The Duke and Duchess of Sussex and Family, News and Events 7: Oct. 2022 -

[Royalist.in.NC]

Originally Posted by Moran

The rift with Charles' "darling boy" didn't just happen. Darling boy wanted it and did his best to achieve it. He also insulted and attacked Charles' other "darling boy" with abandon, as well as insulting the whole country that gave him the cushy life and recognition he would have never achieved on his own merit.

The coronation is a state affair and absolutely the last place where Harry should be welcome and he should be told so. Actually, if Charles has a modicum of decency, he should never show his darling boy to the public again after he lied to the public for years that his dear, dear baby was a man he wasn't. A man who cared about these less fortunate than him and respected the station and privileges he was born to.

Also, which is most important, Harry has shown no desire to heal the rift. In fact, insisting that he should be invited to the coronation at this stage equals saying that no matter what he does, he should be pampered and indulged so he can continue use his country, its monarchy and his family to achieve significance and it's totally fine for him to attack everyone and everyone else just bending down for him. Just no.

Excellent points, as always! I do agree that Harry expects to get away with whatever he’s done because he always has. No matter what Charles or anyone else does or says, it will never be enough. It will never bring back Diana. And because he’s after money and revenge, he/ they will publish anything they can. The only thing the RF can do is to not give them any more fuel to add to their dumpster fire (by not communicating - they have proven they can’t be trusted). Indeed after all Harry has said, why would he want to go unless he gets his way?

I suppose through intermediaries they could find out how much money they want, give it to them (not in a lump sum) along with an ironclad NDA for both of them that the money will stop if they continue to trash the RF. It is galling but it would certainly show the public they were after money all along if they took the money and shut up.

[.....] And this talk of “invite him, he’s a member of the family” doesn’t take into consideration that he’s shown no respect for the family nor the monarchy the coronation celebrates.

[Denville]

Originally Posted by Royalist.in.NC

I suppose through intermediaries they could find out how much money they want, give it to them (not in a lump sum) along with an ironclad NDA for both of them that the money will stop if they continue to trash the RF. It is galling but it would certainly show the public they were after money all along if they took the money and shut up.

I cannot imagine that any family member would want to talk to or sit next to the Sussexes at the coronation. And this talk of “invite him, he’s a member of the family” doesn’t take into consideration that he’s shown no respect for the family nor the monarchy the coronation celebrates.

Why on earth would the RF go into a deal giving them money? They are making their own money, and will manage to do so for quite a while yet, with skilful nonsense peddling. Eventually I guess the well will run dry and the American public will get sick of the whole thing but for now, they are making a living, and they dont need money from the RF.
[.....]

[Moran]

Originally Posted by Royalist.in.NC

I suppose through intermediaries they could find out how much money they want, give it to them (not in a lump sum) along with an ironclad NDA for both of them that the money will stop if they continue to trash the RF. It is galling but it would certainly show the public they were after money all along if they took the money and shut up.

[.....] And this talk of “invite him, he’s a member of the family” doesn’t take into consideration that he’s shown no respect for the family nor the monarchy the coronation celebrates.

I suspect they'd rather take the money and not shut up. What is Charles going to do? Bring his darling boy to court? So unbecoming. And it will only give fuel to those who have no problem with anything Harry and Meghan do scream that you see, the RF has something to hide and is so terrible for silencing Diana's baby. After all, poor Harry lost his mum, so he can never do wrong.

[Denville]

They don't need money. They can make their own, and if they were offered more money from the RF they would probably take it but go on writing their books or appearing on TV.

[Royalist.in.NC]

I know, I know - they can’t be given money and they won’t shut up. Harry has become a laughing stock here in the States. All the RF can really do at this point is Keep calm and Carry on - as they’ve been doing.

And at some point their 15 minutes of fame will be over. They’ll pop up from time to time to pontificate about something to us poor unfortunate souls but no one will care IMHO. They’ll be like other celebs (Kardashians for example) and except for tabloids no one except their fans will pay attention.

[Lilyflo]

Originally Posted by Moran

The rift with Charles' "darling boy" didn't just happen. Darling boy wanted it and did his best to achieve it. He also insulted and attacked Charles' other "darling boy" with abandon, as well as insulting the whole country that gave him the cushy life and recognition he would have never achieved on his own merit.

Regardless of how much the rift is Harry's fault, Charles will most likely wish to mend it. Parents don't tend to give up on their children, whatever they've done. He might be able to distance himself emotionally but I very much doubt it. Everything we know about Charles points to a loving man with deep attachments to his family. I would be very surprised if he's able to cut himself off from Harry for an extended period, as the subsequent pain would be unbearable for him.

[Moran]

Originally Posted by Lilyflo

Regardless of how much the rift is Harry's fault, Charles will most likely wish to mend it. Parents don't tend to give up on their children, whatever they've done. He might be able to distant himself emotionally but I very much doubt it. Everything we know about Charles points to a loving man with deep attachments to his family. I would be very surprised if he's able to cut himself off from Harry for an extended period, as the subsequent pain would be unbearable for him.

I'll also be surprised but if this happens. However, the coronation isn't this far away. This isn't an extended period.

Charles doesn't just have one son. He has one darling boy who attacked the other repeatedly and very publicly. He can't just say "ah well, darling boy, you see, your brother is also my darling boy, so be quiet and play nice as he attacks you and your wife and even brings unwanted attention to your kids. Pa loves him so very much, so let's give him all the ammunition he wants to keep attacking you." He just can't, unless his attachment to his attacking darling boy isn't vastly superior to his attachment to the attacked one.

[Denville]

William is not a fool. He can see that Harry's eaten up iwth jealousy because he is the older son, and Im sure he's furious. But he will keep up a polite front with his brother and try not to quarrel with him. What will be acheived by fighting?
Harry has ammunition or can make up ammuntion attacking William even if he never comes back to the UK

[Moran]

I'm not saying that William would be fighting. I'm saying that he might not want Harry to be invited in the same spaces with him and no one can say he isn't entitled to this.

I'm sure he'd be polite and distant. But I'm surprised at how people are so sympathetic to Charles wanting a relationship with his attacker son and refusing to see that it might well cost him the relationship with his attacked son.

Inviting Harry at the coronation and going over him being Charles' beloved son is basically saying that he can say whatever he likes about William and their father won't care because only Harrykins and his fewwings matter.

[Denville]

Not at all. The RF keep up a front in public, like all well known public families. It would be very foolish if they did not, because they are the public face of the UK and they work together and have to pull together in public at least. The RF can probably guess that while they and the Household protected H when he was a working prince, now he will show himself up as a less than desirable individual and that' has happened.
Harry has abused or ignored all his family, in his book and in the past couple of years, and William has just come i for his share of the attacks, but he's not going to come out and complain about it in public. He may find it hard at times to look polite and put on a pleasant face in public but he'll do it, just as he did at Philip's funeral etc.

[HenRach Dominion]

I don't understand the fear of TRH The Sussexes upstaging the coronation.
HRH The Duke of Sussex went to his grandfather's funeral without incident (it was HRH The Duke of York who complained about uniforms).
They went to the Jubilee without issue (unless you feed into the tabloid narrative that HRH The Duchess of Sussex standing by a window was her seeking the spotlight).
They went to his grandmother's funeral without issue (in fact, when the uniform issue came up again, HRH The Duke of Sussex graciously said that it wasn't important, and that honoring his grandmother should be the focus).
So why would they suddenly decide to cause problems at the Coronation when they haven't at any other big events?
Now, if the concern is the media's potential focus on them, then that's more the media looking for clicks and not honoring the historic moment rather than anything TRH The Sussexes have done.

[Moran]

They won't do anything AT the coronation. The whinefest will start later. Like it did with HLM's death. Harry thought it was so very important to defend his lady's honour and it was more important than showing consideration to his father whose mother was dying or actually try to get there in time before his granmother died.

They got their share of royal dust sprinkle and Harry leaped on the attack immediately after.

It's going to be the same. They will behave perfectly, in their estimation. The thing is, Meghan doesn't know what appropriate behavior means, so she will make herself ridiculous in her attempts to paint herself as respectful and so much part of the family. But it's going to be a small thing.

The whineattack will come later.

As to William trying to forgive Harry, not going to happen. Not as long as Harry keeps attacking. How can you forgive someone who never asked for forgiveness? I have no doubt he will tolerate him for appearance's sake but if Charles goes all mushy on darling Harry who keeps showing no regret and actually forces him on the family, then he can kiss being close to William goodbye.

ETA: If family closeness is renewed with Charles pretending that nothing ever happened, it's going to be taken as a sign that they indeed apologized to Meghan for all she claimed they did wrong. Because Harry did say no reconciliation can happen without his injured lady receiving an apology on the RF's knees.

[Denville]

how is he forcing Harry on the family? He has hardly been in the UK in hte past 2 years, only for family funerals or the like, and to visit the aging queen and I doubt if there was much contact when they were here. Its almost as litlte contact as the D of Windsor had... and it need n ot have been like that. If H had not been such a ffool, he could have had his life in the US, and come to see his family and be welcomed there, unlike the DOW.
William is not a fool. He knows that he has to tolerate H for the sake of the unity of the family, just as he probably tolerates Andrew in spite of the embarrassment that he has caused them. Harry is in LA, and wont be back that often, so Will's tolerance will not be stretched too far. Im sure he's aware that its very hard for Charles, who loves Harry as a father, to cope iwth his awful behaviour and he's not going to make it harder for him.

[Moran]

I said "IF he forces Harry on the family" because there have been opinions that being the loving father he is, Charles is going to try and draw Harry back "into the fold". Personally, I don't believe it and I say that unless Harry makes an actual effort, bringing him back as Charles' darling boy is a direct hit on William and a confirmation that everything Harry said about William, his wife and the grim prediction he voiced with such laughable concern were all true.

Sorry, no matter how hard it might be for my mum to cope if my brother behaves like Harry does, I'm out if she tries "to bring him back into the fold", pretending that he never attacked me, my husband or my children. Harry attacked all of William's family but because Charles loves his son, he should close his eyes? Not very loving to anyone else but Harry.

I don't see it happening.

Andrew is not applicable here. He never attacked his family. Harry publicly behaved in the manner of a man hating his brother. Publicly. The Duke of Windsor is a better example indeed. I can't imagine Charles forcing William to tolerate someone who delighted in bringing him down. Andrew never did this. Never.

[Lilyflo]

Originally Posted by Moran

But I'm surprised at how people are so sympathetic to Charles wanting a relationship with his attacker son and refusing to see that it might well cost him the relationship with his attacked son.

Family relationships can be complicated. William is a father himself so despite being justifiably furious with Harry, he might be able to empathise with Charles. Perhaps William understands that you can't turn off parental love like a tap and that no matter what Harry has done (or will do) Charles will always have fatherly love for him and wish to heal any rifts, even if that takes a long time and a huge amount of forgiveness.

[Moran]

Originally Posted by Lilyflo

Family relationships can be complicated. William is a father himself so despite being justifiably furious with Harry, he might be able to empathise with Charles. Perhaps William understands that you can't turn off parental love like a tap and that no matter what Harry has done (or will do) Charles will always have fatherly love for him and wish to heal any rifts, even if that takes a long time and a huge amount of forgiveness.

Or perhaps Charles might be able to empathise with William and draw on his parental love to understand that closing the rift on William, Catherine and their children's expense isn't very loving or parental.

Lilyflo, I'm not attacking you. Really. But you are one of the few people who talk about love and forgiveness on Charles' part without mentioning that Charles wasn't even the main target on Harry's hatred. Do you really think William's feelings can be taken out of the equation so Charles can play happy families with Harry? Because that's what I see in your post. The one who was attacked most maliciously should empathize with Charles' desire to heal the rift which isn't even Charles', mostly. And it can be done without the attacker doing anything to mend this rift. Because Charles loves him. I don't get it.

[Denville]

Originally Posted by Moran

I said "IF he forces Harry on the family" because there have been opinions that being the loving father he is, Charles is going to try and draw Harry back "into the fold". Personally, I don't believe it and I say that unless Harry makes an actual effort, bringing him back as Charles' darling boy is a direct hit on William and a confirmation that everything Harry said about William, his wife and the grim prediction he voiced with such laughable concern were all true.

Sorry, no matter how hard it might be for my mum to cope if my brother behaves like Harry does, I'm out if she tries "to bring him back into the fold", pretending that he never attacked me, my husband or my children. Harry attacked all of William's family but because Charles loves his son, he should close his eyes? Not very loving to anyone else but Harry.

I don't see it happening.

Andrew is not applicable here. He never attacked his family. Harry publicly behaved in the manner of a man hating his brother. Publicly. The Duke of Windsor is a better example indeed. I can't imagine Charles forcing William to tolerate someone who delighted in bringing him down. Andrew never did this. Never.

ANdrew's behaviour was worse than Harry's, pound for pound and the RF are goign to have to keep him under the radar for the rest of his life...
if you dont think that Charles is going to bring H back into the family why bring it up? Of course he will hope for some degree of reconcilation but at the present I cant' see any sign that it wont be a toleration of Harry for the sake of public unity and because he has shown a lot of signs of mental disturbance.

[OwlBranch]

Originally Posted by Moran

Or perhaps Charles might be able to empathise with William and draw on his parental love to understand that closing the rift on William, Catherine and their children's expense isn't very loving or parental.

This is not just about love from a father to a son, it is also about love from a KING to a nation, to Commonwealth.

What kind of message is the KING sending if he excludes his own son?

The tabloids were always hysterically saying Harry blindsided the QUEEN. But she was able to rise above the fray, personally stayed in touch with Harry, personally invited him to the Jubilee. She was able to appear outwardly not bothered by the all the things that the Daily Mail said she was very bothered by. She was a successful Monarch because of this approach.

Can Charles do that? Can he be a magnanimous leader?

The mob is always out for blood. But should a KING sway with public sentiment or be a steady rock?

[Moran]

Originally Posted by OwlBranch

This is not just about love from a father to a son, it is also about love from a KING to a nation, to Commonwealth.

What kind of message is the KING sending if he excludes his own son?


The mob is always out for blood. But should a KING sway with public sentiment or be a steady rock?

That someone who hates Britain so much doesn't have a place in a state occasion?

It wasn't about a father's love but a SON should not be excluded?

Why not someone who hates and doesn't appreciate Britain?

Harry went out of his way to show that he doesn't care about traditions, manners, customs, anything that doesn't affect him directly. That he hated this racist institution, otherwise known as his family.

But he should be included because he's the king's son?

Rising above the fray doesn't mean pretending that a state occasion is a place for Charles to pamper his baby and his irreverence to everything the RF is supposed to stand for.

[Denville]

Nobody is out for blood. Harry isn't very popular, but if the RF welcome him back politely, and he is willing to come to the coronation but not take part, I cant see that there will be any bother about it. Charles will always hold out a hand for him but he is not a fool and wont give Harry anything that he can use against his family. Harry will do that by himself whether he comes ot the UK or not.
Odds are unless H gets over his wobbly behaviour, and has some effective therapy, and stops the endless silly books and interviews, he will only come to the UK once a year or so, if that. He will be tolerated by relatives, and they wont talk about anything deep with him. They wont criticise Meghan because it will do no good and conversation with probably be about the kids and the weather. but they are not goig to shut him out completely.