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  #941  
Old 02-04-2020, 01:08 PM
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Originally Posted by _Heather_ View Post
I see what you're saying here. I don't agree. But I do understand. However, Thomas Markle has behaved abominably and shows no signs of changing that behavior. No one should be blackmailed and manipulated into "fixing" a relationship with someone like that. That said, Mr. Markle is very much in a place where he simply has nothing left to lose so no matter what they do regarding their relationship with him he'll always do whatever he thinks will come out best for him and keep him in the limelight and continuing to cash in. The situation with Mr. Markle is a no-win and always will be. However, I do believe that this lawsuit was a mistake and was more lashing out than logical. The outcome remains to be seen and I certainly see no reason for them to attempt to "fix" or build a relationship with Thomas Markle but I don't foresee this lawsuit being the driving force for British media changes that they seem to want to believe it will be.
I think the changes they want are frankly indicative of an increasingly narcissistic time A controlling of the narrative and only giving stories to those that are sympathic. A media that will also present you in a positive light. Trump has tried it and today so did the British government and all the journalists walked out.

A country without a questioning media is totalitarian.

In my opinion that is dangerous and reminiscent of despots and dictators. But it is a sign of our times where people.cannot be criticised at all and this is increasingly worrying.

I don't know what they think they will change. People used to chased ino car chases, hacked, family and friends selling them out. It has all changed. There are three big tabloids left and they rarely write anything of substance about royalty or famous people anymore just a load of buff pieces, like hundreds about how Meghan and Kate hate eachother. Who cares.
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  #942  
Old 02-04-2020, 01:38 PM
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Originally Posted by BaiSoSo View Post
Harry said it well "I will not be bullied into playing a game that killed my mother."

And yet Harry's mother was playing games with the media until the day she died. Harry ignores that fact when invoking his mother. She wanted to use the press when it suited her, but she wanted to control them. That doesn't work.

Just a few examples--

Diana conspired with Andrew Morton for the book.

Diana called Richard Kay frequently, the last time a few hours before she died.

Interesting article about Diana and paparazzi that last summer--
https://www.nytimes.com/1997/09/06/w...lity-tale.html
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  #943  
Old 02-04-2020, 01:46 PM
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Originally Posted by poppy7 View Post
I think the changes they want are frankly indicative of an increasingly narcissistic time A controlling of the narrative and only giving stories to those that are sympathic. A media that will also present you in a positive light. Trump has tried it and today so did the British government and all the journalists walked out.

A country without a questioning media is totalitarian.

In my opinion that is dangerous and reminiscent of despots and dictators. But it is a sign of our times where people.cannot be criticised at all and this is increasingly worrying.

I don't know what they think they will change. People used to chased ino car chases, hacked, family and friends selling them out. It has all changed. There are three big tabloids left and they rarely write anything of substance about royalty or famous people anymore just a load of buff pieces, like hundreds about how Meghan and Kate hate eachother. Who cares.
I don't see them saying they don't want to be criticized or saying they won't work with media. They will. That comes with life. That said I don't blame them for not wanting to be accused of terrorism because they decided to help Muslim woman in their time of need. Or see their child likened to an chimp or have their privacy breached. That is their right. People don't have to agree. That is also a right.
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  #944  
Old 02-04-2020, 01:55 PM
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Originally Posted by ACO View Post
I don't see them saying they don't want to be criticized or saying they won't work with media. They will. That comes with life. That said I don't blame them for not wanting to be accused of terrorism because they decided to help Muslim woman in their time of need. Or see their child likened to an chimp or have their privacy breached. That is their right. People don't have to agree. That is also a right.
Except that is not how Harry came across in the documentary and other recent comments. He seems to be against all media at the moment, with only stories he issues seeing the light of day.

I agree some of the stories were wretched, but criticize those stories, not the media as a whole.
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  #945  
Old 02-04-2020, 01:57 PM
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Originally Posted by O-H Anglophile View Post
Except that is not how Harry came across in the documentary and other recent comments. He seems to be against all media at the moment, with only stories he issues seeing the light of day.

I agree some of the stories were wretched, but criticize those stories, not the media as a whole.
Is that the Africa Documentary?
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  #946  
Old 02-04-2020, 02:01 PM
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Originally Posted by ACO View Post
I don't see them saying they don't want to be criticized or saying they won't work with media. They will. That comes with life. That said I don't blame them for not wanting to be accused of terrorism because they decided to help Muslim woman in their time of need. Or see their child likened to an chimp or have their privacy breached. That is their right. People don't have to agree. That is also a right.
It is all over their website and wanting to control who they give stories too. It is in everything they do.

Some stories were awful but if you want to ban RRs which are basically the kindergarten teachers of the media. Then that tells another story. Tenacious journalists do not become royal reporters. Smily, happy, posh ones do.
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  #947  
Old 02-04-2020, 02:15 PM
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Originally Posted by BaiSoSo View Post
Because they violated her copyright laws...again no one is holding the media accountable for their actions which is why they feel comfortable doing things such as hacking phones, publishing private letters, blackmailing people into getting in contact with them or sharing their medical records. If they don't put boundaries on the media they will continue to inch forward taking more and more...heck some of the tv shows were basically saying the public own Meghan/Archie.

The couple has made it known they are not here for the media games Harry said it well "I will not be bullied into playing a game that killed my mother."

Her father BEING a liar doesn't stop the media from using him against Meghan. He flat out admitted that he lied to PM and a week later they had him on the show again.

What does US law have to do with anything?

As for twitter there is also a lot of support for the Sussexes so take it for what it is.

Printing a letter the recipient gave you is different than hacking someone's phone.


As others are pointing out Diana played games with the media as well. She wanted them to come take her picture when it benefited her but she didn't want negative publicity. No one has that not even the queen.


Twitter is a US company so if they decided to sue they'd have to do it in a US court. Or if they decided to get the posters banned.


Also US laws have something to do with it because they want their charities open in the US and they are going to be demanding the same sort of arrangement out of them - only good publicity and only what they printed.


The US media is kinder than the British media but that won't work in the US either.


As for Meghan's father they would have been better off dealing with him before the wedding. She herself said on her site prior to meeting Harry that she had a close relationship with him. It wasn't always strained.


They're making it harder on themselves. And they don't need to.
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  #948  
Old 02-04-2020, 02:26 PM
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Originally Posted by QueenMathilde View Post
Printing a letter the recipient gave you is different than hacking someone's phone.


As others are pointing out Diana played games with the media as well. She wanted them to come take her picture when it benefited her but she didn't want negative publicity. No one has that not even the queen.


Twitter is a US company so if they decided to sue they'd have to do it in a US court. Or if they decided to get the posters banned.


Also US laws have something to do with it because they want their charities open in the US and they are going to be demanding the same sort of arrangement out of them - only good publicity and only what they printed.


The US media is kinder than the British media but that won't work in the US either.


As for Meghan's father they would have been better off dealing with him before the wedding. She herself said on her site prior to meeting Harry that she had a close relationship with him. It wasn't always strained.


They're making it harder on themselves. And they don't need to.
I think her relationship with her father began to crumble after her engagement. I don't think he's a vert nice man but I think she should have gone to see him, and perhaps been more helpful to him in terms of helping him deal with the media. Cos I don't think he was able to for it nor was he able to go to England to her wedding. but now its too late. He's not a very stable man, he seems to feels aggrieved and if she goes on with a case that involves him, he's going to get more difficult. Of course she should not put up with every unfair story.. overt racism or invasion of privacy, she should fight those ones. But there are limits and pursuing court cases on other issue, only makes the stories last longer.
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  #949  
Old 02-04-2020, 02:58 PM
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Originally Posted by Denville View Post
I think her relationship with her father began to crumble after her engagement. I don't think he's a vert nice man but I think she should have gone to see him, and perhaps been more helpful to him in terms of helping him deal with the media. Cos I don't think he was able to for it nor was he able to go to England to her wedding. but now its too late. He's not a very stable man, he seems to feels aggrieved and if she goes on with a case that involves him, he's going to get more difficult. Of course she should not put up with every unfair story.. overt racism or invasion of privacy, she should fight those ones. But there are limits and pursuing court cases on other issue, only makes the stories last longer.



Well I don't think she'll be able to get along with (or get rid of) the father now. I don't understand the point in aggravating the father in the first place. The cast of Married With Children said they remember him picking her up from school and bringing her to work and they said they got along fine. She also praised him on her blog so the relationship only got strained when she got engaged.



Sure he sold pictures to the media but the pictures were no big deal. They should have done for him what they did for Doria and sent someone from the palace to help him.
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  #950  
Old 02-04-2020, 03:01 PM
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Originally Posted by QueenMathilde View Post
Well I don't think she'll be able to get along with (or get rid of) the father now. I don't understand the point in aggravating the father in the first place. The cast of Married With Children said they remember him picking her up from school and bringing her to work and they said they got along fine. She also praised him on her blog so the relationship only got strained when she got engaged.



Sure he sold pictures to the media but the pictures were no big deal. They should have done for him what they did for Doria and sent someone from the palace to help him.
He seems to have been a recluse, with money problems.. at the time before she got engaged.. Perhaps he was slipping into mental stress and problems and felt that she should help him. Maybe she had good reason for not helping him.. he may be hopeless with money but I think she didn't give him that much of a chance... It is sad, as while he's not as good a parent as her mother I think he did try to do his best when she was a kid.
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  #951  
Old 02-04-2020, 03:03 PM
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Originally Posted by poppy7 View Post
It is all over their website and wanting to control who they give stories too. It is in everything they do.

Some stories were awful but if you want to ban RRs which are basically the kindergarten teachers of the media. Then that tells another story. Tenacious journalists do not become royal reporters. Smily, happy, posh ones do.
The same RRs who used threatening language to not cover them? I mean we literally have some of these individuals retweeting nasty troll accounts who are openly racist. I counted at least 3 who had to "apologize" for it once called out. So my concern of their lack of coverage is nonexistent. And frankly if they that open about and others have seen it, I can imagine so have the Sussexes (or their team).

But again they will not be working royals so they don't need to be part of the rota. That is not them saying they will not interact with media. Of course they will. I just see them doing more things like where they had military media covering one of their final engagements because they were covering families of the military.

That is not controlling the media. As we see they still write their stories. No one banning them from print.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Denville View Post
I think her relationship with her father began to crumble after her engagement. I don't think he's a vert nice man but I think she should have gone to see him, and perhaps been more helpful to him in terms of helping him deal with the media. Cos I don't think he was able to for it nor was he able to go to England to her wedding. but now its too late. He's not a very stable man, he seems to feels aggrieved and if she goes on with a case that involves him, he's going to get more difficult. Of course she should not put up with every unfair story.. overt racism or invasion of privacy, she should fight those ones. But there are limits and pursuing court cases on other issue, only makes the stories last longer.
Honestly no one knows their relationship. We don't know when it crumbled. It could have been loooong before that and honestly I suspect it was. People are so quick to say a child needs to be there for a parent (and vice versa) without know the why people have walked away. It is not easy and usually when people are estranged it not something down lightly. Add the fact of how public this is and how easier it would be for her to just do what the public opinion apparently think she needs to do (without having a clue), and the fact she continues ignore his antics.... maybe that should tell you something.

The fact this man never met Harry and apparently also never met her ex boyfriend and barely had a relationship with her ex husband gives me somewhat of a clue about her relationship with her father in her adult years. People keep wanting to go back to how close they were when she was a child but again we don't know the full story there either and by his actions it seems a lot of him is "you owe me and I made you who you are." and growing up with that is hardly fun. You can love someone and still need to be away from them.

Meghan has one lawsuit. She did pick her battle and it is this one. It does involve her father. Heck, maybe she is making a point. No one knows. But the court will decide in the end.
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  #952  
Old 02-04-2020, 03:16 PM
Serene Highness
 
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Originally Posted by ACO View Post
The same RRs who used threatening language to not cover them? I mean we literally have some of these individuals retweeting nasty troll accounts who are openly racist. I counted at least 3 who had to "apologize" for it once called out. So my concern of their lack of coverage is nonexistent. And frankly if they that open about and others have seen it, I can imagine so have the Sussexes (or their team).

But again they will not be working royals so they don't need to be part of the rota. That is not them saying they will not interact with media. Of course they will. I just see them doing more things like where they had military media covering one of their final engagements because they were covering families of the military.

That is not controlling the media. As we see they still write their stories. No one banning them from print.
The royal Rota will not be covering them. You realise what they do? They go to an event and they sent one to cover it for all the organisations. It is a cost effective system. They just decided they hate them. The royal reporters cover a larger sphere and come from all over. They are meek journalists. This whole thing with the toxicity is ridiculous. Set Lynn Barber ňn them, then they would know about being hacked to pieces. If you are a public person you are open to all sorts. You need to decide how to deal with that but picking and choosing your battles would seem the best way for me.
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  #953  
Old 02-04-2020, 03:26 PM
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Yes... as I said. They will not be covering them. We agree. It is literally the same group of reporters at every event. The main ones most can name and point in a crowd. The royals know many of them well and from time to time give them exclusives.

They don't see themselves as meek journalist. I am sure they would be offended to be called such. I know know in particular seems himself on the level of an Anderson Cooper. Says as much himself. My point is they basically walked away from *that* group and they all know it and took offense.

People will see things differently. It is what it is. But it is pretty much done now so going around in circles about a moot point is kind of pointless. These people still write about them anyways. They just won't be up close.

But that really has nothing to do with this lawsuit as the rota rota is not being sued.
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  #954  
Old 02-04-2020, 03:32 PM
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Originally Posted by ACO View Post
Yes... as I said. They will not be covering them. We agree. It is literally the same group of reporters at every event. The main ones most can name and point in a crowd. The royals know many of them well and from time to time give them exclusives.

They don't see themselves as meek journalist. I am sure they would be offended to be called such. I know know in particular seems himself on the level of an Anderson Cooper. Says as much himself. My point is they basically walked away from *that* group and they all know it and took offense.

People will see things differently. It is what it is. But it is pretty much done now so going around in circles about a moot point is kind of pointless. These people still write about them anyways. They just won't be up close.

But that really has nothing to do with this lawsuit as the rota rota is not being sued.
Who is Anderson Cooper? That guy on CNN or something? I have only ever seen a SNL skit with him so think.

They would see themselves that way please. It's hysterical Harry dislikes them. Now when other journalists get involved it can be another story. Which is essentially what has happened with Harry and Meghan. It won't last. It will be Harry who next year.

Maybe a different type of journalist does it abroad but in England there is a 'type.'
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  #955  
Old 02-04-2020, 03:47 PM
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Originally Posted by O-H Anglophile View Post
And yet Harry's mother was playing games with the media until the day she died. Harry ignores that fact when invoking his mother. She wanted to use the press when it suited her, but she wanted to control them. That doesn't work.

Just a few examples--

Diana conspired with Andrew Morton for the book.

Diana called Richard Kay frequently, the last time a few hours before she died.

Interesting article about Diana and paparazzi that last summer--
https://www.nytimes.com/1997/09/06/w...lity-tale.html
And Harry said he isn't going down that route with his family.

Diana thought speaking to the media would help her, it didn't they just used each other and the game became deadly with Diana losing. Harry saw that and decided to limited access to his family and that has angered the media which is one of the reasons they degrade the couple and make up lies about them.

The media didn't either think he was serious or that they would fight back. Maintaining control over one's own life is important and probably another reason the Sussexes are proceeding with the lawsuit.
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  #956  
Old 02-04-2020, 05:42 PM
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Mr Markel has stated publicly that he was offered the same advice , help that Doria Markel was offered ; He declined , whether that was because he felt he could cope ,or because he had never met Harry who know's . i can only feel that if Meghan and Harry had offered the same courtesy of actually meeting Meghan's father as they did Doria , before his own brother revealed his address [and does that not say a lot about Markel family dynamics ], then a lot of the manipulation of Thomas Markel by media/ family could have been avoided .
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  #957  
Old 02-04-2020, 05:49 PM
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Originally Posted by BaiSoSo View Post
And Harry said he isn't going down that route with his family.

Diana thought speaking to the media would help her, it didn't they just used each other and the game became deadly with Diana losing. Harry saw that and decided to limited access to his family and that has angered the media which is one of the reasons they degrade the couple and make up lies about them.

The media didn't either think he was serious or that they would fight back. Maintaining control over one's own life is important and probably another reason the Sussexes are proceeding with the lawsuit.
There is an in between what Diana did with the press and the scorched earth policy Harry has adopted.
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  #958  
Old 02-04-2020, 06:12 PM
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I think things are going to get worse for Harry and Meghan not better. And they are making it worse for themselves. The "you go, girl!" group of celebrities she's surrounded herself with will make it worse too. We'll see.
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  #959  
Old 02-04-2020, 07:17 PM
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Originally Posted by poppy7 View Post
I think the changes they want are frankly indicative of an increasingly narcissistic time A controlling of the narrative and only giving stories to those that are sympathic. A media that will also present you in a positive light. Trump has tried it and today so did the British government and all the journalists walked out.

A country without a questioning media is totalitarian.

In my opinion that is dangerous and reminiscent of despots and dictators. But it is a sign of our times where people.cannot be criticised at all and this is increasingly worrying.

I don't know what they think they will change. People used to chased ino car chases, hacked, family and friends selling them out. It has all changed. There are three big tabloids left and they rarely write anything of substance about royalty or famous people anymore just a load of buff pieces, like hundreds about how Meghan and Kate hate eachother. Who cares.
It really disturbs me that Meghan and Harry want to cultivate their own little group of sycophantic, young media types - I agree with you. I think they’ll find out that they can’t control the uncontrollable. The media will still write what they want, and people will still think what they want. I honestly don’t think they are as savvy as they’d like us to think ....
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  #960  
Old 02-04-2020, 08:05 PM
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And they are free to write it. No one is stopping them.
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