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  #321  
Old 06-07-2021, 04:36 PM
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Originally Posted by Alison H View Post
They won't be putting "Lili" on the birth certificate. It's a bit confusing that the announcement said "Lilibet "Lili" Diana", but that was just to show that she'd be known as Lili. Harry's birth certificate says Henry Charles Albert David, but he's only ever been "Harry". That's nothing unusual. When I was at school, there were loads of Kates, Debbies, Mandys, Daves, Andys, Mikes, etc, whose birth certificates said Katherine, Debra, Amanda, David, Andrew or Michael but who'd never been known by the full versions.


It does seem to be a trend now to use a nickname/short name as the official name, e.g. Teddy rather than Edward or Beth rather than Elizabeth. I'm not a great fan of that idea, but each to their own.


Fairly random point :-) , but the last two or three generations of royals have been unusually nickname/abbreviation-free. If you go back to the early 20th century, you can get extremely confused as you read about Ducky, Sunny, Moretta, Sandro, Greek Georgie, Lenchen, Ena, etc etc etc!
That was because they used a lot of the same name.. so there had to be nicknames and abbreviations to distinguish them.. Ena was actually Victoria Eugenie's fourth name and the one she was called by. Just as Edward VIII was known by his last name David. They dont do it now.. Elizabeth was alwasy given as a second name to honour the queen -not as the used name.
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  #322  
Old 06-07-2021, 04:37 PM
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Originally Posted by Mbruno View Post
Lilibet Diana is actually a nice name. It is not very original though considering that, barring the nickname, they repeated the names of their niece (Charlotte Elizabeth Diana). That might reflect the Sussexes' insecurity and their inferiority complex in relation to the Cambridges. I am sorry to sat that, but it is what it looks like to me.

So okay, let's just consider they thought that Lili will be their last child. They want to honour Diana and the queen. What names could they have taken if they wanted to omit "Diana" and "Elizabeth"? Frances and hm.... already 8 other little (and bigger) girls in the family have "Elizabeth" as their name one way or the other... Let's just say that I have three cousins on one side and two on the other who share my grandmothers names with me. Original this is not but nice!
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  #323  
Old 06-07-2021, 04:39 PM
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What I don't really get is announcing the Lili name officially. I get it that a shortened version is better in everyday life. In fact, the only people who call me by my actual first name are people I work with. Friends and family all have their own versions of the shortened name my parents use for me.

But they never introduced me as "Moran, we call her Mora" officially and this announcement was as official as they come. It feels like an uncomfortable look in their private life. I don't need to know how anyone is going to call their just born child. Especially a couple so intent on preserving its privacy. To me, it's inexplicable sharing of something intimate with the world.
  #324  
Old 06-07-2021, 04:45 PM
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Originally Posted by Moran View Post
What I don't really get is announcing the Lili name officially. I get it that a shortened version is better in everyday life. In fact, the only people who call me by my actual first name are people I work with. Friends and family all have their own versions of the shortened name my parents use for me.

But they never introduced me as "Moran, we call her Mora" officially and this announcement was as official as they come. It feels like an uncomfortable look in their private life. I don't need to know how anyone is going to call their just born child. Especially a couple so intent on preserving its privacy. To me, it's inexplicable sharing of something intimate with the world.
Why shouldn't they announce how they want their child to be known? She is not supposed to be called Lilibet anywhere than in official documents (i.e., situations in which both her first and middle name will be used). She is to be Lili at school, at work, with friends and within the family. They might end up with a private nickname for her as well but that's something completely different.

So, I don't see how it is a private issue if the purpose of announcing it, is to make sure that everyone will use the correct name, which is Lili.
  #325  
Old 06-07-2021, 04:52 PM
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Why shouldn't they announce how they want their child to be known? She is not supposed to be called Lilibet anywhere than in official documents (i.e., situations in which both her first and middle name will be used). She is to be Lili at school, at work, with friends and within the family. They might end up with a private nickname for her as well but that's something completely different.

So, I don't see how it is a private issue if the purpose of announcing it, is to make sure that everyone will use the correct name, which is Lili.
Because we aren't going to know her personally. We aren't likely to attend her school and so on. And her name can be explained personally to the people who are actually going to socialize with her. Not the world who isn't likely to meet her in person.

In my culture, it isn't done. In yours, it is. I wonder about UK and US.
  #326  
Old 06-07-2021, 04:52 PM
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Originally Posted by Somebody View Post
Why shouldn't they announce how they want their child to be known? She is not supposed to be called Lilibet anywhere than in official documents (i.e., situations in which both her first and middle name will be used). She is to be Lili at school, at work, with friends and within the family. They might end up with a private nickname for her as well but that's something completely different.

So, I don't see how it is a private issue if the purpose of announcing it, is to make sure that everyone will use the correct name, which is Lili.
The correct name is Lilibet, as they've named her that name.
  #327  
Old 06-07-2021, 04:55 PM
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Originally Posted by Moran View Post
What I don't really get is announcing the Lili name officially. I get it that a shortened version is better in everyday life. In fact, the only people who call me by my actual first name are people I work with. Friends and family all have their own versions of the shortened name my parents use for me.

But they never introduced me as "Moran, we call her Mora" officially and this announcement was as official as they come. It feels like an uncomfortable look in their private life. I don't need to know how anyone is going to call their just born child. Especially a couple so intent on preserving its privacy. To me, it's inexplicable sharing of something intimate with the world.
I don't see the issue. Why wouldn't they announce her name? Also announcing Lili will be what she is called? That is literally what Charles and Diana did with Harry. He wasn't introduced as Henry. They made it clear from day one that he was to be called Harry. I am sure it happened with Meghan too as she has never been called Rachel. The same is happening with Lili.
  #328  
Old 06-07-2021, 04:58 PM
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But Harry was a public figure. There were going to be stories about him in the paper, the RF would show him off at his christening and other things.. so since they wanted him to be called Harry rather than Henry, it made sense to say this when he was born and named. Lilibet is not a public figure.. Her pals at nursery and teacher will call her Lili, but that's something to tell them.. no real need to tell the whole world.
  #329  
Old 06-07-2021, 05:09 PM
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As is it right now, Lili will one day be a Princess of the United Kingdom so although she may not be a public figure right now, why wouldn't they tell the whole world how they want her addressed. It would look silly if that was to be announced later.
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  #330  
Old 06-07-2021, 05:13 PM
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Originally Posted by Archduchess Zelia View Post
As is it right now, Lili will one day be a Princess of the United Kingdom so although she may not be a public figure right now, why wouldn't they tell the whole world how they want her addressed. It would look silly if that was to be announced later.
Since she is not even using the title she's entitled to, why will they wish for her to be a Princess? She's going to be living in the US, so its hardly of any use to her to be an English princess.
  #331  
Old 06-07-2021, 05:17 PM
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Their wishes don't really matter. Officially that's what going to happen automatically once Charles ascends the throne unless changes are made before (or they're stripped of them after). They can of course choose not to use their titles but as it is right now, they will be elevated as soon as Charles succeeds QEII. So again, it makes perfect sense to specify how they want her addressed.
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  #332  
Old 06-07-2021, 05:23 PM
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Originally Posted by Archduchess Zelia View Post
Their wishes don't really matter. Officially that's what going to happen automatically once Charles ascends the throne unless changes are made before (or they're stripped of them after). They can of course choose not to use their titles but as it is right now, they will be elevated as soon as Charles succeeds QEII. So again, it makes perfect sense to specify how they want her addressed.
of course their wishes matter. Edward and Sophie's children didn't have the titles of HRH prince and princess, partly because their parents did not want them to be HRH. When Charles becomes King, Harry can ask that his children are not landed with a title that will be of no use to them in their life in the USA.
  #333  
Old 06-07-2021, 05:24 PM
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Originally Posted by Archduchess Zelia View Post
A. It's a nickname. One used by family and friends. And Lili is her great-granddaughter. How on earth do you problematise that?
I "problematise" that because this a woman who only goes by that name to a few people, almost all of whom are now dead. It's now out there being commercialised in the public sphere. See: lilibetdiana.com

[...]Such a name IS a lovely tribute when the parents are on good terms with the "honouree".

Quote:
B. That's your assumption. And even if that was the case, what makes you think QEII would disapprove?
It is my assumption but I'm basing it on how the Susssexes have acted for the last 18 months/ Such as publishing their manifesto before it was agreed hoping to back the family into a corner, the catty "she doesn't own the word royal" and the family finding out about the Oprah interview not from them but when Harpo contacted ITV. They like to mess with people's expectations and play games and do what they want to do.

Quote:
C. Not really. In spite of everything they've said, they've always maintained that QEII (and Philip) was pretty much the only relative that kept in contact with them and they've both always been clear that QEII has been very supportive of Meghan. Also considering the gravity of some of the issues H&M have brought up, "trashing everything [QEII] holds dear" isn't really the comeback lots of people seem to think it is these days.
And I call shenanigans on that. HM was supportive of Meghan whilst she was in the firm, that is true. But I don't believe they can try to tear her life's work apart and go "but we love the Queen and she supports us" It doesn't work like that. When they trash her firm and family they trash her. When Philip died we found out he didn't use Zoom and only had a phone. Where does that put Harry's endearing "Philip ends a call by closing the computer screen"? Nor do I think they were having cosy zooms with HM whilst Harry was telling the world she was a bad parent who made his father a terrible person.

And quite frankly they've lied about so many other things that are provable I wouldn't trust them to tell me the grass is green.

And IF "the things that HM holds dear" are terrible and not worth anything these days then why on Earth do they want to name the baby after her intimate name? And tell the world that?

In that case "because she's still his grandmother" isn't a good enough reason to link a baby with this woman who stands for terrible things in that way.
  #334  
Old 06-07-2021, 05:26 PM
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But Harry was a public figure. There were going to be stories about him in the paper, the RF would show him off at his christening and other things.. so since they wanted him to be called Harry rather than Henry, it made sense to say this when he was born and named. Lilibet is not a public figure.. Her pals at nursery and teacher will call her Lili, but that's something to tell them.. no real need to tell the whole world.
And yet here were are chatting her up for pages as her birth and name has been worldwide news for the past 30 hours. Lili is a private citizen but she is still a member of a very public family who will be written about. Heck there is an hour long program on American TV tonight all about her. So yeah why not tell the world? It was hardly going to be a secret.
  #335  
Old 06-07-2021, 05:27 PM
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Originally Posted by Denville View Post
of course their wishes matter. Edward and Sophie's children didn't have the titles of HRH prince and princess, partly because their parents did not want them to be HRH. When Charles becomes King, Harry can ask that his children are not landed with a title that will be of no use to them in their life in the USA.
Louise and James are still both technically HRHs regardless of the decision to style them as children of an Earl, but I think that's a discussion for another thread (and also an issue that has been discussed to pieces around here).
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  #336  
Old 06-07-2021, 05:29 PM
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Originally Posted by Denville View Post
The correct name is Lilibet, as they've named her that name.
In the Netherlands it happens very often that a child has a "doopnaam" Baptismal name ( I don't know how you name it in English) but has a different name, as in Henry and Harry. Or Catharina and we name her Cathrien.
Or Martina Janna and we name her Marjanne. Or Johannes and we name the child Johan or Jan of Hannes and so on. It happens very often much more than in the UK. So for me Lilibeth Diana and calling her Lili sounds okay and I don't see the problem in telling that she will be called Lili.
Nice name!.

Althought I can understand that it raises eyebrows after all he said about his family.
However how many more can we say about a name

I wish them well and hope they have a good time the first weeks postpartum with their little girl and big brother Archie
  #337  
Old 06-07-2021, 05:31 PM
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Originally Posted by Heavs View Post
I'm absolutely sure we will have some sort of picture of her at some point and probably regular updates on her milestones like we did with Archie.
[...]I heard Camilla Tominey say that they are expecting a photo to be released within a week. Not sure how true that is but that would be nice. Or even something for Father's Day.
  #338  
Old 06-07-2021, 05:32 PM
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Originally Posted by Archduchess Zelia View Post
Their wishes don't really matter. Officially that's what going to happen automatically once Charles ascends the throne unless changes are made before (or they're stripped of them after). They can of course choose not to use their titles but as it is right now, they will be elevated as soon as Charles succeeds QEII. So again, it makes perfect sense to specify how they want her addressed.
Their wishes do matter. Lady Louise is actually Princess Louise, just like Lilibet would become Princess Lilibet, but her parents wish for her to be known as Lady Louise - so that's what she is known as. Until she is 18, I think, then she will decide for herself.
  #339  
Old 06-07-2021, 05:33 PM
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Originally Posted by Erin9 View Post
Harry has called Charles and William out by name....and generically included “family” in a litany of other grievances. Along with the institution itself. No one has been spared.

Yes he has Erin9 so that includes a large number of family members other than his father and brother. Sadly they've implied with their remarks about the alleged comment regarding the Sussexes' child's skin tone, that it could have been any member of the British Royal Family apart from the Queen and DoE.


Hoping that the birth of little Lilli might be an opportunity for some bridge building to begin again between the Sussexes and the BRF.
  #340  
Old 06-07-2021, 05:58 PM
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Personally, I think many people are reacting based upon how they feel about HM--she is a much beloved and admired lady all over the world. I also think many people feel sorry for HM due to her loss of her beloved husband so recently. Couple these feelings to those many people have about Harry and Meghan and their recent interviews and statements--and you have negative fallout. No, I am not a fan of the name chosen by the Sussexes for their new baby girl--but, Lili is their child and they get to choose their child's name. But, a sweet baby has been born to loving parents who are thrilled with her. Maybe she will be the blessing needed to help heal hurts and build bridges--babies can do that. So, welcome to the world Lili!
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