Meghan Markle: Citizenship and Religious Conversion

[Osipi]

Another way to look at this from the Queen's viewpoint. If HM approved Parliament's passing the amendment to the Act of Succession in 2013 that not only allows the first born child to become heir to the throne regardless of gender but also allows for those in the line of succession to marry a Roman Catholic should they wish to, why would the Queen then be adamant that her grandson *only* marry a woman that has been baptized and confirmed in the Church of England. It just doesn't make sense.

The Queen's approval for Harry to marry has absolutely nothing to do with religion. It has to do with HM's role as monarch. He may have had some problems getting consent if he came asking to marry the sister of Bashar Hafez al-Assad, for example. He could have asked and gotten consent to marry Meghan if she was a practicing Buddhist, or be an atheist or whatever spiritual path she chooses to follow. As has been stated, the Church of England itself finds no reason why these two should not marry. The Queen has given her consent as Harry's monarch and obviously the families on both sides are overjoyed with the engagement.

Whatever Meghan does or doesn't do as far as her joining the Church of England is her own decision. No one else has any impact on that.

[Rudolph]

Except I didn’t say most Britons. I said eyebrows would be raised and they would.

If Meghan said I want a big church wedding, say my vows before God but you know what, I don’t want to be baptised or confirmed. I’m sure The Queen would give her the side eye.

So for me either Meghan Markle has had some religious epiphany and now wants to be baptised or people have had a word. I know what I believe.

[jacqui24]

Originally Posted by Rudolph

Except I didn’t say most Britons. I said eyebrows would be raised and they would.

If Meghan said I want a big church wedding, say my vows before God but you know what, I don’t want to be baptised or confirmed. I’m sure The Queen would give her the side eye.

So for me either Meghan Markle has had some religious epiphany and now wants to be baptised or people have had a word. I know what I believe.

We can assume the Queen gives the side eye as much as we want. That's still far way off from they CAN'T. The truth is there is nothing preventing it. If whoever officiates feels comfortable, I doubt the Queen is going to pipe up and put a stop to it.

[Gaudete]

Originally Posted by Rudolph

Except I didn’t say most Britons. I said eyebrows would be raised and they would.

So for me either Meghan Markle has had some religious epiphany and now wants to be baptised or people have had a word. I know what I believe.

Your original post said:

How many eyebrows would have been raised not least by The Queen if Meghan didn’t get baptised.

This is a royal wedding. I know times are changing but they haven’t changed that much.

My post was intended to demonstrate that times have indeed changed that much. Religion in the UK is very different today than it was just twenty years ago and if Meghan had said she had wanted a big church wedding without baptism or confirmation it would not only have been possible but the vast majority wouldn't have thought twice about it. The Queen, perhaps. But I don't presume to know what the Queen thinks.

[Osipi]

Originally Posted by Rudolph

If Meghan said I want a big church wedding, say my vows before God but you know what, I don’t want to be baptised or confirmed. I’m sure The Queen would give her the side eye.

I disagree. We could take your sentence and add into it that not only does she not wish to be baptized and confirmed but also add in that she was converting to the Roman Catholic church and the marriage *still* would have gotten the Queen's approval and blessing and the Church of England allow the marriage to take place in whichever CoE church they wanted it to be in.

[Rudolph]

Harry doesn’t need the approval of the ‘vast majority’ , he needs the approval of his deeply religious grandmother.

People can scoff and no doubt they do but The Queen takes it seriously.

[ladongas]

Originally Posted by Rudolph

.....

So for me either Meghan Markle has had some religious epiphany and now wants to be baptised or people have had a word. I know what I believe.

Many of us who had given little thought to religion prior to committing to marriage and future parenthood did have a bit of an epiphany when we gave consideration to our future. We saw the connection between G-d’s love for us and our love for the future we and our family would share.

And Meghan is 36 years old. Women that age don’t need ‘people to have a word’ with us in order to make a serious decision.

[Rudolph]

Presumably Meghan was serious about her first marriage. She didn’t need religion then but along comes Prince Harry who’s grandmother is Supreme Governor of the Church of England and voila, Meghan is getting baptised and confirmed.

As they would say on Seinfeld, that’s a big coincidence. And like I said, I know what I believe.

[Zaira]

The Queen seems to take the stance to live and let live with her family. If Meghan simply identifies as Christian and didn’t feel the need to join the COE why would it matter if she had a big church wedding? As it were, it’s all moot since she is having a big church wedding and is getting confirmed. Further, she seems to have a strong background in faith given her education and her charitable commitments so this is hardly coming out of nowhere. Even if she isn’t a pious practicing Christian (and given that no one else in the family seems to be besides the Queen and Charles supposedly), why care about if she is or is not confirmed? How is that a marker of her spiritual sincereity?In America, denominations are much more fluid as others have mentioned and folks move around a lot over the course of their lives between different traditions and confirmed or re baptized or never baptized but still take faith seriously. Meghan being confirmed in the COE literally doesn’t bat most people’s eyes.

I feel like some posters on here are trying to insinuate a negative out of her decision to be confirmed or insinuate she isn’t really committed and only doing it to save face. Maybe that is true but maybe it isn’t. Regardless, many people get confirmed for cultural reasons versus spiritual. Not sure why this is being so dragged out...

[Nice Nofret]

there was a man Henry de Navarra who said: Paris is worth a mass .... -

[Gaudete]

It amazes me that people who have never met someone can decide how sincere they are in their religious convictions. Very strange.

[Rudolph]

Originally Posted by Nice Nofret

there was a man Henry de Navarra who said: Paris is worth a mass .... -

And getting married to a Prince is worth a baptism

[Gaudete]

Originally Posted by Rudolph

And getting married to a Prince is worth a baptism

The Prince of Wales is known to attend services in the Orthodox tradition. The Duchess of Kent and Princess Michael are practicing Roman Catholics. I have never seen any evidence to suggest that Prince Harry attends church on a weekly basis. I think if the Queen demanded absolutely unswerving loyalty to the Church of England as Henry VIII once did, we’d have seen consequences of it by now. Unless you know something about Her Majesty’s rigid religious scruples we don’t.

[jacqui24]

Originally Posted by Rudolph

And getting married to a Prince is worth a baptism

And no one is saying it isn't if it's what is wanted. We are just disputing the she needs to do this in order to be a member of BRF or marry in church. She doesn't.

[Somebody]

Meghan knows perfectly well that she is marrying into the BRF whose head is also the head of the Church of England. So, it might be said that this decision is completely hers but that ignores the fact that context matters. Her choice isn't made in a vacuum.

Had Harry NOT been a prominent member of the BRF, she might have made a different decision: for example, a church wedding because of Harry's Anglican background without necessarily Meghan being baptized and confirmed as well. Or they might have considered that they would like future children to be baptized and that's why they decide that it would be best if Meghan also becomes an official church member (before or after marriage).

All in all, imo it is Meghan's decision - as I don't think she would do it against her will - but her decision is influenced by the unique circumstances she is in.

[jacqui24]

Originally Posted by Somebody

Meghan knows perfectly well that she is marrying into the BRF whose head is also the head of the Church of England. So, it might be said that this decision is completely hers but that ignores the fact that context matters. Her choice isn't made in a vacuum.

Had Harry NOT been a prominent member of the BRF, she might have made a different decision: for example, a church wedding because of Harry's Anglican background without necessarily Meghan being baptized and confirmed as well. Or they might have considered that they would like future children to be baptized and that's why they decide that it would be best if Meghan also becomes an official church member (before or after marriage).

All in all, imo it is Meghan's decision - as I don't think she would do it against her will - but her decision is influenced by the unique circumstances she is in.

I absolutely agree that she's made certain decision based on the fact that Harry is who he is and she's going to have a prominent public role as his wife. However, she still had a choice. She could've taken a different route and it still would work. Does her decision on this make certain things easier in terms of managing public reaction? Yes, but not the only way. But some earlier posts made it seem like the Queen made her list of demands in order to give permission for a church wedding is simply ludicrous. It fact, it was flat out stated by some that Meghan didn't have a choice but to do so.

[Rudolph]

Had she chose not to get baptised The Queen would may have still granted permission on the condition it was a civil ceremony. No point having a big religious ceremony if she wasn’t willing to get baptised. I think she made that clear when she granted permission. That’s my opinion

[Gaudete]

Originally Posted by Rudolph

Had she chose not to get baptised The Queen would may have still granted permission on the condition it was a civil ceremony. No point having a big religious ceremony if she wasn’t willing to get baptised. I think she made that clear when she granted permission. That’s my opinion

This simply isn’t true. You’re entitled to your opinion but it doesn’t change the fact that Meghan does not need baptism or confirmation to marry in an Anglican Church.

[Princess Squirrel]

Originally Posted by Rudolph

Had she chose not to get baptised The Queen would may have still granted permission on the condition it was a civil ceremony. No point having a big religious ceremony if she wasn’t willing to get baptised. I think she made that clear when she granted permission. That’s my opinion

Tell me, do you think our Queen also blackmailed Sophie and Autumn? Mike Tindall? All had church weddings, not civil.

[Rudolph]

Originally Posted by Gaudete

This simply isn’t true. You’re entitled to your opinion but it doesn’t change the fact that Meghan does not need baptism or confirmation to marry in an Anglican Church.

The Queen can set it as a condition for Harry. He needs her permission before the marriage can take place in the first place

If Harry was Joe Bloggs it wouldn’t matter but The Queen has standards.