The Duchess of Sussex: Family and Background

[Dman]

Originally Posted by ACO

Thomas kept silent for over a year. He understood well enough. There really is no excuse for his behavior now. He started listening to Samantha and let his ego take over. Thomas does not care. He has made it extremely clear.

Personally I think he just bitter over Doria becoming adored worldwide. His comments make it painfully obvious. He a footnote and she is not. So now everyone has to pay.

Yes, he kept quiet for a year. That’s before the media and paps started to search for him and painted him as a fat and retired slob. He went on to listen to Samantha and it all snowballed from there.

Originally Posted by O-H Anglophile

You are talking like these are reasonable, empathetic, loving people. They are not--they are greedy, jealous, narcissists.

No, I’m just saying that some members of the Markle family are clueless on Meghan’s new life and the Monarchy. I think they’re seeing fame and fortune and have very little to no regard on how to behave now that Meghan is a member of the British Royal Family. None of the key Markle players are thinking about Meghan and what they should be doing to support her. Everything is about themselves.

[O-H Anglophile]

Originally Posted by Dman

No, I’m just saying that some members of the Markle family are clueless on Meghan’s new life and the Monarchy. I think they’re seeing fame and fortune and have very little to no regard on how to behave now that Meghan is a member of the British Royal Family. None of the key Markle players are thinking about Meghan and what they should be doing to support her. Everything is about themselves.

Exactly. They are concerned about themselves.

Samantha is carrying out her personal vendetta against Meghan while basking in the attention and earning some money. Thomas Sr is whining about poor me, when almost all of it was brought on by his own actions. They are not interested in supporting Meghan.

[hel]

Originally Posted by Dman

How can you care about something you don’t understand? That’s what I’m saying..they don’t have clue what the royal institution means and don’t have any respect for it. It’s like all they see is that Meghan married a famous royal guy. The history, traditions, and any understanding of Meghan’s royal role and the pressures that goes with it, are meaningless to them.

Samantha is bitter and very much jealous of Meghan. It’s like she’s looking at her life, then look at Meghan’s, and wondering...why her and not me? Sad state of affairs.

Even if they understood the institution of monarchy well enough to care about it, they'd *also* have to care enough about Meghan to want her to succeed.

Thomas Sr., from the evidence, cares about her the most of the three of them, but apparently not enough to stand up to his other two kids on her behalf. And he seems pretty selfish, TBH, so even if he fully understood, I think he'd only choose what's good for Meghan if it's also good for him.

Thomas Jr., at this point, talks the least. As far as I can tell, I think he's indifferent to Meghan's welfare but doesn't have any sustained malice towards her. He gets angry, sure, when he's not getting what he wants, but he's not going out of his way to hurt her for the sheer pleasure of hurting her.

Which brings us to Samantha. If given enough information to understand the monarchy, it's almost certain that Samantha would use that information to inflict as much damage as possible on Meghan.

[Winnie]

BTW, has anyone watch the You Tube interview with Samantha's mother and daughter Noel? It is under the subject heading of "Meghan Markle Cousin says Samantha Markle is a jealous bitter Woman". Very honest but scary for a young child to have to remember that upbringing. Noel so very soft spoken and quite lovely.

[jacqui24]

Originally Posted by Dman

I don’t think he and his other children have a clue of the magnitude of the life and pressures that’s comes with Meghan being a senior HRH and the institution as a whole. From the looks of it, they’re looking all of this has some kind of Hollywood fantasy. They’re not taking any of this serious. They’re just thinking about themselves and what they can get out of it.

I don't think you can say that at this point. It might be the case at the beginning. However, I don't know if they care? Meghan's well being doesn't seem to be high on their priority list. Samantha obviously hates Meghan with a passion and has an ax to grind. Tom is in a free fall and just can't control himself. Tom Jr. has finally run out of things to say after his vindictive and contradictory behavior. Quite frankly, the one thing I see them having in common is the inability to see the bigger picture and play the long game.

Originally Posted by hel

Even if they understood the institution of monarchy well enough to care about it, they'd *also* have to care enough about Meghan to want her to succeed.

Thomas Sr., from the evidence, cares about her the most of the three of them, but apparently not enough to stand up to his other two kids on her behalf. And he seems pretty selfish, TBH, so even if he fully understood, I think he'd only choose what's good for Meghan if it's also good for him.

Thomas Jr., at this point, talks the least. As far as I can tell, I think he's indifferent to Meghan's welfare but doesn't have any sustained malice towards her. He gets angry, sure, when he's not getting what he wants, but he's not going out of his way to hurt her for the sheer pleasure of hurting her.

Which brings us to Samantha. If given enough information to understand the monarchy, it's almost certain that Samantha would use that information to inflict as much damage as possible on Meghan.

Completely agree with this assessment.

Originally Posted by Dman

No, I’m just saying that some members of the Markle family are clueless on Meghan’s new life and the Monarchy. I think they’re seeing fame and fortune and have very little to no regard on how to behave now that Meghan is a member of the British Royal Family. None of the key Markle players are thinking about Meghan and what they should be doing to support her. Everything is about themselves.

So the question is, how would include them change anything? They are who they are. The media attention might have magnified it. However, if fame and fortune is what they expect from Meghan, I'm not seeing a happy ending to this story by keeping in touch.

[Dman]

Originally Posted by jacqui24

So the question is, how would include them change anything? They are who they are. The media attention might have magnified it. However, if fame and fortune is what they expect from Meghan, I'm not seeing a happy ending to this story by keeping in touch.

I’m not sure anything can be done with Samantha. Her bitterness is long and deep.

Things aren’t beyond repair with Thomas though. The problem is solvable, but it’s going to take Tom, Meghan even Harry to meet in the middle and bury this craziness.

[Heavs]

I could agree with trying to make TM understand more about her new life if his debacle had been only the posed pap pics and *maybe* some of the wedding stuff. He claimed they were briefly in contact with him after the wedding at one point. That said, he did understand enough to realise that announcing his intentions to TMZ not to MM first was going to make her extremely upset.

As it is I don't think even he believes half the stuff coming out of his mouth anymore and then there are the things like the nasty "I made her!" quotes which show a manipulative narcissist.

In his own words he refused to listen to guidance and for whatever reason refused a visit from them pre wedding. He was also offered support in getting to the wedding and almost certainly settling in/having things explained once he got there, but we know how that went. Post wedding I don't think there's anything that they can say to him that doesn't have a high chance of ending up as his next interview, probably twisted as "See, I told you they were a cult, they're trying to control me!"

Doria definitely seems to have grasped don't talk to the press and enough about how the BRF works to keep discreet and look and act perfectly on her daughter's wedding day. Whilst there are alien aspects to the protocol etc if you aren't used to it, what her parents were both asked to do wasn't rocket science either.

[jacqui24]

Originally Posted by Dman

I’m not sure anything can be done with Samantha. Her bitterness is long and deep.

Things aren’t beyond repair with Thomas though. The problem is solvable, but it’s going to take Tom, Meghan even Harry to meet in the middle and bury this craziness.

And what is middle? I think it's gone pretty far off with Tom threatening his daughter publicly among other problematic comments he's made. He's now having weekly outbursts. Until that stops for awhile, there is no way any contact would help matters. I honestly think Meghan stopped talking to Tom due to the Piers Morgan interview, which he purposely hid from his daughter knowing full well how she'd feel about it. That's about less than a month after their wedding. They've barely returned from honeymoon. I don't know why it's so hard for Tom to understand that his outbursts are the reason why his daughter isn't speaking to him. He's blamed everything from the royal family to Meghan being stuck up. Yet, the reason is looking at him right in the mirror. Meghan isn't engaging in a war of words with her father. She's treating him like a child that's throwing a tantrum, which he is acting like one except he is far more dangerous (not the physical kind, but inflicting damage) because he's not a child. At this point, reasonable people can understand why she's done what she's had to do.

[Dman]

Originally Posted by jacqui24

And what is middle? I think it's gone pretty far off with Tom threatening his daughter publicly among other problematic comments he's made. He's now having weekly outbursts. Until that stops for awhile, there is no way any contact would help matters. I honestly think Meghan stopped talking to Tom due to the Piers Morgan interview, which he purposely hid from his daughter knowing full well how she'd feel about it. That's about less than a month after their wedding. They've barely returned from honeymoon. I don't know why it's so hard for Tom to understand that his outbursts are the reason why his daughter isn't speaking to him. He's blamed everything from the royal family to Meghan being stuck up. Yet, the reason is looking at him right in the mirror. Meghan isn't engaging in a war of words with her father. She's treating him like a child that's throwing a tantrum, which he is acting like one except he is far more dangerous (not the physical kind, but inflicting damage) because he's not a child. At this point, reasonable people can understand why she's done what she's had to do.

Meeting in the middle is getting together, talking and burying the hatchet. Right now, everyone is in their corners and the mess is continuing to stew.

I do understand the pickle the Sussex’s are in though. Trust go a long way with the royals. A lot of people are thinking that the royal couple are frightened of talking to Tom and then he go back and tell the media what was said. Look at what he did with Piers Morgan.

[hel]

Originally Posted by jacqui24

And what is middle? I think it's gone pretty far off with Tom threatening his daughter publicly among other problematic comments he's made. He's now having weekly outbursts. Until that stops for awhile, there is no way any contact would help matters. I honestly think Meghan stopped talking to Tom due to the Piers Morgan interview, which he purposely hid from his daughter knowing full well how she'd feel about it. That's about less than a month after their wedding. They've barely returned from honeymoon. I don't know why it's so hard for Tom to understand that his outbursts are the reason why his daughter isn't speaking to him. He's blamed everything from the royal family to Meghan being stuck up. Yet, the reason is looking at him right in the mirror. Meghan isn't engaging in a war of words with her father. She's treating him like a child that's throwing a tantrum, which he is acting like one except he is far more dangerous (not the physical kind, but inflicting damage) because he's not a child. At this point, reasonable people can understand why she's done what she's had to do.

Further to this, it's also baffling why he can't seem to understand that his poor public image is almost entirely due to his continued outbursts.

I was looking at some of the early discussion about Meghan's family on the board. Believe it or not, a year ago pretty much everyone on this forum was pretty solidly in the guy's corner. There are lots of posts about how his behaviour was dignified and kept Meghan's best interests at heart.

Then the photos hit, and the tenor of a lot of posts was "the press should leave him alone". Even once the truth about the photos came out, there were still a lot of people willing to forgive him.

Then the interviews started. Thomas Sr. talks an inordinate amount about how he has to speak out to "protect his image". But the single thing that's trashed his image the most has been how he's spoken out.

The more he talks, the worse he looks. Then he talks more, to "improve his image". It's bizarre to me that he doesn't seem to understand that.

[Madame Verseau]

@Dman - what is failure to understand the workings of the British monarchy as justification for the Markles to publicly attack Doria? The woman Sam called the maid and Dad accused of teaching Meghan of having an attitude? Meghan loves her mom and no one should expect her to overlook that bit of nastiness just to get along with her abusive father. If anything I can Meghan putting in a condition Dad publicly apologize to Doria and if he and the half sibs drag her again it's a wrap.

[ACO]

Why does she have to “bury the hatchet” with a bully? Just because he is her father?! Tom Sr literally blamed Meghan for Samantha’s behavior. I would disagree the relationship is repairable right now.

[Dman]

Originally Posted by Madame Verseau

@Dman - what is failure to understand the workings of the British monarchy as justification for the Markles to publicly attack Doria? The woman Sam called the maid and Dad accused of teaching Meghan of having an attitude? Meghan loves her mom and no one should expect her to overlook that bit of nastiness just to get along with her abusive father. If anything I can Meghan putting in a condition Dad publicly apologize to Doria and if he and the half sibs drag her again it's a wrap.

I’m not talking about the attacks on Doria. The attacks are crazy, but Doria can handle herself and I’m not sure she’s paying the Markles much mind, but probably pissed that they are publicly attacking Meghan. She divorced from that mess long ago.

Originally Posted by ACO

Why does she have to “bury the hatchet” with a bully? Just because he is her father?! Tom Sr literally blamed Meghan for Samantha’s behavior. I would disagree the relationship is repairable right now.

Tom is just listening to Samantha. I think she’s very happy that Thomas is behaving in this manner. It would’ve killed Samantha if she saw her father walking Meghan down the aisle back in May. A lot of this is her doing. The woman is in her 50’s, but she’s still acting like a high school brat.

[ACO]

I feel that’s just an excuse for Tom Sr. He is a grown man and clearly well aware of his actions. He said it many times. He is trolling the media. Samantha is vile but he knows it and excuses it. So again I ask, why does Meghan need to mends things with a bully? Being her father is not good enough.

[Zonk]

What's so interesting is that Tom Sr. says that Meghan asked him to tell Samantha to stop bad mouthing her to the press and not to share her personal information with her, which is totally understand able from her viewpoint. She doesn't have a relationship with Sam and he does. He also stated that she asked him to stop speaking to Sam and he said he couldn't choose one child over the other. Also, understandable. But what Tom Sr., doesn't seem to understnad is that by NOT publicly denouncing some of the things both Sam and Tom Jr., has said about Meghan to the media, he is picking one child over the other. At least, that's how it appears to me.

I tried to go back in history to think of two siblings that disliked each other so immensely it bordered on a sickness. I don't know how Meghan feels about Samantha causes she chooses to ignore her but it obvious that Samantha has a clearly dislikes Meghan. I have never seen or heard anyone talk about a sibling is such a denigrating and nasty way. I mean, I don't think I have ever disliked or hated anyone in my life the way she talks about Meghan.

[DeeT]

Originally Posted by Dman

I’m not sure anything can be done with Samantha. Her bitterness is long and deep.

Things aren’t beyond repair with Thomas though. The problem is solvable, but it’s going to take Tom, Meghan even Harry to meet in the middle and bury this craziness.

Meghan has done her part, above & beyond! She has never mentioned her estranged relatives & always cared for her father.

The problem is solvable, it’s time for her relatives to stop harassing her. Go back to their lives & their family; leave Meghan alone.

[M. Payton]

Originally Posted by Dman

I’m not talking about the attacks on Doria. The attacks are crazy, but Doria can handle herself and I’m not sure she’s paying the Markles much mind, but probably pissed that they are publicly attacking Meghan. She divorced from that mess long ago.



Tom is just listening to Samantha. I think she’s very happy that Thomas is behaving in this manner. It would’ve killed Samantha if she saw her father walking Meghan down the aisle back in May. A lot of this is her doing. The woman is in her 50’s, but she’s still acting like a high school brat.

Are you saying that because Sr has *attacked* Doria and that she can handle herself that it is okay for Sr to attack her? Wow, that blows my mind for sure here, maybe some here have never been in an abusive relationship so they do not understand the meaning of the word *Abuse* and how it can effect a person's view and the outcome of any relationship by both parties. SR has NO right to abuse his daughter and betray her the way he has done.....there is something called *Mental Health* and why doesn't someone in this day and age understand that. I see Meghan as tough as steel and NO she is NOT responsible nor is Harry for this problem nor fixing it.....that lies completely on Sr and Sam.......totally!

[MARG]

Originally Posted by Dman

I’m not sure anything can be done with Samantha. Her bitterness is long and deep.

Things aren’t beyond repair with Thomas though. The problem is solvable, but it’s going to take Tom, Meghan even Harry to meet in the middle and bury this craziness.

I would beg to differ. Tom Snr seemed quite capable of keeping quiet while being one of the first to know that his daughter was dating Harry. Samatha's response was to immediately launch an attack on Meghan and sustained that attack throughout the dating and engagement. It was never on the cards that she would be invited to the wedding, nobody in their right mind would have expected her to have been.

However, I now find myself wondering if much of the information Samantha had to vent about Meghan didn't come from dear old dad. He declined palace assistance prior to the wedding and was very clear that he did not want them to visit after the wedding. Was he worried that he would have been found out months rather than days before the wedding? At one stage he was saying that Meghan expected him to cut contact with Samantha and he bleated that he had two daughters and it was cruel to expect him to choose.

I don't believe Meghan or Harry ever asked that but I do believe he was asked to stop communicating information about Meghan and Harry to her. That is where IMHO, they realised that Dad and Samantha were in it together. With the benefit of 20/20 hindsight, I don't believe Snr ever intended to attend the wedding, perhaps he has fear of flying, who knows but to suddenly detonate the week before the wedding was unconscionable and also made his actually being there a very remote chance.

I believe his treatment of Meghan is bullying plain and simple and once he moved on to Harry and HM herself there really is no going back. He is toxic, has probably always been toxic but when Meghan was a child she adored him and he obviously loved her too. But, once the disappointments of life pass by and had he really been swindled out of his lottery money, I guess he became angrier and self-pitying, resentful and he really didn't think through his behaviour to Meghan.

Unfortunately, seeing the reality of his daughter's marriage to a Prince of the UK, the almost storybook magical pomp and ceremony, Meghan in a historic and (thanks to the sunlight) stunningly sparkling diamond tiara and his ex-wife Doria, resplendent in her avocado ensemble, treated like royalty herself and spoken of by commentators in the most glowing of terms, that big old green-eyed monster raised it's head and lashed out indiscriminately because "that should have been me and, if you told me what royalty was really like, it would have been me!"

I think he has burnt his bridges but, leave space for the chance that Meghan still loves him but just doesn't particularly like him at present. Perhaps someone who knows the Royals will give him a heads up on their "never complain, never explain" mantra and that basically, he's just shadow boxing and his grandiose belief that the BRF have retreated in the face of his attacks is totally unfounded since the BRF take summer holidays every year.

I just keep on thinking of "Suppose They Gave a War and Nobody Came?".

[Dman]

Originally Posted by M. Payton

Are you saying that because Sr has *attacked* Doria and that she can handle herself that it is okay for Sr to attack her? Wow, that blows my mind for sure here, maybe some here have never been in an abusive relationship so they do not understand the meaning of the word *Abuse* and how it can effect a person's view and the outcome of any relationship by both parties. SR has NO right to abuse his daughter and betray her the way he has done.....there is something called *Mental Health* and why doesn't someone in this day and age understand that. I see Meghan as tough as steel and NO she is NOT responsible nor is Harry for this problem nor fixing it.....that lies completely on Sr and Sam.......totally!

No, what are you talking about?

[Soula]

Most of this would have been avoided if Meghan had invited some of the family to the wedding, they would have been embarrassing but not to the extent that it has now escalated to.

I'm sure they would have still talked but it wouldn't have got this bad. This is the gift that keeps on giving as far as the press is concerned.

As for the wall of silence from KP, Harry shouldn't have made the "family she never had" comment. He should have kept silent. To be fair, however dysfunctional a family is, they wouldn't want that stated on an international stage.

Just MHO....