General News about the Sussex Family, Part One: May 2019 - March 2020

[Betsypaige]

If the story is true, I'm glad that HM is being civil and is still opening family invitations to the Sussexes. I hope they get to go to Balmoral if the Coronavirus pandemic has settled down by then (which hopefully it should have, but who knows - some have said that it could resurge again later on in the year).

She'd never be anything less than civil; she's being extremely grandmotherly (though tough when she needs to be). During this whole thing, she has made it known to Harry and Meghan that they are loved by all and a part of their family; neither she nor Charles have indicated any resentment towards the Sussexes despite how everything has gone down. They've only ever wanted H and M's happiness, even if they were personally disappointed. It seems like Harry needs constant reassurance that no one was trying to push him aside, that he's still very much loved and valued......

 

[LadyGlendower]

Okay, I'll play! Im one member who was rather surprised that Meghan returned with Harry this month. And I think at some point I stated that I thought she would never return to the UK.

I think that she/they need or want something and that their grand plans are in tatters.

So pile on me---tell me "i told you so" about her returning. You will still from me.

Their antics have become so cringeworthy that the only thing that still interests me is their legal battle with the DM (it is interesting litigation).

 

[Denville]

If the story is true, I'm glad that HM is being civil and is still opening family invitations to the Sussexes. I hope they get to go to Balmoral if the Coronavirus pandemic has settled down by then (which hopefully it should have, but who knows - some have said that it could resurge again later on in the year).

Of course she is being "civil". Harry is her grandson and she loves him, and she may not get that many more chances of seeing him or Archie.

Okay, I'll play! Im one member who was rather surprised that Meghan returned with Harry this month. And I think at some point I stated that I thought she would never return to the UK.

I think that she/they need or want something and that their grand plans are in tatters.

So pile on me---tell me "i told you so" about her returning. You will still from me.

Their antics have become so cringeworthy that the only thing that still interests me is their legal battle with the DM (it is interesting litigation).

I am sure that it was unlikely that she would literally never return. They have charities here, they have to show wiling to keep up with their patronages, and there will be family visits. But I don't think she wanted to return for more than brief visits... They have not been gone very long and they were still within their time limit on being "royal workers" so they came back in March. And if they have trouble making a living in the US, who knows what may happen? But I don't believe it would be what Meg woud want....

 

[Gawin]

Okay, I'll play! Im one member who was rather surprised that Meghan returned with Harry this month. And I think at some point I stated that I thought she would never return to the UK.

I think that she/they need or want something and that their grand plans are in tatters.

So pile on me---tell me "i told you so" about her returning. You will still from me.

Their antics have become so cringeworthy that the only thing that still interests me is their legal battle with the DM (it is interesting litigation).

Thank you for your honesty & integrity! ?

I'm not happy with Harry and Meghan myself. I just don't subscribe to the evil-Meghan-who-destroys-everything-she-touches theory some members seem to hold. IMO she had a mistaken idea of what being a Royal is all about.

But I agree with you. I suspect Harry and Meghan are rethinking their plans. They lost their SussexRoyal brand and (as someone else pointed out) the Coronavirus scare might delay any plans they do have.

 

[Denville]

I believed she'd come for individual things..but I could see her not wanting to bring Archie on each visit. By the time of "Trooping", I expected she and H would be starting their career abroad.. I can't speak for all posters, I think she does not like the UK and does not want to live here again, but that does not preclude some visits.

 

[Betsypaige]

Okay, I'll play! Im one member who was rather surprised that Meghan returned with Harry this month. And I think at some point I stated that I thought she would never return to the UK.

I think that she/they need or want something and that their grand plans are in tatters.

So pile on me---tell me "i told you so" about her returning. You will still from me.

Their antics have become so cringeworthy that the only thing that still interests me is their legal battle with the DM (it is interesting litigation).

I think I was among the number that thought she might never return, but part of that was based on the fact that it seemed like she - and Harry - had turned their backs on the BRF completely. I now acknowledge that, while some of that was based on simple facts (the Africa interview, the January fiasco and attendant website statement nonsense), some of it was also sheer speculation.

I don’t quite know where Meghan truly stands on the BRF personally, but it’s Harry’s family, and he seems to blow hot and cold...perhaps because it seems lime he thinks they don’t understand him. That’s why these personal
visits - with his grandma, his father, are so important...

 

[Countessmeout]

What facts???

If you were taking Facts from the January fiasco they stated:
-they were keeping Frogmore as a family base for when they visited
-that they planned to continue to support their British patronages
-they planned for their son to know his British family and heritage

These were the facts. The African video spoke of frustration, not of a hatred for the country and plans to never return to the country ever again.

It was tabloid 'rumor' that fed into people thinking Meghan would boycott the country. And even had posters on here suggesting she would never allow the queen or Charles to see Archie again.

 

[sndral]

She'd never be anything less than civil; she's being extremely grandmotherly (though tough when she needs to be). During this whole thing, she has made it known to Harry and Meghan that they are loved by all and a part of their family; neither she nor Charles have indicated any resentment towards the Sussexes despite how everything has gone down. They've only ever wanted H and M's happiness, even if they were personally disappointed. It seems like Harry needs constant reassurance that no one was trying to push him aside, that he's still very much loved and valued......

I suspect the Queen has more insight into what Harry may feel and the forces driving him than any of us. She watched her younger sister struggle with the role of being the spare. She watched her second son struggle with the role of being the spare. She loved both of them, seemingly unconditionally, despite their trials and issues. I have no doubt that she loves Harry in much the same way and has a deeper understanding of why he’s taken this path based on her experience watching Margaret and Andrew trying to navigate similar positions.

 

[ACO]

I doubt if anyone believed she woud "never again set foot" in the UK.... She has got to come back at times.. and I said that she was a member of the queen's personal family.. but that's another matter to making a permanent return.

Quite a few stated so. Some very matter of factly. Clearly were wrong.

 

[Betsypaige]

What facts???

If you were taking Facts from the January fiasco they stated:
-they were keeping Frogmore as a family base for when they visited
-that they planned to continue to support their British patronages
-they planned for their son to know his British family and heritage

These were the facts. The African video spoke of frustration, not of a hatred for the country and plans to never return to the country ever again.

It was tabloid 'rumor' that fed into people thinking Meghan would boycott the country. And even had posters on here suggesting she would never allow the queen or Charles to see Archie again.

Did you really read my post? I said I believed that it seemed H and M had turned their backs on the BRF based on FACTS in the Africa interview (where she whined - against the backdrop of a continent struggling to survive - about not being supported) and the website/bombshell fiasco, where they were incredibly disrespectful to HM, Charles and the BRF in general. I admitted that I had been speculating at times - did you see that?

I think I was among the number that thought she might never return, but part of that was based on the fact that it seemed like she - and Harry - had turned their backs on the BRF completely. I now acknowledge that, while some of that was based on simple facts (the Africa interview, the January fiasco and attendant website statement nonsense), some of it was also sheer speculation.

Sndrl:

I suspect the Queen has more insight into what Harry may feel and the forces driving him than any of us. She watched her younger sister struggle with the role of being the spare. She watched her second son struggle with the role of being the spare. She loved both of them, seemingly unconditionally, despite their trials and issues. I have no doubt that she loves Harry in much the same way and has a deeper understanding of why he’s taken this path based on her experience watching Margaret and Andrew trying to navigate similar positions.

I agree completely, but I do also think his father and brother understand him more than he thinks. It seems to me that he sometimes lets his emotions get the best of him, and that he assumes decisions that they - and the Queen make - with regard to the Monarchy have anything to do their personal feelings about him (not being valued, etc.).

The problem with being the spare is that the heir has to spend a tremendous amount of time mentoring the future monarch, and so the poor younger sibling feels left out. If only the heir could spend some personal time with his or her son or daughter, maybe cut down on some engagements in order to do so. I agree with those who believe that a role needs to be created for the “spare”.

 

[Denville]

Did you really read my post? I said I believed that it seemed H and M had turned their backs on the BRF based on FACTS in the Africa interview





Sndrl:





The problem with being the spare is that the heir has to spend a tremendous amount of time mentoring the future monarch, and so the poor younger sibling feels left out. If only the heir could spend some personal time with his or her son or daughter, maybe cut down on some engagements in order to do so. I agree with those who believe that a role needs to be created for the “spare”.

there is a role for this particular "spare". As C has only 2 children and wants to keep things slim, he was very keen for him to be a full time royal and to have responsibility for the Commonwealth side of things. Charles is a workaholic and William has hinted that he wishes at times his father would slow down a bit, spend a bit more time with his grandchildren.. but Ch feels driven to work very hard. He wasn't great with the kids in early years because of the bad marriage but when Diana died I think he did try hard to make up for their losing her and to spend more time with them... Then they became adults and probably went through a phase of being busy with their own lives and not wanting Dad around. But he's tried his best, according to his lights to be there even if he's often busy. If Harry wants constant "well dones" after every thing he does... well.....

 

[Betsypaige]

there is a role for this particular "spare". As C has only 2 children and wants to keep things slim, he was very keen for him to be a full time royal and to have responsibility for the Commonwealth side of things. Charles is a workaholic and William has hinted that he wishes at times his father would slow down a bit, spend a bit more time with his grandchildren.. but Ch feels driven to work very hard. He wasn't great with the kids in early years because of the bad marriage but when Diana died I think he did try hard to make up for their losing her and to spend more time with them... Then they became adults and probably went through a phase of being busy with their own lives and not wanting Dad around. But he's tried his best, according to his lights to be there even if he's often busy. If Harry wants constant "well dones" after every thing he does... well.....

That’s true, there is a role for this spare - and I doubt that Charles hasn’t made that very clear to Harry. I was making the point in general, though.

 

[poppy7]

I suspect the Queen has more insight into what Harry may feel and the forces driving him than any of us. She watched her younger sister struggle with the role of being the spare. She watched her second son struggle with the role of being the spare. She loved both of them, seemingly unconditionally, despite their trials and issues. I have no doubt that she loves Harry in much the same way and has a deeper understanding of why he’s taken this path based on her experience watching Margaret and Andrew trying to navigate similar positions.

I am not quite sure, contrary to the Crown, that Margaret suffered a great deal being the spare. The people who knew her have said the Crown got that wrong. She suffered because I think she was personality wise a bit unsuited for it. Very bohemian and would have liked a freer life. She was also grander than all the others. She was rather like her uncle in some respects. Andrew I think yes in recent years been a little petulant. Harry has always felt quite constrained by the royal life and he got married and that just did not work out really. It is a great shame because for all that had been said, some of it probably true, Meghan is apparently always professional, prepared and impressive when she does events. It could have been so different and as time stretches on I am struggling to see how the media could be the ones to drive them out. It seems short sighted and bolting like. They were incredibly popular on events. But you know there were also aspects of being bulls in China shops. Even beginning with announcing her pregnancy to the family at Eugenie's wedding...if true a total faux pas. The tiara. The constant speaking true sources and on and on. But it could, have been different because she was good at events. Briefed, informed, charismatic. Sad really.

 

[Denville]

I media could be the ones to drive them out. It seems short sighted and bolting like. They were incredibly popular on events. But you know there were also aspects of being bulls in China shops. Even beginning with announcing her pregnancy to the family at Eugenie's wedding...if true a total faux pas. The tiara. The constant speaking true sources and on and on. But it could, have been different because she was good at events. Briefed, informed, charismatic. Sad really.

I don't have any sympathy for Margo or Andrew.... both of them were outrageously spoiled..
And Im half thinking that perhaps Harry is also spoiled.. I feel a bit sorry for him, but at times I feel that he is just bull headed and wanted out to go his own way. Well now he has it. And I don't think that Meghan's leaving is that sad.. I think she may have put on a good performance..but if she's not "happy and thriving", she was going to be difficult... THey wanted out, they have gotten out.. they have their own way as much as anyone can.... I feel a bit sorry for Charles, Will and the queen who have to pick up the pieces and fill the gap...

 

[poppy7]

I don't have any sympathy for Margo or Andrew.... both of them were outrageously spoiled..
And Im half thinking that perhaps Harry is also spoiled.. I feel a bit sorry for him, but at times I feel that he is just bull headed and wanted out to go his own way. Well now he has it. And I don't think that Meghan's leaving is that sad.. I think she may have put on a good performance..but if she's not "happy and thriving", she was going to be difficult... THey wanted out, they have gotten out.. they have their own way as much as anyone can.... I feel a bit sorry for Charles, Will and the queen who have to pick up the pieces and fill the gap...

I think they are all spoiled. Let's be honest. It comes out more in some though...Margaret, Andrew, David, Harry. And yes it is sad for the ones who have to fill the gaps and probably for some who saw their lives as different. But Meghan was good...but alas it seems only when performing. She didnt get the memomi

It is a life long performance.

 

[Denville]

I think they are all spoiled. Let's be honest. It comes out more in some though...Margaret, Andrew, David, Harry. And yes it is sad for the ones who have to fill the gaps and probably for some who saw their lives as different. But Meghan was good...but alas it seems only when performing. She didnt get the memomi

It is a life long performance.

I think Charles did go too easy on Will and Harry when they were kids, because of Di's death. He let them get away with too much.. However William seemed to mature a bit and while he is probably not that crazy about the burdens of Royal life he's accepted it... But Harry IMO didn't... I though that he had matured to an extent in latter years but Im starting to believe no.
I think with meghan being unhappy here it fed his original desire to get out. But he saw himself being a Park ranger somewhere, now he's a married man with a family and his wife clearly wants them to make a good living...

 

[poppy7]

I think Charles did go too easy on Will and Harry when they were kids, because of Di's death. He let them get away with too much.. However William seemed to mature a bit and while he is probably not that crazy about the burdens of Royal life he's accepted it... But Harry IMO didn't... I though that he had matured to an extent in latter years but Im starting to believe no.
I think with meghan being unhappy here it fed his original desire to get out. But he saw himself being a Park ranger somewhere, now he's a married man with a family and his wife clearly wants them to make a good living...

Harry never had a realistic opinion on what the other side looked like because while he bemoaned his position. He took full and hearthy advantages of the benefits. He could no more have been a park ranger than a doctor. He has always been dissatisfied with things and uneasy and I dont think it will change.

 

[Denville]

Harry never had a realistic opinion on what the other side looked like because while he bemoaned his position. He took full and hearthy advantages of the benefits. He could no more have been a park ranger than a doctor. He has always been dissatisfied with things and uneasy and I dont think it will change.

Precisely. I think that Charles spoiled him.. and he always seemed to me to have a more "outrageous" side than his brother had. Both of them were spoiled - both of them were rather Hooray Henries in youth.. but WIll gradually grew into a steady relationship with Kate.. and marriage and royal life... (IMO Harry could be more unpleasant at times.. but I thought he improved in the army).
And he was free and able to do what he liked within reason for a longer time than Will who had married life, and the oncoming of Royal life to steady him.
I think Harry dreamed at times of "freedom"... He has no idea what life's like outside the RF.. and though he talked about being a park ranger, I suspect he would never have left.. but Meghan's unhappiness and/or her desire to get out to have a freeer life nd make money (it could be boht) pushed Harry to leave. But he's not going to be a park ranger.. He will probably follow M's lead on what they should do to make a living...

 

[camelot23ca]

Well, from a marketing perspective: This is good advertisement for the Sussexes brand.

Yes. The level of visibility that Harry and Meghan have now is based entirely on their connection to the British Royal Family. I’ve not seen anything from either of them that would indicate they have the enormous amount of talent, intelligence and drive needed to maintain, or supersede, their current level of fame and opportunity without continuing to regularly remind the public of their royal connection.

So, they’ll be “just Harry is fine” and “just call me Meghan” except when they take to Instagram to show us previously unseen pictures of them with The Queen at their wedding to celebrate their own anniversary, or a new royal group shot from Archie’s christening to mark his birthday, etc.

And of course they’ll be at Trooping the Colour and at Balmoral most years, (with one or two of their chosen propagandists in tow to make sure everyone knows how caring and special in an undefinable way they’re being). They can’t let the royal tank run on empty.

 

[Denville]

Yes. The level of visibility that Harry and Meghan have now is based entirely on their connection to the British Royal Family. I’ve not seen anything from either of them that would indicate they have the enormous amount of talent, intelligence and drive needed to maintain, or supersede, their current level of fame and opportunity without continuing to regularly remind the public of their royal connection.

So, they’ll be “just Harry is fine” and “just call me Meghan” except when they take to Instagram to show us previously unseen pictures of them with The Queen at their wedding to celebrate their own anniversary, or a new royal group shot from Archie’s christening to mark his birthday, etc.

And of course they’ll be at Trooping the Colour and at Balmoral most years, (with one or two of their chosen propagandists in tow to make sure everyone knows how caring and special in an undefinable way they’re being). They can’t let the royal tank run on empty.

Are you saying that is why they will come home, botht of them, on a regular basis? To remind everyone of their royal connextions?

 

[Osipi]

I'm still of the opinion that what we're going to see is basically going to be the half in, half out that was originally their intent with the difference being that the Sussexes will no longer be actively working for the "Firm".

I think they will hold true to their words and spend a considerable amount of time in the UK at Frogmore Cottage while not only visiting and being part of Harry's family, but also staying true to their British charities and incentives that they already have in place.

I also cannot place blame or point a finger at either Harry or Meghan in
instigating this abrupt change. I do believe it was a decision made jointly by the both of them together as a couple. Neither of them were "coerced" or "influenced" by the other to make these decisions on their lives going into the future. I do think their methods were overly rash and not well thought out and the outcome was not what the Sussexes hoped to accomplish but that is something that they'll just have to live with.

We still do not have any kind of a glimmer into what their future endeavors in North America will involve and probably will not until after the cut off date of March 31st. It will be interesting to watch and see what their plans are and how they hope to incorporate it and what they hope to accomplish. I do think that whatever they do decide to do will reflect the "values upheld by the Queen" as they've stated in their intention.

Makes for interesting times to watch, see what develops and follow this couple as they begin their new lives. I'm looking forward to it. ?

 

[Denville]

I'm still of the opinion that what we're going to see is basically going to be the half in, half out that was originally their intent with the difference being that the Sussexes will no longer be actively working for the "Firm".

I think they will hold true to their words and spend a considerable amount of time in the UK at Frogmore Cottage while not only visiting and being part of Harry's family, but also staying true to their British charities and incentives that they already have in place.

I

W
Makes for interesting times to watch, see what develops and follow this couple as they begin their new lives. I'm looking forward to it. ?

How are they going to make enough money to live and pay their own expenses if they spend half their time in the UK doing charity engagements. Is Meghan relaly going to want to stay here for long periods of time? what about Arhcie, as he grows older... how will this work with his education?

 

[Osipi]

The answers to your questions and all the other questions we may have will be answered by one thing. Time.

We may see surprisingly different solutions than we've thought of. Thing is that right now *everything* is pure speculation and maybes. We just have to be patient and wait for some real concrete plans to be released into the public domain of what this couple's plans will entail.

Right now we're in a state of limbo where nothing factual is known. ?

 

[Betsypaige]

Precisely. I think that Charles spoiled him.. and he always seemed to me to have a more "outrageous" side than his brother had. Both of them were spoiled - both of them were rather Hooray Henries in youth.. but WIll gradually grew into a steady relationship with Kate.. and marriage and royal life... (IMO Harry could be more unpleasant at times.. but I thought he improved in the army).
And he was free and able to do what he liked within reason for a longer time than Will who had married life, and the oncoming of Royal life to steady him.
I think Harry dreamed at times of "freedom"... He has no idea what life's like outside the RF.. and though he talked about being a park ranger, I suspect he would never have left.. but Meghan's unhappiness and/or her desire to get out to have a freeer life nd make money (it could be boht) pushed Harry to leave. But he's not going to be a park ranger.. He will probably follow M's lead on what they should do to make a living...

You’ve said Charles spoiled William and Harry three times in this thread, so clearly you seem to blame him for any flaws they may have with regards to behavior. Any parent who loses their spouse or co-parent has a very difficult job, and Charles’ was made harder by the fact that he was/is the heir. Generally speaking, the boys have grown into fine men - obviously not perfect, but no one is.

Harry seems to be naive in many ways - perhaps not unexpectedly as he grew up in a Royal fishbowl (or he might see it as a gilded cage). I suspect his expectations of what life will be like outside of the BRF are out of whack with reality as he’s never lived a “real” life. Actually, his life I imagine will be even less than expected due to the Coronavirus. If he’d planned to earn money and make a living out of giving speeches, we’ll thats gone out the window for now.

On another note, I wonder if the BRF might take a page out of the Amish book. There’s a term called Rumspringa (“hopping around”) that describes a kind of freedom that Amish teenagers have (around 16) - a period in which they decode whether to join the Church.

Maybe when the younger Royals destined to be Working Royals become older, say 18-20, they can be granted some sort of freedom to live a more freer life, to decide what if they want to make commitments to the working Royal life. However, it wouldn’t be all fun and games. They’d have to work somewhere, perhaps have an internship, for the period of time.

purpose of Rumspringa

Contrary to belief, Amish parents do not “encourage” their youth to leave home and experiment with sinful behaviors—nor do they condone it. At the same time, there must be at least a semblance of free choice in the decision to become Amish. Amish parents may disapprove of their teens’ behaviors, but do not necessarily exercise authority to prevent some of those behaviors.



amish rumspringa youth group
Amish youth play volleyball at Sunday singings
Rumspringa, according to one Amishman who has studied numerous portrayals of the adolescent period, is a time when an Amish youth enters into a more formalized social world, interacting with others in his age group in a variety of settings.

Rather than an angst-filled period of existential choice, it is primarily “a time to find a marriage partner”. As opposed to a sinful exploration of the world, typical Rumspringa activities are much tamer. They may include attending church singings, participating in games and activities with one’s “buddy bunch” or “gang” and of course, dating.

 

[sndral]

I am not quite sure, contrary to the Crown, that Margaret suffered a great deal being the spare. The people who knew her have said the Crown got that wrong. She suffered because I think she was personality wise a bit unsuited for it. Very bohemian and would have liked a freer life. She was also grander than all the others. She was rather like her uncle in some respects. Andrew I think yes in recent years been a little petulant. Harry has always felt quite constrained by the royal life and he got married and that just did not work out really. It is a great shame because for all that had been said, some of it probably true, Meghan is apparently always professional, prepared and impressive when she does events. It could have been so different and as time stretches on I am struggling to see how the media could be the ones to drive them out. It seems short sighted and bolting like. They were incredibly popular on events. But you know there were also aspects of being bulls in China shops. Even beginning with announcing her pregnancy to the family at Eugenie's wedding...if true a total faux pas. The tiara. The constant speaking true sources and on and on. But it could, have been different because she was good at events. Briefed, informed, charismatic. Sad really.

I don’t think there was any issue w/ Meghan and her wedding tiara - there’s no credible source for that speculation IMO. Likewise the claims that she sought to overshadow Eugenie’s wedding, all of it utter click bait driven tabloid drivel, IMO.
My thoughts aren’t based on the series The Crown, as I haven’t actually watched it, rather, I have read a number of biographies about various members of the royal family. From what I read Margaret was very spoiled, especially by her father King George VI.
I know in British aristocratic circles the first born son is ‘different,’ they inherit the title & the estate, and that must be challenging to some siblings. It is the British way, but it seems so odd to me that by an accident of birth the first born son has a destiny mapped out for him and often the family fortune is his. The RF is different in that in aristocratic families the second son was expected to make his own way & had more freedom, whereas in the RF the second son is expected to forever play second fiddle to his elder brother, always give way to what big brother, the important one, wants, etc..
How successful the arrangement is seems to depend on the personalities involved, Princess Anne is a pragmatic sort and seems to do a magnificent job balancing her personal passion - horses, with supporting her mother and brother. But what would have happened if she had been told she couldn’t indulge her passion for horses & could only do Royal work? King George VI was shy and retiring and thus was happy to be a supporter to his brother David.
Prince Phillip struggled when the time came to give up his naval career & adjust to life supporting his wife so early, but he chose that role when he decided to marry then Princess Elizabeth. As I mentioned, Margaret & Andrew had their struggles.
Nevertheless, I wouldn’t be surprised to see some thawing of both Harry and William’s positions. Perhaps William will come to realize that yes, as future King, he gets the last word, but if he wants his brother to help ease his burden, he needs to bend a little. And perhaps Harry will realize that freedom has its’ price. We shall see.

 

[poppy7]

I don’t think there was any issue w/ Meghan and her wedding tiara - there’s no credible source for that speculation IMO. Likewise the claims that she sought to overshadow Eugenie’s wedding, all of it utter click bait driven tabloid drivel, IMO.
My thoughts aren’t based on the series The Crown, as I haven’t actually watched it, rather, I have read a number of biographies about various members of the royal family. From what I read Margaret was very spoiled, especially by her father King George VI.
I know in British aristocratic circles the first born son is ‘different,’ they inherit the title & the estate, and that must be challenging to some siblings. It is the British way, but it seems so odd to me that by an accident of birth the first born son has a destiny mapped out for him and often the family fortune is his. The RF is different in that in aristocratic families the second son was expected to make his own way & had more freedom, whereas in the RF the second son is expected to forever play second fiddle to his elder brother, always give way to what big brother, the important one, wants, etc..
How successful the arrangement is seems to depend on the personalities involved, Princess Anne is a pragmatic sort and seems to do a magnificent job balancing her personal passion - horses, with supporting her mother and brother. But what would have happened if she had been told she couldn’t indulge her passion for horses & could only do Royal work? King George VI was shy and retiring and thus was happy to be a supporter to his brother David.
Prince Phillip struggled when the time came to give up his naval career & adjust to life supporting his wife so early, but he chose that role when he decided to marry then Princess Elizabeth. As I mentioned, Margaret & Andrew had their struggles.
Nevertheless, I wouldn’t be surprised to see some thawing of both Harry and William’s positions. Perhaps William will come to realize that yes, as future King, he gets the last word, but if he wants his brother to help ease his burden, he needs to bend a little. And perhaps Harry will realize that freedom has its’ price. We shall see.

Spoilt yes but she didn't want to be Queen but my goodness she loved the life.

We will see with Harry but I fear he is one of lives malcontents.

 

[ACO]

Personally I don't think William and Harry were that different growing up. They were both spoiled, wild and obnoxiously privileged. We saw people who worked with them both in those years come out and say William was just as bad (maybe worse in some cases) but he was clearly more protected. And understandably so. Harry could be seen as a wreck. William could not be.

I also don't think they were nearly as close in recent years (and I mean pre Meghan) as people thought them to be. I feel it was mostly them putting on a show. They are brothers and they love each other but that doesn't mean they were thick as thieves.

That was the press and their interpretation because that sold. And they needed it to be. But the moment Harry was no longer the third wheel and had his own life.... funny how quick that brotherhood crumbled.

More like there was no longer a reason to fake it. That is how I see it anyways.

That all being said, these people are a family and those dynamics are complicated. Harry wanted out. He is gone. William could too but he also knows he doesn't have much of a choice and he accepted that a long time ago. Hard to know how things would be if the roles were reverse but that is what their accident of birth has dealt them.

Time heals and this current global crisis no doubt has put some other things in perspective.

 

[Denville]

You’ve said Charles spoiled William and Harry three times in this thread, so clearly you seem to blame him for any flaws they may have with regards to behavior. Any parent who loses their spouse or co-parent has a very difficult job, and Charles’ was made harder by the fact that he was/is the heir. Generally speaking, the boys have grown into fine men - obviously not perfect, but no one is.

Harry seems to be naive in many ways - perhaps not unexpectedly as he grew up in a Royal fishbowl (or he might see it as a gilded cage). I suspect his expectations of what life will be like outside of the BRF are out of whack with reality as he’s never lived a “real” life. Actually, his life I imagine will be even less than expected due to the Coronavirus. If he’d planned to earn money and make a living out of giving speeches, we’ll thats gone out the window for now.

On another note, I wonder if the BRF might take a page out of the Amish book. There’s a term called Rumspringa (“hopping around”) that describes a kind of freedom that Amish teenagers have (around 16) - a period in which they decode whether to join the Church.

Maybe when the younger Royals destined to be Working Royals become older, say 18-20, they can be granted some sort of freedom to live a more freer life, to decide what if they want to make commitments to the working Royal life. However, it wouldn’t be all fun and games. They’d have to work somewhere, perhaps have an internship, for the period of time.

Will and Harry have had gap years, Harry had 10 years in the army, Will had Univeristy and his time as a pilot where he had about 3 or 4 years of working in a service job which was not the army.. But their lives are never going to be the same as "normal people." The only way they can learn in depth is by reading and talking to "ordinary people" and that's not the same either.
I don't blame Charles for their flaws.. their faults are their own. I don't think that he was the wisest parent at times.. He no doubt felt guilty about the broken marriage, his own faults as a husband...and IMO he let them have their own way too much as teenagers and both of them became uncharmingly spoiled Hooray Henries. I think WIlliam matured because of his steady relationship with Kate, and her middle class family... and his doing a relatively ordinary few years in a job. Harry had the army.. but Im not sure it matured him a lot. I think now he is very much under M's influence... and he will probably find it hard to adjust to having to hustle and earn a living....

 

[soapstar]

Let’s move on from going back and forth about which members said Meghan would never return to the UK. That topic adds nothing to the discussion.

If you wish to continue discussing Charles’ relationship with William and Harry, or their relationship with the Queen, please take it to the BRF relationship thread. Any further off-topic discussions will be deleted.

 

[camelot23ca]

Are you saying that is why they will come home, botht of them, on a regular basis? To remind everyone of their royal connextions?

I think certain royal events, such as Trooping the Colour, accompanying The Queen to church, etc, are high visibility, low commitment opportunities for the couple to remain visible as royals now that they’re not working members of the royal family.

I don’t think Harry is completely estranged from his family so I do think he’ll come back to see everyone, and to keep Archie in contact with the family, and that Meghan will accompany him at least some of the time. But it’s possible to kill two birds with one stone - there’s no reason they can’t mix family time with self promotion.