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  #481  
Old 06-27-2018, 09:52 PM
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Doesn't Thomas Markle Sr. realize how his talking to the press and being paid is an embarrassment? But it does it anyway and wonders why Meghan is giving him the silent treatment. Granted he's done a lot for her while raising her and all her education etc but still.
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  #482  
Old 06-27-2018, 10:00 PM
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In order for that to happen, royal rob, TMZ would have to be covering William's Middle East tour.

I seriously don't believe that Tom Sr. understands that Kensington Palace, Buckingham Palace or any of the other British palaces are not there to conduct the royal family's personal communications. Nor does the Queen. Its a family run, owned and operated business which is in the monarchy business and that's the first and primary focus of their staff. As it should be.

Meghan has far more things to do, take care of and get adjusted to than to play media wars with anyone and eventually Tom Sr. is going to realize that he's not even close to even being a footnote in things. The wedding was where he would have had a part to play and that's over and done with and he's missed it mostly by his own choosing. There are no do overs.
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  #483  
Old 06-27-2018, 11:26 PM
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What puzzles me is how out-of-the-blue all this is. What? Total silence for months and then he's off and running. Clearly some unusual family dynamics on the Markle side. He had everyone's sympathy (I believe) and he has well-and-good trounced it to the point of now being frozen out of his royal daughter's life from this point forward.

Anything he now says just brings shame down on his head. I hope he sees that at some point. But it's a hole he's digging from which he will never get out.
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  #484  
Old 06-28-2018, 12:20 AM
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Originally Posted by Lady Nimue View Post
What puzzles me is how out-of-the-blue all this is. What? Total silence for months and then he's off and running. Clearly some unusual family dynamics on the Markle side. He had everyone's sympathy (I believe) and he has well-and-good trounced it to the point of now being frozen out of his royal daughter's life from this point forward.

Anything he now says just brings shame down on his head. I hope he sees that at some point. But it's a hole he's digging from which he will never get out.
I don't think this is the first time it's happened. From what I've read, Meghan's relationship with her dad has been problematic before, they've had periods of estrangement previously. I would not be surprised if this type of selfish and manipulative behaviour was the reason. Some people here were skeptical of him when the photos were first published (before it was admitted that they were staged. I wasn't one of them, but in retrospect I see they were absolutely right.)

Tom is an adult and he chose not to listen to the advice that he admits he was given by Meghan and Harry about the press. I think Tom is also manipulative in his own way. I now doubt that he's a quiet recluse who just wanted to be left alone. I think that was a role he played until he decided he could use Meghan's position to generate money and attention. His behaviour escalated very quickly once she was actually married. I think now we are seeing the real Tom Markle - arrogant, thoughtless, selfish and doesn't care about how his actions hurt his daughter.

I don't think he feels much shame, in his mind his appalling behaviour is justified. He minimized any hurt Meghan and Harry would feel by nonchalantly stating "they'll get over it". He does not seem to have much empathy or concern for Meghan despite his statements of love. I think his comments about being proud of her were because he thought he reflected well on HIM and HE could get something out of it. Now he cannot brag about meeting the Queen or "being part of history", so he persists in continuing to do what he was asked not to do and seems to have no concern about how his actions have and are continuing to embarrass and hurt her.

As far as Meghan is concerned, they say "living well is the best revenge". Although I'm sure this betrayal from her dad really hurts, I hope Harry and her Mom and her new family continue to provide her with support. If I were her, I would would very careful if there are any future dealings with her father, no matter how remorseful he may claim to be.
  #485  
Old 06-28-2018, 02:20 AM
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Everyone keeps saying that Meghan isn't being appreciative of Tom Markle and all he did to cover her expense to raise her and put her in a good school.

Meghan's relationship with her father has had high points and low points all through out her life but she has never once spoken about him in a bad way.

In fact the reason all this was so surprising to everyone is that she has spoken about his role in her life glowingly and generously. She has acknowledged all her has done to make her feel included when she was a child, the draw you own box story. She has been very vocal about the positive aspects of their relationship while always keeping quiet of the negative aspect. This is a courtesy she extends to all Markles she has never once spoken a bad word against them.

I've said it before if he had only continued to say things about her or his personal conversations with her she probably would have forgiven him as she is probably used to him disappointing her before but these attacks on Harry and the Queen, that's a step too far and that's probably what resulted in him being cut off.
  #486  
Old 06-28-2018, 02:44 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lady Nimue View Post
What puzzles me is how out-of-the-blue all this is. What? Total silence for months and then he's off and running. Clearly some unusual family dynamics on the Markle side. He had everyone's sympathy (I believe) and he has well-and-good trounced it to the point of now being frozen out of his royal daughter's life from this point forward.

Anything he now says just brings shame down on his head. I hope he sees that at some point. But it's a hole he's digging from which he will never get out.
Well while it’s true Thomas Markle Sr started blabbing in public in recent times...his scamming endeavours had been going on much longer. He got caught out so likely thought he try something else, a different tactic. Spewing personal stuff about Meghan and her relationship with Prince Harry - publicly

What gave Thomas the right to give ITV/GMA a photo of Doria for use? The man is just unbelievable. He respects no boundary, much less his youngest daughter’s wishes/plea!

I think it’s absolutely disgusting that all along during his scams with the paparazzi he was colluding with his other daughter Yvonne aka Samantha behind the scenes. Someone who’d been trashing Meghan via the media right from the very beginning since Meghan & Harry’s relationship came to light.
  #487  
Old 06-28-2018, 03:17 AM
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Originally Posted by Lady Reem View Post
Well while it’s true Thomas Markle Sr started blabbing in public in recent times...his scamming endeavours had been going on much longer. He got caught out so likely thought he try something else, a different tactic. Spewing personal stuff about Meghan and her relationship with Prince Harry - publicly

What gave Thomas the right to give ITV/GMA a photo of Doria for use? The man is just unbelievable. He respects no boundary, much less his youngest daughter’s wishes/plea!

I think it’s absolutely disgusting that all along during his scams with the paparazzi he was colluding with his other daughter Yvonne aka Samantha behind the scenes. Someone who’d been trashing Meghan via the media right from the very beginning since Meghan & Harry’s relationship came to light.
The guy is definitely not crafty. Rather than the 'disgusting' look at the whole of it: he's not managing the scenario well for an apparent scammer. Why? Because he isn't (a scammer). We have no evidence that he has ever been a scammer. We have lots of evidence that he's clueless, not quite tracking on the subtleties of this royal business, that he's fuddled. It's easy to sit outside the situation and assume he must know all that we know, yes? But it's not a given.

BTW when elderly folks begin to fail they can function quite well in their limited universe.

Also I was the one (maybe there were others) who saw the photos as fishy, either they were photoshopped (I suggested) or posed. They were weird. Right there you can see that what he was doing was not normal behavior. He was likely doing Samantha's bidding while at the same time failing to inform her that he was indeed talking with and being handled by 'the palace'. Not saying that was what was happening but it's a strong possibility to my mind. It's so inept of a scam. The English with their Monty Python sensibilities should find this whole thing amusing (ouch!). There's nothing despicable, just sad. Old age. Compassion is what is needed, not disgust. JMO.

I think most people see what's happening and regardless of how successful any of us are in making sense of any of it, it really doesn't matter, except to say: see how you can rise above beginnings, leave behind negative influences, and soar! Well done, Meghan!
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  #488  
Old 06-28-2018, 03:45 AM
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I agree with Lady Nimue-Tom Sr probably functions adequately in his own world but he is out of his depth and listening to the wrong voices. His behavior is just odd. Nor do I believe he understands his youngest daughter's new life in the least. I think it is all very unfortunate but I know people who can be manipulated and would not understand why what they've done is wrong or inappropriate.

It is easy to judge knowing what we here do but we are on the outside looking in, not living it.
  #489  
Old 06-28-2018, 03:47 AM
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They'll ride out the storm as eventually the media and the press are going to find there's absolutely nothing new to be garnered from any of the Markle side of the family and it will die out. Whatever Meghan does decide to do, it will be done to the extent that its not public fodder for discussion.
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  #490  
Old 06-28-2018, 04:17 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lady Nimue View Post
The guy is definitely not crafty.
Thomas Markle Sr. colluded with a Paparazzi agency to scam the public whilst knowing that Prince Harry and his reps were simultaneously working behind the scenes to warn the media off - on his behalf. He just hadn’t banked on getting caught. Too right the man is definitely shady/crafty.
  #491  
Old 06-28-2018, 04:28 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lady Reem View Post
Thomas Markle Sr. colluded with a Paparazzi agency whilst knowing that Prince Harry and his ppl were simultaneouslyworking behind the scenes to warn the media off - on his behalf. He just hadn’t banked on getting caught. Too right the man is damn shady/crafty.
That's one way of looking at it. But we have no reason to believe he is a man of low character in that way. Rather, I don't think he can keep his lines straight. That's all. He's fuddled. That's what I see. Someone crafty would be a tad more sophisticated about it all. He isn't. He may have once been clever and savvy but those were the good 'ol days. No more.

More importantly it's not worth expending anger towards the man imo. He's a side show. A sad one. Compassion more than venom is what he needs methinks.
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  #492  
Old 06-28-2018, 04:31 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lady Reem View Post
Thomas Markle Sr. colluded with a Paparazzi agency whilst knowing that Prince Harry and his ppl were simultaneouslyworking behind the scenes to warn the media off - on his behalf. He just hadn’t banked on getting caught. Too right the man is damn shady/crafty.
I don't think it was crafty-I think he figured if there were going to be photos of him anyway, there might as well be some he controlled that were "nice."
  #493  
Old 06-28-2018, 04:47 AM
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Originally Posted by Lady Nimue View Post
That's one way of looking at it. But we have no reason to believe he is a man of low character ion that way. Rather, I don't think he can keep his lines straight. That's all. He's fuddled. That's what I see. Someone crafty would be a tad more sophisticated about it all. He isn't. He may have once been clever and savvy but those were the good 'ol days. No more.

More importantly it's not worth expending anger towards the man imo. He's a side show. A sad one. Compassion more than venom is what he needs methinks.
Crafty to me means:
1) When Sr says *I hope they understand* meaning Meghan, Harry and KP in NOT telling them before hand about the interview with GMB,
2) When Sr. takes money for the interview, that could also be *shady* as in behind Meghan's back in taking the money
3) When admitting that he *refused* the very help that Meghan, Harry and KP offered him,

Venom:
This is not *venom*, this is just plain simple *Facts* as stated by Sr himself, nothing more, nothing less.

The man in not a nitwit by any stretch of the means here, he might be and is getting old as that happens to all of us, yet he has all his faculties it seems for he lives *alone* in a foreign country, has a home in Ca also (meaning he must take care of his finances to have this), he had (maybe) heart stunts put in (alone), then watched his daughter marry on a small TV in a hotel room (really I wonder about that), he seems to have sufficient means to get around and do everything for himself. He does not seem like a dumb wit at all, in fact quite capable of doing everything he wants when he wants.....it is more about his *Image* then how this is all effecting Meghan......

Agree to disagree about Sr........
  #494  
Old 06-28-2018, 04:50 AM
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I don't think it was crafty - I think he figured if there were going to be photos of him anyway, there might as well be some he controlled that were "nice."
Yes, it's such a 'simple' way of thinking about it all, isn't it? Very naive. He's trying to do it all correctly, to help out, and it's backfiring miserably on him. It's too bad. We are told Meghan cried when he didn't come: she loves him. I think he's a good man. Piers Morgan said he thought he was 'a decent man'. We can argue that it was soft-soap, but I don't think so. I think Piers would have chosen another phrase to soft-soap but he chose that because that was his impression of the man in the pre-interview.

Anyway, I'm more inclined to give the old folks latitude. Only good thoughts to Mr Markle (and even sad Samantha, that poor distressed soul).

Quote:
Originally Posted by O-H Anglophile View Post
I agree with Lady Nimue - Tom Sr probably functions adequately in his own world but he is out of his depth and listening to the wrong voices. His behavior is just odd. Nor do I believe he understands his youngest daughter's new life in the least. I think it is all very unfortunate but I know people who can be manipulated and would not understand why what they've done is wrong or inappropriate.
His behavior is odd, and what he's saying. What he's saying has a lot of similarity to how Samantha thinks. It's hard to gauge what's going on. I, too, have known people who 'would not understand why what they've done is wrong or inappropriate.' It's a curious thing to see.

Quote:
Originally Posted by O-H Anglophile View Post
It is easy to judge knowing what we here do but we are on the outside looking in, not living it.
Yes, to us it all makes sense, we know the protocols, but to him (even all of them) it may not be so obvious.
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  #495  
Old 06-28-2018, 07:03 AM
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Originally Posted by M. Payton View Post
Crafty to me means:
1) When Sr says *I hope they understand* meaning Meghan, Harry and KP in NOT telling them before hand about the interview with GMB,
2) When Sr. takes money for the interview, that could also be *shady* as in behind Meghan's back in taking the money
3) When admitting that he *refused* the very help that Meghan, Harry and KP offered him,

Venom:
This is not *venom*, this is just plain simple *Facts* as stated by Sr himself, nothing more, nothing less.


The man in not a nitwit by any stretch of the means here, he might be and is getting old as that happens to all of us, yet he has all his faculties it seems for he lives *alone* in a foreign country, has a home in Ca also (meaning he must take care of his finances to have this), he had (maybe) heart stunts put in (alone), then watched his daughter marry on a small TV in a hotel room (really I wonder about that), he seems to have sufficient means to get around and do everything for himself. He does not seem like a dumb wit at all, in fact quite capable of doing everything he wants when he wants.....it is more about his *Image* then how this is all effecting Meghan......

Agree to disagree about Sr........
Thank you so much for your common sense approach on this. Much appreciated.

Your whole post hits the point perfectly.
  #496  
Old 06-28-2018, 07:19 AM
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The Markles lost in the court of public opinion with the antics and obvious greed. They went underground because they realized they made themselves objects of scorn and ridicule. Has GMB made any comments about Sr's freezeout from the palace? Has Piers condemned them from treating Sr so"poorly"? Dad has not been forced to do the pap photos or the interview for a fee.
  #497  
Old 06-28-2018, 07:22 AM
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For Lady Nimue - general response to your posts.

Well, like I've already mentioned, I judged people by what they say and do.

I don't know if you defend Thomas Markle because you genuinely think he has been wronged or whether it's an intellectual excersize for you. And it doesn't matter. Suffice to say I'm glad I'm not on your side in this matter, because that sure is a hard task!

But back to Thomas senior.

He has been babbling away in interview after interview. - When he could have kept his mouth shut.

He has been more than willing to disclose even fairly private details about his daughter.

Even if he is right when he is suggesting that he is the one who has been, shall we say, neglected here. There was no need for him talk about any issues there may be between him and his daughter in public.

He did take part in an "arranged" paparazzi shoot. - He didn't have to, right?

There is an old saying: If you haven't got anything good to say about people, don't say anything. I will claim that is even more apt when it's about your own daughter!
What is wrong with him keeping his mouth shut? Or (even with the help of the palace) issuing a blah-blah statement, expressing his delight for his daughter, and best wishes and hope to see her when he gets better, blah-blah...
Even if he was being hypocritical, that would be the safe and decent thing to do.

It's one thing to make a mistake and being lured/conned/taken advantage off to say something inappropriate to the press. It's an entirely different matter to repeat the mistake!

Not only that, he had to be political! Why on earth possessed him to drag QEII and President Trump into the whole thing?!? You have to live in a cave in Tibet, not to know that politics is a big no no in regards to royals.

We must also assume that he has read or even been told what people think about what he has been saying and doing so far. And if he is being the caring and loving dad, he would like to give the impression of being, surely he would realize his mistakes and seek to rectify them? Either by keeping his mouth shut or seek assistance. Perhaps phoning his daughter: "Hi, Meghan. Eh, I screwed up. Help!"
  #498  
Old 06-28-2018, 08:10 AM
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Just to refresh our information of Meghan and Tom's Sr.'s relationship over the years and a bit of everything that's happened up until today, I'm posting an article that I think was very well written and with sticking to the facts, presents a clear and precise time line of what we do know as fact.

https://www.eonline.com/news/947147/...-father-thomas
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  #499  
Old 06-28-2018, 11:19 AM
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What matters to me is that we see that Harry and Meghan very much wanted to include her father in the wedding celebrations. They still offered forgiveness and understanding after the staged photos came out, they sat silent while Tom Sr. played games with TMZ instead of going through the proper channels regarding his supposed health and attending the wedding. After the wedding they called him then they went on their honeymoon. They return and immediately begin working and living their lives and yet Tom Sr. is upset and demanding a sit down with The Queen and they barely had a chance to start their married lives together. Sorry but you don't just whine to the press because The Queen is not at your beck and call. There is NO excuse for his behavior.
  #500  
Old 06-28-2018, 11:48 AM
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I haven't been keeping up with this thread. In fact, I've been avoiding it because I have nothing nice or good to say about Meghan's father and the debacle he's caused by constantly speaking to the press. I had some compassion for him when he was caught colluding with the paps. But the moment he spoke to TMZ, I was done feeling sorry for him. He is a grown man who's continuously making choices that he believes is best for himself, clearly not considering what harm or embarrassment he is causing his daughter and that is unacceptable. I look to Doria on how a parent should be behaving now and I applaud how she has handled it all. Thank goodness Meghan has at least one parent she can trust.
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