Meghan Markle: Citizenship and Religious Conversion

[MichelleQ2]

Does anyone know how Princess Grace handled this situation?

[loonytick]

Originally Posted by MichelleQ2

Does anyone know how Princess Grace handled this situation?

Princess Grace reportedly paid a $2 million dowry, so even before you start looking at taxes it was a very different financial situation.

[jacqui24]

Originally Posted by MichelleQ2

Does anyone know how Princess Grace handled this situation?

Different time. Different tax laws. Prince Albert did renounce his US citizenship when he was 21 I believe.

Originally Posted by wyevale

This entire 'can of worms' will be avoided if the Lady simply retains her US citizenship until her UK citizenship is granted, and then gives up her US passport.

I hear some howling 'but she IS American'... YES, the World knows this, and it will always know that that was where she was born, and brought up...

I agree that's the sensible thing for her to do. And speaking as American, I'd absolutely not be upset if she does renounce. From an accountant perspective, I'd breath a sigh of relief for her. However, this won't take care of the entire situation. Any children born to her before she renounces is going to have US citizenship. They won't be able to renounce until they are of age. If, anytime before then, they are set up with some trust fund from grandparents or great grandparents, that could mean they'd have to file US tax returns as children too. And I don't think there are official confirmations, but the non-direct line children in the royal family have the in past been set up with something at some point when they are little right? Especially as part of an inheritance.

[tihkon2]

Originally Posted by jacqui24

If any future children is set up with a trust, they'll have to file US tax returns as well. Just because they are underage, doesn't mean they don't have to file tax return.

Sorry Jacqui24

I meant to say, I'm going on the assumption that Meghan will give up her US citizenship once she attains British Citizenship. And then that their (possible) children will decide what's what at the appropriate age.

No matter what the law, I would guess that we won't be seeing underage Princes and Princesses of The United Kingdom paying US income tax. Something will be worked out. It'd be amusing watching the IRS try to do it though. :-)

[texankitcat]

Originally Posted by wyevale

This entire 'can of worms' will be avoided if the Lady simply retains her US citizenship until her UK citizenship is granted, and then gives up her US passport.

I hear some howling 'but she IS American'... YES, the World knows this, and it will always know that that was where she was born, and brought up...

I find the whole debate of her retaining her American citizenship once she is married into the Royal family to be a bit ridiculous. She was born American and will always be American whether she is a British citizen or not. That is who she is and will always be. By maintaining her American citizenship wouldn’t she stil be able to vote in US elections and wouldn’t that be a concern? Along with the tax issues and children’s citizenship, etc....wouldn’t it be simplify matters all around ifshe give up her American citizenship rather than open up this can of worms which may backfire on the RF. They already have so much scrutiny on their finances etc.., from the British public. Just saying.....

[Somebody]

Originally Posted by wyevale

This entire 'can of worms' will be avoided if the Lady simply retains her US citizenship until her UK citizenship is granted, and then gives up her US passport.

I hear some howling 'but she IS American'... YES, the World knows this, and it will always know that that was where she was born, and brought up...

Not completely - it is an issue until she has UK citizenship. The only way it could be avoided is if she would give it up before marriage and apparently that is not the route they are going to take. To me it would make much more sense if they would go that route (waving the '3 years' requirement) and grant her British citizenship on or before her marriage into the BRF. As was also done for Máxima and Stephanie (not sure about Mary and Marie; anyone?); so yes, of course she will be criticized but it will be for one or the other... She undoubtedly is in a different position - and would they really prefer an American to represent the BRF instead of a British citizen?

Moreover, would they have children before she renounces her US citizenship, her children will be American citizens at least for the first 18 years of their lives - which might include paying taxes as was pointed out.

Edit: Looks like both Mary and Marie gave up their original citizenships (Australian & British; and French, respectively) upon marriage - I assume that means the procedure for obtaining Danish citizenship was fast-tracked.
Edit 2: For both Mary and Marie a special law was passed by which they received Danish citizenship upon marriage.

[loonytick]

Originally Posted by texankitcat

I find the whole debate of her retaining her American citizenship once she is married into the Royal family to be a bit ridiculous. She was born American and will always be American whether she is a British citizen or not. That is who she is and will always be. By maintaining her American citizenship wouldn’t she stil be able to vote in US elections and wouldn’t that be a concern? Along with the tax issues and children’s citizenship, etc....wouldn’t it be simplify matters all around ifshe give up her American citizenship rather than open up this can of worms which may backfire on the RF. They already have so much scrutiny on their finances etc.., from the British public. Just saying.....

I agree. I really can't see any upside (and a world of downside!) to her keeping her US citizenship.

[Somebody]

The three-year path:

The 3 year route
Alternatively, if you are the spouse or civil partner of a British citizen you will be eligible to apply after 3 years in the UK. The residence requirements are as follows:
have lived in the UK for at least 3 years before the date of your application spent no more than 270 days outside the UK during those 3 years spent no more than 90 days outside the UK in the last 12 months been granted indefinite leave to remain or permanent residence not broken any immigration laws while in the UK

The Life in the UK test was already mentioned but Meghan's absences list would also be interesting: why were you abroad? Representing the Queen!

Absences
(...)
You are expected to insert:
the dates that you left the UK
the date your returned
where you went
your reason for going there; and
how many days you were absent

Source

[Lisele]

Originally Posted by loonytick

I agree. I really can't see any upside (and a world of downside!) to her keeping her US citizenship.

Thanks to everyone who weighed in on Meghan's US citizenship and taxes :) Like I said I was aware the US citizen's paid taxes to their home country and the country they work in but didn't factor in the children born in the interim.

Like many here, I'm surprised she wasn't fast tracked like HRH CP Mary, HM Queen Maxima, etc., ... or would that be an option somewhere down the road - possibly when she finds herself enceinte a year or two from now. Somehow, I have a feeling that HM The Queen would want her great-grandchildren from this union UK citizen's and not US. I could be wrong and obviously this is another topic for both H&M to tackle once they get there.

[jacqui24]

Originally Posted by Somebody

Not completely - it is an issue until she has UK citizenship. The only way it could be avoided is if she would give it up before marriage and apparently that is not the route they are going to take. To me it would make much more sense if they would go that route (waving the '3 years' requirement) and grant her British citizenship on or before her marriage into the BRF. As was also done for Máxima and Stephanie (not sure about Mary and Marie; anyone?); so yes, of course she will be criticized but it will be for one or the other... She undoubtedly is in a different position - and would they really prefer an American to represent the BRF instead of a British citizen?

Moreover, would they have children before she renounces her US citizenship, her children will be American citizens at least for the first 18 years of their lives - which might include paying taxes as was pointed out.

Edit: Looks like both Mary and Marie gave up their original citizenships (Australian & British; and French, respectively) upon marriage - I assume that means the procedure for obtaining Danish citizenship was fast-tracked.
Edit 2: For both Mary and Marie a special law was passed by which they received Danish citizenship upon marriage.

I completely agree with this. I know there are talks about the immigration tightening. But honestly, she is marrying into an institution that's a big part in the UK culture. It's just really eyebrow raising when someone that isn't a UK citizen is representing HMQ on foreign soil. And having heirs to the throne that could possibly need to disclose their financial assets to the US government is strange. Unless Cambridge has another baby before Charles becomes King, the first child Meghan and Harry have will need permission to marry by law. How is someone that's deemed important enough to need monarch's permission to marry so it doesn't damage the monarch disclosing their financial assets to a foreign government not a problem? Honestly, I wouldn't be surprised if once this story gains traction that they are criticized for having a member of the BRF that will be required to file US tax and disclosures.

And yes, Mary, Marie, and Alexandria were all fast tracked for citizenship when they married.

Originally Posted by Lisele

Thanks to everyone who weighed in on Meghan's US citizenship and taxes :) Like I said I was aware the US citizen's paid taxes to their home country and the country they work in but didn't factor in the children born in the interim.

Like many here, I'm surprised she wasn't fast tracked like HRH CP Mary, HM Queen Maxima, etc., ... or would that be an option somewhere down the road - possibly when she finds herself enceinte a year or two from now. Somehow, I have a feeling that HM The Queen would want her great-grandchildren from this union UK citizen's and not US. I could be wrong and obviously this is another topic for both H&M to tackle once they get there.

Honestly, fast tracking her citizenship and having her renounce US citizenship before their first child is only way to prevent it unless they wait 3 years after marriage. Given her age, I don't see them waiting three years. I know they are trying to follow the rules like normal people, but this is extenuating circumstances. The story started out in US, but Express has already picked it up. I don't think there is a way for them make a law about members of royal family automatically can't have foreign citizenship as it's up to US government to determine validity of US citizenship and procedures.

[Somebody]

Down the line (which could be within a year) they might want to use the 'we don't want their children to be US citizens' as an explanation for why she won't have to wait for 3 years before she is granted UK citizenship...

An interesting comparison might be princess Leonore, who is currently 8th in line to the Swedish throne (although it is debated whether she is meeting the requirements to stay in the line to the throne as she has only been living in Sweden for a very short time - and 'needs to grow up in Sweden' to keep her position) and is also a US citizen. Her younger brother Nicholas (and future sibling after birth) might also have US citizenship through their father who holds both American (through his father) and British (through his mother) citizenship.

[loonytick]

I was just over at the UK government website reading up on citizenship, and the regulations say things like 3 or 5 years residency is "usually" required and that the rules about time spent in the country can be waived under "special circumstances."

I suspect that marrying an HRH and the potential for future royal children to be born with dual citizenship if they don't fast track will be deemed to qualify as a "special circumstance" in which an exception is made.

[jacqui24]

Originally Posted by loonytick

I suspect that marrying an HRH and the potential for future royal children to be born with dual citizenship if they don't fast track will be deemed to qualify as a "special circumstance" in which an exception is made.

I think the fact that your marriage had to receive the Queen's permission should qualify.

[Osipi]

What really tickles me is that should Meghan retain her US citizenship, we'll have a British royal princess that is eligible to vote in US elections.

Somehow, I don't see that going over too well.

[Ish]

If the plan is for Meghan to give up her US citizenship down the line (which I would expect), then I wouldn’t be surprised if they’re just following the official process for now, but intend on expediting things if/when it becomes an issue.

It’s not an issue yet, as Meghan is going to have to do US (and Canadian) taxes for 2017 regardless of her citizenship status. Depending on how she and Harry handle their finances/expenses it may not be a huge issue, really, until she gets pregnant. If that happens before Meghan’s been a resident for 3 years, then I could see them quickly expediting her citizenship... but if it takes longer they may not need to expedite things.

After all, why rush it and potentially create controversy if it’s (at this time) not a huge problem?

[Stefanie]

If I was Meghan I' d wait how things develop first after the wedding before I' d rush into giving up US citizenship

[xenobia]

Originally Posted by Stefanie

If I was Meghan I' d wait how things develop first after the wedding before I' d rush into giving up US citizenship

What do you mean with "how things develop"?
She can't give up her US citizenship until she's got a UK citizenship. She simply can't be without a citizenship. When she's brittish, we'll see if she decides to have dual citizenship. Probably not, is my guess.

[texankitcat]

Originally Posted by Stefanie

If I was Meghan I' d wait how things develop first after the wedding before I' d rush into giving up US citizenship

I doubt she is thinking in those terms. She is a mature woman who obviously is very focused and determined in her committment to what she believes in and knows her own mind. She is committing her life to Prince Harry and the Royal family and that comes with many sacrifices and rewards. I don’t see her taking that on lightly or carelessly. She is going to be amazing although I am sure there will be challenges while she adjusts.

[Skippy]

Originally Posted by xenobia

What do you mean with "how things develop"?
She can't give up her US citizenship until she's got a UK citizenship. She simply can't be without a citizenship. When she's brittish, we'll see if she decides to have dual citizenship. Probably not, is my guess.

I believe that Stefanie implies that Meghan might grow wary of British Royal life after the wedding and when she has renounced her US citizenship there is no way back for her > she's trapped.

I believe that Meghan is going into this with a full mind and a full heart. She will be supporting Harry all the way, today already showed it. They really worked as a team, while he is the leader (position-wise, as she will be entering the family).

[jacqui24]

Originally Posted by Skippy

I believe that Meghan is going into this with a full mind and a full heart. She will be supporting Harry all the way, today already showed it. They really worked as a team, while he is the leader (position-wise, as she will be entering the family).

THIS. I know some people joked online that if people didn't know, they'd think Meghan is the royal. They intend to compliment Meghan, but honestly my take on it is Harry is comfortable letting his wife to be be herself and take the lead as she is comfortable. But if she ever stumble, not that there is any indication she is incapable of handling herself, he'd be there to back her up. That to me is the essence of a confident man. He's secure enough about himself to letting the woman he loves shine.