Meghan Markle: Citizenship and Religious Conversion

[AdmirerUS]

One of the major networks today commented that the baptism was gesture to honor Her Majesty. Which is just such and American thing to say, I had to share it.

 

[MaiaMia_53]

One of the major networks today commented that the baptism was gesture to honor Her Majesty. Which is just such and American thing to say, I had to share it.

Thanks for sharing. I'm sure that was part of it. However, Meghan herself would also have to feel deeply about wanting to make this commitment in her own heart. It can't just be a gesture of respect alone. It seems to me that in her consultations and lessons with the Archbishop of Canterbury, Meghan has opened up and as reported 'bonded' with this church leader in an important way that has benefited her own spiritual growth. That's not a small thing, nor is it simply indicative of a respectful gesture.

 

[Pranter]

That would be a pretty poor reason to become baptized and confirmed into a Church IMO (because you respect the Queen etc)...it should not really have anything to do with how others view you or how you want to show something...but your relationship to Christ and His teachings.


LaRae

 

[wyevale]

In truth we have NO idea what may have prompted Ms Markle to take this step, which is entirely voluntary. Potentially any number of reasons...

 

[ACO]

Exactly. If I had to guess it would be so that Meghan, Harry, and their future family will all be under the same church. It doesn't seem to me that she was highly religious so this probably wasn't a big deal for her.

 

[French Toast]

Yeah right. Thanks for pointing that out. It's not a Buddhist Temple, so I stand corrected. However, the founder of the congregation is Swami Paramahansa Yogananda who was a disciple of Swami Sri Yuketeswar, a late 19th-century/ early 20th-century East Indian yogi who was a scholar of the Bhagavad Gita (700 verse Hindu scripture) and of the Bible.

Swami Yogananda founded the Self-Realization Fellowship Hollywood Temple in 1920 to further meditation and yoga well-being and enlightenment practices in the west. Although the L.A. Temple's practices are not directly connected to either Hinduism or to Buddhism, there are some indirect connections to both of those belief systems.

Thanks for the lecture; however, I must say there was no need for you to copy snd paste anothers work about the Self-Realization Fellowship, its history, and its late founder.

As one who visits the SRF lake shrine in Pacific Palisades as well as the temple near my home in Encinitas, CA quite often I know a lot about the SRF. It is a very special place.

 

[Ish]

That would be a pretty poor reason to become baptized and confirmed into a Church IMO (because you respect the Queen etc)...it should not really have anything to do with how others view you or how you want to show something...but your relationship to Christ and His teachings.


LaRae

There are many reasons why someone would join a church or religion, them believing in it being just one. Religion has as much to do with social constructions as it has to do with faith.

It is incredibly unlikely that Meghan is joining the Church of England because she has a newfound belief in its teachings that just happens to coincide with her relationship with Harry. It is a lot more likely that she recognizes the church as being important to Harry’s family, and realizes that there are a lot of activities that will involve the Church of England in her future and has come to a logical conclusion that joining the church will enable her to be more involved and/or more comfortable in these activities.

Many people convert to a religion because of their significant other. It’s probably less common now in a world where (in the West at least) religion plays a smaller role, but it still happens. Meghan is not unique in this.

 

[carlota]

as a christian, we baptise and then prepare for communion and prepare for confirmation separately. these are important steps of faith, each requiring a lot of preparation and commitment and consideration of each step. to give you an idea, one prepares for 2 years for communion, and about 1 year for confirmation. so to see that meghan was baptised and confirmed on the same day, with both activities done one followed by another as if it were a laundry list makes me for one disappointed but also makes it appear as if this was something that 'had to be done' as a future member of the RF that she will be rather than as the commitment / devotion that the media is reporting.

 

[Rudolph]

Let’s not overthink it. She’s not exactly a Charlie Church. She got baptised and confirmed because of Harry and his grandmother.

 

[Osipi]

No one can specifically state just why Meghan decided to be baptized and confirmed in the CoE. I'm sure that Harry and his family probably contributed to part of the reason. A lot of adults grow up exposed to different faiths and never formally commit themselves to one until reasons and opportunities present themselves.

 

[KittyAtlanta]

RUDOLPH, That may be so, but I prefer to hope that her decision to walk through this open and welcoming door to the faith offers Meghan a spiritual journey that I hope will enhance her life. She did not have to do this and I see it as a conciliatory act, not to be questioned by anyone.

 

[Mirabel]

Thanks for sharing. I'm sure that was part of it. However, Meghan herself would also have to feel deeply about wanting to make this commitment in her own heart. It can't just be a gesture of respect alone.

Sure it could.
She might be a person who simply doesn't care that much about which church she attends.
Lots of people aren't committed to any particular faith and consider one as good as another.

This might be due to Meghan's upbringing; her father belonged to one church, her mother to a different one, and the school she attended to a third.
It doesn't seem strange if she has no special attachment to any.

 

[Ish]

Let’s not overthink it. She’s not exactly a Charlie Church. She got baptised and confirmed because of Harry and his grandmother.

I agree completely. I just don’t get why people act like this is a bad thing.

 

[Mbruno]

That would be a pretty poor reason to become baptized and confirmed into a Church IMO (because you respect the Queen etc)...it should not really have anything to do with how others view you or how you want to show something...but your relationship to Christ and His teachings.


LaRae

Tell that to all royal brides/grooms who changed their religious denomination to conform to the religion of the Royal Family they were joining (for example, Queen Astrid of Belgium; Queen Sofia of Spain; Queen Anne-Marie of Greece; Prince Henrik, Crown Princess Mary and Princess Marie of Denmark, etc.)

 

[Osipi]

When we look at the facts, we know that Meghan was not, in any way, required to join, be baptized and confirmed in the Church of England. It was something she *chose* to do of her own free will. Whatever her reasons for doing so remain her own private reasons.

 

[renzii]

As a Roman Catholic, children are generally baptised at, or some time after birth with at least 2 sponsors/godparents who are supposed to ensure that the child is taught and learns to follow the tenets of our faith. They are then introduced to the sacrament of Holy Commuion at 7 after a period of learning. Confirmation follows as a teen, when one is expected to be able to make those promises of faith, originally agreed to by ones's parents and godparents, for yourself.
Adults who are converting, may do all three at once after a period of study.

 

[Zonk]

We can also add Autumn Phillips to the list as someone who converted.

Meghan could have decided to join the Anglican Church because of Harry and the Queen, or she could have attended a service and for lack of a better phrase and don't think I am demeaning the conversion, she could have had a come to Jesus moment and decided to do something because she decided to commit to Christ.

IMO religion is a personal decision and up to the individual and they shouldn't have to defend or explain their decision to anyone.

 

[Pranter]

Tell that to all royal brides/grooms who changed their religious denomination to conform to the religion of the Royal Family they were joining (for example, Queen Astrid of Belgium; Queen Sofia of Spain; Queen Anne-Marie of Greece; Prince Henrik, Crown Princess Mary and Princess Marie of Denmark, etc.)

I have said similar statements when this has happened.


LaRae

 

[O-H Anglophile]

as a christian, we baptise and then prepare for communion and prepare for confirmation separately. these are important steps of faith, each requiring a lot of preparation and commitment and consideration of each step. to give you an idea, one prepares for 2 years for communion, and about 1 year for confirmation. so to see that meghan was baptised and confirmed on the same day, with both activities done one followed by another as if it were a laundry list makes me for one disappointed but also makes it appear as if this was something that 'had to be done' as a future member of the RF that she will be rather than as the commitment / devotion that the media is reporting.

In the Roman Catholic faith, First Communion classes last around 6-7 months and include instruction for the Sacrament of Reconciliation. These are generally weekly one hour classes for children.
The same for Confirmation, but for teenagers.

As an adult, I'm sure Meghan was able to learn what she needed quickly. She seems like an intelligent woman.

 

[wyevale]

TBH being a member of the Church of England doesn't exactly DEMAND a 'conversion on the road to Damascus' ! A more laid back, laissez faire denomination is hard to imagine, [and I say that as a communicant member since childhood].

I love it less since they mucked about modernising the Liturgy, and dropping one of the immortal classics of English Literature ['the Book of Common Prayer'], but nevertheless, a more tolerant and kind hearted set of people i've never encountered..

 

[Denville]

Tell that to all royal brides/grooms who changed their religious denomination to conform to the religion of the Royal Family they were joining (for example, Queen Astrid of Belgium; Queen Sofia of Spain; Queen Anne-Marie of Greece; Prince Henrik, Crown Princess Mary and Princess Marie of Denmark, etc.)

They changed their denomination, whihc is not the same thing at all....

 

[Mbruno]

They changed their denomination, whihc is not the same thing at all....

What about Queen Noor, who became a Muslim ?

As pointed out by other posters, although Meghan was not baptized, she probably had some previous exposure to the Christian faith, not least because her father is Episcopalian and she attended a Catholic school. So, I don't think that joining the CoE was such a radical "conversion" for her (like Ivanka Trump becoming Jewish or Queen Noor embracing Islam for example).

 

[MARG]

There are so many reasons for Meghan to make a decision to be Baptised and into the CofE. Initially, it could have to be able to share the experience with Harry and to understand what was happening and why at the many Public services the BRF find themselves attending and honour his grandmother,

Confirmation though is a very personal decision and since she joined the church as an adult her decision takes on a deeper meaning. In the ordinary event of things, baptism takes place as a baby and around thirteen, those who wish to go on and be confirmed start classes in the faith and if the Vicar considers you ready, are Confirmed.

Megan's instructor wasn't a Vicar but rather the Archbishop of Canterbury, Justin Welby, which means she had one on one discussion on the CofE from the Reformation on and has become well versed in the faith. I do not believe the Baptism and Confirmation would have taken place quite so soon unless Meghan had made a personal profession of faith for no other reason that neither were prerequisites for marriage.

Since we don't see any services in which the members of the BRF take Communion in public, Confirmation is not essential but it leads me to believe that Harry does attend Communion Services along with other family members and practices his faith and that may very well be something else she wanted to understand and they can share.

 

[Lady Reem]

Meghan had an African American friend on campus whose parents were pastors and lived locally. She’d spend her weekends attending their church services during her university years. Obviously she also had her catholic schooling, and there’s the fact of her parents christian background. Meghan was not in no-man’s land, in terms of christianity before her baptism. She was not the ‘other’ as some would like to paint her. So, some people get baptised in childhood, it doesn’t necessarily mean they lead a christian life later on as adults. I have seen mean and unchristian attitudes online towards her from a lot of supposedly christian-bred people.

 

[Lady Reem]

They changed their denomination, whihc is not the same thing at all....

They still changed , switched, in order to fit in with the royal families they were marrying into. Meghan is of the Protestant denomination via her parents. She attended a christian school as a youngster, and attended church services at university. So same difference.


Her inner circle in Canada where she lived and worked for quite a while are so discreet and haven’t discussed her but it’s possible she did attend church services, knowing her background.

She has not converted from a different religion to another, let’s be clear here. And anyway there is nothing wrong with switching religions in my eyes. Everyone has their own belief system and I wouldn’t cast aspersions.

Some christians are baptised as babies, some in adolescence, and some as adults. Being baptised as a baby wouldn’t make you more of a christian than those getting it done later in life.

 

[XeniaCasaraghi]

It is incredibly unlikely that Meghan is joining the Church of England because she has a newfound belief in its teachings that just happens to coincide with her relationship with Harry. It is a lot more likely that she recognizes the church as being important to Harry’s family, and realizes that there are a lot of activities that will involve the Church of England in her future and has come to a logical conclusion that joining the church will enable her to be more involved and/or more comfortable in these activities.

Many people convert to a religion because of their significant other. It’s probably less common now in a world where (in the West at least) religion plays a smaller role, but it still happens. Meghan is not unique in this.

The church of England is a denomination not a whole new religion. They all hold the same big belief in Jesus as the Lord and savior. It's not like she is converting to Islam or Hinduism. I concur that Meghan's religious background gives the impression that she is an open thinker when it comes to faith and the different denominations. The fact that one parent was Episcopalian (Protestant?) but they sent her to Catholic School gives the impression that they aren't too rigid when it comes to worship.

 

[Somebody]

Meghan may have been familiar with Christianity from a young age. The fact that her parents decided not to have her baptized (nor dedicated - which would be normal practice in churches where they practice believer's baptism -, most likely) means that she was not of 'the protestant denomination'. Instead her parents got married at a yoga-related religious place (as I learned today), so it is more likely that she grew up in that kind of environment.

While I don't think the difference is necessarily much bigger for her than for other royals who changed from one denomination to another (it does matter which denominations we are talking about; from one protestant to another is less of a change (I do it every few years - whenever we move) than from protestant to catholic or orthodox), there is little evidence that her parents intended to raise her as a Christian. They were clearly fine with her attending a Christian school, so culturally she got a good background but the fact that she only got baptized and confirmed this week suggests that the upcoming wedding is the primary reason (or at least catalyst - just like Catherine got confirmed the month before her wedding) for becoming Anglican.

 

[caethi]

as a christian, we baptise and then prepare for communion and prepare for confirmation separately. these are important steps of faith, each requiring a lot of preparation and commitment and consideration of each step. to give you an idea, one prepares for 2 years for communion, and about 1 year for confirmation. so to see that meghan was baptised and confirmed on the same day, with both activities done one followed by another as if it were a laundry list makes me for one disappointed but also makes it appear as if this was something that 'had to be done' as a future member of the RF that she will be rather than as the commitment / devotion that the media is reporting.

In the Catholic tradition, when adults are baptised, it is very common for confirmation to immediately follow. These sacraments are often part of the Easter Vigil service. When a person is baptized as an infant, it makes sense to be confirmed several years later when one is able to understand the faith and make a commitment to it. An adult can prepare for baptism and confirmation at the same time. And...maybe her story is that she is emotionally and psychologically ready to participate in and commit to a particular religious tradition. We don't know. But it's a good thing.

 

[jacqui24]

I have no issues with people saying Meghan marrying Harry is the catalyst for her to be baptized and confirmed. However, to question a person’s faith simply based on that and judge her for it in a negative way makes me quite uncomfortable. And quite frankly, none of us here have had discussions regarding faith with Meghan. The Archbishop of Canterbury has and he has in the past said this is devoted couple, both to each other and spiritually. Given his position and faith, I can safely take his words as credible. And to me, that’s the end of the discussion.

Now what did the Bible say about judging others?

 

[Dalriada]

It would be extremely naive not to consider the faith of anyone who marries into the inner circle of the royal family as their faith has always been questioned in law for centuries to guard against the monarchy turning Roman Catholic. Only in 2013 The Succession to the Crown act also ended the historical disqualification of a person who married a Roman Catholic from the line of succession, and removed the requirement of those outside the first six persons in ...
Prince Harry’s grandmother and head of the family as monarch has important and distinct constitutional relationships with the Established Churches of England and Scotland, dating back to the sixteenth and seventeenth centuries and she holds the distinctive title ‘Defender-of the Faith’ originally granted to Henry Vlll by the Pope. Faith has been quite a public issue for Prince Harry’s family.