too difficult ( although Harry for example would struggle under the Canadian point system as he doesn’t have a university degree, doesn’t speak French , etc.).

My concern is about Harry seeking to have any public role in Canada as the Canadian constitution, as I argued before, assigns no official public role to members of the Royal Family other than the Queen of Canada herself and, unlike his great-granduncle, the late Duke of Gloucester, who was Governor General of Australia (?), Harry will not be Governor General / Viceroy of Canada. As I said, Harry could be an accredited UK diplomat in Canada, with the UK government paying for his housing , maintenance and security, but that doesn’t square with his desire to be a free agent and carve out his own progressive role without being constrained by instructions from Buckingham Palace or the Foreign Office.

On the other hand, Canada paying for the maintenance of a British Prince, who is not a Canadian citizen and has no official position in the Canadian government or any Canadian federal or provincial agency/department, certainly won’t fly well with the Canadian public and is not a realistic option. That is completely different from an occasional Royal Family tour on the invitation of the Canadian government.

I wish Harry and Meghan would provide further details on their Canadian base and how that is supposed to work. Maybe they could set up a private foundation /charity run fom Toronto or Vancouver , but then we are talking about them living in Canada as private citizens only , with no public or diplomatic role, and the issue of their security for example would arise again.
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