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  #2921  
Old 01-17-2020, 02:32 PM
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I donít think Harry going to the Queen is indicative of a bad relationship. I think itís more I go to the one more likely to spoil me.

I suspect William, Harry, Charles have ups and downs of a relationship. Charles and Dianaís relationship took two. I suspect the sons know that more than anyone.

I donít think being so dependent on Dad financially helps.

I personally feel Harry and Meghan came across as entitled . Nothing wrong with wanting to life your own life but you donít get to keep the parts of royal you like.

Who wouldnít want to be part time royalty?
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  #2922  
Old 01-17-2020, 02:40 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by O-H Anglophile View Post
Not really an apples to apples comparison. Denmark is a different country and Mary was going to be the future Queen marrying the Crown Prince.
It is because even if Harry was the heir, in the current political climate, Meghan would not have been allowed to queue-jump to automatic citizenship.
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  #2923  
Old 01-17-2020, 02:53 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Missjersey View Post
I tend to agree with you Pranter, especially your last paragraph.

Iíll add, Iíve always thought Harry had a chip on his shoulder/resentment towards his father and grandmother in the way his mother was treated during/after his parents divorce.

Who knows what goes on behind closed doors but I do think Harry has been mollycoddled where that has become his ďnormĒ. When he married, I canít help but think there was a sigh of relief from his elders hoping that this would see him settled in some way and building a marvelous future for himself and his bride.

Today I donít think itís a chip/resentment anymore. I think itís a deep internal rage thatís now playing out in public. I think heís a very angry young man.
Harry was quite young when Charles and Divorced. William was the one that took the brunt of the drama during that time.

I agree that Harry may have been spoiled more due to not having as high expectations placed on him and due to his own charm and mischievousness. However, he has very much come into his own and done some wonderful work with his charities and with the Invicitus games. WE all hoped he had matured and was ready to settle down and use his energies to be a great asset to the BRF with his new wife. Unfortunately, it is turning out to be the opposite.

Harry is definitely an angry bitter young man, and it is not an attractive thing to witness. For a young man who has so much going for him and has so many advantages the victim role doesn't sit well and for a man who advocates Mental Health Awareness and seeking help rather than suppressing it, he is not doing the cause any favors when his solution is to have temper tantrums, stomp his feet and run away. He needs therapy in a very bad way.
  #2924  
Old 01-17-2020, 02:59 PM
Pranter's Avatar
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Missjersey View Post
I tend to agree with you Pranter, especially your last paragraph.

Iíll add, Iíve always thought Harry had a chip on his shoulder/resentment towards his father and grandmother in the way his mother was treated during/after his parents divorce.

Who knows what goes on behind closed doors but I do think Harry has been mollycoddled where that has become his ďnormĒ. When he married, I canít help but think there was a sigh of relief from his elders hoping that this would see him settled in some way and building a marvelous future for himself and his bride.

Today I donít think itís a chip/resentment anymore. I think itís a deep internal rage thatís now playing out in public. I think heís a very angry young man.

I don't think it's really resentment towards his father and The Queen...I think more likely to be disappointment that developed as he became old enough to understand what all went on back then and everyone's roles.

I don't think Harry has been mollycoddled. He went off on his own into the military and did very well by all accounts. You don't fly in Apache's (an go to war in them) without some brains, don't care what your school grades were. The military doesn't mollycoddle you, especially not the British military.

I do think allowances have been made for him to find his own way especially after the military (the media strikes again making it impossible for him to go back to war)....he wasn't really needed then, heck the Cambridges weren't even full time.

Unless he was dating someone the media left him alone unless he was off working with a charity etc. It's only been since he married that there was even an expectation of him working 'full time' (whatever that means to the BRF).

I think he was always wary of the media but tried to rub along with them for the most part (there was an incident or two) until he started dating Meghan and things just went off the deep end. I remember an engagement he was doing the day Kate had Louis and the media asked him about her ..his face and tone/attitude was negative, really not the usual we'd been seeing.

I'm sure he is angry. What all he is angry about we can only guess. However he's said it more than once he's not going to tolerate the harassment (we know there have been some horrible threats and even ppl arrested) and he's not going to see his wife end up like his mother. Everyone was put on notice...I'm sure that included the family.




LaRae
  #2925  
Old 01-17-2020, 03:04 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by _Heather_ View Post
It now appears that Rose Van Cutsem, wife of Hugh Van Cutsem who has been a longtime close friend of both Harry and William posted and then quickly removed an IG post mocking Harry and Meghan's announcement. If that's true, and I frankly believe that it is because it would be easy enough to prove (screenshots are taken of this kind of thing all the time), then it speaks volumes. There's been numerous reports of Harry dropping his old friends, etc. and if someone like Rose Van Cutsem feels like it was okay to post that then clearly there's not much of a relationship there any longer.
Hereís the story from the DM

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/tvshowbi...un-Megxit.html
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  #2926  
Old 01-17-2020, 03:09 PM
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The Duke and Duchess of Sussex to Step Back as Senior Royals: January 2020

Quote:
Originally Posted by soapstar View Post

I saw this, found it hilarious.
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  #2927  
Old 01-17-2020, 03:25 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TRCRoyal View Post
I can't help but wonder what everyone is thinking right now. I don't think Harry and Meghan wanted to step down from all royal duties, and I don't think they'll end up losing their titles whatsoever.

I really believe the worst part of this has already happened with all the media attention and the rumours the announcement sparked. But I think the Queen has gotten this under control now and they'll work out the details that allow Harry to still be a Prince of the UK and get to live a semi-private life.


Can't help but wonder, though. Vancouver is not a normally paparazzi-heavy city. Meghan was photographed twice in 3 days, makes me wonder how the paps knew she'd be at the airport picking her friend up (and why she had to do it herself after the first time she was photographed). Also, why not lay low and not visit the shelter for a couple of weeks until things have calmed down? Or is it prove that you'll still do charity wherever you go?

Then again, maybe I'm overthinking this!

I'm doing overthinking as well, I believe.


I've mentioned that I believe the Guardian more than the Daily Mail. But I read the Daily Mail because normally they print all the pics available in their online issue and it's interesting to see what they print and think about why they either chose these quotes or fabricated them.



But I find that I don't like the way Meghan is shown in Canada and as it's pics, it must be true apart from the explanations. I find it not okay (I have stated that before) that she goes to some charities to empower staff with her presence when she stays as a Royal Duchess in what is to be considered a private holiday in Canada. She could really create problems for her supporter Justin Trudeau and that is political, then.

On the same day, the DM reports that she was given a diamond and 18ct gold necklace from a native jewel-creater which she wore on her visits and which was described in detail by the Mail, who got the information from the giver and her gallery via IG, where they thanked Meghan for her support. Strangely enough for them the Mail did not post how much the necklace would have cost at the gallery, it looks affordable, something Meghan would have bought for herself, nothing in the least "Royal". And it's a gift from the charity and the artist.

Still I feel not good when I read that. Charities should spend their money or gifts they get for their poor clientel, not for a Royal Duchess. Meghan shouldn't have taken it but given it back and up for auction with the info that she wore it (including that pic). Maybe that's what happened and the DM did just not "followup on this story", as they use to say.

But my intuition tells me that the first visit to meet the staff at the shelter was arrange to not let the second visit with the giftreception stand alone on that day. I don't know but there's a reason the Royals only buy their clothes and don't take them as gifts.



IMHO. I really feel unsettled now. Meghan should have given it more time in the Uk, stop reading the papers and media and done more "ordinary Royal charity work". It so feels like the shadow of Diana haunting the world but I doubt this time the Royal lady will only have her freedom for such a short time.
  #2928  
Old 01-17-2020, 03:31 PM
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https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...ermission.html
Wow, she now can breath? Well, she knew what she was getting into, I would trade my life with her for a month and she could see what it is really to have your soul crash!
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  #2929  
Old 01-17-2020, 03:32 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Pranter View Post
I think William has been raised with a very different set of expectations from Harry..so perhaps he's been more groomed to know there's no getting out of it ever..you are gonna be the King at some point.

Harry would of had (been raised with) different expectations and allowed to have more freedom in options. Perhaps without that sense of you must do X.

I agree that Charles is going to want both boys to be happy. The last thing he's going to do is insist Harry keep doing the full time work for the Firm if he is miserable doing it.

I tend to go by the body language of them when they've all be together in public for events or interviews etc. I think they usually get on well with Charles. The media is not going to be overly concerned with us hearing how much they love/respect each other.



LaRae

I agree with this......I'm probably a bit sensitive about it because, like I said, I have a soft spot for Charles.



Quote:
And then in the documentary for Charles's 70th birthday, William said he wished his father was able to spend more time with his children. I bolded some relevant points.

My point is, it is possible to have some facts, but without having or using the whole picture, shape those facts into a story that is not accurate.

https://www.etonline.com/prince-will...-grandchildren


'Prince William and Prince Harry want their father, Prince Charles, to focus on his work-life balance a little more. In the new BBC One documentary, Prince, Son & Heir: Charles at 70, in honor of the Prince of Wales' upcoming 70th birthday, the brothers open up about their father and their hopes for him.

Charles’ eldest son, William, expresses his desire to have his father spend more time with his three children, Prince George, 5, Princess Charlotte, 3, and Prince Louis, 6 months.

"I would like him to have more time with the children,” William says of his father. "Having more time with him at home would be lovely, and being able to, you know, play around with the grandchildren. When he’s there, he’s brilliant, but we need him there as much as possible.”"
I remember this, this was really lovely.

I tend to get swayed by the most recent "thing", so it's possible that's what's happened here, lol.

Quote:
Harry is definitely an angry bitter young man, and it is not an attractive thing to witness. For a young man who has so much going for him and has so many advantages the victim role doesn't sit well and for a man who advocates Mental Health Awareness and seeking help rather than suppressing it, he is not doing the cause any favors when his solution is to have temper tantrums, stomp his feet and run away. He needs therapy in a very bad way.
Didn't Diana say that she overcompensated with Harry so that he wouldn't feel overlooked as the "spare"? If so, maybe that accounts for Harry's spoiled ,petulant behavior. He's definitely got a good heart, but he's acted out so many times - I mean really, dressing up as a Nazi - even if it was subconsciously, that it almost seems as if he's crying out for attention. I think he's extremely insecure - understandable as even just being referred to as "the spare" makes him (or any one else) seem little more than backup to the future king, not valued for himself at all.
  #2930  
Old 01-17-2020, 03:39 PM
Duke of Marmalade's Avatar
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DM says that further details regarding Megxit could be released soon.

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...-imminent.html

Most british press only refer to Meghan as Meghan Markle now instead of DoS.
  #2931  
Old 01-17-2020, 03:48 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ACO View Post
You mean the woman who has posted a rant about the Daily Mail calling them trash for twisting something that has nothing to do about them? That Rose?
I have absolutely no idea what Rose Van Cutsem may or may not have posted about the DM. She's no concern of mine. I simply saw an article with a shot of the IG post and there was absolutely no ambiguity whatsoever about that post. It was quite clearly mocking the Sussex post. There's no possible way that anyone could mistake that wording. Rose is the wife of a close friend of William and Harry. Now I'm sure that someone will attempt to argue that they're really not friends, we don't actually know that, no one has ever stated in black and white that they're friends so how dare we infer a friendship there, blah blah blah. But Hugh and Rose are friends of theirs. And the IG post said, and a I quote "I am standing back as a senior member of my tax return because I'd rather drink coffee, see my friends, love my family, and do yoga." It was posted and then swiftly deleted. Everyone is, I suppose, free to think what they like of it but to me that certainly sounds like an eye rolling and mocking post and based on how fast it was deleted, I'd say she might have realized it wasn't a great idea to post. The point, though, is that she posted it at all.
  #2932  
Old 01-17-2020, 03:49 PM
christinacg's Avatar
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Duke of Marmalade View Post
DM says that further details regarding Megxit could be released soon.



https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...-imminent.html



Most british press only refer to Meghan as Meghan Markle now instead of DoS.


They always have, just like they still call the DoC Kate Middleton. Nothing new
  #2933  
Old 01-17-2020, 03:49 PM
Lilyflo's Avatar
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Duke of Marmalade View Post
Most british press only refer to Meghan as Meghan Markle now instead of DoS.
The tabloids always have and they still call the Duchess of Cambridge 'Kate Middleton'. Apparently it's to generate more internet hits as that's how people search for them.
  #2934  
Old 01-17-2020, 03:50 PM
hel hel is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Duke of Marmalade View Post
DM says that further details regarding Megxit could be released soon.

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...-imminent.html

Most british press only refer to Meghan as Meghan Markle now instead of DoS.
I don't actually think that's true.. the page you link to includes the word "Duchess" 28 times in reference to Meghan.

The headline refers to Meghan Markle because of SEO. I don't think it's a coded message.
  #2935  
Old 01-17-2020, 03:52 PM
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Sorry, I’m not a double quoter, this is in response to Pranter and Texankitcat....

He was very young back in those horrible days but who’s to say (if he reads his own press) that he hasn’t read his mother’s press—that’s a possibility..who knows....

His charities seemed so deeply personal, one could see that. Regarding his Army, I shout a gigantic HOOAH. He seemed happiest there in my eyes. Wasn’t there something about William going off the to the air ambulance and Harry was miffed because he couldn’t fly anymore? If that’s true, it just adds to the angry drawer.

Maybe mollycoddled isn’t the right word, yet, it seems to me, people have walked on eggshells throughout his many trials and tribulations into adulthood behind the scenes to help him achieve whatever he was looking for and this is where we are now.

It’s sad. It’s unbelievable, not that he wants to protect his family, but the way in which he presents it so coldly to the people who love him most.
  #2936  
Old 01-17-2020, 03:57 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ashelen View Post
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...ermission.html
Wow, she now can breath? Well, she knew what she was getting into, I would trade my life with her for a month and she could see what it is really to have your soul crash!
Well, if there is any truth in this article, we know now who was really behind this "stepping back as senior Royals"-move! All this talk about "joint decision", "why is only Markle who gets all the blame" and so on is in vain if this story is true!
Surely, Prince Harry was also not happy about his "horrendous fate, worse than death"-situation (no quote, my own words), but he always knew where his place was and what he owed to his grandmother and the country as many things he said during royal tours or interviews in documentaries show.

It is sad, but the truth is that virtually every person marrying into the RF, who came from a broken home/ family him/ herself, caused deep trouble to the monarchy, beginning with Wallis Simpson, Townsend, Lord Snowdon, the Princess of Wales, Fergie and now MM. Can all of these cases really be of pure coincidence?! Who could possibly believe that?

On the positive list we have people like the current Duchess of Gloucester, Sophie Wessex or the Duchess of Cambridge, by origin of stable family backgrounds.
  #2937  
Old 01-17-2020, 03:58 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by texankitcat View Post
We do know that the Queen refused to meet with Harry until the Sussex, Wales and Cambridge camps got together to work out a workable plan, which is exactly what Charles asked Harry to do and exactly what happened. The Queen was not going to be placed in the middle. I am sure Harry wanted to plead his case and expedite the process through the Queen, but that isn't how things are done. He should have known better. The world does not revolve around Harry and his spouse.
but the point being that, if the story is true, the courtiers feared that she wuodl be swayed by him. To tell the truth I think that she, like Charles, has been rather indulgent in some ways to Harry.
  #2938  
Old 01-17-2020, 04:00 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Missjersey View Post
Sorry, Iím not a double quoter, this is in response to Pranter and Texankitcat....

He was very young back in those horrible days but whoís to say (if he reads his own press) that he hasnít read his motherís pressóthatís a possibility..who knows....

His charities seemed so deeply personal, one could see that. Regarding his Army, I shout a gigantic HOOAH. He seemed happiest there in my eyes. Wasnít there something about William going off the to the air ambulance and Harry was miffed because he couldnít fly anymore? If thatís true, it just adds to the angry drawer.

Maybe mollycoddled isnít the right word, yet, it seems to me, people have walked on eggshells throughout his many trials and tribulations into adulthood behind the scenes to help him achieve whatever he was looking for and this is where we are now.

Itís sad. Itís unbelievable, not that he wants to protect his family, but the way in which he presents it so coldly to the people who love him most.
I can't figure out all the quote functions either!


I just think it's good to keep in mind that 99 percent of what we know is what the tabloid media are telling us.


LaRae
  #2939  
Old 01-17-2020, 04:01 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lumutqueen View Post
I saw this, found it hilarious.
As I am currently working on my taxes, I also thought it was hilarious. I just don't think the IRS would be of the same opinion in my case.
  #2940  
Old 01-17-2020, 04:04 PM
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As The Stomach Churns

We're all getting caught up in the middle of the "right now". The "right now" isn't giving us very many facts to work with so we're hunting and fishing and playing Sherlock Holmes looking for anything and everything that may provide some "clues" even to the point of things that happened years ago even sometimes dredging up things from the War of the Wales via a wayback machine called information on file. On this point, I will say that a quote from Charles during that time back then is as appropriate now as it was then. He is quoted as saying, "They've turned us into a bloody soap opera".

No matter how hard we try, we're never going to have a complete picture of the relationships and interactions and know the dynamics of their familial life. We only know what has been made public and statements that have been made at a point in time. We have had Camilla joking that Charles is such a workaholic that on his birthday, she'd have to hold up a sign stating "Happy Birthday, Darling!" as he rushed past her to another appointment. That could be construed as a husband that neglects his wife by an onlooking public.

This is not a family that is your normal, everyday family unit. We see this with wedding planning and finding dates and times when its feasible for all of them to get together. We have a date set practically in stone of the Wednesday in the week before Christmas for the extended family lunch and another set in stone for the family all to appear for Trooping the Color and Remembrance Sunday. This happens when you not only have a family but a family that is a business and a very busy business to boot. The "Firm" doesn't operate on set working hours of 9-5 and weekends off but is constantly in motion doing something. This also isn't a business where its acceptable to "call into work sick" because that work for the day may have been on the calendar for up six months or more and a whole lot of people would be let down if one stayed in bed with a bad cold or a headache.

I honestly don't feel that all that is going on right now has roots in familial relationships or how much time spent together or who was a good dad or a bad dad and neglectful or emotional/mental distress among the family. I see it more as individuals that work for the "Firm" wanting to make some changes in how they operate, do things, how much time spent with the "Firm" business in relation to how they would fit in their own personalities and aims and goals on their own. Sometimes the way things are done need to be changed and adapted to fit to the people that are doing the work.

If things never changed in the "Firm", the British Royal Family would still be cloistered behind palace walls with that "aura" of mystique around them. Tiaras and ballgowns and white tie attire would still be the attraction for attending the ballet or the opera. Royal children would be taught by tutors and raised by governesses and nannies and seen but not heard. And... the press would be expected to only print glowing reports and know nothing about private matters. The "gilded fishbowl" of the past is long gone.

Its clear that we're *all* very interested, concerned, trying to keep on top of developments of all this and see things very differently from each other here and it makes for good conversation. I just think we need to remember and keep in mind that what we see isn't the full picture of how things really are.

We now return you to the scheduled discussion of "As The Stomach Churns", the most popular soap opera taking the world by storm.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Pranter View Post
I can't figure out all the quote functions either!


I just think it's good to keep in mind that 99 percent of what we know is what the tabloid media are telling us.
Me three on the double quote thingie. My solution is to have the thread open in two tabs and do a lot of copy/paste.
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