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  #621  
Old 10-24-2019, 11:57 AM
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It is a fact that 'win or lose' this case will make not make one iota of difference to the way the Duke and Duchess are treated in the UK Press..
The endless Leveson Enquiry failed to make any real change, despite the millions spent and anguish dredged up by it..
NO journalist feels constrained by its findings, [that much is OBVIOUS] and no member of the Public sees any real difference in the tat purveyed by the Tabloid [and other] Press...
As noted above, no-one will benefit except Lawyers and [if the plaintiffs win], the charities to whom they award their winnings.
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  #622  
Old 10-24-2019, 12:00 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BaiSoSo View Post

The problem is the British media and the fact that there is no accountability.
But who is the British media a problem for?

> The British public? They can decide with their £ if they consider the media a problem.

> The wider BRF: Not really. There is a working relationship between the two sides, and there is a fair amount of give and take.

> H&M: Probably, because

a) H&M burnt their bridges with the media when their was so much goodwill surrounding the couple at the time of their wedding, and further, there was so much goodwill Harry himself had built up over the years; and

b) Based on Meghan's comments on the Bradby interview, she clearly pays far too much attention to what the press has to say!

Clearly these are my opinions, and not everybody may agree with them, but they are set out as I see them.
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  #623  
Old 10-24-2019, 12:02 PM
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The lawsuits have absolutely nothing to do with negative coverage in the press, and will have exactly zero effect on negative coverage in the press. They are worthwhile lawsuits, and it will be interesting to see whether or not the Sussexes prevail--I assume they have a very good chance of doing so, at least in Meghan's lawsuit for copyright infringement. I certainly hope so.

However, the fact that with all the irritation/anger/fury that Meghan and Harry may feel regarding the negative coverage in the press, that the only lawsuits that the Sussex lawyers were able to dig up were these two relatively narrowly targeted ones, one of which is in regard to events over a decade ago, is an implicit admission that there is nothing much that can be done about the day to day coverage in the media. So posters who are expecting either lawsuit to make any material difference in how the Sussexes are covered in UK media are not understanding how this all works.
  #624  
Old 10-24-2019, 12:03 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by texankitcat View Post
There isnít accountability in the US media either. This lawsuit wonít change a thing except help them feel better for taking action.
This has nothing to do with the US media (which has strengths and weaknesses)....the lawsuit has been brought against a British tabloid who violated copyright laws by publishing Meghan's letter. The other one is about a British tabloid that hacked Harry's and many other phones.

Quote:
Originally Posted by muriel View Post
But who is the British media a problem for?

> The British public? They can decide with their £ if they consider the media a problem.

> The wider BRF: Not really. There is a working relationship between the two sides, and there is a fair amount of give and take.

> H&M: Probably, because

a) H&M burnt their bridges with the media when their was so much goodwill surrounding the couple at the time of their wedding, and further, there was so much goodwill Harry himself had built up over the years; and

b) Based on Meghan's comments on the Bradby interview, she clearly pays far too much attention to what the press has to say!

Clearly these are my opinions, and not everybody may agree with them, but they are set out as I see them.
It's a problem for a lot of people...that's why the phone-hacking lawsuit includes several people. It is a problem for people who are forced to disclose their medical information under blackmail circumstances.

For Meghan and Harry.... it is a problem when the tabloids write false stories that lead gullible people to believe them and then reaction in over the top ways such as death threats.

Just because the fans or the general public don't see it all doesn't mean the actions of the British media/tabloids don't have negative impacts on people's lives and that behavior shouldn't be tolerated. Like Harry said....if you knew all that he knows you would probably act in a similar manner if it was your family.
  #625  
Old 10-24-2019, 12:23 PM
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I saw the Africa documentary and both Harry and Meghan specifically stated that the media were publishing stories that were not true. So they donít seem to object to the attention, they object to lies being published about them.
  #626  
Old 10-24-2019, 12:29 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ista View Post
The lawsuits have absolutely nothing to do with negative coverage in the press, and will have exactly zero effect on negative coverage in the press. They are worthwhile lawsuits, and it will be interesting to see whether or not the Sussexes prevail--I assume they have a very good chance of doing so, at least in Meghan's lawsuit for copyright infringement. I certainly hope so.

However, the fact that with all the irritation/anger/fury that Meghan and Harry may feel regarding the negative coverage in the press, that the only lawsuits that the Sussex lawyers were able to dig up were these two relatively narrowly targeted ones, one of which is in regard to events over a decade ago, is an implicit admission that there is nothing much that can be done about the day to day coverage in the media. So posters who are expecting either lawsuit to make any material difference in how the Sussexes are covered in UK media are not understanding how this all works.
100% agreed. Both lawsuits have merit and both are certainly win-able with some very worthwhile charities in line to benefit substantially. However, the only real impact this will have is that coverage of the Sussexes will be more relentless, more brutal, more unforgiving, and more negative than before. There's a very, very fine line to walk between accepting that as a public figure there will be things written about you that you don't like and deciding when something is serious enough and underhanded enough to warrant the scrutiny that litigation brings and I don't really believe that the Sussexes have found that balance yet. I think they're irritated, frustrated, hurt, and angered and are striking out because they can rather than because they've found that balance.
  #627  
Old 10-24-2019, 12:33 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BaiSoSo View Post
This has nothing to do with the US media (which has strengths and weaknesses)....the lawsuit has been brought against a British tabloid who violated copyright laws by publishing Meghan's letter. The other one is about a British tabloid that hacked Harry's and many other phones.
Lest we forget.....The British media wouldnít have the letter if Meghanís father hadnít sold....excuse me, graciously shared the letter with the media. I donít see a lawsuit being discussed in that direction. It doesnít excuse the media and it doesnít mean they arenít accountable for their actions, but letís not pretend that her fatherís actions didnít contribute to this debacle. No one seems to be holding him accountable.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Curbside View Post
I saw the Africa documentary and both Harry and Meghan specifically stated that the media were publishing stories that were not true. So they donít seem to object to the attention, they object to lies being published about them.
Imagine the media and tabloids publishing things that arenít true! Like we donít see that every day from the US to England and beyond? Every celebrity, politician, sports figure, Royal, etc.., has things said in media that arenít true, or denies things that are true. Either way, itís news for about day or two and then something else takes itís place.

They certainly are within their rights to bring lawsuits, but itís unrealistic to think this will change anything the media does. They will pay the penalty to the appropriate charity and make it all back with another sensational story. Itís a mere slap in the hand in the end.

Quote:
Originally Posted by muriel View Post
But who is the British media a problem for?

> The British public? They can decide with their £ if they consider the media a problem.

> The wider BRF: Not really. There is a working relationship between the two sides, and there is a fair amount of give and take.

> H&M: Probably, because

a) H&M burnt their bridges with the media when their was so much goodwill surrounding the couple at the time of their wedding, and further, there was so much goodwill Harry himself had built up over the years; and

b) Based on Meghan's comments on the Bradby interview, she clearly pays far too much attention to what the press has to say!

Clearly these are my opinions, and not everybody may agree with them, but they are set out as I see them.
Whole heartedly agree with all the above. Placing focus on family and work instead of obsessing over negative press would be a better use of their energy and time. You canít control what others think or say, only your reaction to it. Harry certainly knows better, but I think seeing his wife so upset is what is fueling this intense reaction and getting the better of his emotions when cooler head would serve him better.
  #628  
Old 10-24-2019, 01:13 PM
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At the end of the day, the Duke and Duchess are standing up for their rights, justice and their values. That’s all they can do. That’s enough. They’re not trying to control the media. They’re holding them accountable. Their aren’t the first of the family to do this and they won’t be the last.

Their lawyers and other legal teams are doing to work. In the meantime, the couple are fully focused on their duties and roles and work ahead.
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  #629  
Old 10-24-2019, 02:12 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JR76 View Post
According to most sources the Royal family is in general left alone by the media when out in private these days. The only ones who comes close to the paparazzi craziness of the 90s was Kate before the engagement and sometimes Beatrice during the worst days of the "holiday outrage". The last time I remember seeing pap pics of a royal was when Meghan and Harry was at that new age place in Windsor (?) earlier this year. There have been stories about photographers going after the Cambridge kids but the pictures we see published is most often those taken by private citizens and not by professionals.
As it stands now the big problem isn't pics being published but what's written. My view on this is to simply just not read it. Unfortunately Meghan and Harry have read it and are quite naturally very upset by what they see written about them.
It is true they have read it, so then why do they say they don't read the press, like they did in their engagement interview?

I have thought about the lawsuit by Meghan over the letter that was released. Since she sent it to her father, isn't it technically his? Therefore, he can release it. I don't agree with him releasing it, so please don't read that into what I am asking. I am legitimately trying to understand how the law would work in this case.
  #630  
Old 10-24-2019, 02:19 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by duchessrachel View Post
I have thought about the lawsuit by Meghan over the letter that was released. Since she sent it to her father, isn't it technically his? Therefore, he can release it. I don't agree with him releasing it, so please don't read that into what I am asking. I am legitimately trying to understand how the law would work in this case.
I've wondered this myself. Technically it belongs to him so it's his to give/sell/etc. However, she wrote it so the copywrite or implied copywrite would belong to her and if it was, in fact, altered so her words were not correctly put out there then it would infringe on her copywrite. I think, if I'm not mistaken, that this is the crux of that lawsuit. However, I'm no lawyer so I could be very, very much mistaken here.
  #631  
Old 10-24-2019, 02:25 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by _Heather_ View Post
I've wondered this myself. Technically it belongs to him so it's his to give/sell/etc. However, she wrote it so the copywrite or implied copywrite would belong to her and if it was, in fact, altered so her words were not correctly put out there then it would infringe on her copywrite. I think, if I'm not mistaken, that this is the crux of that lawsuit. However, I'm no lawyer so I could be very, very much mistaken here.
That's also how I've understood it. The heart of the matter will not be the publishing of the letter itself but the alleged altering of it's content in an attempt to discredit the writer. Like you I'm no lawyer so I could be equally at fault about this.
  #632  
Old 10-24-2019, 02:35 PM
duchessrachel's Avatar
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Quote:
Originally Posted by XeniaCasaraghi View Post
Yes that's exactly what all of us are saying....fantastic understanding of what is being said.



This right here. I'll use Kate as an example again, when those pictures of her in France came out I don't believe she (or William) released a statemt or video crying about how unfair it was to her and how violated she was! They took legal action, I believe there was perhaps one statement (I don't remember) then they moved on.
This whole thing with Meghan and Harry could have been avoided if they had just filed the lawsuits released a simple statement about the violation of the law and not put their hurt feelings into the ring.
I agree they should suck it up. They are Royals. In my opinion, the success of royalty is that traditionally the general public, those who love royalty, feel they are on a different plane, almost not human. They are supported by the public purse, so they should be quiet, show up to events, cut ribbons, honor the military, help the needy, wear their jewels so the public can ooh and ahh, and keep their mouths shut. Because of the "higher plane" they many associate with royalty and because they are exceptionally privileged and funded by the public purse, many feel they should suck it up when it comes to the press. I am not saying this public attitude is right, but it is what it is. Honestly, the press can make you or break you. It is not fair, but it is a fact. When royals began to act "human" like everyone else, they cease to be relevant. The thing that absolutely baffles me about Harry and Meghan's choice to do this documentary is did they really believe the press would not run with this? Did they really think that the press would focus on the work they did in Africa instead of the unwise comments they made? Are they that naive? File lawsuits against the press when they have lawfully done something wrong, but Harry especially should know that releasing highly emotional statements do not work. The highly emotional Panorama interview did not get his mother anywhere except divorced from Prince Charles. All she said in that interview accomplished nothing, and the Royal Family enjoys some of the greatest popularity that is has ever had today.

Quote:
Originally Posted by sophie25 View Post
Was it not reported a couple of months ago that H and M have indeed recruited a Hollywood PR firm to advise them over Palace courtiers? I remember even reading the name of the firm but I can't recall it now.
I read that. If that is true, why would BP allow them to do that? Should they use the PR people that BP would recommend, which I have a hard time believing would be this one?
  #633  
Old 10-24-2019, 02:41 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by duchessrachel View Post
I read that. If that is true, why would BP allow them to do that? Should they use the PR people that BP would recommend, which I have a hard time believing would be this one?
I suspect that as long as it was paid for with their own personal bank accounts rather than the public funds they receive then BP might not really get to tell them they can't use the new firm. However, I suspect that BP might be making their feelings more than clear about the direction that new firm appears to be leading them in.
  #634  
Old 10-24-2019, 02:46 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by _Heather_ View Post
I suspect that as long as it was paid for with their own personal bank accounts rather than the public funds they receive then BP might not really get to tell them they can't use the new firm. However, I suspect that BP might be making their feelings more than clear about the direction that new firm appears to be leading them in.
I hope BP is doing this. I think that for hose who work for the Firm, the Firm should be able to tell them what they can and cannot do, specifically when it comes to PR since bad PR for one member of the royl family affects the whole family. But, it probably does not totally work this way.
  #635  
Old 10-24-2019, 02:55 PM
hel hel is offline
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I think the problem is not the lawsuit but the deep enmity and loathing that Harry feels for the press. Acting out of anger and hostility is rarely a good idea, especially when it leads you to paint with broad brush strokes.

I was listening to an interview the other day with a member of the media and he spoke about how hostile Harry routinely is to the press. All the press. Others have written about how Harry doesn't distinguish between paparazzi and someone like Arthur Edwards, or between a credentialed reporter and a drone in a content factory at the Mail Online. And he blames all reporters for the actions of any of them.

That's not to his credit, and it makes him look unreasonable, even when taking reasonable actions like the lawsuits.
  #636  
Old 10-24-2019, 03:03 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by duchessrachel View Post
I agree they should suck it up. They are Royals. In my opinion, the success of royalty is that traditionally the general public, those who love royalty, feel they are on a different plane, almost not human. They are supported by the public purse, so they should be quiet, show up to events, cut ribbons, honor the military, help the needy, wear their jewels so the public can ooh and ahh, and keep their mouths shut. Because of the "higher plane" they many associate with royalty and because they are exceptionally privileged and funded by the public purse, many feel they should suck it up when it comes to the press. I am not saying this public attitude is right, but it is what it is. Honestly, the press can make you or break you. It is not fair, but it is a fact. When royals began to act "human" like everyone else, they cease to be relevant. The thing that absolutely baffles me about Harry and Meghan's choice to do this documentary is did they really believe the press would not run with this? Did they really think that the press would focus on the work they did in Africa instead of the unwise comments they made? Are they that naive? File lawsuits against the press when they have lawfully done something wrong, but Harry especially should know that releasing highly emotional statements do not work. The highly emotional Panorama interview did not get his mother anywhere except divorced from Prince Charles. All she said in that interview accomplished nothing, and the Royal Family enjoys some of the greatest popularity that is has ever had today.

Duchess Rachel, you have put your perspective very nicely. Reminded me of the way I used to post a few years ago, when was high in energy and enthusiasm. Keep going. Hoping to see many more
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  #637  
Old 10-24-2019, 03:04 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hel View Post
I think the problem is not the lawsuit but the deep enmity and loathing that Harry feels for the press. Acting out of anger and hostility is rarely a good idea, especially when it leads you to paint with broad brush strokes.

I was listening to an interview the other day with a member of the media and he spoke about how hostile Harry routinely is to the press. All the press. Others have written about how Harry doesn't distinguish between paparazzi and someone like Arthur Edwards, or between a credentialed reporter and a drone in a content factory at the Mail Online. And he blames all reporters for the actions of any of them.

That's not to his credit, and it makes him look unreasonable, even when taking reasonable actions like the lawsuits.
I heard the same interview. He of course is human, but when he is representing the Queen, he is expected to conduct himself in a professional manner with the press. The Royal Family serves at the pleasure of the Government and the people of the UK, and like it or not....the Royal Press Pack is part of that deal. Behaving like a petulant angry teenager isn't becoming to him as an adult or as a member of TRF.
  #638  
Old 10-24-2019, 03:50 PM
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  #639  
Old 10-24-2019, 04:24 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by texankitcat View Post
I heard the same interview. He of course is human, but when he is representing the Queen, he is expected to conduct himself in a professional manner with the press. The Royal Family serves at the pleasure of the Government and the people of the UK, and like it or not....the Royal Press Pack is part of that deal. Behaving like a petulant angry teenager isn't becoming to him as an adult or as a member of TRF.
Well if the press this is directed at would also behave professionally and responsibly none of this would be happening. No one likes to be lied about, especially in public. Itís hard for them to defend themselves because people, as you can read here and elsewhere, often feel they should just ďsuck it upĒ. If I were them I would be pissed of and extremely frustrated.

I also wonder what type of relationship these ďnewspapersĒ want to have with Harry and Meghan. You canít lie about people and then expect to have a good working relationship with them. It doesnít really work that way.
  #640  
Old 10-24-2019, 05:28 PM
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I really wish people would take the time to actually read the thread where folks have in detail discussed the basis of the lawsuit but there seems to be an influx of a certain type of poster lately.

In the UK, you own the copyright to your words regardless of if you physically own the letter or whatever that your words are on. It doesn't matter that Tom is in physical possesion of the letter. He only owns the physical letter, not it's contents. He was within his rights to show the physica letter to the reporter, but not to publish it. If the MoS wanted to run the letter, they had to ask Meghan's permission. They did not.

Not only did they not ask permission, they didn't give the palace a heads up or solicit comment from the palace--highly unusual and indicative of an understanding that they would face legal challenge.

In addition, Bylines has reported more information about the lawsuit including images that were filed with the briefing papers on behalf of the Duchess. The images show just HOW MUCH of the letter the DM cut (despite claims it was published in full by the paper). In addition, it lists other stories the DM ran based on false and intentionally inflammtory info.

https://bylinetimes.com/2019/10/24/m...tabloid-media/
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