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  #1321  
Old 04-22-2021, 05:44 PM
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The media in the US are like the media everywhere. They want to report the juiciest story so that people will buy their magazine or newspaper. I agree that our media doesn’t know nor probably care about royal rules. Oprah had a really good reputation; in my book she lost tons of credibility. It wasn’t a real interview at all. And even though she is an entertainer, she has done far better interviews.

However, every real person that I’ve talked to (sister, hairdresser, niece who is 31, a few friends) cannot believe they said what they said about Harry’s family. So people here certainly don’t believe everything they read and anyone who has followed Meghan knows how her own family is alienated. Her TV show was on a third rate network and the movies she has done are with a brand that is known for “feel good” but mostly poor acting because they don’t hire big talent. Celebrities here jump on the Sussex bandwagon to get publicity for themselves as well.

Reputable newspapers like The NY Times, Washington Post have given it very little attention. Our tabloids like The National Enquirer will print anything. Between Covid, racial issues, police shootings, and a new President to keep up with, the US has enough on her plate.

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Originally Posted by Denville View Post
I doubt if she loves Meghan. She will love Harry and his kids but I would say that she probably thinks that Meghan roused Harry up to this idea of leaivng the RF and so on, and that without hher Harry would not have done what he did.


its hard to say. If they had told the queen at the beginning of married life that they weren't sure, didn't want to do royal duties, wanted time off etc.. would the queen have let them start with all the work that they did? Surely she would have suggested that they make a slow start, like Will and Kate did? rather than having them appear as full time working royals and then their explosive departure. but perhaps yes they were told "You can't be part timers and take time off to make money, but you can take some time for private life or some kind of job where you are not trying to make a private income." And maybe the queen hoped that that was all clear and that as they had chosen to go on with royal work, they'd be oK but she still tried to work out a plan to give them some time off.
there was also a story that Harry had been offered an estate to run.. but I dont think they'd have wanted that.. so they might have talked about it but ultimately rejected the idea of being gentleman farmers....
But Meghan said she wanted to hit the ground running, didn’t she?
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  #1322  
Old 04-22-2021, 05:51 PM
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Originally Posted by _Heather_ View Post
But are "listening" and "willing to hear" just other ways of saying "doing what Harry and Meghan want?" I mean really, just because you listen to what someone has to say or you are willing to hear them doesn't mean that you have to agree with them or do what they want. So really, how do you or any of us know that they weren't listening or willing to hear them and simply didn't give in? Listening and hearing aren't the same as agreeing or capitulating.

As for Meghan's feelings...why are Meghan's feelings any more important than anyone else's feelings or any long-standing policies? It's long been a policy that they don't really comment on this type of thing for several reasons. First, it makes a mountain out of a molehill. Second, if gives a silly little story legs and causes it to grow disproportionately. Third, if they comment on one story they'd have to comment on every story and that's both ridiculous and impossible. Fourth, that's the policy of the "employer" and "employees" have to learn to deal with it. If they don't like it, too bad. Meghan was no more important or powerful that any other member of the firm/family. They've all had stories written about them that I'm positive they'd like to have slapped down but they didn't. That wasn't the policy and it didn't happen for any of them. Those in charge deemed it minor and unimportant and didn't feel any need to issue a statement. That's it. End of story. As an "employee" of the Firm, Meghan had to just suck it up and deal with it like so many of us do on a daily basis. My employer is frequently written about in news articles, oftentimes with a political spin suited to whichever publication is doing the writing. Would I and others in my department love to clap back and let them know exactly how wrong they are? Sure, sometimes. Sometimes the articles are so ridiculous that they're laughable. Other times we'd love to slap them down. But we can't because those higher up than us have decided that isn't our policy. If we don't like it we're free to leave but as long as we'd like to stay then we have to follow policy. I can assure you that if one of us were to make headlines tomorrow by deciding to "have our say" or "set the record straight" we would absolutely find ourselves out on our ear.
"Listening" and "willing to hear " are not synonymous with doing what someone wants.
For ex, I manage 20 employees and time and again my employees come to me with the most silly and selfish demands. As a manager, I listen to them and hear them out. It is up to me to filter out and process what claims are valid and what should go in one ear and out the next.

Meghan's feelings should have been just as valid as anyone else. The story did not die down, in fact it kept on gaining legs and was constantly being rehashed over and over in the press. KP could have killed the story with just 1 line by saying it was not true.
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  #1323  
Old 04-22-2021, 05:54 PM
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Originally Posted by US Royal Watcher View Post
Good points. You are probably correct that Harry is angry with William. My original belief was based on my perception that Harry displays completely different attitudes when speaking about William and Charles. With William it is "we're on different paths" and "I'll always be there for him." His language about Charles is very different. I think it is fair to say that Harry is more angry at Charles than he is at William.
I think for a long time William probably carried around a lot of anger or resentment toward his father - his attitude in private may not have been too dissimilar to what we saw from Harry on Oprah. The recent profile on William acknowledged that that there used to be conflict. It wouldn’t surprise me that, when Harry and William were in their 20s, the two of them were on the same team, mostly united against their father. Not in the sense that there was constant conflict, but more like resentment over the divorce, Diana, charles not being around that much, etc. And I do think there was a time, when he was much younger, that William did feel “trapped” in his role.

Then William grew up, started taking on more responsibilities and - crucially - had children of his own, and that gave him perspective he might not have had before. He likely found some common ground with Charles and also realized that, even as an emotionally present father who has a loving relationship with his wife and the mother of his children, parenting can still be very, very hard. And maybe found some sympathy for his own father, who had plenty of faults, but was also trying to parent in a situation that was impossible in many ways.

I think the “space” Harry is talking about could be William maturing in a way that Harry hasn’t yet. It will be interesting to see what Harry thinks once he’s got two children who are George and Charlotte’s age.
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  #1324  
Old 04-22-2021, 06:05 PM
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Meghan and Archie have been spotted in California
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/Ezm7e31V...pg&name=medium
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/Ezm7e2lV...pg&name=medium
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  #1325  
Old 04-22-2021, 06:21 PM
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Originally Posted by camelot23ca View Post
I think for a long time William probably carried around a lot of anger or resentment toward his father - his attitude in private may not have been too dissimilar to what we saw from Harry on Oprah. The recent profile on William acknowledged that that there used to be conflict. It wouldn’t surprise me that, when Harry and William were in their 20s, the two of them were on the same team, mostly united against their father. Not in the sense that there was constant conflict, but more like resentment over the divorce, Diana, charles not being around that much, etc. And I do think there was a time, when he was much younger, that William did feel “trapped” in his role.

Then William grew up, started taking on more responsibilities and - crucially - had children of his own, and that gave him perspective he might not have had before. He likely found some common ground with Charles and also realized that, even as an emotionally present father who has a loving relationship with his wife and the mother of his children, parenting can still be very, very hard. And maybe found some sympathy for his own father, who had plenty of faults, but was also trying to parent in a situation that was impossible in many ways.

I think the “space” Harry is talking about could be William maturing in a way that Harry hasn’t yet. It will be interesting to see what Harry thinks once he’s got two children who are George and Charlotte’s age.
Spot on - I mentioned some of this earlier. William and Harry were never going to resent their late mother even if they knew she had her flaws, so Charles took the brunt of it. By all accounts, Charles loved his boys deeply even though he wasn’t around a lot - like his mother with him. But, the kids wanted their father, so just like C grew up resenting his parents while loving them, so did W and C. The former certainly knows how difficult it is to parent when your the heir - and Charles was the lone one.

I remember a few years ago that Charles missed George’s birthday to attend some day out re: red squirrels. He got guff for that, understandably so. In the Charles at 70 program, W said C is a brilliant grandfather, and he wished he’d not work so often so he could see his grandkids and family more. I suspect C took that to heart, because from all reports, he spends a lot more time with the Cambridge’s.

Your last point is an excellent one, but even so, Harry ought to consider that his father won’t be around forever. I’d have thought Charles getting COVID would have scared him some. He shouldn’t wait until his kids are older to reach out; he should have taken the chance his father offered before rushing home to CA.
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  #1326  
Old 04-22-2021, 06:26 PM
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The Duke & Duchess of Sussex and Family, News and Events 4: April 2021 -

Quote:
Originally Posted by Alisa View Post
If they were not willing to answer phone calls- what were the chances of getting them to sit down and meet with the couple?


By the time Charles stopped- temporarily-taking Harry’s calls, he’d likely heard it all. And then some. He had to be pretty frustrated to take that step IMO. Their conversations obviously weren’t productive by that point and might well have been going in circles.

It tells me a lot more about Harry’s behavior that Charles stopped taking his calls than it does about Charles.
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  #1327  
Old 04-22-2021, 06:36 PM
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It's not as if the boys saw Diana much more than they saw Charles. They were away at school for most of the year and then spent an equal time with both their parents. The biggest difference was that their mother was better at doing things with them in public places like amusement parks while their father often spent his time with them on big closed off for the public estates such as Highgrove, Windsor and Balmoral.
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  #1328  
Old 04-22-2021, 06:40 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Alisa View Post
"Listening" and "willing to hear " are not synonymous with doing what someone wants.
For ex, I manage 20 employees and time and again my employees come to me with the most silly and selfish demands. As a manager, I listen to them and hear them out. It is up to me to filter out and process what claims are valid and what should go in one ear and out the next.

Meghan's feelings should have been just as valid as anyone else. The story did not die down, in fact it kept on gaining legs and was constantly being rehashed over and over in the press. KP could have killed the story with just 1 line by saying it was not true.
Precisely. So how do you know that they didn’t listen and weren’t willing to hear? Because that’s what Meghan said? There’s two sides to every story. Just because Meghan said they weren’t willing to listen or hear what they were saying means absolutely nothing other than “I didn’t get my way.” Do you really think the BRF is going to run to the reporters shouting “yes we did, we did listen” because I can assure you, they aren’t.

And apparently Meghan’s feelings were as validated as everyone else’s which is to say, not at all since they didn’t make any special exception for her or break their own established protocols just because she demanded they should. No one else’s feelings led to a breach in protocol and hers didn’t either. So in that instance I’d think you’d be thrilled that Meghan was treated no differently than anyone else. Or is this one of those situations where she should have gotten special treatment just because she’s her and she demanded it?
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  #1329  
Old 04-22-2021, 07:05 PM
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The less they show Archie the more the paparazzi will hunt them ! The pix will have a great value !
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  #1330  
Old 04-22-2021, 07:10 PM
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Originally Posted by Heavs View Post
Well that was predictable.



Cute photo of Archie, but I'd like to add that it is illegal to photograph the children of celebrities/ public figures in California without consent. I wouldn't blame Archie's parent if they pursue legal action again. I doubt that his parent(s) gave permission for him to be photographed.
https://www.rcfp.org/law-criminalizi...ed-california/
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  #1331  
Old 04-22-2021, 07:21 PM
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https://pagesix.com/2021/04/22/princ...eths-birthday/

It would appear Harry, Meghan and Archie were all in LA yesterday. Harry had a business lunch while Meghan and Archie likely kept themselves busy until Harry was done.

Nice seeing Archie. He getting big.
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  #1332  
Old 04-22-2021, 07:29 PM
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Interesting that Harry is reputedly having a meal with a major philanthropist. Some future projects perhaps. Archie is indeed getting to be a big boy while Meghan looks to me as if she may well be giving birth in early June.
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  #1333  
Old 04-22-2021, 07:29 PM
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By the time Charles stopped- temporarily-taking Harry’s calls, he’d likely heard it all. And then some. He had to be pretty frustrated to take that step IMO. Their conversations obviously weren’t productive by that point and might well have been going in circles.

It tells me a lot more about Harry’s behavior that Charles stopped taking his calls than it does about Charles.
I think the opposite. Closing off communication by stop taking Harry's call closed off any possibility of coming up with a solution that benefited all. However, I would be lying if I said I was surprised by the PoW's actions.
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  #1334  
Old 04-22-2021, 07:33 PM
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By the time Charles stopped- temporarily-taking Harry’s calls, he’d likely heard it all. And then some. He had to be pretty frustrated to take that step IMO. Their conversations obviously weren’t productive by that point and might well have been going in circles.

It tells me a lot more about Harry’s behavior that Charles stopped taking his calls than it does about Charles.

Yes I agree that Charles was likely frustrated with Harry to stop speaking to him on the phone.
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  #1335  
Old 04-22-2021, 07:36 PM
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Cute photo of Archie, but I'd like to add that it is illegal to photograph the children of celebrities/ public figures in California without consent. I wouldn't blame Archie's parent if they pursue legal action again. I doubt that his parent(s) gave permission for him to be photographed.
https://www.rcfp.org/law-criminalizi...ed-california/
I’d forgotten about this in CA! A good law - I remember Jennifer Garner supporting this bill. I absolutely agree that this photographer should not have taken this photo.
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  #1336  
Old 04-22-2021, 07:36 PM
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Precisely. So how do you know that they didn’t listen and weren’t willing to hear? Because that’s what Meghan said? There’s two sides to every story. Just because Meghan said they weren’t willing to listen or hear what they were saying means absolutely nothing other than “I didn’t get my way.” Do you really think the BRF is going to run to the reporters shouting “yes we did, we did listen” because I can assure you, they aren’t.
If the lines of communication was closed there was no way Charles could listen or hear the couple's possible solution. There are multiple sides to a story. Unfortunately all we have are Harry's and Meghan's and judgements are being made based on what they said in the interview.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Heather
And apparently Meghan’s feelings were as validated as everyone else’s which is to say, not at all since they didn’t make any special exception for her or break their own established protocols just because she demanded they should. No one else’s feelings led to a breach in protocol and hers didn’t either. So in that instance I’d think you’d be thrilled that Meghan was treated no differently than anyone else. Or is this one of those situations where she should have gotten special treatment just because she’s her and she demanded it?
The opposite Kensington Palace shot down and issued statements refuting hurtful stories in the press about the Cambridges. Meghan wasn't given the same treatment- instead the hurtful stories like her making Kate cry were allowed to perpetuate in the press.
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  #1337  
Old 04-22-2021, 07:49 PM
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By the time Charles stopped- temporarily-taking Harry’s calls, he’d likely heard it all. And then some. He had to be pretty frustrated to take that step IMO. Their conversations obviously weren’t productive by that point and might well have been going in circles.

It tells me a lot more about Harry’s behavior that Charles stopped taking his calls than it does about Charles.
That's why Charles suggested letters; he and his father had communicated by letters when they were having particular issues - no problem there, I think it probably helped them. For some reason, Harry took that as an insult, like his father didn't want to have anything to do with him. Well, how does he think Charles feels now that Harry didn't give him the time of day before he hauled himself back to CA?

Quote:
Originally Posted by JR76 View Post
It's not as if the boys saw Diana much more than they saw Charles. They were away at school for most of the year and then spent an equal time with both their parents. The biggest difference was that their mother was better at doing things with them in public places like amusement parks while their father often spent his time with them on big closed off for the public estates such as Highgrove, Windsor and Balmoral.
As far as the public goes, that's true - hence at least partly why people think Charles was an uncaring father.

I recall that Charles almost looked surprised at all the home movies showing his parents having a blast with him, like he had forgotten those times because he'd chosen to focus on the disappointments. It was wonderful seeing him react to his parents playing with him and all of them being so happy. I think that probably happened to William and Harry....
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  #1338  
Old 04-22-2021, 07:54 PM
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Harry, Meghan and Harry were all out at lunchtime on Wednesday though, when these photos were taken (probably without permission) and the source was apparently an employee at the place where Harry had lunch who spotted him arriving.

LA is eight hours ahead of London anyway isn’t it? That’s an awful lot of coordinating when those photos wouldn’t be appearing in British newspapers or on TV anyway, due to their illegality.
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  #1339  
Old 04-22-2021, 08:03 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Alisa View Post
I think the opposite. Closing off communication by stop taking Harry's call closed off any possibility of coming up with a solution that benefited all. However, I would be lying if I said I was surprised by the PoW's actions.


There might not have been a solution that both parties could agree on. Sometimes there isn’t one.
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  #1340  
Old 04-22-2021, 08:10 PM
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There might not have been a solution that both parties could agree on. Sometimes there isn’t one.
Honestly, if the calls were not going well, better to stop them than to take any chances of saying things that might be regretted later. I really don't understand Harry taking umbrage at his father's desire to communicate by letter.........it's still communication whether H liked it or not. But.....I agree with you, and sometimes (don't know if this was the case here, a cooling off period is needed).
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