The Duke and Duchess of Sussex and Family, News and Events 2: December 2020-

[tommy100]

Patrick Adam's tweet is interesting - if he is still in contact with Meghan does this suggest the true feelings of Meghan? Either way it rather undermines the effort to focus criticism on the staff rather than the family themselves.

What I find interesting in this is how Meghan and Harry have spoken out via Finding Freedom - which the authors noted the couple themselves had contributed to - and which at the very least they allowed friends to speak for, now an Oprah interview as well as a James Corden chat, but once people who have worked with them speak out its so horrendous and so awful. It is also interesting that when H&M friends speak out it is never with their permission, never their fault but when staff and sources around the Household do its the Household and RF's fault directly. There are two sides to every story and just because the other side's story doesn't fit the narrative H& want (nor their fans) doesn't mean it isn't true. If you are going to speak out about your experiences, those who were there with you are just as entitled to speak out about their experiences too IMO.

I really don't get the rather over the top hitting out at the Palace for investigating the bullying complaints - of course they have to, it is part of their role as an employer. I would ask those who are raising merry hell over it - would they do the same if this had been an employee in Andrew's office alleging there was bullying? Just because you like someone doesn't mean you can say other people's claims about them can't be investigated - if you thin they are wonderful and caring and couldn't possibly have done it what are people worrying about? To be honest it seems another example of people placing the Sussex's at the centre of everything - I got the impression the investigation and review was all about the Palace side of it - were complaints ignored? Where staff unable to speak out? I didn't get the impression the Palace were going to be issuing a dossier judging the claims of bullying or detailing exactly what the allegations were.

I can't wait for the interview to be broadcast simply so we can get over this ridiculous period, it isn't making anyone look good and it just getting people angry and frustrated at each other. I hope both sides go away and think about a better way forward that creates less division.

[poppy7]

Originally Posted by tommy100

Patrick Adam's tweet is interesting - if he is still in contact with Meghan does this suggest the true feelings of Meghan? Either way it rather undermines the effort to focus criticism on the staff rather than the family themselves.

What I find interesting in this is how Meghan and Harry have spoken out via Finding Freedom - which the authors noted the couple themselves had contributed to - and which at the very least they allowed friends to speak for, now an Oprah interview as well as a James Corden chat, but once people who have worked with them speak out its so horrendous and so awful. It is also interesting that when H&M friends speak out it is never with their permission, never their fault but when staff and sources around the Household do its the Household and RF's fault directly. There are two sides to every story and just because the other side's story doesn't fit the narrative H& want (nor their fans) doesn't mean it isn't true. If you are going to speak out about your experiences, those who were there with you are just as entitled to speak out about their experiences too IMO.

I can't wait for the interview to be broadcast simply so we can get over this ridiculous period, it isn't making anyone look good and it9 just getting people angry and frustrated at each other. I hope both sides go away and think about a better way forward that creates less division.

You see I don't see two sides, well I do but one is H and M and the other the media. If I had a famous friend I wouldn't talk without consent. If I was a former employee of a person who I felt bullied me and then saw them go on TV and get the world's sympathy do you know if I thought I could have my voice heard, after employer did nothing, I probably, would.

The two sides here are M and H and the media. I don't even see the palace as being part of it really but M and H seem to blame them for not giving them what they want and for not interfering with the media. But you don't constantly step into a yard when there are rapid dogs on the loose.

I also agree with whoever talked about bullying complaints being so difficult because when a complaint is made, in any sphere whether work or personal but when the alleged victim uses their voice, their is a counter attack. And no one is perfect. Unfortunately, being in such a situation myself it is insidious. And given the charismatic nature of perpetrators it can often be impossible to even get your nearest and dearest to believe it. It is genuinely horrific.

[Fem]

Originally Posted by MARG

I am appalled at the regurgitation of year old spite and malice coming from the palace supposedly pre-empting the Oprah interview.

I have now lost ALL respect for the Firm having announced their HR department will be investigating Meghan bullying staff on the strength of these anonymous victims pitiful tales leaked and printed in the media. Hell, The Times even published an accusation from one of these shrinking violets that Meghan was deliberately unkind as part of her master plan to have she and Harry appear forced to leave. Really?

Harry and Meghan have no control over out of context clips released as publicity by Harpo Productions and said nohing until the palace decided to leak like a sieve and then announce they will investigate mean Meghan.

The way I see it, the Oprah interview cannot possibly be worse than "Malice at the Palace".

Oh wow. There's a lot of... claiming things here.

1. We have no proof that the Palace has anything to do with the former employees going to the press with this stuff. Nothing was done in their case. Nobody was listening to them. They were left mistreated and possibly traumatized by the experience and their (alleged) bully is all over international media yelling "woe is me!". Honestly, I would go to press too.

2. The Palace wanted to take the high route, as they always do, by claiming that the family doesn't care about the interview and that they want to focus on Prince Philip and his health. Beside that, this bullying revelations in press makes KP and BP look as bad as the Sussexes, if not even worse - they knew, they did nothing, no anti-bullying policy was in place, their employees were not safe. We do care about things like that here in Europe. What is more wrong? Bullying employees or covering up those bullying claims on an institutional level, because the (alleged) bully was a senior member of BRF and their image needed to be protected?

3. No one will be investigating Meghan. The official investigation that was announced by BP is not focusing on Meghan, but on checking if there is an enough protection of employees when the person accused of improper behavior is the member of the Royal Family. They had to do it. The claims are serious and they are an employer. Every company in the world would be expected to start an investigation like that and introduce a policy that would fix this problem on an institutional level. It's not "Meghan's trial" or anything like that - they have to make sure the employees are safe and protected by the institution.

4. The former employees are professionals, who, quite often, are used to working in high-stress situations and they know how it looks like to work in a stressfull work environment. Calling people who might have been, as they claim, traumatized by their work experience "shrinking violets" is awful and shows no compassion nor empathy, that the Sussexes claim is so important.

5. Tbh, many people over the last year were speculating that that was the plan for the start and there is evidence supporting this theory. Websites, trade marks, an american PR firm... Meghan's own words, in that short snippet of interview with Oprah, seem to suggest that as well.

When one logically and calmly tries to look at this mess, it doesn't look good for the Sussexes. They are dragging everyone through mud because they feel hurt and they decided to air their grivances to Oprah instead of a therapist, simply because they want to make money on people like you and me.

I think all this mess has left me with no respect or sympathy left for the Sussexes.

[JR76]

Originally Posted by Countessmeout

Her co-workers would very much know what she is like to work around.
[...]
She had people working doing her make up hair and other jobs for her when she was on set.

It's not those doing Meghan's hair who are coming out to her defense it's her co-actors and other people either on the same level or above her. We don't know what lower members of the glam squad, lightning assistants or interns has to say about her (if we do please share). There's also the possibility that Meghan was a delight on the set of Suits which is an environment that she's comfortable in and that the stress of finding herself in a completely new environment made her unstable and had her lashing out at people. It could happen to the best of us.

Originally Posted by MARG

[...] I have now lost ALL respect for the Firm having announced their HR department will be investigating Meghan bullying staff on the strength of these anonymous victims pitiful tales leaked and printed in the media.

The inquiry really has very little to do with Meghan. It's an internal inquiry looking into the failure of the palace HR department and it's guidelines in this case. As an active union member I applaud the people involved for coming forward. Hopefully the inquiry ends up dealing with the problems that caused these problems.
These, as you call them, "anonymous victims with pitiful tales" are most likely only anonymous to us and not to those at the palace. Did all this have to become worldwide news? No, definitely not but the same could be said for most parts of the Sussex saga.

[rominet09]

I don't know if it is a good place to put it but this pic is supposed to be of Archie.
https://www.instagram.com/p/CMCpe9NlIBR/

[Princess_Eleanor]

It's interesting that Meghan, self-proclaimed feminist and supporter of women, is accused of bullying 3 female staff members and seems to place blame on Catherine and Camilla, two female members of the BRF in the Oprah interview. Did she treat the male staff differently and why have we not heard her complaining about male members of the BRF (yet)?

It seems that she expected more help from Catherine. But what kind of help? It is rather obvious that Meghan does not like advice that doesn't align with her own ideas and opinions. And Catherine may not be the kind of person, who keeps giving unsolicited advice to someone who is not interested.

I suspect the kind of help Meghan wanted from Catherine may have been support of Meghan's own ideas and wishes, many of which did not fit with royal life. Now part of the interview appears to be (let's see about that!) an attack on Catherine, who Meghan knows cannot and will not respond, because she does adhere to BRF rules. So is Meghan, who has got a public voice to say whatever she pleases now, as she likes to stress, verbally attacking a woman, who can't answer back because she remains a diplomat and future Queen?

[Nico]

Originally Posted by Princess_Eleanor

It's interesting that Meghan, self-proclaimed feminist and supporter of women, is accused of bullying 3 female staff members and seems to place blame on Catherine and Camilla,

Wait what ?
I've seen the Catherine part but i didn't know she was blaming Camilla as well !

[Claire]

They didn't give her support when she wanted to give interviews to everyone. Suppose you can throw the Queen and Sophie in there too. Hey all the women as well. In general all the women of the palace had to support her and allow her to talk to Oprah.

[Princess_Eleanor]

Originally Posted by Nico

Wait what ?
I've seen the Catherine part but i didn't know she was blaming Camilla as well !

Well, at least that's one of the Daily Mail articles about this issue says. I know it's not the most reputable source, so we'll see what she actually says in the interview! The article says that she blames Catherine and Camilla for "leaking stories about her to the press." We'll see whether that's in the interview but some people seem to believe that it will be?

At the very least, she seems to have expected more support and help from Catherine and Camilla, more so Catherine, but she may have complaints about Camilla as well...

[Claire]

Originally Posted by Princess_Eleanor

I suspect the kind of help Meghan wanted from Catherine may have been support of Meghan's own ideas and wishes.

i think you are on the mark here - I think she wanted them to accepted and laud over everything that come out of her mouth like it was a coming from heaven. She wanted support for the acceptance of freebies and the allowing of interviews and photoshoots. I understand that she sees the royals been on the internet, twitter and Zoom as her doing. It was all her ideas that they stole and have never given her credit for. Omid Scobie has a whole list of how Meghan changed the monarchy - it is a amusing read.

[Harald]

Originally Posted by Sionevar

What a terrible, awful mess this whole situation is.

The one thing I just can't understand - what does Harry think this interview is going to achieve re: his relationship with his brother, father and grandmother? Does he somehow think it's going to improve the situation, and not cause potentially irreparable damage?

I don't doubt that he loves his family back in the UK, and that they love him, but I'll be amazed if he comes through this interview with all his relationship bridges still intact...

The aim of that interview is not repairing relationships with the BRF but about bolstering their brand in the United States with its market of 330 million Americans and the highly lucrative opportunities that await in their new home. It is their big introduction to America as well as their give-The-Firm-the-finger goodbye to Britain.

[Erin9]

Originally Posted by Countessmeout

Her co-workers would very much know what she is like to work around.



Being a full time working actress, working long hours on set as well as her blog and charity work would have been far more stressful then being a royal. She had people working doing her make up hair and other jobs for her when she was on set. They would certainly know better then most how she would handle a high stress situation at work.



But of all course all former employers are never disgruntled. Never think their poop smelled like heaven and they didn't get enough credit for their work.

Again- that is not the same thing as Meghan’s co-workers knowing what she is like as a boss. We won’t agree on that. I’ve seen it myself. They have no clue.

I’m not going to compare being an actress to being a royal in terms of what is more stressful. They would both be stressful in their ways, but no one’s life was at stake in either role either. She wasn’t a doctor or a nurse, for instance. As an actress, she played pretend all day. It’s not exactly an essential job. She provided entertainment. That’s it. Long hours are in lots of jobs- and she was well paid for it.

Furthermore- Meghan couldn’t handle being a royal. They was a job, for all the talent and passion I think she had in certain aspects of the role, that she failed at. How you handle a job you’re suited for vs not will certainly impact your behavior.

She was a fairly successful actress. In the end- not a successful royal and very unhappy in the job. Obviously. She’s still whining over a year later. So....how she behaved in a situation that certainly didn’t go as she’d hoped- who knows. She also had a lot of life changes in a very short time too. That itself is stressful. I’m not saying there is any veracity to any of this. What I am saying is- I don’t know.

But her friends/co workers saying how great she is proves nothing to me. None of them worked for her to begin with. And certainly none got to see how she handled a job that she couldn’t last 2 years in.

[Erin9]

Originally Posted by Alison H

Doria Ragland hasn't said a word in all of this yah-boo-sucks name-calling. What a classy, dignified woman she is.


What a shame that Meghan hasn't followed her example.

This. I couldn’t agree more.

[Mbruno]

Originally Posted by AC21091968

I agree with you and I would even include of some modern feminists to the mix who slags off Catherine for not having a career before her marriage and being "submissive" to the archaic sexist monarchy by simply following protocol.

Notwithstanding the Sussex team's spin on the latest YG poll that shows a slight improvement in Meghan's favorability ratings (prior to the bullying claims to be fair), the truth of the matter is that Catherine still has a favorability rating in the UK of + 57 (William's is +65), whereas Meghan's is still -14.

So whatever the Sussex Team is doing to attack Catherine, it is not working, at least in the UK. I don't think that Meghan blaming Catherine for leaking bad information about her will help Meghan either.


But then again, I agree with other posters that Meghan probably doesn't care about UK public opinion at this point (and probably already counts it among everything that "has been lost"). Instead she is now solely targeting the US public.

[Sionevar]

Originally Posted by Harald

The aim of that interview is not repairing relationships with the BRF but about bolstering their brand in the United States with its market of 330 million Americans and the highly lucrative opportunities that await in their new home. It is their big introduction to America as well as their give-The-Firm-the-finger goodbye to Britain.

Oh, I'm very well aware of that. I know this is for an American audience. I just find it hard to believe Harry is okay with the 'middle finger' part. Is that what he really wants to do? To damage his relationship with his family to the point where they may never be on comfortable speaking terms again? Surely, there are ways to introduce oneself to the USA without burning so many bridges behind you?

[Erin9]

Originally Posted by Alison H

This is all so unpleasant and undignified.


OK, social media is a fairly new thing, and maybe Anne Boleyn's friends would have been sniping about Catherine of Aragon all over social media if it'd been around then, and Wallis Simpson's friends would have been saying all sorts if it'd been around then, but nothing like this has ever happened before. "Sussex Squad" fan clubs sniping at William and Kate, as if they were a rival football team. Meghan's ex-colleagues saying that the Queen isn't "in the same league" as Meghan. Meghan saying that Kate didn't look after her, as if she was the new kid at school and expected another kid to get her in with the in crowd.


It's just embarrassing. And it's very sad. As Sionevar said, it's just a mess. How do you put an end to this now?

It really is. Unpleasant, undignified. Embarrassing. Immature. Childish. How old are Harry and Meghan?! They sure don’t act like people pushing 40.

I’d never thought about Catherine of Aragon and Anne Boleyn in the era of social media. What a thought!! Or Wallis Simpson.

All Harry and Meghan had to do was act like adults and not make a public spectacle of everything. Starting with the Africa interview- every time they’ve had a chance to demonstrate their unhappiness they’ve taken it.

But then I think a pretty big sticking point is that they didn’t get what they actually wanted. Their current life wasn’t their original plan. I see a lot of people saying they wanted out- no. They wanted half in and half out. They wanted the parts of the job they liked and to ditch the ones they didn’t. It didn’t work out like that.

[evolvingdoors]

Originally Posted by Princess_Eleanor

It's interesting that Meghan, self-proclaimed feminist and supporter of women, is accused of bullying 3 female staff members and seems to place blame on Catherine and Camilla, two female members of the BRF in the Oprah interview. Did she treat the male staff differently and why have we not heard her complaining about male members of the BRF (yet)?

It seems that she expected more help from Catherine. But what kind of help? It is rather obvious that Meghan does not like advice that doesn't align with her own ideas and opinions. And Catherine may not be the kind of person, who keeps giving unsolicited advice to someone who is not interested.

I suspect the kind of help Meghan wanted from Catherine may have been support of Meghan's own ideas and wishes, many of which did not fit with royal life. Now part of the interview appears to be (let's see about that!) an attack on Catherine, who Meghan knows cannot and will not respond, because she does adhere to BRF rules. So is Meghan, who has got a public voice to say whatever she pleases now, as she likes to stress, verbally attacking a woman, who can't answer back because she remains a diplomat and future Queen?

Hold your horses on that, I came across a video on twitter from a podcast that interviewed four royal reporters/commentators (two of them were the Arbiter's and the editor of "Majesty" Ingrid Seward, plus some old guy I am not familiar with, and William name was brought up, so I think she may be discussing him in the interview.

[Lilyflo]

Originally Posted by evolvingdoors

Hold your horses on that, I came across a video on twitter from a podcast that interviewed four royal reporters/commentators (two of them were the Arbiter's and the editor of "Majesty" Ingrid Seward, plus some old guy I am not familiar with, and William name was brought up, so I think she may be discussing him in the interview.

Isn't that the one where they were paid to comment on the interview that none of them has seen yet but they pretended they had? The tricksters who played this prank also mentioned donkeys and other things, which they got the RRs to respond to. It'd be hilarious if it weren't so shocking.

[REAL COUNTESS]

I don't know if this belongs here, if not I am sure the MODS will move it. A while back there was an article in the paper I read it on TRF. Harry and Meghan went somewhere there was a fan a young girl who really wanted to meet Meghan it also was the girls 13th or 14th Birthday. The article read she was ignored by Meghan and she got a rude answer, like do you know who I am and Meghan just walked off. If the Bulling stories are true then this one maybe as well. What I want to say with this is, if she wants to be as perfect as she is trying to tell people that she is in her own opinion don't do this to anyone especially children. Maybe someone else remember this story in the paper and read it.

[Sionevar]

Originally Posted by REAL COUNTESS

I don't know if this belongs here, if not I am sure the MODS will move it. A while back there was an article in the paper I read it on TRF. Harry and Meghan went somewhere there was a fan a young girl who really wanted to meet Meghan it also was the girls 13th or 14th Birthday. The article read she was ignored by Meghan and she got a rude answer, like do you know who I am and Meghan just walked off. If the Bulling stories are true then this one maybe as well. What I want to say with this is, if she wants to be as perfect as she is trying to tell people that she is in her own opinion don't do this to anyone especially children. Maybe someone else remember this story in the paper and read it.

It might have been this article, which is a report in The Sun from Lady Colin Campbell.

https://www.the-sun.com/lifestyle/10...olin-campbell/