Harry and Meghan: Tour of Southern Africa - September 23-October 2, 2019

[HighGoalHighDreams]

Originally Posted by Madame Verseau

I would like to see Archie but on the Sussexes' terms. I've seen news stories that Archie's appearance is "key" to the tour's success. How Harry and Meghan approach their engagements is key.

As someone who has absolutely no interest in seeing an appearance by Archie (solely because I have no interest in appearances by royal babies, regardless of who they are), I respectfully disagree with your perspective, Madame Verseau. If there is a shortage of sightings of Archie on this tour, that will be the only thing reported and remembered about the tour. They can have the best engagements in the world, but the point of engagements is to bring awareness to causes. If the narrative turns into something else, the, well, "engagement" of the causes is just not there.

[Curryong]

I don't think anyone is saying that they want Archie bouncing on Meghan's hip as she is greeting crowds or in a knapsack peeking over Harry's shoulder when he's making a speech.

However I am old enough to remember the first Royal baby who was taken on tour with his parents, William in Australasia in 1983. A photo opportunity of parents and baby was provided, all of them sitting on a rug with a couple of toys for William. It didn't dominate that tour by any means, but it still attracted attention as a very sweet and pleasant occasion.

[Ista]

I actually won't be that surprised if we don't see any clear photos of Archie, although it would be nice if we did. I think this was discussed further upthread.

[Countessmeout]

I have a feeling the most we may see him is when they arrive. He will be younger then George was when he went to Australia and he accompanied his parents to an event.

[JR76]

Originally Posted by Countessmeout

I have a feeling the most we may see him is when they arrive. He will be younger then George was when he went to Australia and he accompanied his parents to an event.

Hasn't it been known that there won't be a photo-op at the arrival? Also given how all the British reporters are stuck at Heathrow we'll be lucky to get any pics at all if they don't get there in time.

[Gawin]

Here's how Harry and Meghan will fly to South Africa

https://www.cnn.com/travel/article/h...ial/index.html

[Cocoasneeze]

Originally Posted by HighGoalHighDreams

As someone who has absolutely no interest in seeing an appearance by Archie (solely because I have no interest in appearances by royal babies, regardless of who they are), I respectfully disagree with your perspective, Madame Verseau. If there is a shortage of sightings of Archie on this tour, that will be the only thing reported and remembered about the tour. They can have the best engagements in the world, but the point of engagements is to bring awareness to causes. If the narrative turns into something else, the, well, "engagement" of the causes is just not there.

If the tour "success" depends on the sightings and photo ops of a 4 month old baby, then that's REALLY weird. Babies aren't robots or machines, and it can very well be, that Archie is in a cranky mood, cries a lot during this tour. He's also not a working royal, he is just a 4 month old child. The tour success simply cannot be based on how many times Archie is going to be seen.

[Durham]

So happy they're meeting Desmond Tutu. One of those people who always make me smile. Lovely man.

Can't wait for the pictures.

[Princess Larisa]

I have always believed that the quickest and easiest course of action is to do a family arrival with photos. That way the baby photos can be reported right away, no one is wondering and waiting to see the baby, no one keeps asking about the baby and a baby sighting doesn’t interrupt other engagement reporting during the tour. It’s over and done with and the baby doesn’t have to be seen until going home. It also makes for a positive, happy beginning for a tour.

Unfortunately, the Sussexes have decided on no media coverage for arrivals or departures, so I’m sure the reporters will be whining about seeing Archie all the time.
I expect there is an embargoed engagement planed where they might bring Archie.

[ACO]

I don’t need to see Archie. I’m good with them just posting a picture from a private engagement. Though I’m sure there will be at least one moment. Rumor has it will be a The rhino sanctuary that Harry visited a few years ago.

[Heavs]

We don't know why they aren't doing arrival photos, there could be many reasons beyond personal choice, they certainly didn't mind doing them on both of the other tours they've done.

Unfortunately I suspect there will be a lot of whining in the press until we see Archie (since he'll get the most clicks etc).

[Ista]

I think this is one of the biggest downsides to them trying to draw a large circle of privacy around Archie. At this point, he's this Super Secret baby, so of course "will we see him?" is a huge question, and yes, runs the risk of overshadowing everything else the Sussexes are in SA to do. I agree that arrival photos would have been the quick and easy way to short-circuit that, but as we have discussed before, there may very well be good reasons for the private arrival and departure. It is unusual, though, so of course it is going to draw a lot of commentary.

Edited to add: And, since Meghan has shown she is not at all averse to being separated from him, it might have been wiser to have left Archie at home, and for Meghan to have flown home at the end of her published appearances on day 3 or 4.

[Princess Larisa]

If it was me I would have published a new close-up photo of Archie this week with a statement ‘’due to his age there will be no photo opportunities with the baby during the tour’’. But, to my eternal sorrow, I’m not a royal

Originally Posted by Ista

Edited to add: And, since Meghan has shown she is not at all averse to being separated from him, it might have been wiser to have left Archie at home, and for Meghan to have flown home at the end of her published appearances on day 3 or 4.

I agree, I think it would have been easier for everyone to have 3-4 days in SAR together and then Meghan going home and Harry continuing the solo part of the tour. When they announced the timetable I thought Meghan was breastfeeding and wrongly assumed she was unable or unwilling to leave Archie for a few days. But, this is her first baby and she probably had no idea how things would be once he was born.

I have to admit this split schedule has never made sense to me. If Archie is going wouldn’t it be better to do 4 days in SAR all together and then Meghan and Archie fly home and Harry does the rest of the tour alone. I assume they’re flying commercial for this so it makes no difference when Meghan goes home.
It wouldn’t be the first time, Camilla has gone home before Charles when on tour before.

[Osipi]

Correct me please if I'm wrong here but I think I remember it being said that the arrival would not be a public one due to security concerns and hence no pictures will be taken.

As for seeing Archie, to be honest, he is not the focus of this tour. If we do get to see him, it will be an added bonus. The entire tour has its specific itinerary and the engagements and appearances have all been planned out for s purpose. The main focus of the tour is what Harry and Meghan are there to do in their official capacity. Those we'll see a lot of picture of and I sincerely wish that the reports coming from this tour are mainly focused on why they're there in the first place.

As for leaving Archie or taking him with them, I trust Harry and Meghan, as his parents, to know what is best for the child and act accordingly. These are two very hands on parents and they are the ones that know Archie and his needs and his moods the best.

[Countessmeout]

I think this is one of the biggest downsides to them trying to draw a large circle of privacy around Archie. At this point, he's this Super Secret baby, so of course "will we see him?" is a huge question, and yes, runs the risk of overshadowing everything else the Sussexes are in SA to do. I agree that arrival photos would have been the quick and easy way to short-circuit that, but as we have discussed before, there may very well be good reasons for the private arrival and departure. It is unusual, though, so of course it is going to draw a lot of commentary.

Edited to add: And, since Meghan has shown she is not at all averse to being separated from him, it might have been wiser to have left Archie at home, and for Meghan to have flown home at the end of her published appearances on day 3 or 4.

Meghan is involved in 6 of the 10 days of the four. The first 4 and the last 2. She is simply not accompanying him to the middle section. If Archie wasnt with them, she could very well have accompanied Harry on all 10 days.

There is a big difference between going to a wedding for 48 hours on the same continent, and being away from the baby for 10 days on different continents. When she went to tennis Archie was home with his dad.

[Ista]

Originally Posted by Osipi

Correct me please if I'm wrong here but I think I remember it being said that the arrival would not be a public one due to security concerns and hence no pictures will be taken.

My recollection is that there was speculation on this board that there might be security concerns, but that was never confirmed. If that has changed, I would appreciate someone posting the link.

[Madame Verseau]

Meghan is to give a speech on gender violence

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...nce-Harry.html

[ACO]

Well there is a lot going on in SA right now violence wise. Maybe having their arrival and departure public knowledge isn’t something they want? No idea but the non arrival images was told in advance.

As for Archie... I think people will complain either way. No way they were leaving him this early for almost 2 weeks. Also Meghan has her own engagements with some embargoed per the correspondents. Most are private to not take attention from Harry’s solo engagements.

[Zaira]

Originally Posted by Ista

My recollection is that there was speculation on this board that there might be security concerns, but that was never confirmed. If that has changed, I would appreciate someone posting the link.

Its worth noting that they also didn't do an official welcome and plane photo op in Australia either, so I actually dont think it has anything to do with Archie and is maybe more of a logistics thing or timing thing. Idk.

[MARG]

Originally Posted by Curryong

I don't think anyone is saying that they want Archie bouncing on Meghan's hip as she is greeting crowds or in a knapsack peeking over Harry's shoulder when he's making a speech.

However, I am old enough to remember the first Royal baby who was taken on tour with his parents, William in Australasia in 1983. A photo opportunity of parents and baby was provided, all of them sitting on a rug with a couple of toys for William. It didn't dominate that tour by any means, but it still attracted attention as a very sweet and pleasant occasion.

I remember that too, it was on the lawn at Government House and it was a strictly controlled photocall. If H&M could arrange something along those lines it would be nice but it's not a dealbreaker. Since they have not announced where the Sussexes will be staying, I can only assume it is pro-active security.

The idea of an arrival photo would be fine with just H&M however the media circus that seems to follow the Sussexes is beyond crazy and to subject such a young baby to the full impact of the photographer's flashes would be harmful to his vision and the psychological impact would be a great unknown. What is known is that it would be a form of child abuse or endangerment.