The Duchess of Sussex: Family and Background

[Madame Verseau]

Sam had a child abuse charge substantiated against her in court. That would be a big strike against her for contact with the Sussex kids. If could hurt Dad if he allows the children near Sam if they are with him. The same with Jr because of the gun charge while drunk.

[Rudolph]

Originally Posted by alvinking

I guess you did not understand, it is not about death or divorce, it is about custody. I just said that this law was applied recently in these two cases

And the Queen has nothing to d with it as far as her great grand Children are concerned. The monarch has custody of his/her grand children

It is Charles once monarch who will have custody of his grand children, so theoretically it will be charles decision. Case in point Diana wanted her brother and sister to be legal guardian of her children, The Queen overruled her will, and appointed John Major. Just drawing a parallel to show that it is the will of the custodian that matters, not that of the parents

Well the article that was posted refers to George, Charlotte and Louis and any potential children for Harry. The Queen’s great-grandchildren.

But either way I doubt the law would survive a court challenge if the monarch tried to block visitations by Mr Markle, especially if it’s the parents wishes

[Mbruno]

Originally Posted by Madame Verseau

Here's an interesting tidbit I ran across. Sr whines he may never see his grandchildren from Harry and Meghan. Well that could be arranged

https://amp.news.com.au/entertainmen...31304d4674bd3b

I'm surprised the law is still on the books. The sovereign has custody of minor grandchildren. That means the queen and Charles when he becomes king can block the Markle malcontents from having contact with Harry and Meghan's kids. They can use the public attacks and the adjudicated bad acts of the half sibs as grounds along with Dad's ties to the older kids. Dad, Sam and Jr don't have a legal leg to stand on, and going to an American court won't help. I wouldn't be surprised if Dad figures it out he may shut up and throw his older kids under the bus if distancing himself from them helps him gain access.

Harry’s children will be the Queen’s great-grandchildren, so the law as you stated it doesn’t apply to them yet.

[Heavs]

Originally Posted by alvinking

Well however archaic this law may be, it has been used 4 times recently. No custody settlements during the divorce of Charles, of Anne, and of Andrew, and John Major was appointed legal Guardian of William and Harry after the death of Diana, regardless of her will's wishes.

On a side not at Harry's wedding, Former Prime Minister John Major was there, not as a Prime Minister, but as a former legal guardian of Harry

That's interesting I assumed Major was there because he's a Garter Knight.

This also might have been why (allegedly) the Queen refused to allow Beatrice and Eugenie to go to boarding school in Switzerland which Sarah was said to have wanted. This was when they still had PPOs IIRC so security was probably a big consideration.


The only reason I can think of for Charles invoking this is if they have children and unfortunately divorce and Meghan wants to move back to the US full time. It might also depend on their styles and titles at the time and threats etc. I can't see it being invoked to prevent TMsr from seeing his grandchildren if their parents wish it. The biggest threat of him not seeing his (theoretical) grandchildren is himself right now. In the future, who knows?

[alvinking]

Originally Posted by Rudolph

But either way I doubt the law would survive a court challenge if the monarch tried to block visitations by Mr Markle, especially if it’s the parents wishes

Dura Lex, Sed Lex

In the even that the monarch uses this right, Court challenge would fail, i'm afraid

[Rudolph]

Originally Posted by alvinking

Dura Lex, Sed Lex

In the even that the monarch uses this right, Court challenge would fail, i'm afraid

The monarch only has the right because it was legislated by Parliament. And if an act of Parliament doesn’t comply with existing U.K. and EU law, it can be challenged in court

I’m not positive but I’m assuming a law passed 300 years ago my not pass muster in 2018.

I don’t think it’s ever been tested.

[Osipi]

But anyways.... when it comes to Meghan's e(strange)d family and visiting with the potential children, I can't see Harry and Meghan or anybody leaving their children alone at any time with any of them. If anything, it would be a well supervised visit with perhaps even RPOs on duty.

As things stand now, any of the Markles being any way, shape or form welcomed to events surrounding the first Sussex child, in my guessimation, would be absolute zero. Doria though will be front and center as the proud grandmother.

[Mbruno]

Originally Posted by Osipi

But anyways.... when it comes to Meghan's e(strange)d family and visiting with the potential children, I can't see Harry and Meghan or anybody leaving their children alone at any time with any of them. If anything, it would be a well supervised visit with perhaps even RPOs on duty.

As things stand now, any of the Markles being any way, shape or form welcomed to events surrounding the first Sussex child, in my guessimation, would be absolute zero. Doria though will be front and center as the proud grandmother.

My perception watching different royal families is that royal grandchildren have little contact with non-royal grandparents. There may be a few exceptions like the Middletons or the Westlings, who seem to be somewhat close to their grandchildren, but, generally speaking, we don't see non-royal grandparents very often with their grandchildren, at least not in public.



I don't see why anyone would assume that Tom Sr, an estranged father who is divorced from Meghan's mother and lives in another continent, would have any social contact with Harry and Meghan's children. It looks totally implausible to me.


BTW, I don't expect them to be close to Doria Ragland either.

[jacqui24]

Originally Posted by Rudolph

But either way I doubt the law would survive a court challenge if the monarch tried to block visitations by Mr Markle, especially if it’s the parents wishes

The only way this would end up in court is if the parents challenge this law. Tom Markle has no grounds even if he's not allowed to see the grandchildren.

Originally Posted by Mbruno

My perception watching different royal families is that royal grandchildren have little contact with non-royal grandparents. There may be a few exceptions like the Middletons or the Westlings, who seem to be somewhat close to their grandchildren, but, generally speaking, we don't see non-royal grandparents very often with their grandchildren, at least not in public.



I don't see why anyone would assume that Tom Sr, an estranged father who is divorced from Meghan's mother and lives in another continent, would have any social contact with Harry and Meghan's children. It looks totally implausible to me.


BTW, I don't expect them to be close to Doria Ragland either.

The key word here is perception. It's what people see. We don't see Harry hanging out with his Spencer family with the exception of photos from a wedding here and there. But by all accounts, he's very close to them. I would be very surprised if Doria isn't close to any children Meghan and Harry would have.

[Mirabel]

Originally Posted by Osipi

Its just a possibility but I have a sneaking suspicion that Samantha was trying to do everything in her power to sabotage Meghan's wedding because she knew she'd be left out of it. The coup came when Daddy bought into her line that he needed to "improve his image". Daughter plays Daddy's ego like a Stradivarius violin and the wedding falls apart. Well... almost. This continues to this day. Daddy still doesn't realize that perhaps he doesn't have a working phone number for Meghan most likely because its a possibility that number would be passed to Sam, TMZ, Piers Morgan or anyone else and would no longer be a "private" number.

It may have made Meghan unhappy at the time, but I am pleased that Charles stepped in to escort Meghan.

I thought it showed the acceptance the RF had for her. I think it was better not to include Markle, who'd have given interviews about everything from comments by guests to the menu at the reception!

This way he has very little he can say, and people are already growing bored with him.

But I do feel Meghan made a mistake cutting off Morgan.
It wouldn't have taken much to keep him on her side, and he could have helped with the PR.

[ACO]

Morgon? Piers? No way. It was smart she distanced herself from that weasel. His existence is bad PR.

As for the custody stuff. It’s just a technicality. Unless something dramatic occurs, it’s clearly not enforced. There is no need for it. The parents raise their kids who they want with reason of the monarchy.

Thomas Markle has zero rights.

[Mbruno]

Originally Posted by jacqui24

I would be very surprised if Doria isn't close to any children Meghan and Harry would have.

Why ? As far as I know, Doria is not even close to her daughter. How often did they see each other in the past years prior to Meghan's second wedding for example ? And Doria still lives physically very far apart from the Sussexes.

An important point I am trying to get across here is that a royal family is not like an ordinary American middle-class family. In the old days, royal children traditionally lived a secluded life. That is not exactly the case today as royals go to "normal" schools and have "normal" friends, but it is still unrealistic to expect them to have the same proximity to non-royal grandparents as they have to the royal family properly.

[Marlo]

Originally Posted by Mbruno

Why ? As far as I know, Doria is not even close to her daughter. How often did they see each other in the past years prior to Meghan's second wedding for example ? And Doria still lives physically very far apart from the Sussexes.

An important point I am trying to get accross here is that a royal family is not like an ordinary American middle-class family. In the old days, royal children traditionally lived a secluded life. That is not exactly the case today as royals go to "normal" schools and have "normal" friends, but it is still unrealistic to expect them to have the same proximity to non-royal grandparents as they have to the royal family properly.

Doria is not even close to her daughter? How do you know? Get your fact straight. Have you ever heard of Skype and FaceTime?

[Osipi]

Originally Posted by Mirabel

But I do feel Meghan made a mistake cutting off Morgan. It wouldn't have taken much to keep him on her side, and he could have helped with the PR.

Let's look at it this way. On one hand, here's Meghan deeply in love with Harry and deciding to marry and have a permanent partnership through life. One of the things Harry would have been adamant about from the very first is one doesn't talk to the press.

On the other hand, there's Piers Morgan who isn't exactly renown for his professional journalistic skills. He met Meghan once because he was a Suits fan.

Which one makes the most sense to choose? Its not rocket science.

[AlowVera]

Originally Posted by Osipi

Let's look at it this way. On one hand, here's Meghan deeply in love with Harry and deciding to marry and have a permanent partnership through life. One of the things Harry would have been adamant about from the very first is one doesn't talk to the press.

On the other hand, there's Piers Morgan who isn't exactly renown for his professional journalistic skills. He met Meghan once because he was a Suits fan.

Which one makes the most sense to choose? Its not rocket science.

I think this illustrates how Meghan said she did not have the same understanding of what royalty is in the UK. Had Meghan truly been the royal watcher as some have accused her of being she would never have communicated with Morgan in the first place. To Americans Morgan was the replacement for Larry King who was a respected talk show host. We did not know about the News Of the World scandal that affected Prince Harry. I'm sure that once Harry let her know about Morgan she rightly saw what a conflict of interest it would be and cut off ties with Morgan very smart move in deed.

[Cocoasneeze]

Originally Posted by Mbruno

Why ? As far as I know, Doria is not even close to her daughter. How often did they see each other in the past years prior to Meghan's second wedding for example ? And Doria still lives physically very far apart from the Sussexes.

An important point I am trying to get across here is that a royal family is not like an ordinary American middle-class family. In the old days, royal children traditionally lived a secluded life. That is not exactly the case today as royals go to "normal" schools and have "normal" friends, but it is still unrealistic to expect them to have the same proximity to non-royal grandparents as they have to the royal family properly.

The thing is though, we have no clue how often Doria and Meghan see each other, and that's how it should be. Meghan and Doria don't need to tell anyone when meet up, call each other, face time etc. And just because we have no knowledge of how often they see each other, doesn't mean they aren't close.

I'm actually a bit weirded out about speculation who will and won't be close to Meghan and Harry's children, when she isn't even pregnant yet.

[ACO]

Originally Posted by Mbruno

Why ? As far as I know, Doria is not even close to her daughter. How often did they see each other in the past years prior to Meghan's second wedding for example ? And Doria still lives physically very far apart from the Sussexes.

An important point I am trying to get across here is that a royal family is not like an ordinary American middle-class family. In the old days, royal children traditionally lived a secluded life. That is not exactly the case today as royals go to "normal" schools and have "normal" friends, but it is still unrealistic to expect them to have the same proximity to non-royal grandparents as they have to the royal family properly.

Huh? Mother and daughter traveled plenty to see each other. All you had to do was look at her IG and see the many pictures of them together with her friends, on the set of Suits, video chatting, etc. They live in different countries and have their own lives but how does that equal they are not close?

I agree the royal family are different but again not sure why that means Doria won't have a close relationship with her future grandchildren. The press have no idea how close Harry is to anyone. We learned just how important it was for Harry to have Meghan immediately meet his mother's family and friends in the engagement interview. Let the press tell it and they think Harry & William never interact with the Spencers. Also Harry and Meghan said themselves they spent a lot of time with Doria. In those video/pictures from IG, it didn't look like it was the 1st interaction between Harry and his girlfriend's mother.

This week proves how easy it is for the Sussexes to travel around without being seen. The press had them in London, Italy, LA, Scotland, and Toronto. Doria could have been in London for a week and we might not even have known. You don't have to see people face to face to be close. I talk to my sister every day and we live 700 miles apart.

[jacqui24]

Originally Posted by Mbruno

Why ? As far as I know, Doria is not even close to her daughter. How often did they see each other in the past years prior to Meghan's second wedding for example ? And Doria still lives physically very far apart from the Sussexes.

An important point I am trying to get across here is that a royal family is not like an ordinary American middle-class family. In the old days, royal children traditionally lived a secluded life. That is not exactly the case today as royals go to "normal" schools and have "normal" friends, but it is still unrealistic to expect them to have the same proximity to non-royal grandparents as they have to the royal family properly.

Huh? Since when is Doria not close to her daughter? We've seen photos of them in Toronto before both on just visiting Meghan and then again for IG, and Meghan obviously also went to LA when she can. Doria has also traveled to UK incognito before and have obviously spent a decent amount of time with Harry without any photos being leaked. Just because we don't see them spend time with each other, doesn't mean they don't. And what is the difference between them having visits from grandparent that lives abroad versus one that keeps a really busy schedule and travels a lot?

[Mbruno]

Originally Posted by jacqui24

Huh? Since when is Doria not close to her daughter? We've seen photos of them in Toronto before both on just visiting Meghan and then again for IG, and Meghan obviously also went to LA when she can. Doria has also traveled to UK incognito before and have obviously spent a decent amount of time with Harry without any photos being leaked. Just because we don't see them spend time with each other, doesn't mean they don't. And what is the difference between them having visits from grandparent that lives abroad versus one that keeps a really busy schedule and travels a lot?

The Queen dorsn’t travel overseas anymore and, to be frank, Charles doesn’t do it quite often these days either as many international engagements have been outsourced to the Cambridges and Harry. Harry’s children will obviously spend summers in Balmoral and be with other members of the RF around Christmas and in other special occasions, or maybe on weekends as Beatrice, Eugenie and Edward’s children have done with their grandparents. There is no comparison really with the very limited amount of time , if any, that they will spend with Mrs Ragland and much less with her estranged husband, whom they will probably never see. Again, the RF is not your run-of-the-mill Anerican family.

And I stand by my perception. Meghan and Doria have seen each other only occasionally over the past 7 years or so. In fact, they haven’t seen each other since the wedding as far as I know. I have no reason to believe they are particularly close as the Middletons are to Kate for example, or the Westlings are to Daniel. Meghan herself is known to have told Harry that she “ never had a family” , whatever that means. Marrying into the RF should be a good opportunity for her to make a clean break with her past.

[Osipi]

First off, in order to be close to the children, there have to be children in the first place and everything before that is speculation and assumption.

On another note, we're veering into other kinds of discussions and that is perhaps due to the Markles being (gasp!) quiet for a day? Did Samantha contract laryngitis? Did Tom, Sr. take a staycation and locked his doors? Stay tuned.... it most likely won't last for long.